Who is the biggest global icon?

albo23 · Post #261 » by **albo23** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:10 am

markjay wrote:
bigbreakfast wrote:i think its hilarious the ppl who have lived in different regions/countries of the world all pretty much pick messi, but the posters who undoubtedly have only lived in the US pick someone else.......

How do you know where people have lived?

I've lived in two countries in Europe, one in Asia, one in North America, and one in Africa and I say Kobe.

I have trouble believing that.

83SixersRocked · Post #262 » by **83SixersRocked** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:14 am

albo23 wrote:It's Messi and anyone who has ever left the United States should know any other choice is stupid.

Post fail

Canada_7 · Post #263 » by **Canada_7** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:47 am

Mamba Venom wrote:I never looked up Messi before this thread. I barely heard his name. I thought it went Ronaldo then Donavon then Beckem. But I don't see how a 25 year old Messi can be that big of an icon.

Maybe in the US...but no one cares about him outside of the US. He's merely an above average player but he's a no-name compared to the rest of the world in this regard.

Mr. Crowley · Post #264 » by **Mr. Crowley** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:50 am

I'm shocked of all the votes Kobe have got in here.

I do not live in the states, from where i am only one basketball player was well known in here even for people who do not was into the sport, and that was Jordan.

Pacquiao in here it's kinda popular even by people who do not like box, Maywheater not so much though.

But yeah Cristiano and Messi are far and away the biggest global icons from that list, football ( soccer ) is the most popular sport in the world and it is really hard to compete with that.

Cristiano is probably most popular tan Leo only for the women appeal though.

Ettorefm · Post #265 » by **Ettorefm** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:04 am

To think that people all round the world know Kobe as much as US citizens do is laughable. I mean, many people do, but he's not more known than even some retired football (yes, football, not soccer) players like Ronaldo or Zidane.
.
Basketball is not even the #1 or #2 sport in the US. To think that any basketball superstar is more known than a football player is crazy.

Post #266 » by **LLcoleJ** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:15 am

If the US is not part of this equation than why ask the question? Yes, I know football (soccer) is the biggest sport in the world. But it seems that if the point of this thread was to exclude one of the pieces of the globe then we are not doing the question justice.

remove : Kobe, James, Messi and maybe Ronaldo

Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson is more known in the US than Messi and I think that fact is important only because nobody really knows Ochocinco either, and if they do they probably don't like him.

The other guys on the list have more worldwide marketability with guys like Feder and Manny taking the lead with Woods close behind them.

Josephpaul · Post #267 » by **Josephpaul** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:24 am

Ettorefm wrote:To think that people all round the world know Kobe as much as US citizens do is laughable. I mean, many people do, but he's not more known than even some retired football (yes, football, not soccer) players like Ronaldo or Zidane.
.
Basketball is not even the #1 or #2 sport in the US. To think that any basketball superstar is more known than a football player is crazy.

People know him one way or other , aslong if they watch tv they should know or have idea who he is.

HEAT33 · Post #268 » by **HEAT33** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:07 am

I would say top 10 players in soccer before any other player in NFL, NBA or baseball.

Im sure a lot of people in Europe have never even heard of Kobe.

If you say Kobe Bryant, they probably think its a type of Japanese steak.

waya · Post #269 » by **waya** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:42 am

Cool_Dude wrote:OK, even if Pele's legacy doesn't hold up well today, Messi still needs to win at least one World Cup. Zinedine Zidane all-time is definitely better than Messi. Forget the stats for a minute, and consider the unwritten impact they have/had on the field. Zidane would masterfully control the entire game from the midfield with his footwork and passing. Messi is more of a guy who runs with the ball towards the goal and finds crafty ways to score. But Messi's game is built around his speed, and his small stature allows him to make quick changes of direction at high speeds. Zidane was never fast nor athletic, but his sheer skill and genius in creating something out of nothing and his ability to see and react to plays before they happen puts him above Messi IMO until Messi wins World Cups.

