Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part I

[hands11]

Plumlee is older than Derrick Favors, John Wall, and Jan Vesely, he came from the same recruiting class as DeMarcus Cousins. He's a grown man playing against teen-aged boys. He's a low skill hustle big man with pretty good athleticism. He's a role player in the NBA, I doubt he becomes a regular starter on a good team. Nerlens Noel is wholly better than him. Zeller, Austin, and Len are all far better prospects than him too IMO.

Agreed.

Plumlee is the kind of guy you draft with a late first round pick in the hopes that he can be an NBA ready role player with a cheap contract. Hopefully, he'll pan out to be something like Zaza Pachulia. I don't think he can be much more.

He isn't my favorite player in the draft but couldn't we use a NBA ready young ZaZa on a cheap contract backing up at center ?

[dcPress]

I dunno; it seems to me that the only way this team would get near a title in the near term is through maintaining their defensive mindset. It seems to suit the character of this group. So I wouldn't draft a big man since by the time he develops our current setup will have played out. Maybe Noel or trade the pick for a 3pt specialist.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I wish I saw the game. It would have been neat to watch Singleton, Webster, Ariza and Wall on defense. With that kind of length and mobility, they could have switched every screen and really hawked the passing lanes. I hope Wittman plays that group a little more. Booker can also fit in (as can Vesely, though with more offensive downside).

It also showed how much better the offense flows with a stretch 4. Wall can beat his man off the dribble at any time and if there are 3 guys who can hit 3s playing with him that makes things tough for the defense.

I am not optimistic enough to think CS could be that guy but it was interesting to see. I was expecting the usual 4th quarter offensive meltdown last night but it didn't happen and i think the lineup was a big reason why.

What the game showed with Singleton, Ariza, Webster, Wall (and also Templeton) is a look Randy can give on nights force feeding the ball to Nene and Okafor inside doesn't work. Teams that have been stout inside and who have beat the Wizards by clogging the middle and daring Wall to shoot have a tough time when the Wizards have a stretch four who is hitting threes. On top of that, Webster hitting shots with Ariza also hitting shots is going to give virtually all opponents trouble.

Nivek mentioned the defense was bad, but Stoudemire has been on fire for several games for NYK and Carmelo can get any shots he wants. The opponent has great offensive players. Felton, Prigioni, and Kidd get the ball to scorers if they're not hitting shots themselves. The Knicks scored in bunches.

The Wizards really impressed me last night. Ariza hit shots like he did with the Lakers in the playoffs years back. His four-point play rallied the Wizards. John Wall had a terrific fourth quarter. He had an up and down game until the fourth, and he took over.

I like what Wittman and the team are doing (again). They are 5-5 over the last 10. No more games against Sacramento, either.

[thinker07]

I watched the UCLA game tonight and Shabazz KILLED his prospects. Game was tied at the end and UCLA has the ball with a final shot. Larry Drew has the ball as the clock is winding down. Shabazz is stomping his feet, clapping his hands, jumping up and down, screaming for the ball. Larry Drew doesn't pass to Shabazz and instead hits the game winner at the buzzer. Shabazz stares in disbelief as the shot goes in. The team mobs Drew SHABAZZ just quietly and quickly walks off the floor without celebrating or congratulating Drew. WOW - don't know how you can pick Shabazz any more - terrible selfish teammate.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Larry Drew Jr. killed UNC and took his talents to UCLA. I didn't see the game and am not saying anything about Shabazz either way, but I remember Drew being upset about minutes and transferring. Just after that they started winning with Kendall Marshall, a much better player than Drew. I am glad to see Drew have success.

Shabazz wasn't a prospect that has wowed me. He's a good scorer (only) at this point.

thinker, if he doesn't celebrate the success of the team and a fellow teammate, and in fact SULKS IN A WIN you have something there. I wouldn't want him, either. I didn't see it, but if that is true it bodes very poorly.

I am surprised by this reaction based upon video I have seen of Muhammed so far.

[stevemcqueen1]

Plumlee is older than Derrick Favors, John Wall, and Jan Vesely, he came from the same recruiting class as DeMarcus Cousins. He's a grown man playing against teen-aged boys. He's a low skill hustle big man with pretty good athleticism. He's a role player in the NBA, I doubt he becomes a regular starter on a good team. Nerlens Noel is wholly better than him. Zeller, Austin, and Len are all far better prospects than him too IMO.

