Heat begin talks with Kenyon Martin

HeatDaChamps · Post #41 » by **HeatDaChamps** » Wed Jan 2, 2013 9:56 am

would be a no-risk signing, if the OP is really a heat insider....not sure why the hell it would take them so long though, its rly not that difficult...we dont have more than the min.

ReturnofMVP3 · Post #42 » by **ReturnofMVP3** » Wed Jan 2, 2013 10:36 am

krikor wrote:who is watchout?

the heat forum insider...

krikor · Post #43 » by **krikor** » Wed Jan 2, 2013 11:36 am

well he is selling his house

http://www.usatoday.com/story/gameon/20 ... m/1791981/

Heats_Finest · Post #44 » by **Heats_Finest** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 12:58 am

To people who think Martin is our rebounding answer, he's not that good of a rebounder. Average at best, which still means we're going to get beasted on the boards when he's on the court.

What he does bring is defense, hands, catching and finishing around the rim. Which is always a good thing to have.

Tuff Gong · Post #45 » by **Tuff Gong** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 1:22 am

Regardless of what he brings to the table at this stage he'd be a significant upgrade over Haslem who completely sucks.

ricochet · Post #46 » by **ricochet** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 4:50 am

Tuff Gong wrote:Regardless of what he brings to the table at this stage he'd be a significant upgrade over Haslem who completely sucks.

puppa bear · Post #47 » by **puppa bear** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 10:16 am

Either way it needs to be done quickly, so the team can move on. We want to build some rhythm between now & ASG!

RexBoyWonder · Post #48 » by **RexBoyWonder** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 6:32 pm

As much as i feel we desperately need to adress our biggest weakness and add a decent big man, looking at the numbers and thinking rationally, you have to figure that martin is NOT the answer.

Pros :
Very good defender

Cons:
Not really a good rebounder, Medicore at best
At this stage, almost as bad offensivly as Haslem and Joel
Not a Center
Supposedly a bad Locker room presence
Injury prone, very old for a PF, alot of mileage

That's not really much of an upgrade, we need to find something better.

Chris Andersen for example. if he's healthy and in Shape, could be very usefel for us

Cons:
Injury prone

Pros :
Good defender
Very good rebounder
Excellent Shot Blocker
Plays Center
effective and efficient on offense
would probably love to play here and appreciate the opportunity.

Nitro1118 · Post #49 » by **Nitro1118** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 7:56 pm

RexBoyWonder wrote:As much as i feel we desperately need to adress our biggest weakness and add a decent big man, looking at the numbers and thinking rationally, you have to figure that martin is NOT the answer.

Pros :
Very good defender

Cons:
Not really a good rebounder, Medicore at best
At this stage, almost as bad offensivly as Haslem and Joel
Not a Center
Supposedly a bad Locker room presence
Injury prone, very old for a PF, alot of mileage

He's a good rebounder, and much better finisher at the rim than either Haslem or Anthony, and a better jumpshooter than Joel. He's also a much better defender than Haslem, and has more size than Joel.

EIther way, the Heat need another big, and for the minimum he could be cut at anytime with little financial loss.

That's not really much of an upgrade, we need to find something better.

For the minimum, you're not gonna get a big upgrade. Just a small-decent one on the cheap.

Chris Andersen for example. if he's healthy and in Shape, could be very usefel for us

Cons:
Injury prone

Pros :
Good defender
Very good rebounder
Excellent Shot Blocker
Plays Center
effective and efficient on offense
would probably love to play here and appreciate the opportunity.

He hasn't been useful in years.

RexBoyWonder · Post #50 » by **RexBoyWonder** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 8:10 pm

Nitro1118 wrote:

He's a good rebounder, and much better finisher at the rim than either Haslem or Anthony, and a better jumpshooter than Joel. He's also a much better defender than Haslem, and has more size than Joel.

He rebounded 6.9 per36 last year. that's aweful for a big man.
ANYONE is a better finisher then Haslem and Joel.
He doesn't have more size then Joel.
and if you'r counting on Kenyon Martin's jumpshot...may god help us.

Chris Andersen hasn't been useful in years

He's got a PER of 19 the last two years.

That's the 4th best on out team.

I hate it when pepole just pull stuff out of their ass with nothing to back it up.

Slot Machine · Post #51 » by **Slot Machine** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 8:18 pm

Chris Andersen really isn't a good defender, he gets a ton of blocks but his defense in other areas is very lacking.

Kenyon finishes better at the rim and his TRBper36 are probably bad last year due to him playing with Reggie Evans. His rebounding looks fine before last year and it's hard to believe he'd fall off that significantly in one year.

imchillin · Post #52 » by **imchillin** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 9:39 pm

Kenyon fits our team, hes a heat type player, hes intense, he plays hard all the time. hes a great defender. This makes it easier for Lebron, Bosh, Battier etc.

We do need a rebounder and i can't think of anyone we can afford that can get us rebounds...Unless we go to the D-league and just pick up the top rebounder or something.

and i'm not sure chris anderson fits here, personality wise..he comes with his own baggage

EscapoTHB · Post #53 » by **EscapoTHB** » Thu Jan 3, 2013 10:48 pm

Id rather go the d league route.

