Around the NBA part 2

[Falstaffxx]

JR is just on another level this year.

He has been much better than I expected. If he can continue at this level, it will be big.

[Capn'O]

The "Can Melo play with Amar'e" questions are just pathetic at this point. Melo scored 40 **** points tonight and Stat's challenges had nothing to do with spacing... just a lack of rhythm. This is really the first he's played against contact in what? 6 months except for one game in the preseason? He's going to be rusty. But he's finding his spots just fine.

Not to turn this thread into being about the Knicks, but I think the injuries to Amare and now Felton were blessings in disguise. I don't think the Knicks would be anywhere near this good with a healthy Amare starting the season. I have wanted Amare off the bench for awhile now. It is clearly best for the team.

Well, it set the hierarchy once and for all. I think Amare will be starting by season's end. Or at least getting the lion's share of minutes at that spot.

[ibraheim718]

JR is just on another level this year.

He has been much better than I expected. If he can continue at this level, it will be big.

Last year was a horrible shooting year for him. When the offers come knocking it's going to be hard to not see JR walking. I wouldn't blame him.. he needs to make the cash up that he's been missing out on.

[Capn'O]

The corollary to all I have said is I'm terrified of Jimmy Butler. His defense is the most impressive I've seen since prime Bowen or Artest. Just nasty. Bulls can single cover Melo this year. DO NOT WANT!

[GettinitDone]

^All this Melo scoring 40-45 pts for us to get a W, while most (Melo) fans are ecstatic, I'm on the other hand quite concerned.

He has been scoring 30-40s in Denver and what's the pattern? It's only in regular season, and in playoffs, other teams just know how to contain him, or let him score 30-40 and Nugs still lost anyway.

The very context that "Melo has to score 40-45 pts for Knicks to win" is clearly a flaw, if it is not stopped in Round 1, it is stopped in Round 2 or ECF.

I do think the system we played early in regular season when passing was flawless, fluid, and effortless, that's the true system for contending for championship.

[ibraheim718]

The corollary to all I have said is I'm terrified of Jimmy Butler. His defense is the most impressive I've seen since prime Bowen or Artest. Just nasty. Bulls can single cover Melo this year. DO NOT WANT!

That kid is strong as hell... He's actually like a cross between Bowen and Artest.

[Falstaffxx]

^All this Melo scoring 40-45 pts for us to get a W, while most (Melo) fans are ecstatic, I'm on the other hand quite concerned.

He has been scoring 30-40s in Denver and what's the pattern? It's only in regular season, and in playoffs, other teams just know how to contain him, or let him score 30-40 and Nugs still lost anyway.

The very context that "Melo has to score 40-45 pts for Knicks to win" is clearly a flaw, if it is not stopped in Round 1, it is stopped in Round 2 or ECF.

I do think the system we played early in regular season when passing was flawless, fluid, and effortless, that's the true system for contending for championship.

Well, the Knicks this year are similar, a little better so far, in strength to the 2009 and 2010 Nuggets right? Those teams won 53 and 54 games. The Knicks this year are on pace for probably like 56-57 wins, right?

[Capn'O]

^All this Melo scoring 40-45 pts for us to get a W, while most (Melo) fans are ecstatic, I'm on the other hand quite concerned.

He has been scoring 30-40s in Denver and what's the pattern? It's only in regular season, and in playoffs, other teams just know how to contain him, or let him score 30-40 and Nugs still lost anyway.

The very context that "Melo has to score 40-45 pts for Knicks to win" is clearly a flaw, if it is not stopped in Round 1, it is stopped in Round 2 or ECF.

I do think the system we played early in regular season when passing was flawless, fluid, and effortless, that's the true system for contending for championship.

This is why Amare needs to be healthy. And Ray. He won't need to score as many.

Defenses have adjusted to the early season ball movement by swarming the perimeter and cutting out the 3 forcing Melo to score 1 on 1 as the highest efficiency play. He does this pretty efficiently but the %s aren't quite as high as when we were hitting the 3 ball at 40%.

Having two guys that really can't be single covered + JR except by elite defenders is critical. It will set up so much for guys like Vak, Cope, Kidd, and even Chandler off the offensive glass. We're seeing it already with Amare back in.

[Capn'O]

The corollary to all I have said is I'm terrified of Jimmy Butler. His defense is the most impressive I've seen since prime Bowen or Artest. Just nasty. Bulls can single cover Melo this year. DO NOT WANT!

