The Mike Dunlap Thread

JMAC3 · Post #521 » by **JMAC3** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 6:17 pm

You guys arent getting my point. I am not saying that we havent improved to some degree, because we clearly have. My point is the teams should be improved our roster is twice as good as it was last year, but we havent gotten wins to show the difference. My point is that we are good enough to win some of these games, but Dunlap is holding us back because he gets outcoached every single game.

We have gotten beaten badly more then the boxscore indicates, because we will be down 25 the entire game and then we will close it to 10 or 12 by the end of the game when other team doesnt care. Also, we have lost a ton of close games where we turned the ball over or didnt get up a decent shot and that falls back on the coach most times.

I guess my main point is that with another coach I think we have at least 5 more wins right now, which isnt monumental. But I do not want to see Dunlap coaching this team next year as of right now. So why wait...

Post #522 » by **fatlever** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 6:54 pm

i really dont think there is a coach on the planet who would have this team at 12 wins at this point in the season.

did dunlap cost us a game or two? yeah, that portland game comes to mind. that was on him.

what dunlap has taken away from this team in terms of giving up 3s he has also improved our team in terms of not giving up as many points in the paint. we were atrocious at defending the paint last year.

im not sure there are many coaches out there that could get this team playing as hard as they do. that is the one major difference between last year. this team dives for loose balls, jumps in the stands for tipped passes, sprints down the floor on fast breaks, runs back on defense.

dunlap made the offense easier on the eyes by freeing kemba and speeding up the tempo and by forcing the guards to attack the basket. its still awful by nba comparison, but nothing like last year.

our defense the past two games has been better, closer to what we did in the early part of november. the hornets hit some 3s on us, but they worked hard for most of those 3s (except a few). it was nothing like the pathetic display of defending we showed vs the spurs, warriors and suns recently.

as we have discussed many times though, nothing will change until we get some two-way bigs on the roster. we dont have a single big man who should be getting meaningful minutes on a quality nba team. not one. biz ideally should be the 3rd or 4th big in a rotation getting 10-15 minutes a night, not starting and playing 30+. tyrus was the closest thing to a two-way big we had on the roster and he is awful, but we miss him as crazy as that sounds. tyrus is better than warrick in nearly every facet of the game, better rebounder, defender, mid-range shooter. warrick might be slightly better in the post.

all this being said, we do need to see some improvement in-season from this team to know dunlap is making a difference.

it probably also would have been a good idea for dunlap to have more experience on his bench.

Post #523 » by **fatlever** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 6:58 pm

and at what point do we have to point the finger at the players who have played major minutes in both seasons, for two different coaches? kemba, hendo and biz (and to a lesser degree, tyrus, reggie and diop)

JT2006 · Post #524 » by **JT2006** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:30 pm

JMAC3 wrote:You guys arent getting my point.

Maybe we don't care about your point, and just think you should go home if you're so tired of the team. What's the point of watching something you hate? Get a life if this bothers you so much.

HornetJail · Post #525 » by **HornetJail** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:30 pm

Shut up crunk.

JT2006 · Post #526 » by **JT2006** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:38 pm

really? you think that will be helpful?

Post #527 » by **fatlever** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:13 pm

get this back on topic

toddlincoln · Post #528 » by **toddlincoln** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:27 pm

Not sure what people are expecting..?? Our talent level is absolutely not much higher than it was last year. The main difference is Kemba Walker is playing well and MKG has flashes of what will come. We have two good starters plus a lot of a couple good bench-calibre players (Sessions, Taylor) , a ton of mediocre roleplayers (Henderson, Ben Gordon, Biyombo, Mullens, Haywood) and an equal amount of scrubs (Warrick, Reggie Williams, Diop) playing WAYYYY too many minutes. To suggest that any of this is Dunlap's doing is idiotic.

