Wiz at Jazz 9:00pm! Going for a winning west coast trip lol

[Nivek]

The shooting goes back to Wittman in part, but not because of his substitution patterns and not because he ran the offense through Nene. Coaches in general do a lousy job of picking who's having an "off night" and who's not. The percentage play is to go with your best players. Nene is the team's best offensive player, and he's a good passer.

The bigger issue with the team's shooting is their shot selection. Wizards are last in at-rim attempts and 20th in 3pt attempts, which are the most efficient shots in the game. For the Wizards, only 49% of their FGA come at-rim or from 3pt range -- last in the league. (Lg avg is 57%.) Some of this has to do with the team having personnel that's not good enough to get to the rim. Some is by choice/design, or -- at very least -- hasn't been coached away. Some of those long 2pt attempts could easily be 3pt attempts, for example, if the players were taught to come off screens and head to the 3pt line instead of a spot just inside the line.

This wouldn't fix everything, of course, but it would at least be pushing the team toward the right process.

[nate33]

The shooting goes back to Wittman in part, but not because of his substitution patterns and not because he ran the offense through Nene. Coaches in general do a lousy job of picking who's having an "off night" and who's not. The percentage play is to go with your best players. Nene is the team's best offensive player, and he's a good passer.

The bigger issue with the team's shooting is their shot selection. Wizards are last in at-rim attempts and 20th in 3pt attempts, which are the most efficient shots in the game. For the Wizards, only 49% of their FGA come at-rim or from 3pt range -- last in the league. (Lg avg is 57%.) Some of this has to do with the team having personnel that's not good enough to get to the rim. Some is by choice/design, or -- at very least -- hasn't been coached away. Some of those long 2pt attempts could easily be 3pt attempts, for example, if the players were taught to come off screens and head to the 3pt line instead of a spot just inside the line.

This wouldn't fix everything, of course, but it would at least be pushing the team toward the right process.

Interestingly, the Wizards are among the best in the league at forcing defenses to take bad shots. They rank 3rd best in the league at forcing the highest percentage of opponent attempts from 16-23 feet, and they are 3rd best in the league at forcing the fewest numbers of attempts at the rim. (They rank 12th in opponent 3Ps attempted, and 11th in 3P% defense.)

It seems that they understand the concept that at rim shots are good and long 2's are bad, they just lack the personnel to generate the right shots. It's hard to get a lot of 3's or at rim shots without penetration. Hopefully, Wall will change this.

[dobrojim]

Sorry for the reposts, the site was crashing and I guess quadruple posted

dang, you mean JW didn't go off en fuego

shyt

[dobrojim]

Nene should've just gotten a DNP tonight

UT's bigs did a great job on nene, them and the refs that allowed
them to drape themselves all over him on every drive.

we start the game by just missing a bunch of decent quality shots.
we seem to get down and ready to mail it in (as UT first gets momentum
and starts playing loose and easy) but come back just
enough to keep things interesting before a couple bonehead plays
prevent us from ever getting the lead back. Mental fatigue?
Home cooking for sure.

[hands11]

One game later and Wittman's bad at subbing/playcalling, Nene has no trade value, Trevor Booker is a bad/ awful player, and the organization is dumb from top to bottom. How anyone can blame this loss on anything but the players being unable to hit open shots is beyond me. The team shot under 36%, trailed by double digits for the majority of the game and still almost beat a better than .500 team in their home. This squad is still far from perfect offensively roster-wise and on a bad shooting night like this it becomes more evident, the Wizards are showing a lot of resolve so that's something positive that can be taken away from these tough losses. Need to be thinking of ways to improve on the team's growth vs. completely trashing the entire organization after a hard fought loss. It's something to learn from, as far as I'm concerned it's a brand new season since Wall's return. I expect the team to bounce back on Friday against Minnesota.

Can't agree....Wittman has been making questionable lineup decisions throughout and consistently sticks with lineups that are struggling for too long. I've been consistent with Néne being more valuable to us than he in on he trade block due to the contract. But even then, when he has nothing, you have to take him out or at minimum stop running the offense through him.