That kid is strong as hell... He's actually like a cross between Bowen and Artest.

Yeah. **** that guy. Throw in Rose... I wasn't too worried about the Bulls last year as we had two guys that could really smoke them. This year - give them to the Heat. Let those two teams fight it out.

[Butch718]

The corollary to all I have said is I'm terrified of Jimmy Butler. His defense is the most impressive I've seen since prime Bowen or Artest. Just nasty. Bulls can single cover Melo this year. DO NOT WANT!

He's got a lot of length too. That's one team I want to avoid in the playoffs, especially if they have a healthy Rose at the end of the season. You gotta admire what Thibs has done with that team. Still elite defensively and have remained extremely competitive without their best player.

[Capn'O]

1 year later: The McGee for Nene trade is still WTF for Denver. Seriously. What were they thinking? Is that really worth 3 mil to them?

[GettinitDone]

^Nene is known for his big pussy showings on the road and in clutch. He can put 26 and 14 one game and 6 and 4 the next game. He can be this beast dunking on guys and completely dominate the paint and then be a Kwame Brown 2 quarters later in the same game. He disappears in big games. For all of his scoring skill set (ability to knock down 15-18 footers, dunk on people) he has never scored 30 pts in a game. Big men who are allergic to rebounding, first name comes to mind is Brook Lopez, then to me, Nene is second.

At least McGee has talent to be a star once he matures. It is a risk (trading proven for talent) that few GMs in this L have guts to do, I admire their GM Masai Ujiri and the owner Josh Kroenke for fully trusting Ujiri to run the show and not meddle.

[GettinitDone]

^All this Melo scoring 40-45 pts for us to get a W, while most (Melo) fans are ecstatic, I'm on the other hand quite concerned.

He has been scoring 30-40s in Denver and what's the pattern? It's only in regular season, and in playoffs, other teams just know how to contain him, or let him score 30-40 and Nugs still lost anyway.

The very context that "Melo has to score 40-45 pts for Knicks to win" is clearly a flaw, if it is not stopped in Round 1, it is stopped in Round 2 or ECF.

I do think the system we played early in regular season when passing was flawless, fluid, and effortless, that's the true system for contending for championship.

Well, the Knicks this year are similar, a little better so far, in strength to the 2009 and 2010 Nuggets right? Those teams won 53 and 54 games. The Knicks this year are on pace for probably like 56-57 wins, right?

The difference between those Melo's Nuggets teams and this year Knicks is the latter has a bunch of vets who won't deal with BS/ non-sense that come from usually young players or diva stars (like Melo was once). They just don't have time for such things, and keep in mind they're only paid veteran minimum, so they're a bit pissed too ("hey I'm only getting paid $1M this year, we better get that championship or I'd be very pissed"). These are vets who were once all stars, and surely they get the instant respect. The set standard for how the young players have to approach practices and games. The standard is definitely higher this year and the vets won't accept anything less.

It's not coincidence Melo seems so mature (his diva behaviors are almost non-existent) and engaged this season, even compared to just last season. And JR, the other knucklehead supposedly destined to have a career known as supertalent who was never able to overcome ugly shot selection and personal agendas is able to have breakout season... and Felton played brilliantly in first month of season before old demons and injuries got the best of him again.

I believe this veteran presence is EXACTLY what troubled but talented young players like DeMarcus Cousins and John Wall need. They need tough love. In Sacramento and Washington, there's noone who has courage to get in their faces and tell him to cut the BS. Put them on Knicks, and Sheed/ KT would be the bad cop and get in Cousins' face if he messes up or talks back to Woody, or Kidd/ Camby would be the good cop giving him advice. If Cousins talked back, then Sheed would lay him on the ass. It's what these talented but non-sense kids need, someone who acts in their best interest while never afraid of their superstar power/ hierarchy within the organization.

[GettinitDone]

Lin's defense (you guys talking Jimmy Butler's?)






I guess he stole a thing or two from Shump before he left.

[JustaKnickFan]

^All this Melo scoring 40-45 pts for us to get a W, while most (Melo) fans are ecstatic, I'm on the other hand quite concerned.

He has been scoring 30-40s in Denver and what's the pattern? It's only in regular season, and in playoffs, other teams just know how to contain him, or let him score 30-40 and Nugs still lost anyway.

The very context that "Melo has to score 40-45 pts for Knicks to win" is clearly a flaw, if it is not stopped in Round 1, it is stopped in Round 2 or ECF.