We are losing because we don't have the frontcourt necessary to win in the NBA. Our defensive rebounding is atrocious -- that blame is squarely on our bigs. MKG is rebounding like a madman for a rookie SF (equivalent to a decent starting PF) and we're still last or near last in the league in def. rebounding %. Our interior defense is similarly horrible. This all falls on Biyombo/Mullens/Warrick/Haywood. Warrick is a scrub and shouldn't be expected to be our starter. Mullens shouldn't be playing anything but spot minutes and same for Biyombo. Eliminating Mullens from the roster due to his injury will probably net us a few games because he's seriously holding back defensively.

BeesWax · Post #529 » by **BeesWax** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 11:29 pm

JMAC3 wrote:You guys arent getting my point. I am not saying that we havent improved to some degree, because we clearly have. My point is the teams should be improved our roster is twice as good as it was last year, but we havent gotten wins to show the difference. My point is that we are good enough to win some of these games, but Dunlap is holding us back because he gets outcoached every single game.

We have gotten beaten badly more then the boxscore indicates, because we will be down 25 the entire game and then we will close it to 10 or 12 by the end of the game when other team doesnt care. Also, we have lost a ton of close games where we turned the ball over or didnt get up a decent shot and that falls back on the coach most times.

I guess my main point is that with another coach I think we have at least 5 more wins right now, which isnt monumental. But I do not want to see Dunlap coaching this team next year as of right now. So why wait...

I think you don't get our point. Our point is you are wrong and Dunlap has done well with what he has. We are not much more talented then last year except with young guys who are in need of coaching which he is doing well. Our guys are learning and improving therefore he is doing a solid job with what needs to be done. We have some of the worst developed talent in the league and he is improving them and making them develope.

RichBoy923 · Post #530 » by **RichBoy923** » Tue Jan 1, 2013 2:49 am

I will say I am convinced he doesn't draw up/practice/stress inbounds plays, at all. I haven't seen a worse inbounding team in my time watching the NBA.

I won't give up on him this soon. Even though we are losing, I think plenty of that has to do with the teams we play. Sure, we might not be playing as good as we did at the beginning of the season but considering the talent we have, I would say we aren't playing as bad as our record indicates. He does do some things that confuse me such as that one period where he showed no consistency in the lineup. That surely can't help build consistency when you are constantly messing with the lineup.

As fans we just have become impatient with this organization (and rightfully so) but this might be too early to give up hope on Dunlap.

Eoghan · Post #531 » by **Eoghan** » Tue Jan 1, 2013 3:42 am

I think it's pretty obvious that when Dunlap started going with the Bobkittens line ups that he's just fulfilling the FO's MO by developing the youth and doing some honest tanking. He could be playing Haywood, Sessions, and Gordon 30 minutes a game, that might have gotten us to 10-12 wins right now, but it would have stunted the growth of Biz, Mully, JT, and Kemba.

Sure, we took 2 steps forward in improving the roster compared to last year but most teams did the same if not more so. Next year will be a much more telling year of how good Dunlap is. This is a tank year.

Elden Payton · Post #532 » by **Elden Payton** » Tue Jan 1, 2013 6:55 am

^^^^^^^^^

BD on this, good words.

@JMAC3

I just wanted to post what BD's last paragraph says.

Yes we have improved but we cannot discredit how much the teams around and above us have improved also.

MasterIchiro · Post #533 » by **MasterIchiro** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:42 am

I for one am looking forward to the start of the 2013-2014 season and a new head coach. Maybe Van Gundy. Carlismo is in the right place at the right time as Brooklyn has turned around their season just before it spiraled out of control.

-Ian- · Post #534 » by **-Ian-** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:40 am

Why would Van Gundy want to come in Charlotte and coach the LOLcats?

catch20two · Post #535 » by **catch20two** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:50 am

We should've hired Jerry Sloan to right this ship when we had the chance but I think Jordan, Higgins, and Cho were wary of how he would react to the calls from upstairs about intentionally tanking.

MasterIchiro · Post #536 » by **MasterIchiro** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:52 am

-Ian- wrote:Why would Van Gundy want to come in Charlotte and coach the LOLcats?

