2/4 LA Clippers @ Wizards 7PM CSN.....

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Word, monte.

My dad likes to say, "It is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove any doubt."

Not feeling my posts lately, huh?

[montestewart]

My dad likes to say, "It is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove any doubt."

My dad never learned to shut up, which unfortunately was the lesson I learned.

[dobrojim]

I liked that one. repeated it many times over the years

I also like Robin Williams when he advises

always let the @sshole have the last word

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

The problem is every single game becomes a referendum on Wall for you. EVERY SINGLE GAME!!! It gets old as f*ck.

Three years ago I said before the draft he was overrated. I said Cousins is better. I took a lot of crap then from you and a bunch of people. What gets old is being right, repeatedly. Yet years go by for people to come around if ever to what I said years ago.

You guys don't like me talking about Wall because you said he would be the better than Jason Kidd and he would be the greatest at the PG position. Heck, at times AJ Price runs PG better. You can get mad about game-by-game referendums, or you can say, "I wonder what kind of PG Marcus Smart would be?"

Wall is a nice kid and extremely gifted athletically. He is still 22 years old. He is rich and will be in the league for years and years. Things will get better than they are now for him. He could stay a Wizard and prove me wrong. If the team plays like they did for about 10 games for a whole season, he might. I think they are a house of cards if they count on Nene's health. Trading Wall for me is a chance to get rid of an injury-prone guy.

I think Wall's up and down play is what is irksome. If there is any referendum it is all on his inconsistent, but typically so, game.

You took a lot of crap for wanting Cousins over Wall. And rightfully so. Cousins has been an unmitigated disaster in Sacramento. Only reason us Wizards fans want him is because he might be available for pennies on the dollar in relation to his talent. No one ever really doubted Cousins talent, just his mental makeup. I'm just glad we didn't draft him because he would have already been on his 2nd team by now.

As for Wall, have I been disappointed by his development? Yes. But not to the point where I'm ready to trade him for any mediocre guard you covet and a middlin' 1st round pick. And I can't help but think the Wizards front office have absolutely done Wall no favors when it comes to putting him into the best position to succeed. They've been as much of a hindrance to Wall as his broken jump shot with the lack of talent, poor skill and subpar coaching they've surrounded him with.

Frankly I thought Wall was closer to the guy we saw get a triple double and a 9 steal game in his first two weeks as a pro. He played recklessly but with a ton of energy & attitude and with a jumper that was inconsistent but passable. More like a guy that shot 30% from 3 his rookie year. That's the Wall I thought we were getting. This Wall is a bit more passive, more tentative and the shot is still work in progress but now without the range from 3.

Again, I really do wonder how Wall would have done had he gone to any other team. I suspect he'd be further along than he is now.

Here is a picture of DeMarcus Cousins teaching Pete Carril a new handshake.


Here is what Pete Carril, who is 82 years old and knows a little bit about basketball said about Cousins:

http://www.bleedblackandpurple.com/2010 ... r-ive.html

To Kings assistant coach Pete Carril, Cousins is something he has never seen before.

“I’ve been in the pros 13 years now … he’s the first and perhaps authentic … only original, different type of player that I’ve seen,” Carril said before the broadcast of tonight’s game on NBA TV. “There’s certain things you can’t teach and he does all of them.”

What does Pete Carril know about basketball? Here are a few of his other quotes:

http://www.coachingtoolbox.net/filingca ... ete-carril

Dat, Cousins is not a disaster to the Kings. Check your facts.

http://www.82games.com/1213/1213SAC.HTM
http://www.82games.com/1213/12SAC14.HTM

Sacramento's offense is better and they rebound better with him on the court. He has outperformed his replacements.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... ide01.html

Right now, Cousins is the one playing at a PER of 21 for a couple of seasons. Something Wall managed for 5-7 games this season. There is no argument you can make to say Wall is better that does not involve the word POTENTIAL.

Cousins' mental make up IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN. I have dealt with the most serious of mental health concerns myself, but he's not me and I don't know his values, his ups and downs, and how hard he is to work with. I don't know if he's a danger to himself or others. Those are LEGIT CONCERNS with Cousins. However, he likes getting paid and so far the worst is a bunch of technicals and a few team suspensions. SO FAR no weapons, drugs, sex assaults, etc.

What I posted earlier in another thread is I think Wittman, and guys like Nene and Okafor, are the perfect "yin" to Cousins' "yang". This coach plays 8 guys 25 minutes and Cousins would be PERFECT in this system.

A trade I would make in a heart beat is Seraphin, Crawford, Ariza, and a 2014 first round pick for Cousins and Thornton (or Salmons or Garcia).