Agreed.

Plumlee is the kind of guy you draft with a late first round pick in the hopes that he can be an NBA ready role player with a cheap contract. Hopefully, he'll pan out to be something like Zaza Pachulia. I don't think he can be much more.

He isn't my favorite player in the draft but couldn't we use a NBA ready young ZaZa on a cheap contract backing up at center ?

Sure. But how would we get him? I wouldn't take him with our pick.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Michael Snaer keeps flying beneath the radar. Three game winners already this season. A couple last season. Mature kid. Leader. Good defender. I think he would be a good pickup in round two at #55 or possibly higher.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1547w14atUI[/youtube]

Snaer can hit the three like Gil used and he can also beat his man off the dribble and put it off the glass, like he did the other night.

I like his character. There is another video of him working with 3 and 4 year olds. I have heard him interviewed. Snaer seems extremely solid.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Nevada has a kid I have seen play and like, Malik Story. He had 31 tonight.



He is fourth-year SG who has a really nice 3pt shot. He also plays pretty good defense. He was James Harden's HS teammate.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4p2CNputt0[/youtube]

[stevemcqueen1]

I watched the UCLA game tonight and Shabazz KILLED his prospects. Game was tied at the end and UCLA has the ball with a final shot. Larry Drew has the ball as the clock is winding down. Shabazz is stomping his feet, clapping his hands, jumping up and down, screaming for the ball. Larry Drew doesn't pass to Shabazz and instead hits the game winner at the buzzer. Shabazz stares in disbelief as the shot goes in. The team mobs Drew SHABAZZ just quietly and quickly walks off the floor without celebrating or congratulating Drew. WOW - don't know how you can pick Shabazz any more - terrible selfish teammate.

I think you're reading too much into that. I don't think Shabazz is a bad teammate, I think he's overly aggressive and I think he's got poor passing skills. That's not the same as being selfish or being a bad teammate.

And I don't think his post game reaction is worth putting any weight in. These are his words.

“Oh yeah, I wanted the ball,” said Muhammad, who had a game-high 22 points but took 23 shots and had zero assists. “But Larry is such an aggressive player, and as soon as the ball went up I knew it was going to be good.

“Everybody was on him and attacking him and I knew Larry was going to have something broken or some scratches, so I was going to wait until he gets up to congratulate him. That was a big-time shot and we’re all so happy that we won the game.”

Some people are cool customers, doesn't really mean anything.

Shabazz has had a rough year. He's never really gotten to fully gel with his teammates and they don't totally trust each other. He got hurt in the summer and missed everything. Then NCAA compliance went on a witch hunt and kept him out of the beginning of the year and recently he got the flu and lost 15 pounds.

All that stuff is petty to me though, and it's unnaturally depressing his stock IMO. I think he could slide behind the big men, in which case, I would draft him in a heartbeat. He's got an NBA skill set that is worth its weight in gold. He's pretty much always been the best player in the class.

[Ruzious]

I'd also say to remember that's the same Larry Drew that basically got run off the team at UNC 1 and a half seasons ago. It's an odd mix of players they have at UCLA - not to mention a coach with a questionable reputation.

That was a good point on Plumlee being old for a prospect. The same applies for Withey. They'll both turn 23 in March. That's a big red flag. Then again, Plumlee is a really good athlete for a guy who was measured at 6'11.5 in shoes. Sometimes bigs are late bloomers.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Good points, Ruz. Every team and player has an off night, but I thought the loss Kansas had the other night exposed Withey. A 6'7" slender guy on the other team had 20 rebounds (IIRC) and Withey only had 5 or 6. McLemore didn't hit threes but he competed and had 9 rebounds himself. Withey will be a roll player at the next level.

I like Plumlee's rebounding and think he's a much better prospect. His athleticism should allow him to excel in the NBA. Plumlee sure picked the right school. Laettner, Parks, Ferry, and even his brother had (or will have) long NBA careers.

David Aldridge recently analyzed Plumlee's draft stock:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1474 ... raft-stock

In many ways, NBA teams know what they will be getting if they draft Mason Plumlee. He will bring the experience and work ethic that comes from playing for Mike Krzyzewski, one of the most respected coaches in sports. He also brings a tremendous amount of athletic ability that has been on display at Duke for four years.