Exactly. I would have never put Nene back in for the end of the 4th. And I don't hate that we have Booker, but I would have tried Ves some over the last two games. Booker has a role and does some things the team needs at time. So does Ves. Randy needs to be able to determine when each can be used best.

From what I have seen the last two games, I would go with Ves first and then being in Booker if I needed more muscle.

The last two games have been ugly as far a coaching line ups go. Seems I have posted that a lot this year. I expected better from Randy.

[Dat2U]

Yes, Booker really is that much better than Vesely and Singleton. I know that's a low bar, but still. Booker doesn't stink, actually. He's not great, but he at least contributes something.

Yep, Booker at least plays like he belongs in the league. When he's healthy he's a passable rotation player. Vesely & Singleton might not even be in the league in two years.

[Dat2U]

I think it's absolutely indefensible that Wall & Beal didn't play more together. What the **** is this team trying to accomplish?

[hands11]

Vesely is not better than Booker, but that's not to say Booker is any good. Its like saying a D student is better than a F student. What Vesely does do those is move better without the ball instead of getting in the way and looking always out of position, which Booker seems to do. Frankly they both should be benched & Singleton should be brought out of the dog house or the rotation should be tightened and Ariza should get some minutes at the 4.

I have to agree with jive. No Ves is not better than Booker but, imo, because of his size and skillset he does more than Trevor to help this team win, including keeping rebounds/loose balls alive, finding the open man with nifty passes and running the court for alley oops from Wall and the other guards.

Maybe you can blame Witt's sub patterns for the loss to Utah, but I'm more inclined to blame the absolutely horrific shooting night that Nene had. The big Brazilian missed a ton of layups and easy putbacks. I don't expect Nene to have a game like that very often.

BTW, I'd also like to see more C. Singleton.

Also, someone please tell Emeka to stop taking those 15 foot jumpers that he rarely makes...open or not. Love Okafor's board work though. No Zard in recent memory has rebounded as well as Emeka has the last few weeks.

I think most of us are saying the same thing. Better coaching would help. Just need to see what is going on and adjust. Each player has their skills and some nights they are better then other. As for Okafor and that shot. I don't mind him taking it. Some night he is really one with it and it helps the offense. But what I have seen from him is, you can tell the nights that shot is off and it doesn't tend to get better that same night. If he clanks one bad, you can see he is off. Okafor has been playing pretty well though. I don't have a lot of complaints about him regarding his recent play. But wow was Nene a black hole last night. I can't remember seeing him look so bad. So when Nene and Okafor are off, that really hurts. That's why they needed to try something different. You could see neither of them would find their scoring game. So you needed Kevin to help and Kevin and Booker wasn't working. At least Ves would have passed it around and run fast breaks with Wall. It deserved a look even if it was only for 4 minutes. They needed all hands on deck and we didn't get to see that.

[DCZards]

It seems that they understand the concept that at rim shots are good and long 2's are bad, they just lack the personnel to generate the right shots. It's hard to get a lot of 3's or at rim shots without penetration. Hopefully, Wall will change this.

You're already starting to see the Zards getting more open 3s as a result of Wall pushing the ball and putting pressure on the defense. Johnny Ballgame's presence makes a real difference. It will get even better as Wall gets in better game shape and grows more accustomed to playing with Beal and Webster.

[tontoz]

You're already starting to see the Zards getting more open 3s as a result of Wall pushing the ball and putting pressure on the defense. Johnny Ballgame's presence makes a real difference. It will get even better as Wall gets in better game shape and grows more accustomed to playing with Beal and Webster.

The problem is that Wall isn't playing much with Beal and Webster. At this point i think it is time to start him.

[AWIZZINGBULLET]

I have to agree with jive. No Ves is not better than Booker but, imo, because of his size and skillset he does more than Trevor to help this team win, including keeping rebounds/loose balls alive, finding the open man with nifty passes and running the court for alley oops from Wall and the other guards.

