ImageImageImageImage

Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edition)

Moderators: UCF, Knightro, UCFJayBird, Def Swami, Howard Mass, ChosenSavior

User avatar
tiderulz
RealGM
Posts: 36,944
And1: 14,872
Joined: Jun 16, 2010
Location: Atlanta
 

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1001 » by tiderulz » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:30 pm

Viper1500 wrote:Well there would have been more to the trade, like I said I really don't understand the negative value for Harrington.

And I disagree, Lamb plus probably a 11-14 pick for a re-signed JJ Redick is not overpaying

Two trades that come to mind which is clear overpay

NJ trading their first round for Wallace

Clippers trading Baron Davis + 1st round pick for Mo Williams - the first rounder ended up being Kyrie Irving


you dont understand the negative value for Harrington? He cant play (injured), is older, doesnt play defense very well, and is guaranteed 2 more years at $7mil/yr. Where is the upside with him? where is the positive value?

Those 2 trades you mentioned are very different. King went after Wallace because he thought it was what Orlando wanted to help get Dwight. (which rumors are that Otis might have pulled the trigger with Wallace there had he been able to)

Clippers traded Davis to drop his salary on Cleveland. LA was dumb not to put protections on that pick.

JJ for Lamb + Toronto pick is neither of those.
User avatar
Def Swami
Forum Mod - Magic
Forum Mod - Magic
Posts: 26,009
And1: 15,407
Joined: Aug 04, 2008
Location: Huevos Bancheros Brunch
Contact:
   

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1002 » by Def Swami » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:30 pm

Offers must not be that hot for JJ if we keep him. I can kinda see that since he can bounce in the off-season.
User avatar
Viper1500
Head Coach
Posts: 6,924
And1: 2,801
Joined: Apr 15, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
   

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1003 » by Viper1500 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:36 pm

Point being, picks are thrown around all the time. OKC has their core, and anything they get from this years draft will end up in the d-league.

And for a contender who is willing to spend money, Harrington can still produce off the bench. He averaged over 14 points on 45% last year.
User avatar
tiderulz
RealGM
Posts: 36,944
And1: 14,872
Joined: Jun 16, 2010
Location: Atlanta
 

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1004 » by tiderulz » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:45 pm

Viper1500 wrote:Point being, picks are thrown around all the time. OKC has their core, and anything they get from this years draft will end up in the d-league.

And for a contender who is willing to spend money, Harrington can still produce off the bench. He averaged over 14 points on 45% last year.


can he? he hasnt played at all this year, so no one knows if he could produce. I would view him differently if he hadnt been injured all year.
User avatar
BadMofoPimp
RealGM
Posts: 49,260
And1: 12,576
Joined: Oct 12, 2003
Location: In the Paint

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1005 » by BadMofoPimp » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:48 pm

Viper1500 wrote:Point being, picks are thrown around all the time. OKC has their core, and anything they get from this years draft will end up in the d-league.

And for a contender who is willing to spend money, Harrington can still produce off the bench. He averaged over 14 points on 45% last year.


I can see Mr. Presti (OKC GM) telling the fans after such a trade,"Well, Picks are thrown around all the time and we already have our core . . . so we traded our top 10 pick and Lamb for JJ"

LOLOLOLOL!!!!!
Image

Provin Ya'll Wrong!!!
User avatar
Viper1500
Head Coach
Posts: 6,924
And1: 2,801
Joined: Apr 15, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
   

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1006 » by Viper1500 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:51 pm

Fair enough, time will tell I guess. I've always been a big fan of him coming off the bench for whatever team he's played for, and will still hold some hope for him.
User avatar
NEM
RealGM
Posts: 13,147
And1: 2,122
Joined: Feb 02, 2003
Location: The O!
Contact:
         

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1007 » by NEM » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:57 pm

would you guys trade our pick (top 1 protected) and jj to okc for lamb and the toronto pick?
I live rent free in your head. You know who you are :D

Not changing this sig until Magic win a championship. Started 6/26/2015.
User avatar
Viper1500
Head Coach
Posts: 6,924
And1: 2,801
Joined: Apr 15, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
   

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1008 » by Viper1500 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:59 pm

BadMofoPimp wrote:
Viper1500 wrote:Point being, picks are thrown around all the time. OKC has their core, and anything they get from this years draft will end up in the d-league.

And for a contender who is willing to spend money, Harrington can still produce off the bench. He averaged over 14 points on 45% last year.


I can see Mr. Presti (OKC GM) telling the fans after such a trade,"Well, Picks are thrown around all the time and we already have our core . . . so we traded our top 10 pick and Lamb for JJ"

LOLOLOLOL!!!!!