[rl25g]

wherever Plumlee is drafted in 2013,

is where Vesely should have been drafted in 2011

[stevemcqueen1]

I'd also say to remember that's the same Larry Drew that basically got run off the team at UNC 1 and a half seasons ago. It's an odd mix of players they have at UCLA - not to mention a coach with a questionable reputation.

That was a good point on Plumlee being old for a prospect. The same applies for Withey. They'll both turn 23 in March. That's a big red flag. Then again, Plumlee is a really good athlete for a guy who was measured at 6'11.5 in shoes. Sometimes bigs are late bloomers.

UCLA doesn't really have a sensibly built team with pieces that fit together well. They've just got a collection of talent. And I don't care for Ben Howland either. Larry Drew is a bad PG and that's where some of UCLA's problems start. You need a general at that position to pull all this talent together. Instead you've got a funky offense where Kyle Anderson is running half of it and then on other plays they just pass it to Shabazz and sit back see what he does. Their bigs aren't really that good, and though Anderson has put up rebounding numbers, relying on him for your rebounding is a bad situation because he can not clear out space and clean the glass like an actual big man.

You're right, UNC had the exact same problems finding an identity when Drew was there and it's no coincidence that they magically came together the very moment Drew was replaced by Kendall Marshall.

On Plumlee, I think his athleticism means he'll transfer fairly well to the NBA despite the lack of variety in his skill set. The problem is, at 23, there isn't a ton of upside left for him. I think he's a banger that runs the floor well and can finish above the rim. An NBA role player, but one almost every team would want. I don't see him suddenly developing a face up game or a dominating back to the basket game all of a sudden. Not at his age. I see him being something like a longer, a little less offensively skilled Taj Gibson. I think he's a deserving late lottery pick.

[nuposse04]

Plumlee is a solid mid range J away from having a decent NBA career. He plays D well, help side D too, and does pretty much everything else you want. If he can get a solid jumper, I wouldn't mind having him on our roster (as a later pick of course).

[go'stags]

CCJ, I think you are spot on regarding Snaer. Hes a good athlete that can shoot the three and throw down dunks. I think he has more offensive capability than he has shown. The FSU offense under Lenard Hamilton strikes me as one that kind of holds guys back on that end, so I think he has more ability. Of course a guy like Al Thorton shined there, so I'm probably wrong, but man are they unexciting, even with decent recruiting classes. But on the other side of that, he will know how to play defense.

If we could get a face up 4, Mcdermott in the high second and somehow get another late second rounder to take Snaer, that would be a great draft IMO.

[pancakes3]

Snaer strikes me as the SG analogy of Singleton.

[go'stags]

Singleton is still a bit of a tweener, just as he was in college. Snaer is a pure 2 who can maybe play some 3.

[stevemcqueen1]

I would probably go with a board like this:

1.) Noel
2.) Shabazz
3.) Zeller
4.) McLemore
5.) Len
6.) Austin
7.) Smart
8.) Bennett
9.) Porter
10.) McAdoo
11.) McCollum
12.) Plumlee
13.) Oladippo
14.) Poythress
15.) Carter-Williams
16.) Burke
17.) Goodwin
18.) Mitchell

I don't think Poythress or Goodwin should declare though. I'm not sure Carter-Williams should either.

[Ruzious]

That's a good list, Steve. I guess the player I need to see more of is Austin. I just saw him early in the season, and he looked so skinny - in spite of having muscles - the frame didn't look like it was there. But I remember thinking the same about Chris Bosh when he was a frosh. Austin's even taller than Bosh - so I'm surprised he doesn't block more shots. He seems to be improving a lot (at least rebounding-wise), so if he can make the kind of developments Bosh did as a frosh, he could be worthy of a top 5 pick. I'll want to follow his progress probably more than anyone else throughout the rest of the season.

Snaer - I'm really not impressed. He's made a lot of clutch end o game winners, but they were open jumpers - nothing he created. There's not a lot to his offensive game. If he makes it, it's gotta be for his defensive, and considering he doesn't create many to's, I'd be really surprised if he makes it.

[Deivy202]

Yea Noell is too good to not draft and would be a clear PF for us . If we are smart we should atleast try and sign Oden for two years I mean he is 7'0 and flashes for real elite skills if hes healthy but it would be a nice risk .But we stand here and not even entertain it I mean really i sure he rather be in WSH than Charlotte .