Dat, you have feelings against Cousins similar to how I'm not sold on Wall. The solution is either both or none IMO. I would trade Wall or acquire Cousins. Seems to me a no-brainer thought to acquire Cousins at the right price. Also, selling high on Wall can blow this team up and rebuild quickly like Houston. I would be good with either course of events.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Who else wants some?

I know you're probably not going to agree but I will tell you why I am very firm in my convictions and where I disagree with you.

[montestewart]

Who else wants some?

I know you're probably not going to agree but I will tell you why I am very firm in my convictions and where I disagree with you.

Uncle

[tontoz]

tontoz, you like to argue and I've been down this road with you before. I don't feel in the slightest bit conflicted. Wall played at a PER of about 21 for several games (7 or so) during the Wizards 7-3 stretch over 10 games. I noted defensive improvements and scoring that was helping a team win.

There is a key adverb: WHEN

You highlighted the rest as if to say he will. And even then I said he would become a candidate when that happens. What I didn't say is Wall can shoot like Archibald. If Wall ups his 17 shots per 36 minutes, to about 25 shots, and if he plays along better teammates he could score over 27 points a game while generating 11 or more assists. That is entirely POSSIBLE.

If he learns to shoot Wall will score a lot of points along with his many assists.

But for the last time, tontoz, timing is everything. That optimism for Wall's breakout is gone and looking at the time it will take for that to happen I think there are better players on the horizon. Wall IS like Payton. He can score and he can assist. However, he's woefully bad shooting the ball and he has turned it over A LOT.

You didn't put me on both sides of any fence. You fenced yourself in trying to make me the victim of your angst over what I said.

You also NEVER ANSWERED MY QUESTION, tontoz. I asked you how has he improved. I admit I thought he had games back but if you look at this: http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... ljo01.html with a larger sample size of games THIS SEASON, I don't see improvement.

If you go to school and get an A the first quarter, but you follow it with C, B, C what is your overall grade?

Your question is irrelevant. I am not arguing about Wall's improvement. I am arguing about your nonsensical posts. I have been criticizing Wall for his lack of improvement for awhile. His shot hasn't improved at all.

Even with a midrange shot/floater Wall is no threat to lead the league in scoring and assists. That is just nuts. But that isn't all you wrote in that post.

A lot of comparisons have been made between Wall and Wade, Wall and Derrick Rose, and even Wall and Gary Payton. Those all apply IMO. I will throw one more out there.

That post was made less than a month after the draft, where you said drafting Wall was a mistake.

And it isn't alone. I could fill a couple of pages with posts of you going back and forth on Wall. One day you say you were "wrong, wrong, wrong" about your predraft assessment of Wall then you turn around and say "I told you before the draft he was overrated". Your opinion on Wall seems to change more often than the weather.

You did it in his rookie year, his second year and this year. Your flip flopping hasn't been as bad this year but he has only played 13 games lol. You have plenty of flopping time left.

[tontoz]

From the same thread i referenced earlier.

I think Chris Paul had an MVP-type I have been a Wall hater and was wrong in being one. He's really good and will very likely be worthy of being mentioned in their company in the future.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

From the same thread i referenced earlier.

I think Chris Paul had an MVP-type I have been a Wall hater and was wrong in being one. He's really good and will very likely be worthy of being mentioned in their company in the future.

Uncle.

On this one I will do just like I am going to do with the speeding ticket. I couldn't even get mad at the cop. I'm just going to put the check in the mail.

You clearly have me here, tontoz. I commend you on your persistence.

THIS IS ALL JOHN WALL'S FAULT!

[TGW]

Oh, I want some, CCJ. You can't fight facts, buddy. Screw Pete Carrill...I don't give a rats butt what that guy has to say, because the facts are there.

Cousins TS% by year: .484, .499, .507
Cousins EFG% by year: .432, .449, .447

For a big man, that is HORRIFIC. Even Seraphin has a higher TS% and EFG% than that, and he stinks. I'm not giving up picks for a better rebounding Seraphin with a sh*t attitude.

"However, he likes getting paid and so far the worst is a bunch of technicals and a few team suspensions. SO FAR no weapons, drugs, sex assaults, etc." -- LOL really? That's your defense to his terrible attitude?

"Hey well the guy hasn't killed anyone yet, so he's okay in my book." -- Wow what a backhanded compliment...

*EDIT*: And to address the PER argument--PER awards rebounds and assists equally, although is much tougher to average 10 assists than to average 10 rebounds. It's a highly flawed stat made up by BSPN to evaluate players without watching games, and is not a good indicator of anything...a good statpadder can have a high PER (Cousins is a perfect example of that).

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

The back and forth that are going on now is kind of what the Kings probably feel with Cousins.

What you have to do with a player like him is really understand him and manage HIS emotions carefully. He might blow up at the time he's got it rolling. Opponents and refs alike know his hot buttons and they use them against them. He knows, like I know, he's got some real weak areas when it comes to controlling himself under fire. The problem is Cousins likes to go there. He likes to vent. Often he vents at the wrong things at the wrong times, and does not take full responsibility.