Nothing beats that legendary quarterfinal game against the heavily-favored Brazilians in world cup 06 where Zidane would continually own multiple Brazilian defenders at once, pretty much every time he got the ball. Ronaldinho was at that time what Messi is now, and Zidane totally burned him. And Zidane scored the first two french goals in the 98 world cup final, also against a great Brazil team, winning France the world cup at home. Messi needs to approach that level of international success, and he simply hasn't.

+1 to all of this. Obviously Messi is great but until I see him do something for Argentina, I don't want to see his name in GOAT discussions.

Don Draper · Post #270 » by **Don Draper** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:07 am

This is off topic but a lot of what you wrote abut Messi simply isn't true. Let me qualify all of this by stating I despise Barcelona and don't really care for Messi.

Cool_Dude wrote:OK, even if Pele's legacy doesn't hold up well today, Messi still needs to win at least one World Cup. Zinedine Zidane all-time is definitely better than Messi. Forget the stats for a minute, and consider the unwritten impact they have/had on the field. Zidane would masterfully control the entire game from the midfield with his footwork and passing. Messi is more of a guy who runs with the ball towards the goal and finds crafty ways to score. But Messi's game is built around his speed, and his small stature allows him to make quick changes of direction at high speeds. Zidane was never fast nor athletic, but his sheer skill and genius in creating something out of nothing and his ability to see and react to plays before they happen puts him above Messi IMO until Messi wins World Cups.

So much wrong with this. First, Messi game's isn't built on speed (he's fast but not Theo Walcott fast). His game is built on a few things: 1) ball control when dribbling (rarely gets dispossessed) 2) intelligence (he seems to always make the correct pass or run) 3) finishing (he's becoming a better goal scorer every year) 4) versatility (he can play any forward position: left or right wing, behind the striker, as the lone striker, etc.).

The bolded is complete craziness and I'm not sure how anyone who has watched Messi can make that claim.

Nothing beats that legendary quarterfinal game against the heavily-favored Brazilians in world cup 06 where Zidane would continually own multiple Brazilian defenders at once, pretty much every time he got the ball. Ronaldinho was at that time what Messi is now, and Zidane totally burned him. And Zidane scored the first two french goals in the 98 world cup final, also against a great Brazil team, winning France the world cup at home. Messi needs to approach that level of international success, and he simply hasn't.

I'm sorry but players are judged how they do over the course of the domestic season. The World Cup is largely dependent on current form and luck (you will see a lot of players play well in the WC, get signed by a bigger club, and never reach their WC form again). In the last decade or so I've never seen anyone use international competitions as the primary measuring stick for individual greatness. The notion that Messi isn't on the level of the greats b/c he hasn't won a World Cup is complete garbage, media-driven, and only believable to a casual fan. Most of the praise you heaped on Zidane is rooted in nostalgia.

Kironte · Post #271 » by **Kironte** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:04 am

reignfire wrote:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008 ... basketball

China is crazy about Basketball, dude.

And people saying you gotta be big in America to be big isn't narcissistic. Am I pro-water or water biased if I say everyone needs to drink water to survive? You can hate America or love America, but a fact is a fact. Anyone who is big in America is already a global icon because America's cultural influence and far and wide.

Basketball is a sport on rise, while Football is a sport in decline. This means the best and most well known Basketball players are going to be on center stage.

Also, any sport that China chooses to be its main sport WILL be the biggest sport in the 21st century. You can hate that fact, but it's still a fact.

Oh the irony :lol:

and lol at football being a sport in decline

Kironte · Post #272 » by **Kironte** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:08 am

GrangerDanger wrote:How is Messi winning? Let's do a quick test

Google Leonardo Messi. you get 9,650,000 hits. pretty good

Google Kobe Bryant. you get 74,800,000 hits. not close

Google Tim Tebow (a backup QB on a mediocore NFL team). you get 44,100,000 hits. not close

Google Mike Trout (rookie MLB player on an expansion team). you get 14,700,000 hits. kind of close

So scrubs in the NFL and MLB are more well known than the most popular soccer player in the world. Don't let your love of soccer cloud your judgement. NBA, NFL, and MLB stars are far more known around the world

Pure comedy :roll:

Brovva Blaqq · Post #273 » by **Brovva Blaqq** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:08 am

donnieme wrote:
markjay wrote:
bigbreakfast wrote:i think its hilarious the ppl who have lived in different regions/countries of the world all pretty much pick messi, but the posters who undoubtedly have only lived in the US pick someone else.......

