Reggie Rose rips Bulls' inactivity

[DuckIII]

The interesting part is the unknown i.e. how long has team Rose been on the FO's case about spending/making moves? I think at least since last season. My guess is when Rose saw how big the gap was between them and MIA in the ECF he started lobbying for better scorers.

I want to reiterate something to be very clear: I have no problem at all with Derrick and his representatives pressuring the FO to make moves. And I can even imagine more than one scenario in which doing it publicly would be defensible and prudent. But what happened today, under the circumstances of Rose's injury and how this team has battled with him out, is utterly disgraceful and sends up MAJOR red flags about the character of either Rose personally, or his camp which he is permitting to rule the roost. One way or the other, its a bad, bad day to be a Bulls fan.

[LobosJordan]

Get Kevin Love and everyone will be happy, except a few on this board who love Luol Deng and Mirotic.

[coldfish]

I love it how the guys supporting Reggie are acting like they are just telling the truth. You want the truth? It is a superstar league and there are two of them. The Bulls don't have one. The Bulls have built a team a superstar can win with but Rose isn't that player. Because of that, the Bulls are basically screwed.

Who are the two superstars that you are referencing?

1. Lebron -- He has two #2s on his team (Wade & Bosh)

2. Durant -- He had two #2s & a version of Noah (Ibaka) when he made it to the finals. He currently has Westbrook & Ibaka still.

3. Kobe -- The Lakers had multiple superstars around him during all of his title wins.

4. CP3 -- He has a #2 (Blake)

2012 - Lebron - Miami
2010 - Kobe - LA
2009 - Kobe - LA
2007 - Duncan - SA
2005 - Duncan - SA
2003 - Duncan - SA
2002 - Shaq - LA
2001 - Shaq - LA
2000 - Shaq - LA
1999 - Robinson - SA
1998 - Jordan - Chi
1997 - Jordan - Chi
1996 - Jordan - Chi
1995 - Olajuwon - Hou
1994 - Olajuwon - Hou
1993 - Jordan - Chi
1992 - Jordan - Chi
1991 - Jordan - Chi
1988 - Magic - LA
1987 - Magic - LA
1986 - Larry - Bos
1985 - Magic - LA
1984 - Larry - Bos

In the past 30 years, 23 of the titles were won by guys that were top 2 (maybe top 3) in the NBA. If you want to look at the NBA now, that's Durant and Lebron. If you want to go by "how NBA titles are won" the Bulls are screwed. If they are going to win, its going to have to be with the Detroit style. You know, the one that everyone here says is a fluke?

[GetBuLLish]

[
If he's interested in making Chicago look like a more desirable destination to potential teammates, yeah. The FO could certainly do things to help shed the conservative label, that doesn't mean that Rose bashing them is a good idea and he should get a free pass.

To sum it up, Rose's jobs include:

1) Carry the team on his back
2) Recruit the best players
3) Be unlike almost every single superstar of the past 10 years and be completely and absolutely private in your frustrations with your organization. And even if you privately complain to the organization and they don't listen, you still never say anything publicly.

What else does he need to do, wash the floors?

And if he doesn't do every single one of these things, be prepared for Bulls fans to turn on you and start talking about your SATs.

[Rerisen]

If they are going to win, its going to have to be with the Detroit style. You know, the one that everyone here says is a fluke?

It's exceedingly hard. But yes, Detroit won on all around depth. Bulls just cut their depth in the off season. So apparently that is not our plan.

[DuckIII]

More than likely, GarPax will help them with the talking points.

[ryan44]

I disagree. If JR's philosophy is holding back the team from doing as much as it could ignoring it is not going to solve the problem . I have to assume that Rose's camp took this up with the FO privately and only went public after seeing inaction. Its not up to Rose to protect JRs cheap/small market philosophy. There is a natural tension between players who want winning above all, and owners who want profits.

No, it's not up to Rose to protect the FO. As long as he knows the only way he's helping the team is if JR changes his mind about his spending philosophy solely because his PR team went public with the issue.

[FrenchieBully]

OK, let's look at the team that Reggie cited, the Miami Heat. How were they created? Well, they tanked for huge capspace in 2010. Then, their leader spent literally years working over the best players in the game trying to get them to join him. Once convinced, that player took less than a max contract to make sure it all worked.

Rose? He sent Lebron a text and left Wade a voicemail. When the new Rose-rule was put in place, he gladly gobbled up a full max contract putting Chicago into lux tax land creating problems for things like sign and trades.

