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Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edition)

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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1321 » by arsenal6106 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:48 am

Rick Rolled wrote:I just found the worst article in the history of mankind.....

http://www.rantsports.com/nba/2013/02/16/orlando-magics-nikola-vucevic-fails-to-perform-and-rising-stars-challenge/

At 15-37 coming into the NBA All-Star Break and after having little-to-no success this season, it’s not exactly surprising that the Orlando Magic only have one player participating in all of the All-Star Weekend contests. That one player was Nikola Vucevic in Friday night’s BBVA Rising Stars Challenge.

For the Magic’s sake, Vucevic needed to come out and put on a good show in the game so that he would at least give Orlando a little bit of respect and something to hang their hat on. That’s not how it worked out, though.
Vucevic, part of Team Shaq, scored only 15 points and gathered only four rebounds in a little more than 19 minutes. Those aren’t the worst numbers in a regular game, but for an All-Star style game those are pretty mundane stats.

Wtf!
I don't want to live on this planet anymore.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1322 » by OrlChamps2030 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:37 pm

OrlandO wrote:
RickB-Orlando wrote:I think a better question is, "How many star players return to form after major knee injuries, and how long do they continue to perform at an elite level?"

I can't think of any. Knee injuries seem to be the single most effective way to end a career prematurely than anything else.

Al Jefferson, Jamal Crawford, and recently Ricky Rubio

Not some stars but some more pretty good players:

Harrington (early in his career), Baron Davis (early in his career), David West, Perkens, and Lowry, Blake Griffin as well.

There is a gamble that a player doesn't return to form after an acl injury. But ACL injuries as of late have not hit pro athletes as hard as they once did (and no i'm not solely basing this observation on AP). There is always a risk with ACL injuries but I think that risk is exponentially higher w bigs. I expect Rondo to come back as strong as ever.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1323 » by OrlandO » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:14 pm

Jiwol wrote:
OrlandO wrote:I'd rip him a new one if the comments section didn't require facebook sign-in.


You can do it on Twitter. He's some adolescent pothead ,judging from the looks. I wouldn't pay any attention to this blabber.

https://twitter.com/TheSizzle20

Holy hell. I don't read rantsports, but it's somehow highly ranked on the web. How is that possible when they're hiring clueless kids to be their "senior writer" for NBA coverage.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1324 » by MagicTownBaller » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:22 pm

http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2013/ ... idan-sourc

Interesting. I don't trust Sheridan, but this is interesting if true. I would trade Redick for him straight up.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1325 » by glennathan » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:34 pm

From Marc Stein at ESPN

The Los Angeles Clippers and Utah Jazz are discussing a trade centered on Eric Bledsoe for Paul Millsap.

Bledsoe is the Clippers' best asset to be moved, though two sources with knowledge of the team's thinking predicted he would not be moved.

Millsap will be a free agent this offseason and the Jazz want to build around a younger core.

Via Ramona Shelburne, Marc Stein/ESPN
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1326 » by glennathan » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:51 pm

@JohnDenton555: My fav MJ story: When he was with Wiz Kwame Brown bet MJ $500 he couldn't make a half court shot in 3 tries. Of course he banked in 1st try.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1327 » by Cigamodnalro » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:54 pm

glennathan wrote:From Marc Stein at ESPN

The Los Angeles Clippers and Utah Jazz are discussing a trade centered on Eric Bledsoe for Paul Millsap.

Bledsoe is the Clippers' best asset to be moved, though two sources with knowledge of the team's thinking predicted he would not be moved.

Millsap will be a free agent this offseason and the Jazz want to build around a younger core.

Via Ramona Shelburne, Marc Stein/ESPN


It wasn't very long ago that Eric Maynor and Eric Bledsoe (drafted one year later) were regarded as similarly talented/valuable PG prospects. The Jazz gave one away for virtually nothing, and now may trade an elite (albeit expiring) PF for the other. Funny how that sometimes happens.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1328 » by glennathan » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:38 pm

Cigamodnalro wrote:
glennathan wrote:From Marc Stein at ESPN

The Los Angeles Clippers and Utah Jazz are discussing a trade centered on Eric Bledsoe for Paul Millsap.