I'd prefer JJ Redick over Lamb and whatever comes from this draft at 10-13. But like I said, there would obviously have to be more to the trade.
User avatar
NEM
RealGM
Posts: 13,147
And1: 2,122
Joined: Feb 02, 2003
Location: The O!
Contact:
         

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1009 » by NEM » Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:44 pm

Viper1500 wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
Viper1500 wrote:Point being, picks are thrown around all the time. OKC has their core, and anything they get from this years draft will end up in the d-league.

And for a contender who is willing to spend money, Harrington can still produce off the bench. He averaged over 14 points on 45% last year.


I can see Mr. Presti (OKC GM) telling the fans after such a trade,"Well, Picks are thrown around all the time and we already have our core . . . so we traded our top 10 pick and Lamb for JJ"

LOLOLOLOL!!!!!

I'd prefer JJ Redick over Lamb and whatever comes from this draft at 10-13. But like I said, there would obviously have to be more to the trade.


you, and most of our fan base, are overrating jj A LOT. he is nothing more than a 6th man on a championship team. what is the purpose of keeping jj here? besides okc would hang up on you if you tried to offer them jj for lamb and the toronto pick... lamb's ceiling is higher than what JJ is at right now, and jj is 28, going on 29. as a rebuilding team, we trade for/keep players who have potential, as opposed to when you are contending you trade for/keep proven vets... jj is the proven vet, lamb is the player with potential... we are rebuilding. it's not rocket science. I would trade jj for lamb straight up. okc would not. as a matter of fact these are the trades involving jj i would do:

jj to phx for the lakers pick
jj to milwaukee for their pick
jj to chicago for rip and teague
jj to okc for the toronto pick or lamb
jj and our pick (top 1 protected) to okc for toronto pick and lamb
jj to utah for burks and their pick

im sure in a lot of people's eyes these are "bad returns" for us, but thats what youre gonna get for jj... maybe even less
I live rent free in your head. You know who you are :D

Not changing this sig until Magic win a championship. Started 6/26/2015.
User avatar
Noonskadoodle
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,497
And1: 197
Joined: Jun 20, 2009

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1010 » by Noonskadoodle » Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:49 pm

ESPN INSIDER....WHERE COULD JJ END UP?

With the trade deadline nine days away, one of the most prevalent names that keeps circling the rumor mill is that of Orlando Magic sharpshooter J.J. Redick, whose actual availability is a matter of conjecture.

Redick has been the subject of trade scuttlebutt all season, and it's easy to understand why. He's one of the best in the league at the long-range shot, and that's a skill that no team can really have enough of. Redick is one of only 10 active shooters to have hit at least 40 percent of his career 3s (minimum of 500 makes.) He's a proven commodity.

Redick is also on an expiring contract and plays for a rebuilding team. A more obvious trade target, you will not find. Whether or not Orlando wants to trade Redick, NBA general managers might wear out the cell phone of Rob Hennigan, their Magic counterpart.

Over at ESPN Insider's Rumor Central, six teams have been mentioned as potential landing spots for Redick over the past month: the Boston Celtics, Milwaukee Bucks, New York Knicks, Chicago Bulls, Indiana Pacers and Denver Nuggets. That's five East teams chasing the Heat, plus a Nuggets squad trying to close the gap between themselves and the power teams atop the West standings.

The Knicks already rank second in the league in made 3s and sixth in percentage, and don't have much in the way of young assets, so we'll cut them out of the Redick sweepstakes. The Celtics need the backcourt help, but don't have the young pieces either or expiring contracts to make a deal work. They're out.

The other four squads rank in the bottom half of the league in successful 3s, so the need is obvious. The question is, for a team landing Redick, what kind of impact could it expect?

I took a stab at answering that by using ESPN's Trade Machine and plugging the reconfigured rosters into a simulation model. Here's who would benefit most from Redick's skills, or what we'll refer to as the "Redick Effect."

Indiana Pacers | Redick Effect: Plus 5.2 wins
Why they need him: The Pacers are a great defensive team, but rank only 24th on the offensive end and are in the middle of the pack in 3-point shooting.

What they'd give up: Indiana owns all its first-round picks. What it doesn't have are any obvious trade candidates. Perhaps a pick plus a package of young players including Tyler Hansbrough, Miles Plumlee and Lance Stephenson might do the trick. The Pacers would have to get creative to make Redick's $6.2 million salary work under the trade rules.

Rotation tweaks: We're more or less replacing Stephenson with Redick in the rotation. Though, like Chicago, the Pacers have a returning star in Danny Granger, who should eventually push Paul George back to the 2. The Pacers have a 50.0 power rating so far this season. Re-figuring that with Granger, Indiana's baseline actually falls to 47.3, which harkens to our pessimistic preseason projections, but should improve with Redick's 16.8 PER replacing Stephenson's 12.2.