How do you know where people have lived?

I've lived in two countries in Europe, one in Asia, one in North America, and one in Africa and I say Kobe.

Not calling you out or anything, but as an African, I'd really like to know where in Africa (or Europe for that matter) you've lived that kobe is actually a bigger name than Messi/Ronaldo.

He probably meant Canada + Quebec (=2x Europe), Hawaii (=Asia), USA and Jamaica (=Africa).

Mirjalovic · Post #274 » by **Mirjalovic** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 9:53 am

Its used to be Tiger Woods, original Ronaldo or Michael Scumacher, (+ Jordan & Tyson in 90s) but right now is Messi or Ronaldo.

Elden Payton · Post #275 » by **Elden Payton** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 9:53 am

reignfire wrote:A lot of Europeans here picked Messi but they have to understand Europe is now the third largest market behind America and Asia, with Asia probably overtaking America in the near future. So, if you're not big in America and Asia, then you're not that big.

Messi is HUGE in Europe, almost unknown in America, and decently known in Asia. So Messi is most well known in the oldest, smallest, shrinking market. Kobe is huge in the largest market(America) and the largest growing market(Asia).

No contest.

W:oW

This thread is definitely delivering.

Notas A3 · Post #276 » by **Notas A3** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:06 am

Notas A3 wrote:It is very simple, in this thread 90% of the non USA posters say Messi and Ronaldo even if they like football/soccer or not. From the USA, 60% (I'm being generous with that %) are saying Kobe,20% Woods, the rest of opinions are mixed with Messi, Ronaldo, Pacquiao or Beckham.
Now, my question is simple, who represents the idea of global better: people from Europe, Asia, South America, Australia and Arabic countries or only one country, USA? I just want an answer to my question from the ones who are saying Kobe, It is a very simple one.

I am still waiting.

Chocobanana · Post #277 » by **Chocobanana** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:12 am

If I had to pick one country, I'd say the USA right now probably has more influence on other cultures than any other country in the world. But one country, or even continent, can't represent a global view, so is it impossible to answer that. But of those categories, Europe probably because it has a more countries and is more wealthy than the other choices (I think).

HEAT33 · Post #278 » by **HEAT33** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:20 am

I live in Asia.
My wife has never even heard of Kobe Bryant lol

This is with me watching Basketball almost everyday.

But she sure knows who Ronaldo is, she thinks he is better looking than me, which is actually impossible.

trickshot · Post #279 » by **trickshot** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:06 am

Chocobanana wrote:If I had to pick one country, I'd say the USA right now probably has more influence on other cultures than any other country in the world. But one country, or even continent, can't represent a global view, so is it impossible to answer that. But of those categories, Europe probably because it has a more countries and is more wealthy than the other choices (I think).

True this. You have a great influence on world trends. U.S movies, music, fashion etc dominate world trend, but what you are failing to understand is that Sport is the exception in this. Ask yourself why are NFL and MLB most popular in the U.S but aren't popular worldwide. Why are basketball and the Nba more popular worldwide despite not being the leading sport in USA? Why is soccer the world's most popular sport despite its poor presence in the U.S?

All the non-US posters in this thread (me included) are trying to make you understand this but some US dudes are being stubborn and acting like the winner of this thread goes home with a medal and their country must come out on top rather than actually opening their minds and being reasonable.

Avice · Post #280 » by **Avice** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:40 am

US sports rarely get shown outside of your country. The most exported items from your media are tv shows, movies and music.In my country, the sports channels show football matches regularly, even if it is not one of the bigger clubs. Basketball is usually shown on at 9 a.m. in the morning, which means there are no consistent viewer for the game. During WC, Euro, or Copa America, it is expected that everyone from students to the workforce to sleep late and be tired due to watching football the night before.And it is not only the superstars that get talked about here, most even know who the up and comers and benchwarmers are. My university's vice chancellor favourite country to root for during the recent Euro was Holland, and he regularly talked about them during his speeches. Made me glad they lost, but I was also disheartened seeing Germany lost too.