Wizards @ Celtics Game Thread 11/07/12

[Kanyewest]

While I have respect for KG, I don't understand how he can get so much respect from the official with the officials. I feel that KG gets superstar treatment from the officials similar to what Alonzo Mourning did a few years back when he was on the Heat.

I still came away impressed with the Wizards. Yes Seraphin's performance was a lot less statistically appealing. But he induced a lot of double teams which opened up the floor for his teammates. I bet Seraphin isn't used to seeing double teams so perhaps that explains some his turnovers.

AJ Price is interesting. Yes he can't get into the paint. While he can't get into the paint, his jump shot is average and that makes him look like a lights out shooter compared to John Wall. As far as I can tell his defense looks excellent and he was guarding Rondo. Unfortunately for Price, it seems like teams have top 10 caliber point guards throughout the league.

Still, the Wizards may be better than their record indicates at least when they are healthy with Wall and Nene. Not sure how many teams are still decent without their 2 best players - for me, only the Spurs come to mind.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I think the Wizards are considerably better than their record.

Some aspects of G/perimeter play are better this season even without Wall. Price can hit the three. He is not the only one. Webster, Singleton, Pargo, and Beal can also hit the three. Wall didn't have the luxury of having so many teammates who hit the three. Another thing is without so many fast break turnovers, opponents are not getting layups at the other end as frequently with Wall out. Price is a better defender IMO than Wall. He is being effective in some aspects, but very ineffective as a play maker in crunch time.

I think the frontcourt defense is a lot better and with Seraphin back there is a good chance to get more points in the paint than in the past. The frontcourt can become a strength with Nene back. I'm not worried about Booker or Vesely and I think Emeka Okafor will rebound (mild pun intended) with better play.

In most ways the team would be better with Wall. However, I don't think his absence is a huge deal because Price hits threes, defends, and plays slower. More Wizards get touches and shots this way IMO.

The big absence for Washington is Nene. Once he comes back--or I should say if-Washington will be a better-than-average team IMO.

[Nivek]

My observations don't necessarily match up to the data.

You and Karl Rove.

[llcc25]

I think the Wizards are as bad as their record. Keep in mind that that the CLE game was not as close as the final score. When Irving/Varejo we're in they were close to +30 so the game should've been a blowout if not for Byron Scott keeping starters on bench for long periods. Regarding BOS, its evident that they are old and slow and not as good as everyone expected so I don't much too much weight on the close losses. If we don't win tomorrow vs MIL who beat both BOS and CLE, I believe we will be in for a very very ugly start to the season. Looking at the remaining 11 November games, all I see is 2 winnable games vs CHA. We have 2 games against IND who is missing Granger and 1 against ATL, but I honestly can't see us winning those. DAL, UTAH, SA, POR, and NY are the other games and I definitely don't see us having a chance against those teams. So by my calculation I see a 2-13 record, at the end of NOV. Looking ahead to DEC, assuming Wall and Nene still are not there, if we beat NO and split our games against ATL, DET, ORL (whom we have 2 games each with), that gives us a 4-10 record for DEC. So basically, in my best case scenario w/o Wall/Nene, I see us at 6-23 at end of December. I know thats harsh, but I just don't see wins against other teams on the schedule.

[dobrojim]

My observations don't necessarily match up to the data.

You and Karl Rove.

at least as far as the Wiz go, Fish doesn't have to explain that to the folks
that 'invested' so heavily in him.

[hands11]

later.
He [Singleton] should play ahead of Ariza clearly. Small sample size but he looks
to have improved considerably in the offseason.

I've noticed an improved (and more under control) Singleton starting during SL and through preseason. I think he'll be in the starting lineup before long. I also have this gut feeling that being on the floor with the younger, more athletic Singleton as opposed to Ariza will relax and benefit Beal. Just a feeling....no hard evidence.

That's what I'm talking about and its why I slotted him to start over Webster at SF.

Now I know he has been playing more PF, but I want to see what he can do there again.

But the team will have problem until something changes at PG. Either Crawford gets moved there or they go get Livingston.

[hands11]

My quick prediction (probably the prediction of many on this forum) is that Ted and Ernie are going to rush Wall and Nene back and get them on the court as soon as humanly possible in hopes of salvaging this season and preventing yet another lottery-bound catastrophe.

IDK

it could be that these close losses with bright spots here and there might lead
them to believe that being overly conservative/cautious is the correct path
since once we get healthy, we'll win our share. Only Hands knows for sure.

Let me consult with my favorite method.

