Around the NBA part 2

Post #1161 » by **j4remi** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:14 pm

The West isn't as monstrous this year imo...so they have an outside shot, not of making 48 wins happen...but getting an 8th seed.

Fat Kat · Post #1162 » by **Fat Kat** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:16 pm

Lakers aren't making the playoffs. MikeD will make sure of that.

Woodsanity · Post #1163 » by **Woodsanity** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:24 pm

RHODEY wrote:The Clippers' lone Achilles's heel is that they look rather ordinary in a half court set. We saw this last night for stretches in the 3rd qtr. versus Dallas. Blake Griffin does not impress me when he is not dunking and CP3 is not really a go to stud, he's a play making stud.

IMO, they are a deeper versus of those Nets teams that made the finals... .

When it comes down to it all the depth in the world(which they have) wont makeup for these shortcomings in the later rounds of the playoffs.

Not really CP3 is one of the best closers in the league. As for their half court offense. It is fine. They just made dumb turnovers all game. The Clippers are not a running team with CP3 running the offense. Most of their fastbreaks come off steals and TOs.

j4remi wrote:The West isn't as monstrous this year imo...so they have an outside shot, not of making 48 wins happen...but getting an 8th seed.

Not as monstrous compared to when?

OKC
Clippers
Spurs
Grizzlies
GSW
Rockets
Denver

are all locks.

Then you have Utah, Portland, Minnesota, LAL, Dallas fighting for that last seed. 3 of those teams would be a middle of the pack playoff seed in the East.

Post #1164 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:37 pm

Not to start nothing, but how exactly is Houston and Denver locks?

Houston has issues playing their own conference, and Denver isn't a good road team.

it's rare to see a WC team make the playoffs with those odds against them.

The Lakers have just as much shot as they do imo, but the got to start winning to have a shot.

Fat Kat · Post #1165 » by **Fat Kat** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:43 pm

Heat sign C Josh Harrellson to a 10-day contract.

Post #1166 » by **j4remi** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:55 pm

Woodsanity wrote:
Not as monstrous compared to when?

OKC
Clippers
Spurs
Grizzlies
GSW
Rockets
Denver

are all locks.

Then you have Utah, Portland, Minnesota, LAL, Dallas fighting for that last seed. 3 of those teams would be a middle of the pack playoff seed in the East.

What I'm saying is, this year there's more parity which is why you listed 5 teams all in the race for the 8 seed instead of the typical 2 or 3 while everyone else is tanking. The fact that LAL has even an outside shot shows that the bottom half of the West is weaker this year.

Wolfgang · Post #1167 » by **Wolfgang** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:00 pm

What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

Post #1168 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:04 pm

Wolfgang wrote:What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

Post #1169 » by **j4remi** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:04 pm

Wolfgang wrote:What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

That's been the rule for over a decade now. In '03 the East's fourth seed wouldn't have made the playoff out West with their record. But what I'm saying is in the last few years (I don't care to see how far back this lasts) it's been pretty clear cut who the top 9 or 10 teams were...so teams would ALREADY be ready to tank. It's rare you see so many teams that have a legitimate shot at the playoffs.

Post #1170 » by **j4remi** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:06 pm

Thugger HBC wrote:Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

I'd give the Grizz their props too to be fair. I still don't get how GSW is doing what they're doing except to say...yeah the West just isn't what it was.

Wolfgang · Post #1171 » by **Wolfgang** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:09 pm

Thugger HBC wrote:
Wolfgang wrote:What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

I'm speaking in terms of depth. There will always be only a handful of teams that can win the championship in the NBA. But people think the West is like 11, 12 teams deep that could be fighting for 8 spots. That's pretty good. And mind you that these guys face each other more since they're all in the same conference.

Let's be honest. Who thought the Warriors and Rockets would have the records they have currently? Lakers aren't 100%. Minnesota isn't 100%. ESPN thinks the Lakers have a chance at making the playoffs and they're currently in the 11th spot.

Post #1172 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:12 pm

j4remi wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

I'd give the Grizz their props too to be fair. I still don't get how GSW is doing what they're doing except to say...yeah the West just isn't what it was.

Offensively GS plays very similar to the Clippers, which is why they've beat them twice this season already.

I'd pay top dollar to rig the system and watch those two in the first round.

Honestly not impressed with the Grizzlies, they are playoff fodder and will continue to be so.

I doubt any team out West down turns down that first round matchup.

Post #1173 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:13 pm

Wolfgang wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:
Wolfgang wrote:What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

I'm speaking in terms of depth. There will always be only a handful of teams that can win the championship in the NBA. But people think the West is like 11, 12 teams deep that could be fighting for 8 spots. That's pretty good. And mind you that these guys face each other more since they're all in the same conference.

Let's be honest. Who thought the Warriors and Rockets would have the records they have currently? Lakers aren't 100%. Minnesota isn't 100%. ESPN thinks the Lakers have a chance at making the playoffs and they're currently in the 11th spot.