What the sims say: Sure enough, the Pacers' baseline jumped to 52.5 with Redick in and Stephenson out. It matters, but is it enough to get by Miami? Probably not, and it's questionable whether Indiana has the pieces to swing a deal anyway. But if the Pacers could land Redick, he would boost Indiana's inconsistent attack.

Chicago Bulls | Redick Effect: Plus 3.4 wins
Why they need him: The Bulls are 29th in the league in 3-pointers made. Just as crucial as a paucity of long-range shooters has been the absence of Derrick Rose and his ability to create open looks by contracting the defense. However, the Bulls could stand to upgrade the rotation spot that has been held down by veteran Richard Hamilton, especially with Rose on the cusp of returning.

What they'd give up: It'd have to be a pretty sweet package of young assets, because the Bulls aren't in a position to absorb any salary. They could send Orlando rookie first-rounder Marquis Teague and a couple of veterans who probably would be bought out -- Hamilton and Vladimir Radmanovic. They make the salaries work in this deal. A first-round pick would have to be included but probably not the pick Charlotte owes the Bulls, which is unprotected in 2016.

Rotation tweaks: We're basically talking about replacing Hamilton with Redick in the Chicago rotation.

What the sims say: Over 82 games, the Bulls got an average of 3.4 extra wins from Redick's presence, improving their baseline to 59.4 games. That's with Rose, and assumes he's at full strength. Between Redick's shooting and Rose's everything, the Bulls jump to 11th in 3s made.

Denver Nuggets | Redick Effect: Plus 1.4 wins
Why they need him: The Nuggets rank 19th in 3s made and 28th in percentage. They really need another shooter to get them through Danilo Gallinari's bad shooting nights. Marginal gains could be huge for a team hovering on the fringe of title contention, but who gets their playing time cut?

What they'd give up: The Nuggets own a $13 million trade exception, so if they're willing to spend the luxury tax money, they can absorb Redick's contract with no problem. It's just a matter of finding a package of young assets the Magic like. Orlando already has a pick via Denver as a byproduct of the Dwight Howard trade last summer, but the Nuggets have another they could send along. The Nuggets' 2012 first-rounder, Evan Fournier, might have to go as well.

Rotation tweaks: The Nuggets currently go nine deep; with Redick, George Karl would juggle 10 players. This probably would cut into Corey Brewer's time a bit, among others.

What the sims say: Denver begins with a 55.2 power rating in my system, fifth best in the league. To work in Redick, the Nuggets probably would have to play small more often, with Gallinari playing more 4 and Kenneth Faried more 5. On paper, the trade-off helps, but the margin is thin -- Denver's win baseline edges up to 56.6, still shy of the big three in the West. It's probably not worth the tax dollars when Karl already has so much to work with.

Milwaukee Bucks | Redick Effect: Plus 1.1 wins
Why they need him: Brandon Jennings is Milwaukee's only real 3-point threat from the backcourt.

What they'd give up: The Bucks could send a first-rounder and/or a young piece such as Ekpe Udoh or Tobias Harris, while moving Beno Udrih to make the salaries work. Milwaukee would have to take on additional salary, perhaps Josh McRoberts.

Rotation tweaks: Redick would essentially replace Udrih in the near term as a backup to Jennings and Monta Ellis, who has an expiring contract and might be on the trade block himself. So the Bucks could angle to keep Redick as a third guard beyond this season while seeking out a rangier wing to pair with Jennings.

What the sims say: Redick would be marginalized in a backcourt rotation that features two ball-dominant guards, and it would be really tough to play them all together and field a semblance of an NBA-quality defense. The end result is a win total that is improved, but not by enough to move the needle. If Milwaukee splurges on Redick, it's with the idea of him being a long-term roster upgrade.

So while the Pacers stand to gain the most from acquiring Redick, the pieces aren't necessarily there to make the deal happen. That really leaves the Bulls as the best landing spot for Redick -- a team that not only benefits from Redick's skills but also has the assets to send back to Orlando. They tried to get him once before, so there's interest. A Rose-Redick backcourt could do significant damage down the stretch as Rose regains his All-Star form.
User avatar
Cigamodnalro
RealGM
Posts: 12,371
And1: 66
Joined: Apr 10, 2006
Location: Political Asylum

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1011 » by Cigamodnalro » Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:58 pm

Thanks Noon. Just came here to see if someone would post that :D
https://twitter.com/cigamodnalro
“A house pulled down is half rebuilt” - Ancient Proverb
"There's beauty in the breakdown" - Frou Frou
"We're going to turn this team around 360 degrees" - Jason Kidd
User avatar
Noonskadoodle
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,497
And1: 197
Joined: Jun 20, 2009

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1012 » by Noonskadoodle » Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:07 pm

Yesssssssss sir
User avatar
rcklsscognition
RealGM
Posts: 22,417
And1: 7,467
Joined: Mar 23, 2009
Contact:
 

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1013 » by rcklsscognition » Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:16 pm

Article does not give any mention to JJ's ball handling and assist effects, which are just as, if not more important than his 3pt shot. I will say this though, if Henny doesn't trade JJ it will be a big failure. Doesn't matter if he resigns here or not, not trading him in the next 9 days is a failure.