I do think the system we played early in regular season when passing was flawless, fluid, and effortless, that's the true system for contending for championship.

Both years in the playoffs Melo was surrounded with trash. Flu-ridden Chandler, Landry Fields, Baron Davis, Toney Douglas, Bibby, Jared Jeffries, etc. This year will be different now that he has a team with a bunch of guys who can score and keep defenses honest.

Also, the whole "Knicks with Lin would be better" is such BS it astounds me. How can you do better than this start? This start was something nobody really saw coming. Also, I feel like a lot of people are overrating Lin, and are making up this "Felton has an agenda against good PGs" thing. First off, Felton will always put up those 15 shots whether its against Lin or Jameer Nelson. He has to, and the coaching staff encourages him to. Second, Felton has had great games against some of the best teams, like the Spurs and Heat (twice), while Lin ended up airballing when he had a chance to take the lead. Lastly, I'm still not sure if Lin can handle the 82-game NBA season. Last year he seemed exhausted after those 7 games of Linsanity and that definitely showed against Miami when they pressed him.

[Wolfgang]

If you honestly haven't watched the Rockets play this year, especially Lin since Knicks fans can't let him go, then don't comment on him. Then was then. Now is now. He's a better player now since last year, especially his defense. Numbers don't tell everything.

[holly1985]

If you honestly haven't watched the Rockets play this year, especially Lin since Knicks fans can't let him go, then don't comment on him. Then was then. Now is now. He's a better player now since last year, especially his defense. Numbers don't tell everything.

He shoots worse , also not as aggressive as last season. It hursts the Rockets at times.
But his passing and defense are better. Overall still a lot to work on.

[21shumpshumpst]

If you honestly haven't watched the Rockets play this year, especially Lin since Knicks fans can't let him go, then don't comment on him. Then was then. Now is now. He's a better player now since last year, especially his defense. Numbers don't tell everything.

Positives for Lin
Very good at steals
very good at rebounding for his size
Suited for the up tempo game that the rockets play

Bad for lin
Horrible at turnovers
Horrible at the 3ball
Streaky as can be (reminds me of gallo, can have one really great game or quarter then stinkers to follow)

He is not awful nor is he this basketball god you guys make him out to be.

Harden is the reason that team goes. Then Parsons. Then Lin. Then Asik.

[Falstaffxx]

If you honestly haven't watched the Rockets play this year, especially Lin since Knicks fans can't let him go, then don't comment on him. Then was then. Now is now. He's a better player now since last year, especially his defense. Numbers don't tell everything.

Positives for Lin
Very good at steals
very good at rebounding for his size
Suited for the up tempo game that the rockets play

Bad for lin
Horrible at turnovers
Horrible at the 3ball
Streaky as can be (reminds me of gallo, can have one really great game or quarter then stinkers to follow)

He is not awful nor is he this basketball god you guys make him out to be.

Harden is the reason that team goes. Then Parsons. Then Lin. Then Asik.

He's not "horrible at turnovers" - his turnovers are just a little high. He's also not particularly "streaky," except on the 3-point shot which you decided to make into a separate bullet point. He contributes even when his shot is off - he made nice contributions to several recent Rockets wins even when he didn't score a lot. His general good play is part of the reason why the Rockets have been winning.

It's funny that the only only positives you could find are steals, rebounding and being "suited" to up-tempo. No "good at getting to the rim," no "good play-maker," no "good at controlling the tempo," no "high-effort player," just "suited" to up-tempo, lol.

[ORANGEandBLUE]

I'm not sure Lin is a better PG for this team now, in the Spring, or even in the next few years. Felton was crucial to our offensive success early this season. He has more experience reading defenses and playing PG, which has helped our execution. Guys know when and where to be when Felton is on the floor. He takes care of the ball. Before his injury, he was a lights-out floor spacer. And all of this played into us playing at a record-breaking level offensively. For all we know, we'll go right back to this level of production when Felton's hand is healthy and he resumes shooting 40% from 3.

Lin doesn't really fit what we were doing. He is not the guy you want orchestrating a methodical, conservative, inside-outside approach. He is an uptempo PG. Lin would have been great here as a 6th man, but I'd prefer JR in that role.

When we let Lin go my biggest fear was that he's develop into an above-average outside shooter. I knew he'd be a solid starter. But until he becomes a better shooter, he is still untapped potential.