Some people get tired of that real fast. I say it comes with the territory if the player is good enough. MJ probably got tired of Rodman's hair color or Dennis Rodman's refusal to shoot the ball. Cousins wants to win. On a team with Nene and Okafor, there is a GOOD LIKELIHOOD he will win more often. He will also be around some good big brother types, dudes not scared of him--well, not real scared of him. (He is a scary man!)

To me, again, Wall and Cousins or trade Wall and maximize the team. I'm really down on Seraphin right now and think maybe there is a way for everyone to come out of this happy.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Oh, I want some, CCJ. You can't fight facts, buddy. Screw Pete Carrill...I don't give a rats butt what that guy has to say, because the facts are there.

Cousins TS% by year: .484, .499, .507
Cousins EFG% by year: .432, .449, .447

Yes!

For a big man, that is HORRIFIC. Even Seraphin has a higher TS% and EFG% than that, and he stinks. I'm not giving up picks for a better rebounding Seraphin with a sh*t attitude.

"However, he likes getting paid and so far the worst is a bunch of technicals and a few team suspensions. SO FAR no weapons, drugs, sex assaults, etc." -- LOL really? That's your defense to his terrible attitude?

"Hey well the guy hasn't killed anyone yet, so he's okay in my book." -- Wow what a backhanded compliment...

I did say, "yet", too.

Yep, that's all I got, LR. It is what it is. My man, Boogie, is a handful. He can't shoot as well as Seraphin.

What I think is Cousins' TS% and his EFG% would be significantly better playing with Wall. Also, his skill as a passer would be MUCH BETTER on big-to-big assists to both Nene and Okafor.

The best example I have as a case for acquiring Cousins: Compatibility in relationships. Some folks get on your nerves and others are friends. Some of your friends would be considered first-class jerks or losers by others. Some friends may be condescending, arrogant, or aloof to some, but BFFs to you. If Wall is on the team there is a place for Cousins. I used to say I prefer they keep Seraphin, because Seraphin (used to) shoot better, and he is much more athletic. But that's too many young guys and too much potential chaos. Keep Nene and Okafor if you get Cousins.

I think Cousins would shoot a little better, pass a lot better, and most importantly he would be the elite rebounder that increases possessions. With more FGAs and more possessions this team will win more games.

[Nivek]

*EDIT*: And to address the PER argument--PER awards rebounds and assists equally, although is much tougher to average 10 assists than to average 10 rebounds. It's a highly flawed stat made up by BSPN to evaluate players without watching games, and is not a good indicator of anything...a good statpadder can have a high PER (Cousins is a perfect example of that).

Your conclusion is good, but your facts all wrong.

PER does NOT reward assists and rebounds equally. There are different values for offensive rebounds, defensive rebounds and assists.

PER was not "made up by BSPN," it was "made up" by John Hollinger long before he got to ESPN. It did it's job, at least from Hollinger's perspective -- it helped him sell books, land a gig with ESPN and ultimately get a job with the Grizzlies. PER is a GREAT stat.

All that said, PER is flawed. The biggest problem with it is its handling of efficiency. A player can increase his PER score by shooting more frequently so long as he shoots ~30%. Since virtually every player shoots better than 30%, virtually any player can boost his PER merely by shooting more often.

[tontoz]

While PER is flawed I still like it because it is readily available and has a history. I think it is fine to use as long as you keep it's limitations in mind.

[Zonkerbl]

Dude is full of anger, so the slightest thing sets him off. I know 'cause I was exactly the same way when I played. Your testosterone gets pumping on the court and it's just hard to stop. All the crap you've been pushing down just comes leaking out.

Here I am twenty years later and I am a lot better in controlling my anger, mostly because my life has just kind of calmed down a lot. I don't know what to tell Cousins -- he doesn't have the luxury of waiting twenty years for things to smooth out.

What's the dude's story? He must be mad at something. Did his dad beat him up all the time or what?

[Zonkerbl]

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball ... sins031610

"Making the situation even more difficult was that DeMarcus was only 14 and 15 at the time. With Monique working to support him and his five siblings and his biological father out of the picture, Cousins said the brash attitude he developed on the basketball court began affecting his life in a negative way.

Violence and shootings were common in Cousins’ neighborhood. Many of his friends were either using drugs or selling them, and a senior on the Erwin basketball team that Cousins looked up to was arrested for a string of armed robberies.

Cousins managed to steer clear of trouble until his sophomore year when, midway through the basketball season, he got into a physical altercation on a school bus with a faculty member following a game. Cousins is adamant that he was defending himself, but he also conceded that his own immaturity may have provoked the fight.