Based on this post, it sounds like you're agreeing that the West is only 3 deep.

Wolfgang · Post #1174 » by **Wolfgang** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:16 pm

If you want to say who can win the title if it came down to the Finals. I'd say 5,6 teams in the west could beat the eastern teams.

Post #1175 » by **j4remi** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:21 pm

Wolfgang wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:
Wolfgang wrote:What...

The West is amazing. Destroys the pathetic leastern conference.

Only the top three west teams, the rest are not that impressive, regardless of their record against the East.

I'm speaking in terms of depth. There will always be only a handful of teams that can win the championship in the NBA. But people think the West is like 11, 12 teams deep that could be fighting for 8 spots. That's pretty good. And mind you that these guys face each other more since they're all in the same conference.

Let's be honest. Who thought the Warriors and Rockets would have the records they have currently? Lakers aren't 100%. Minnesota isn't 100%. ESPN thinks the Lakers have a chance at making the playoffs and they're currently in the 11th spot.

I think we agree, there's parity out West...but I think that the number of teams fighting for the 8th spot is because the bottom half of the West isn't as strong. The "monstrous" that I'm talking about isn't top to bottom...it's that there were typically 2 or 3 first round match-ups that you really didn't know who would win (Lakers take the 60 win Suns to 7 games for instance) because 1-8 was typically stacked and the rest was weak...now the talent is more evenly distributed, but I can probably guess who will win every match-up except maybe 4 v 5.

Thugger, on the Grizz, I really feel their style of play is built for playoff battles moreso than teams like the Clips and Warriors.

Post #1176 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:24 pm

Wolfgang wrote:If you want to say who can win the title if it came down to the Finals. I'd say 5,6 teams in the west could beat the eastern teams.

You're entitled to that, although it doesn't make any sense to me.

Post #1177 » by **Thugger HBC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:27 pm

it isn't the Grizzlies style of play, it's there mentality, just punch them and their confidence goes straight out the window.

talent isn't the issue with them, they are a very mentally weak team.

Quick Kick · Post #1178 » by **Quick Kick** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:02 pm

5-6 teams? Thats being generous. Id say Clips, Spurs, and Thunder are the only real threats to win the title. The rest are pretenders.

Knicks, Heat, Bulls (with healthy Rose), and Celtics (not counting them out) all have a great shot at winning it all as well. The East is not as weak as you think.

yaboynyp · Post #1179 » by **yaboynyp** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:01 pm

ibraheim718 wrote:Low turnovers is the new ball movement on the board. Last few years it was all about "move the ball" "move the ball" this year it's all about "don't turn the ball over" "don't turn the ball over".

There have been some great teams that turned the ball over all the time. The 2008 Celtics were 27th in the league in turnovers. The first Heat championship was 16th the second 23rd.. the 2003 Spurs were 23rd. The 94 rockets were 17th the 95 Rockets were 19th..

You don't want to encourage turning the ball over of course.. but not turning the ball over doesn't necessarily equate to a championship.

It really comes down to overall possessions.. Obviously if you shoot 10 more shots than the other team more often or not you will win (elite vs elite) If you have a high T.O rate than you have to compensate with being able to force to’s or say a high Off rebounding percentage etc..

ibraheim718 · Post #1180 » by **ibraheim718** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:23 pm

yaboynyp wrote:
ibraheim718 wrote:Low turnovers is the new ball movement on the board. Last few years it was all about "move the ball" "move the ball" this year it's all about "don't turn the ball over" "don't turn the ball over".

There have been some great teams that turned the ball over all the time. The 2008 Celtics were 27th in the league in turnovers. The first Heat championship was 16th the second 23rd.. the 2003 Spurs were 23rd. The 94 rockets were 17th the 95 Rockets were 19th..

You don't want to encourage turning the ball over of course.. but not turning the ball over doesn't necessarily equate to a championship.

It really comes down to overall possessions.. Obviously if you shoot 10 more shots than the other team more often or not you will win (elite vs elite) If you have a high T.O rate than you have to compensate with being able to force to’s or say a high Off rebounding percentage etc..

I can agree with that. What I want to see from a team most importantly is aggression.. Basketball is a sport where a specific isolated stat never tell the whole story... Talent gets you home but it's not always enough... what you always need is endurance, aggression, and poise. If you have a team overly concerned with not turning the ball over you lose some aggression and you also lose some creativity.

The point I made last year about ball movement was, yes it's important.. but player movement is just as important.. the two need to go hand in hand. And my point this year about turnovers is that they can easily be overcome and each year you see really good teams doing just that... case in point OKC last year who led the league in turnovers and I think won 60 games.. largely because they were an extremely aggressive team. Basketball really is a possession by possession game.. with 4th quarter possessions being extremely important.