[hands11]

I think the Wizards are as bad as their record. Keep in mind that that the CLE game was not as close as the final score. When Irving/Varejo we're in they were close to +30 so the game should've been a blowout if not for Byron Scott keeping starters on bench for long periods. Regarding BOS, its evident that they are old and slow and not as good as everyone expected so I don't much too much weight on the close losses. If we don't win tomorrow vs MIL who beat both BOS and CLE, I believe we will be in for a very very ugly start to the season. Looking at the remaining 11 November games, all I see is 2 winnable games vs CHA. We have 2 games against IND who is missing Granger and 1 against ATL, but I honestly can't see us winning those. DAL, UTAH, SA, POR, and NY are the other games and I definitely don't see us having a chance against those teams. So by my calculation I see a 2-13 record, at the end of NOV. Looking ahead to DEC, assuming Wall and Nene still are not there, if we beat NO and split our games against ATL, DET, ORL (whom we have 2 games each with), that gives us a 4-10 record for DEC. So basically, in my best case scenario w/o Wall/Nene, I see us at 6-23 at end of December. I know thats harsh, but I just don't see wins against other teams on the schedule.

My prediction. They will bring in Livingston or Nene return before they let that happen.

[payitforward]

My observations don't necessarily match up to the data.

You and Karl Rove.

+1

[payitforward]

I think the Wizards are considerably better than their record.

There is no such thing as being "better than your record." Your record is the measure of how good you are. Not to mention that every fan in every sport things their team is "better than their record."

Competitive sports is about wins and losses. It's not about proving some other abstract point. I can't believe the number of people here -- even here! -- who seem somehow to think that things are going "ok, considering...."

I also keep reading about "when Nene gets back" -- we don't know that Nene *will* get back or whether it'll be soon enough to make any difference whatever.

I also keep reading about "when Wall gets back" -- we went 20-46 last year, and John Wall played every single one of those games. We were 14-46 before the fools-gold streak vs. every team's back of the bench.

Nor have we added a lot of talent since then. Where are all the people who were so convinced that Ernie did well to trade for Okafor and Ariza? Is there even anybody who thinks we added talent in Price and Pargo? We certainly subtracted significant productivity when we didn't bring back James Singleton. Beal is 19 and for the moment at least he hasn't shown he can contribute much.

For god's sake Earl Barron made this squad! You think he expected to play in the NBA this year?

[montestewart]

What if they were worse than their record?

[payitforward]

What if they were worse than their record?

Over the nine seasons of the Grunfield era, only one team has been worse than the Wizards -- Minnesota, by just a few games. Charlotte would likely have been worse as well, but the team started in '04.

I don't think we need to be worrying about whether we're even worse than our record, and certainly not develop some sense of being better than our record.

We are at the bottom of the heap -- right where Ernie's work has put us!

[hands11]

I think the Wizards are considerably better than their record.

There is no such thing as being "better than your record." Your record is the measure of how good you are. Not to mention that every fan in every sport things their team is "better than their record."

Competitive sports is about wins and losses. It's not about proving some other abstract point. I can't believe the number of people here -- even here! -- who seem somehow to think that things are going "ok, considering...."

I also keep reading about "when Nene gets back" -- we don't know that Nene *will* get back or whether it'll be soon enough to make any difference whatever.

I also keep reading about "when Wall gets back" -- we went 20-46 last year, and John Wall played every single one of those games. We were 14-46 before the fools-gold streak vs. every team's back of the bench.

Nor have we added a lot of talent since then. Where are all the people who were so convinced that Ernie did well to trade for Okafor and Ariza? Is there even anybody who thinks we added talent in Price and Pargo? We certainly subtracted significant productivity when we didn't bring back James Singleton. Beal is 19 and for the moment at least he hasn't shown he can contribute much.

For god's sake Earl Barron made this squad! You think he expected to play in the NBA this year?

Hold on, I just got snookered once. Is this another one of those green txt posts ?

[montestewart]

They're all green text posts. But we ran them off a black and white printer.

[payitforward]

They're all green text posts. But we ran them off a black and white printer.

Everything is black and white -- color is a myth.

[GhostsOfGil]

Over the nine seasons of the Grunfield era, only one team has been worse than the Wizards -- Minnesota, by just a few games. Charlotte would likely have been worse as well, but the team started in '04.

I think you bring up some good points PIF. When Wall returns, were still essentially the same team we were last year because OkAriza are giving us squat in terms of on court production. Black and white, it comes down to a HEALTHY Nene, and an improved Wall.

[pancakes3]

Can't believe Ernie's been running this team for 9 seasons.

[paulpressey25]

Can't believe Ernie's been running this team for 9 seasons.

Guys, we need your game thread up.

Or feel free to use ours tonight. We like Wiz fans. Thoughtful, sophisticated and good people trapped for decades with horrible management/ownership just like the Bucks.

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