"RADICAL-Wizard Ideas" thread

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

A very radical Wall trade Idea with Dallas:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bm9mr2o

Wizards send John Wall, Trevor Ariza, Jordan Crawford
Wizards receive Rod Beaubois, Jae Crowder, Vince Carter, Shawn Marion, 1st round pick

This puts mentors around Beal and secures the SF of the future, Crowder, while also getting back a pick. Dallas does this because Wall will become their superstar. The Wizards definitely get to the playoffs. Roddy Buckets isn't really a PG, but with Beal it won't matter. This gets rid of Crawford and Ariza. All players are only signed to this year or the next.

[dobrojim]

isn't the usual rule that the team that gets the best player in a trade wins?

How is taking back a bunch of unproven potential and old garbage and/or
servicable, but waning players back a good deal for us?

[fishercob]

fish, you're psychotic.

Fixed.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

There are some really good meds and alternative therapies and treatment plans, or so I hear.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

isn't the usual rule that the team that gets the best player in a trade wins?

How is taking back a bunch of unproven potential and old garbage and/or
servicable, but waning players back a good deal for us?

Wall's the best player but I don't think he's a superstar. I'll take Crowder because I think he's a sure-fire, quality player. I think he's a better SF than Wall is a PG right now, jim. With that draft pick I think I can get C .J. Mc Cullom, who is going to be a freaking winner at PG next season in the NBA IMO. Marion already has a ring. Carter desperately wants one and he'd be the perfect mentor for Beal. Vince can play SF better than any current Wizard, too, IMO.

That deal would not be giving garbage. Look at the pedigree of Marion and Carter compared with Ariza. Combine these swing men with Nene and Okafor, while keeping Beal, Booker, Seraphin, Vesely; and you're talking about developing the right way.

I think Beaubois/Beal would compete most nights.

[DCZards]

Pedigree? I'll take the mentoring/pedigree of Okafor over that of Marion and Carter, both of whom are WAAAYYY over the hill and probably less capable mentors than even someone like Sam Cassell. I also wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Ariza as a mentor. Trevor A. has a ring and seems like the high-character, hardworking type to me.

In either case, don't like the idea of trading a potential superstar (Wall) for the oft-injured Roddy, the ancient Marion and Carter and the unproven Crowder.

[dobrojim]

Carter is garbage at this stage of his career and his history doesn't scream
high character to me.

Both Crowder and Beaubois have potential, but neither has as much potential as Wall.

Marion might have a few solid years left but I would imagine he's got a hefty contract
that comes along with.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Pedigree? I'll take the mentoring/pedigree of Okafor over that of Marion and Carter, both of whom are WAAAYYY over the hill and probably less capable mentors than even someone like Sam Cassell. I also wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Ariza as a mentor. Trevor A. has a ring and seems like the high-character, hardworking type to me.

In either case, don't like the idea of trading a potential superstar (Wall) for the oft-injured Roddy, the ancient Marion and Carter and the unproven Crowder.

Helps to use the edit/quote feature, DCZ. Here is exactly what I said:

Look at the pedigree of Marion and Carter compared with Ariza. Combine these swing men with Nene and Okafor,

Ariza never was a star, but both Carter and Marion were. Marion defended James in a Finals two years ago when Dallas beat Miami. Carter is a much better shooter than Ariza, even at 35 years old. Vince has been a go to scorer and he can still hit an open shot very well. Take them over Ariza any day.

The idea is add those guys on 2 year deals to Nene and Okafor and Beal, while bringing in an extra pick.

This deal gets rid of a shot jacker and brings in a scoring point and a defensive hawk in Crowder.

Not saying it is my greatest idea, but I think it is pretty sound UNLESS Wall turns into a superstar--which I really don't see happening.

[DCZards]

Ariza never was a star, but both Carter and Marion were. Marion defended James in a Finals two years ago when Dallas beat Miami. Carter is a much better shooter than Ariza, even at 35 years old. Vince has been a go to scorer and he can still hit an open shot very well. Take them over Ariza any day.


Not saying it is my greatest idea, but I think it is pretty sound UNLESS Wall turns into a superstar--which I really don't see happening.

Carter and Marion WERE stars. That's my point. Wall COULD turn out to be a superstar. That's my other point. Your trade could turn out to be another young Chris Webber (Wall) for old Mitch Richmond (Marion/Carter) nightmare.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

DCZ, the reason I believe that is not the case is because year one Wall was just as good as year two Wall. That doesn't happen with superstars.

My real motivation for that deal is getting Crowder and a pick. Offloading Crawford is a HUGE plus as well.

DCZ, check out how effective "over-the-hill" Vince Carter was for the Mavs.

http://www.82games.com/1112/11DAL7.HTM

Scroll all the way down to On/Off Court stats. Carter was phenomenally effective! The Mavs scored more and shot better when he was ON the court. They also defended better and allowed less when he was OFF the court.

Carter was +11.4 for the season.

A lot of people go on emotion, remember Carter in Toronto, remember the Nets didn't win it all, and they say Vince is over-the-hill. I KNOW he's on the downside, but the guy is good on both ends of the court.

[Dat2U]

Here's a radical idea: Teddy Leonsis actually firing the general manager of one of his sports franchises. Ted, please lose the ego, stop thinking your way of managing & leading is so brilliant that anyone with a pulse can successfully run your operation if they just execute your plan. No amount of brilliance or shear genius can hide incompetent decision making. :-/