He was suspended from the team for the rest of the season and, after finishing out the school year, decided to transfer to another high school the following fall.

“That’s been a dark cloud that has hung over me for my entire career,” Cousins said. “Every time I do something good, that gets brought back up.”"

[Dat2U]

tontoz, you like to argue and I've been down this road with you before. I don't feel in the slightest bit conflicted. Wall played at a PER of about 21 for several games (7 or so) during the Wizards 7-3 stretch over 10 games. I noted defensive improvements and scoring that was helping a team win.

The reason I never bought into that stretch of good play was because it relied on such a fragile setup. Nene's health, Wall's health. Beal's shooting & health & continued high level play from Okafor & Webster. It was too much to rely upon. Everything had to run perfect for us to be mediocre and it never does. We simply aren't equipped to handle losses to any of our top players.

As soon as Beal gets hurt and Garrett Temple is inserted into the starting lineup, the wheels basically fall off. Spacing is wrecked. Defenses daring anyone including Wall to shoot as many jumpers as possible. With Wall's questionable shot, you need two shooters minimum on the floor with him otherwise spacing is just going to make things impossible.

The roster is just oddly constructed. Our offense really makes no sense either. We've got Nene, who honestly probably should be a C at this stage of his career, playing PF and half the time were running our offense through him instead of Wall, while Wall on the floor often standing around at the 3 point line waiting for a pass. Huh?

Wall has been set up to fail by the level of ineptitude here since they rolled out the red carpet for his welcome to DC. Maybe if he was LeBron or Durant he would be able to overcome it and shine as one of the NBA's brightest but I seriously doubt if even they could overcome the likes of Ted & EG their minions or Flip Saunders assistants to win anything of significance in a Wizards uniform.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

tontoz, you like to argue and I've been down this road with you before. I don't feel in the slightest bit conflicted. Wall played at a PER of about 21 for several games (7 or so) during the Wizards 7-3 stretch over 10 games. I noted defensive improvements and scoring that was helping a team win.

The reason I never bought into that stretch of good play was because it relied on such a fragile setup. Nene's health, Wall's health. Beal's shooting & health & continued high level play from Okafor & Webster. It was too much to rely upon. Everything had to run perfect for us to be mediocre and it never does. We simply aren't equipped to handle losses to any of our top players.

As soon as Beal gets hurt and Garrett Temple is inserted into the starting lineup, the wheels basically fall off. Spacing is wrecked. Defenses daring anyone including Wall to shoot as many jumpers as possible. With Wall's questionable shot, you need two shooters minimum on the floor with him otherwise spacing is just going to make things impossible.

The roster is just oddly constructed. Our offense really makes no sense either. We've got Nene, who honestly probably should be a C at this stage of his career, playing PF and half the time were running our offense through him instead of Wall, while Wall on the floor often standing around at the 3 point line waiting for a pass. Huh?

Wall has been set up to fail by the level of ineptitude here since they rolled out the red carpet for his welcome to DC. Maybe if he was LeBron or Durant he would be able to overcome it and shine as one of the NBA's brightest but I seriously doubt if even they could overcome the likes of Ted & EG their minions or Flip Saunders assistants to win anything of significance in a Wizards uniform.

Roger to all of that, Dat. All they need to do is this:

Fire Ernie. Replace him with Troy Weaver. Trade for Cousins in the off-season. Strongly encourage Troy Weaver to choose as Randy's replacement, if he falters, Dave Joerger. Ted's minions, this is CCJ's best free advice: Get Cousins (at the right price). Sign Weaver. See how well Randy coaches Boogie. If he can't manage to win with talent, sign a guy who WILL WIN.

It is really very simple.

[hands11]

Umm..."WHEN" is an adverb.

{ducks}

Wow, you're quick, Nivek.

I edited it BEFORE the grammar police busted me.

I learned "WHEN" can also be a conjunction.

We can have our stats wrong, our analysis wrong, our history wrong, but our spelling, grammar, and usage better come correct.

Dame right it better be.

As for Cousins. In a couple years he is going to be a beast. He is only 22 right now.

6-11 270 and athletic.

Hell he is already averaging 10 rebounds 17 pts in 31 minutes on .446FG and .762 FT

I never wanted to draft him but I would take him starting next year. He is going to start to mature. And man is he a load.

Right now, if I could, I would trade Wall for Cousins. There are lots of PG in the league now. You can find PG easier then players with Cousins upside in the post.

Wizards would have a ton of bigs and from there they can wheel and deal to find other pieces they need.

Nene, Okafor, Cousins, Kevin, Ves

Plus Beal and more talent from this years draft. I would start to feel a lot better about where they could go.

Crawford, Price and Temple could run the PG for now.

[tontoz]

Dame right it better be.

You consistently have the best typos on the board, I'll give you that.