Bledsoe is the Clippers' best asset to be moved, though two sources with knowledge of the team's thinking predicted he would not be moved.

Millsap will be a free agent this offseason and the Jazz want to build around a younger core.

Via Ramona Shelburne, Marc Stein/ESPN


It wasn't very long ago that Eric Maynor and Eric Bledsoe (drafted one year later) were regarded as similarly talented/valuable PG prospects. The Jazz gave one away for virtually nothing, and now may trade an elite (albeit expiring) PF for the other. Funny how that sometimes happens.


I do not understand why they would want to trade for Bledsoe when they have Burks out there doing a decent job. (If I am not mistaken I think Burks is there PG)
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1329 » by Neon1 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:42 pm

Burks is a SG
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1330 » by Noonskadoodle » Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:32 pm

Yea Burks is no where near a PG. averaging 1 assist for his career so far.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1331 » by magicman112 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:29 pm

glennathan wrote:
@JohnDenton555: My fav MJ story: When he was with Wiz Kwame Brown bet MJ $500 he couldn't make a half court shot in 3 tries. Of course he banked in 1st try.


What a moron. MJ could bet me he could make a shot from outside the arena and I still wouldn't take it lol.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1332 » by KingRobb02 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 2:43 am

MagicTime1 wrote:As much as we alll would love to have Bledsoe on our team, I still dont think he will start on this team right away. He has to earn that spot from Meer from my point of view.



Why is everyone so convinced that Bledsoe is anything more than Nate Robinson 2.0? Actually, no one cares but Nate is actually out playing Bledsoe so far this year.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1333 » by Bensational » Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:05 am

MagicFan41 wrote:Monta, Rose, Westbrook, Wade, Wall....these are guys whose abilities largely rely on their "speed and athleticism". Rondo does not. I would hardly call him super-"athletic". One of the many reasons he was drafted as low as he was. His "speed" helps a bit defensively but he is hardly a player who makes a living mostly on beating his defender off the dribble because of his explosiveness. What player are you watching? He is long for a PG, which makes him a good defender, and he has amazing court vision. He runs a half court offense probably better than anybody other than Nash in his prime. All of these things (length, height, court vision, b-ball IQ) aren't going away because of an ACL injury. Same reasons that Nash has been so productive up until almost the age of 40.


I'm watching a player who relies heavily on the transition game for his offense, both for scoring and passing. you want to tell me the transition doesn't rely on speed and athleticism? yes, Rondo will be able to play and compete even with a loss of speed, but who's to say if he'll be able to compete at the same level? what if he's lost a step on the break, so defenses catch him sooner? what if he's lost a step on the dribble? Rondo may get a lot of screens, but if you're unable to have the speed to get separation then those screens are useless. At this point, you can't guarantee how Rondo will return. how do you justify $25M of expenses on him then?


Your argument about how many people have traded for stars who just had an ACL tear is pretty weak. That sample size can't be very big. How many players who were one of the top 2-3 at their position in the league have had ACL tears? How many of those have been involved in trade rumors before that injury, haven't gotten along with the brass/teammates? How many were also teamed with a bunch of vets at the end of their careers with the team looking to possibly start anew? All of these factors make this a relatively unique situation. The sample size is minute when you pull all these factors together.


You say it's a small sample size, but it's really not. There are plenty of great players who have been injured but not traded. Why is that? Let's look at some of the potential candidates you've got to work with:

Rondo, Rose, Roy, Paul, Wade, Eric Gordon, Monta, B.Davis, Bynum, Lopez, Horford, Yao, Brand, Amare, Tony Parker, Arenas, Carter, McDyess, Hardaway and so on, and so on.