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The Gump · Post #54 » by **The Gump** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 2:58 am

For all intents and purposes, Haslem and Martin are essentially the same player at this point. Martin is a better finisher in the paint, but Haslem is a clearly better rebounder. Martin may bring a little more to the table defensively, but probably not enough to justify making a move like that and potentially disrupting team chemistry.

Sadly, we're probably just stuck with Haslem this year, so we just need to hope he plays better.

Pimpwerx · Post #55 » by **Pimpwerx** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 3:20 am

Any idea how JHam is doing over in Europe? I mean, we drafted a center last year. Personally, I think our best option for a center would have been drafting one in the 1st round last year. Ezeli would have been better than anyone on the FA market right now. PEACE.

EscapoTHB · Post #56 » by **EscapoTHB** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 3:38 am

Pimpwerx wrote:Any idea how JHam is doing over in Europe? I mean, we drafted a center last year. Personally, I think our best option for a center would have been drafting one in the 1st round last year. Ezeli would have been better than anyone on the FA market right now. PEACE.

Ezeli wouldn't make this team. Dude has worse hands than Joel. He makes Joel look like Hakeem

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Post #57 » by **GameTime_3** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 4:52 am

EscapoTHB wrote:
Pimpwerx wrote:Any idea how JHam is doing over in Europe? I mean, we drafted a center last year. Personally, I think our best option for a center would have been drafting one in the 1st round last year. Ezeli would have been better than anyone on the FA market right now. PEACE.

Ezeli wouldn't make this team. Dude has worse hands than Joel. He makes Joel look like Hakeem

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I've seen Ezeli play a few times and no way does he have hands of Joel Anthony. The dude doesn't have a huge Offensive BBIQ but he knows how to get boards and can dunk the ball(Something Joel can't do). I would take him on this team above Harrelson, Dex and maybe even over Joel. Joel brings more energy and shot blocking but Joel makes us play 4-5 on offense.

ReturnofMVP3 · Post #58 » by **ReturnofMVP3** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 5:20 am

krikor wrote:well he is selling his house

http://www.usatoday.com/story/gameon/20 ... m/1791981/

5 million seems like penuts for a house of that nature

. Something like that in LA could cost you around 15 mill+

Nitro1118 · Post #59 » by **Nitro1118** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 7:48 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:He rebounded 6.9 per36 last year. that's aweful for a big man.
ANYONE is a better finisher then Haslem and Joel.
He doesn't have more size then Joel.
and if you'r counting on Kenyon Martin's jumpshot...may god help us.

1) Last year he was playing in a frontcourt with 3 of the best rebounders in the league...Griffin, Evans and Jordan. The year before last year he was up around 9 rebounds per 36min. The year before that he was at 10 rebounds per 36min.

2) He absolutely does more have size than Joel. I'd give him at least an inch and 20lbs over Joel. You won't be pushing him around like people do Joel down low.

3) No one is counting on Kenyon for his jumper...or anything for that matter. He'd be a vet minimum contract. You don't get serious game-changers for that price, especially mid-season. What you get is an upgrade and depth. He can give you a certain combo of things that Haslem and Joel can't. He provides far more offense and rebounding than Joel, and he's tougher, a better finisher and defender than Haslem. Now, he has his flaws, and is far from an elite player, but right now the Heat have the thinnest, and one of the weakest big rotation in the league. He could make that situation better.

He's got a PER of 19 the last two years.

That's the 4th best on out team.

I hate it when pepole just pull stuff out of their ass with nothing to back it up.

[/quote]

Context context context...he missed half the season the last two years due to injury, and could play only 15MPG those two years because of injury. So, yes his PER is ok, but you can find many players with good PER's in very limited minutes.

And even though he was a very good shot blocker back in the day, I'd give the edge to Martin in all-around defense.

ricochet · Post #60 » by **ricochet** » Fri Jan 4, 2013 8:04 am

Nitro1118 wrote:
RexBoyWonder wrote:He rebounded 6.9 per36 last year. that's aweful for a big man.
ANYONE is a better finisher then Haslem and Joel.
He doesn't have more size then Joel.
and if you'r counting on Kenyon Martin's jumpshot...may god help us.

1) Last year he was playing in a frontcourt with 3 of the best rebounders in the league...Griffin, Evans and Jordan. The year before last year he was up around 9 rebounds per 36min. The year before that he was at 10 rebounds per 36min.

2) He absolutely does more have size than Joel. I'd give him at least an inch and 20lbs over Joel. You won't be pushing him around like people do Joel down low.

3) No one is counting on Kenyon for his jumper...or anything for that matter. He'd be a vet minimum contract. You don't get serious game-changers for that price, especially mid-season. What you get is an upgrade and depth. He can give you a certain combo of things that Haslem and Joel can't. He provides far more offense and rebounding than Joel, and he's tougher, a better finisher and defender than Haslem. Now, he has his flaws, and is far from an elite player, but right now the Heat have the thinnest, and one of the weakest big rotation in the league. He could make that situation better.

He's got a PER of 19 the last two years.

That's the 4th best on out team.

I hate it when pepole just pull stuff out of their ass with nothing to back it up.

Context context context...he missed half the season the last two years due to injury, and could play only 15MPG those two years because of injury. So, yes his PER is ok, but you can find many players with good PER's in very limited minutes.

And even though he was a very good shot blocker back in the day, I'd give the edge to Martin in all-around defense.

Exactly the points I wanted to make.