Are you suggesting a big name coach won't come to Charlotte? I bet I can name one (and a recent one at that, rhymes with merry frown). Plus, the weather is perfect, the women are beautiful and the city is very casual compared to a pressure-cooker like NYC or Brooklyn. Plus the people are mean in those markets, the fans are obnoxious and the air is dirty.

Any other concerns?

Nanogeek · Post #537 » by **Nanogeek** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:57 pm

The team is obviously just tanking. Here is the plan I think Jordan and Cho are cooking up.

2013 PLAN
Bobcats are hoping to land a Shabazz, McElmore, Noel or Len in the draft. No chance of getting more than one of those guys the way the Pistons and Trailblazers are playing.

The only reason Tyrus hasn't been amnestied is Jordan is still hopeful he can move him.

2014 PLAN
Try to parlay Gordon and Session's expiring deals into some useful assets - especially since both those players can contribute on a team. Land a couple of lottery picks in the 2014 draft (Pistons pick will likely be ours in 2014 as its only top 8 protected) and get someone like Wiggins or Jabari Parker.

2015 PLAN
Present a team of MKG, Walker, a hopefully emerging Biyombo, Shabaaz/McElmore/Noel/Len, Wiggins/Parker and get a couple of vets to sign with all the cap space and start doing some damage in the playoffs.

HornetJail · Post #538 » by **HornetJail** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:01 pm

^ That was the original plan.

The toughest part will be getting Wiggins/Parker, because our team will likely be too talented to get a high pick like that. My hope is that we trade our 2013 pick if we don't land a top 3 pick for a 2014 early-to-mid lotto pick, giving us three, possibly four lottery picks in 2014, hopefully we strike gold with one of the picks then trade up all the other 2-3 picks to get some combination of Wiggins/Parker/Randle with those two picks and some of our other players.

Biz/Randle/MKG/Wiggins/Kemba with Mullens/Adrien/Taylor/Hendo/Sessions on the bench would be an amazing core going forward.

e4Nf6 · Post #539 » by **e4Nf6** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:20 pm

At the moment I'm reasonably happy with Dunlap...

One thing that everybody here has to remember is that the level of terrible this year and last are 100% according to plan. This is how teams not named "The Lakers" get good in the NBA, you spend a year or two being completely irredeemably awful, and then with some luck you'll landed a blue chip player via a high draft-pick or all that salary cap money you haven't been using to sign good players. How do you think the zombie Sonics got Durant? How did the Cavs get Lebron? How did the Heat get Lebron for that matter?

Given that winning even a respectable amount of games is totally impossible we should probably judge a coach based on how he develops the young players. Biz and Hendo seemed to have improved a bit. Kemba is a lot better. Taylor looks promising. It looks like he's doing all right to me.

Nanogeek · Post #540 » by **Nanogeek** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:55 pm

CHA_77_Bobcats wrote:^ That was the original plan.

The toughest part will be getting Wiggins/Parker, because our team will likely be too talented to get a high pick like that. My hope is that we trade our 2013 pick if we don't land a top 3 pick for a 2014 early-to-mid lotto pick, giving us three, possibly four lottery picks in 2014, hopefully we strike gold with one of the picks then trade up all the other 2-3 picks to get some combination of Wiggins/Parker/Randle with those two picks and some of our other players.

Biz/Randle/MKG/Wiggins/Kemba with Mullens/Adrien/Taylor/Hendo/Sessions on the bench would be an amazing core going forward.

We won't likely be much better in 2014 than we are in 2013 so we'll likely pick 5-10 in 2014. Also, we'll likely have a 9-14 pick with the Pistons pick. We may even have a Trailblazers pick in the 12-18 range in 2014. So we could have 3 picks in or around the lottery. With a bit of luck one of those might be high enough to get Wiggins or Parker. Otherwise, we might be able to package them to get something useful. Who knows?