Whether it's an ACL injury doesn't matter. The fact is that NBA teams are reluctant to make a move for a player who is injured and still owed big money. Reluctant enough that they wouldn't offer a good enough deal to make it happen. And don't try and say "no other team has been in the position of needing to trade that player". Any team would make a deal if it meant it would improve their team and they'd come out on top.

Is it a risk? Of course. Risks get taken all the time in the NBA, in sports, in life. Just look at Bynum last year, at Dwight after his back surgery, us signing Grant Hill, etc etc etc. Your comment that "no team" would trade for Rondo is asinine. Look at teams like the Lakers, Hawks, etc who might lose their stars to free agency for nothing. Might it be worth the risk to them to get Rondo in a trade in case, which is quite likely, that he returns to normal form? Sure it might. Then again, the majority of comments you've made on this board I've thought the same thing about.


If your problem is how absolute I was by saying "no team", then you've got to let it go. I'll say "no team" because in general, given all the injured players who have had major injuries and not been traded, it doesn't happen.

But hey, you come and find me once a team trades for Rondo by the deadline. And if he's still in Boston green, then I'm sure you'll find a way to ignore it.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1334 » by rcklsscognition » Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:24 am

MagicTownBaller wrote:http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2013/2/16/3995852/knicks-trade-rumors-iman-shumpert-chris-sheridan-sourc

Interesting. I don't trust Sheridan, but this is interesting if true. I would trade Redick for him straight up.


I would also. I would take the risk.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L 

Post#1335 » by Reverse_Angle » Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:44 am

arsenal6106 wrote:
Rick Rolled wrote:I just found the worst article in the history of mankind.....

http://www.rantsports.com/nba/2013/02/16/orlando-magics-nikola-vucevic-fails-to-perform-and-rising-stars-challenge/

At 15-37 coming into the NBA All-Star Break and after having little-to-no success this season, it’s not exactly surprising that the Orlando Magic only have one player participating in all of the All-Star Weekend contests. That one player was Nikola Vucevic in Friday night’s BBVA Rising Stars Challenge.

For the Magic’s sake, Vucevic needed to come out and put on a good show in the game so that he would at least give Orlando a little bit of respect and something to hang their hat on. That’s not how it worked out, though.
Vucevic, part of Team Shaq, scored only 15 points and gathered only four rebounds in a little more than 19 minutes. Those aren’t the worst numbers in a regular game, but for an All-Star style game those are pretty mundane stats.

Wtf!
I don't want to live on this planet anymore.


truly disgusting, an example of corruption of media.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1336 » by glennathan » Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:10 am

rcklsscognition wrote:
MagicTownBaller wrote:http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2013/2/16/3995852/knicks-trade-rumors-iman-shumpert-chris-sheridan-sourc

Interesting. I don't trust Sheridan, but this is interesting if true. I would trade Redick for him straight up.


I would also. I would take the risk.


I don't know that I would trade for Shumpert. Knee injuries always have me worried
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1337 » by Def Swami » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:14 am

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA
RT @chicolisboa: it seems JJ is stayin in Orlando. What do you think? ---> stays unless they get a franchise changing offer
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1338 » by Viper1500 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:35 am

Honestly, it's pretty pathetic if Orlando don't even make the smallest move before the trade deadline. I'm not pro trading JJ, but I am for trading ONE of JJ or Afflalo. This team is in a rebuilding process, enough of these 7-8m dollar veterans, it's time to clear cap space and hope for the best moving forward.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1339 » by MagicFan41 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:43 am

Bensational wrote:
MagicFan41 wrote:Monta, Rose, Westbrook, Wade, Wall....these are guys whose abilities largely rely on their "speed and athleticism". Rondo does not. I would hardly call him super-"athletic". One of the many reasons he was drafted as low as he was. His "speed" helps a bit defensively but he is hardly a player who makes a living mostly on beating his defender off the dribble because of his explosiveness. What player are you watching? He is long for a PG, which makes him a good defender, and he has amazing court vision. He runs a half court offense probably better than anybody other than Nash in his prime. All of these things (length, height, court vision, b-ball IQ) aren't going away because of an ACL injury. Same reasons that Nash has been so productive up until almost the age of 40.