I can't believe how short memories are on this board. Just because you have seen a guy in a while, doesn't mean that he is better than the guys already in the game. Vesely would have been destroyed by Millsap. He's just not strong enough to hold his position defensively. Vesely would have had 4 fouls in about 6 minutes. There may be some situations when Vesely might make sense, like when the opponent has a stretch 4 in the game, but last night was not one of them. It was a brawl in the paint - no place for a weakling like Vesely.

And if Vesely did get put in, and he got abused defensively, everyone on the board would be screaming that Wittman is an idiot.

Should the Wizards win tomorrow night you'll find it's even shorter. Booker was well over the 50% fg percentage mark when he was healthy last season and also a better than average rebounder at his size--- more than can be said for Seraphin, Nene, and Vesely. Folks should at least let the man work himself back into a groove, get a nice size sample of his work and then pass judgment.

[dandridge 10]

I agree with Nate that there is too much Monday morning quarterbacking on this site. Its easy to wait until after the outcome of a game to sit back and say the coach should have done something differently. Different doesn't necessarily mean it would result in better results.

Its funny how no one questions any rotations when the Wizards win. If the Wizards won last night, no one would be questioning why Witman put Nene back in the game.

The fact of the matter was Nene had an off night. However, I have seen him have off nights before, but still make winning plays at the end of games. He is our best big man and you want your best players on the court at crunch time. I can understand Wittman putting him back in. If Wittman didn't put Nene back in the game and we lost, people would be complaining about that too.

Bottom line is no one played particularly well last night, except for possibly Wall, on the offensive end. Its not like there was somoeone on the bench that would have clearly played better than Nene. We were lucky to have even made it a game. We lost the final game of a road trip to a well-rested team that was playing at home. Big deal...get over it.

[DCZards]

The fact of the matter was Nene had an off night. However, I have seen him have off nights before, but still make winning plays at the end of games. He is our best big man and you want your best players on the court at crunch time. I can understand Wittman putting him back in.

Yup. Nene was getting point blank shots. Unfortunately, his shots weren't falling. But those are the shots you want so you keep going to him with the hope that 2-3 will eventually drop...and you win the game.

[Upper Decker]

TBJ podcast said Websters shot with 41 seconds to go was the worst shot of the season.

[hands11]

Not sure why some are over reacting about the Booker situation. I don't think anyone is suggesting not to ever use Booker. We are just saying, don't only use Booker.

Sure. He deserve a chance to find his grove. But that doesn't have to happen all at once.

And it isn't Monday morning quarterbacking is you had that position while the situation was at hand.

[AWIZZINGBULLET]

Not sure why some are over reacting about the Booker situation. I don't think anyone is suggesting not to ever use Booker. We are just saying, don't only use Booker.

Sure. He deserve a chance to find his grove. But that doesn't have to happen all at once.

And it isn't Monday morning quarterbacking is you had that position while the situation was at hand.

It's isn't. He's only played twenty minutes once since his return. Booker has outrebounded Vesely by one playing fewer games and minutes but it's being made out like Booker is stealing something that is rightfully Vesely's, when fact is Vesely couldn't crack the lineup for more minutes through that very long stretch with Booker out. Booker is getting more minutes because he's tougher and a better rebounder---the better overall NBA player. There really is no situation as I see it.

[montestewart]

And it isn't Monday morning quarterbacking is you had that position while the situation was at hand.

Agreed. You've been pretty consistent about wanting to see more of The Janchise.

[hands11]

Not sure why some are over reacting about the Booker situation. I don't think anyone is suggesting not to ever use Booker. We are just saying, don't only use Booker.

Sure. He deserve a chance to find his grove. But that doesn't have to happen all at once.

And it isn't Monday morning quarterbacking is you had that position while the situation was at hand.

It's isn't. He's only played twenty minutes once since his return. Booker has outrebounded Vesely by one playing fewer games and minutes but it's being made out like Booker is stealing something that is rightfully Vesely's, when fact is Vesely couldn't crack the lineup for more minutes through that very long stretch with Booker out. Booker is getting more minutes because he's tougher and a better rebounder---the better overall NBA player. There really is no situation as I see it.