Now ESPN starting Jameer Nelson trade talk. Stupid trade idea IMO:

http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/20 ... lson-magic
User avatar
Noonskadoodle
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,497
And1: 197
Joined: Jun 20, 2009

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1014 » by Noonskadoodle » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:04 pm

I am actually surprised Meer hasnt been discussed more in trades. He could be sooooo valuable to a contending team during a playoff run.

Come off the bench & score....Could start as well.
RYgoBOOM
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,463
And1: 292
Joined: Jul 10, 2012

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1015 » by RYgoBOOM » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:11 pm

rcklsscognition wrote:Article does not give any mention to JJ's ball handling and assist effects, which are just as, if not more important than his 3pt shot. I will say this though, if Henny doesn't trade JJ it will be a big failure. Doesn't matter if he resigns here or not, not trading him in the next 9 days is a failure.

Now ESPN starting Jameer Nelson trade talk. Stupid trade idea IMO:

http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/20 ... lson-magic

Mo williams :lol: :lol:
www.TheAutoSkin.com

Orlando's Elite Peelable Paint 1 stop shop!
User avatar
NEM
RealGM
Posts: 13,147
And1: 2,122
Joined: Feb 02, 2003
Location: The O!
Contact:
         

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1016 » by NEM » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:17 pm

We should make an offer to dallas for vc... Since January 1st (19 games) his per 36: 19.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg, 3.3 apg on 44.9% fg, 42.7% on threes, 82.9 % ft....






























only kidding lol
I live rent free in your head. You know who you are :D

Not changing this sig until Magic win a championship. Started 6/26/2015.
OrlChamps2030
General Manager
Posts: 8,040
And1: 4,337
Joined: Jul 18, 2009
     

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1017 » by OrlChamps2030 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:46 pm

Not really a big fan of the trades in the article posted above. The author also didn't mention the words "assist", "pass", or "play-making" once. Kinda eh about taking back another team's trash (hansborough, harris, udrih, udoh) young guys picked in the 20's that can't get on the court (teague, fournier, plumlee) without atleast a draft pick or some kind of additional asset.

I mean wasn't Rudy Gay offered for JJ + TPE??? And Memphis got a actual legitimate valuable good prospect in Ed Davis, a youngish contributor in Daye, and a starter in Prince for Gay essentially. Seems much better than all of the trades posted above.
User avatar
KingRobb02
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,464
And1: 917
Joined: Aug 07, 2007
         

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1018 » by KingRobb02 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:52 pm

Zmill wrote:Not really a big fan of the trades in the article posted above. The author also didn't mention the words "assist", "pass", or "play-making" once. Kinda eh about taking back another team's trash (hansborough, harris, udrih, udoh) young guys picked in the 20's that can't get on the court (teague, fournier, plumlee) without atleast a draft pick or some kind of additional asset.

I mean wasn't Rudy Gay offered for JJ + TPE??? And Memphis got a actual legitimate valuable good prospect in Ed Davis, a youngish contributor in Daye, and a starter in Prince for Gay essentially. Seems much better than all of the trades posted above.

Haha, that doesn't count. Gay's contract is toxic (old CBA max for a guy who has never won a playoff series and has never been an all-star). The Raptors are just too dumb to stay away.
User avatar
KingRobb02
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,464
And1: 917
Joined: Aug 07, 2007
         

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1019 » by KingRobb02 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:53 pm

Noonskadoodle wrote:I am actually surprised Meer hasnt been discussed more in trades. He could be sooooo valuable to a contending team during a playoff run.

Come off the bench & score....Could start as well.

I agree completely. Jameer can only get worse from this point. I feel like selling a guy like him at the peak of his value is the best case scenario. Move Jameer as soon as possible.
User avatar
Blue_and_Whte
RealGM
Posts: 24,686
And1: 9,569
Joined: Jun 26, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL.
     

Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1020 » by Blue_and_Whte » Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:02 pm

I keep getting this feeling that nothing significant will happen, but I also o.ce said that Ronnie brewer would be a better NBA player than jj redick. So there's that....
Faith, Family, & Orlando Magic
#2A
#Adopt
#MAGA

Return to Orlando Magic