I'm watching a player who relies heavily on the transition game for his offense, both for scoring and passing. you want to tell me the transition doesn't rely on speed and athleticism? yes, Rondo will be able to play and compete even with a loss of speed, but who's to say if he'll be able to compete at the same level? what if he's lost a step on the break, so defenses catch him sooner? what if he's lost a step on the dribble? Rondo may get a lot of screens, but if you're unable to have the speed to get separation then those screens are useless. At this point, you can't guarantee how Rondo will return. how do you justify $25M of expenses on him then?


Your argument about how many people have traded for stars who just had an ACL tear is pretty weak. That sample size can't be very big. How many players who were one of the top 2-3 at their position in the league have had ACL tears? How many of those have been involved in trade rumors before that injury, haven't gotten along with the brass/teammates? How many were also teamed with a bunch of vets at the end of their careers with the team looking to possibly start anew? All of these factors make this a relatively unique situation. The sample size is minute when you pull all these factors together.


You say it's a small sample size, but it's really not. There are plenty of great players who have been injured but not traded. Why is that? Let's look at some of the potential candidates you've got to work with:

Rondo, Rose, Roy, Paul, Wade, Eric Gordon, Monta, B.Davis, Bynum, Lopez, Horford, Yao, Brand, Amare, Tony Parker, Arenas, Carter, McDyess, Hardaway and so on, and so on.

Whether it's an ACL injury doesn't matter. The fact is that NBA teams are reluctant to make a move for a player who is injured and still owed big money. Reluctant enough that they wouldn't offer a good enough deal to make it happen. And don't try and say "no other team has been in the position of needing to trade that player". Any team would make a deal if it meant it would improve their team and they'd come out on top.

Is it a risk? Of course. Risks get taken all the time in the NBA, in sports, in life. Just look at Bynum last year, at Dwight after his back surgery, us signing Grant Hill, etc etc etc. Your comment that "no team" would trade for Rondo is asinine. Look at teams like the Lakers, Hawks, etc who might lose their stars to free agency for nothing. Might it be worth the risk to them to get Rondo in a trade in case, which is quite likely, that he returns to normal form? Sure it might. Then again, the majority of comments you've made on this board I've thought the same thing about.


If your problem is how absolute I was by saying "no team", then you've got to let it go. I'll say "no team" because in general, given all the injured players who have had major injuries and not been traded, it doesn't happen.

But hey, you come and find me once a team trades for Rondo by the deadline. And if he's still in Boston green, then I'm sure you'll find a way to ignore it.


Lol. Right, because if no team does, then that means "no team would". Makes sense. Trades aren't likely, period. Like somebody else said, he played through the game after the injury, was in shootaround a day or two later ready to play the next game. I'm not a doctor but that doesn't sound as serious as it could be. This isn't a team taking a risk on an overpaid clown, it's Rondo at an underpaid contract for his ability. You're right though...no team has ever taken a chance on a guy with an injury (Brandon Roy -> 2 guaranteed years w Minnesota currently, Bynum to Philly and prob Bynum with a max deal this summer whether he comes back or not this year, Arenas, Harrington, Grant Hill, Greg Oden, BOGUT, Tyson Chandler before it was rescinded due to failed physical, Noel will prob get drafted highly this year if he declares, hell even Dwight and his back)........... :roll:

Even in the past year or two alone we have seen numerous injured players with very large contracts trade hands or even get signed to new deals. But I digress, you're right. I'm an idiot.

BTW, I love your logic of "look at the injured players who weren't traded, so that means no injured player can get traded". Guess what, look at all of the healthy players who don't get traded. I guess that means no healthy player will get traded either...
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Re: Official Speculation Thread (Pt. L "Trade Deadline" Edit 

Post#1340 » by BrettC03 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:29 am

Is this even worth arguing over? None of us here are GM's, so it's all speculation.

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