I haven't read anything that sounded like anyone thought Booker was stealing anything from Ves.

Again, I don't think anyone is really picking one over the other. I think most here think they should both be used situationally and it is the coaches job to figure that out. The 3 game benching of Ves just doesn't make sense. It seemed clear to me he would have helped the last two.

As for his recent production, I think you some might have forgotten what he has done recently because we haven't seen much of him for 5 games.


Mon 1/7 Ves We beat OKC that game.
7 rebounds 10 pts on 5-6 shooting. 1 ast 1 block in 20 min
Kevin S had 5 rebound 19 pts

The next game he played 5 minutes and had 2 rebounds and racked up an amazing 5 fouls. at least 2 were BS.
We won that one again ATL
Kevin S 7 rebounds 8 pts

The game after that...

Mon 1/14 Ves had against ORL
7 rebounds 10 pts on 5-7 shooting. 4 ast 1 stead in 25 min -
we won against a hot ORL team.
Kevin 5 rebounds 18 pts

Since then, he played
10 mins the next game with 2 rounds (L) against SAC - close lose. Kevin 3 rbs 16 pts - no Booker

So Ves played very good in two games that we won and two games he was a bad match up where he really didnt play. We won one of those and lost the other. Booker wasn't an option. He was injured.

Then Booker returned.

Ves 3 min the game after Denver (w)
The one game they both played, Booker played 17. That was a smart move because Booker was banging with Faried. Booker had 17 min 8 rebounds 2pts. In that game Kevin made up for the pts with 18 pts - we won

So since that worked, Randy gets fixated.

the next 3 games since he got zero mins

In those 3 games Booker has done this.

21 min 7 rebounds 1 ast 1 stl 4 pts - Kevin S had 3 rb 4 pts - We lost LAC
10 min 1 rebound 3 pts - Kevin S had 3 rb 6 pts - We won - POR.. Crawford 3 ball
17 min 7 rebounds 1 ast 1 stl 2 pts - Kevin S had 3 rb 4 pts - We lost..UT

So while Ves has struggle this year and even sat on the bench a bunch, he did actually produce two nice games of 7 rebounds and 10 pts in 3 games and both games were wins. Since then he got 10 mins, 3 mins, 0 min, 0 min, 0 min

I really don't have a problem either sitting Ves or limiting him minute some nights. Some night are bad match ups for him. But every night Booker isn't the answer either.

Ves has recently shown that he can rebound against some match up and he can even score. And in those match up Kevin S scored and rebounds as well.

Point is, neither Booker nor Ves are a clear choice on any given night. Both can be effective. What I would gauge it on is which is the right match up that night and which gives Kevin the best chance to be effective. Because Kevin the one who can score bigger numbers and even rebound a decent amount. Personally, I think who he shares the front court with can make a difference depending on the opponent.

Neither Booker or Ves has established themselves as a regular back up at PF that can get it done every night. So why act like they have ?

[nate33]

I haven't read anything that sounded like anyone thought Booker was stealing anything from Ves.

Again, I don't think anyone is really picking one over the other. I think most here think they should both be used situationally and it is the coaches job to figure that out. The 3 game benching of Ves just doesn't make sense. It seemed clear to me he would have helped the last two.

That's where I disagree. That doesn't seem clear to me at all. It is extremely rare when I think it is "clear" that Vesely should play ahead of Booker. Booker is the better offensive player, the better defender, the better pick setter, and the better rebounder. The only scenario that comes to mind where Vesely might be more useful is if the other team is playing a tall "stretch 4" like a Byron Mullens.

[Nivek]

When you look at the numbers, Vesely comes out a little ahead of Booker.

Code: Select all

Stat    Booker  Vesely  DIFF
MPG     20.7    12.9    -7.8
ORB     27      29      2
DRB     48      45      -3
REB     75      74      -1
AST     15      19      4
STL     14      10      -4
BLK     8       9       1
TOV     17      16      -1
PF      36      72      36
PTS     74      78      4


See, despite getting 7.8 fewer minutes per game, Vesely has higher totals in 5 statistical categories -- INCLUDING POINTS!