If Rose and his team aren't happy about looking up at the Miami Heat, they need to look in the mirror.

I don't think I need to pull out my front office bashing credentials. I'll call them out but what Reggie Rose did today was completely and utterly ridiculous. Beyond that, it lacked any amount of nuance or intelligence. If he really wanted to build a winner in Chicago:
- He should have been pushing much harder in 2010, his best chance
- He should have been putting on public pressure this summer or before the trade deadline (you know, when the Bulls could have done something) and done so in a constructive fashion. His quotes sound less intelligent and informed than my 10 year old son.

For those that are bringing up Cleveland . . . think about it. They gave a near max contract to Larry Hughes to get a second creator. They went all in for guys like Jamison to put shooters around Lebron. They got Mo Williams. They catered to every whim of Lebron and Maverick and it didn't work because they were all stupid panic moves made to placate Lebron. You guys wanting to trade the Charlotte pick for the likes of JJ Reddick and his expiring deal are pushing the same things . . . if not worse.

Man, I can't wait for tonight. This is going to be hot on TNT. Reggie Rose just nuked his brother's image. This is Dwight territory if not worse (Dwight was always PC in public). Rose would have done less damage by raping someone like Kobe did.

QFT!

Hey Rose thanks for taking up 30% of the cap! Noah and Deng took less money to stay with the Bulls, learn from your teammates. Don't complain when you are surrounded by MLE starters.

How about you send more than a text to Kevin Love. It didn't work with Lebron.

[Rerisen]

[
If he's interested in making Chicago look like a more desirable destination to potential teammates, yeah. The FO could certainly do things to help shed the conservative label, that doesn't mean that Rose bashing them is a good idea and he should get a free pass.

To sum it up, Rose's jobs include:

1) Carry the team on his back
2) Recruit the best players
3) Be unlike almost every single superstar of the past 10 years and be completely and absolutely private in your frustrations with your organization. And even if you privately complain to the organization and they don't listen, you still never say anything publicly.

What else does he need to do, wash the floors?

And if he doesn't do every single one of these things, be prepared for Bulls fans to turn on you and start talking about your SATs.

Rose is a money making cash cow, who unfortunately I guess, also wants to win desperately. If he would only shut up and let us continue to be profitable playoff also rans forever and ever, eh.

If all Rose cared about was money, he is getting plenty, from both the Bulls and Adidas. He could easily enter into this agreement with the Bulls where they both get rich and no one rocks the boat.

At worst, you can criticize him for an over protective, over zealous, brother. But I can't see how Bulls fans should be mad about what this shows about Rose's motivations.

[Payt10]

If they are going to win, its going to have to be with the Detroit style. You know, the one that everyone here says is a fluke?

It's exceedingly hard. But yes, Detroit won on all around depth. Bulls just cut their depth in the off season. So apparently that is not our plan.

They also had a top 5 player at every position in their starting lineup. Just none of them were Superstars.

[GetBuLLish]

By the way, to Coldfish, Ryan, and anyone else arguing that Reggie's statements will hurt recruiting because they paint the FO in a bad light:

Remember how Michael Jordan constantly trashed and humiliated Jerry Krause? Remember how much tension he had with the Bulls FO?

[coldfish]

Go back to 2010. The last time Chicago had a chance to get a superstar. Remember Wade saying "Chicago isn't loyal"? Remember the results of 2010?

Yes, Wade was basically trashing the Bulls FO. I don't get what this has to do with Rose. What Wade said is evidence that superstar players may think poorly about the Bulls FO.

Are you trying to say that because Wade (and possibly other superstars) think badly about the Bulls FO, Rose should never ever publicly criticize the FO, no matter how pissed off he is at them?

That would be pretty ridiculous to me.

Read your own post. Lebron left Cleveland. Did Cleveland win a title? Melo demanded to leave Denver. Did Denver win a title? Did Minnesota win? You basically 100% backed up my post without realizing it. A superstar complaining publicly is normally very bad for a franchise.

Yes, when the player ends up leaving the franchise, it is bad for the franchise. I don't see how that's relevant to what happened here. A superstar complaining publicly is bad because that means the player might leave. I have never heard that a player publicly complaining for help makes other players not want to come. Are you suggesting that?

Wade was reportedly pretty pissed about the 2010 plan. Despite that, he never complained publicly and stated both publicly and privately to Lebron and Bosh how much he loved the Miami organization. It obviously worked.

If Rose wants to create a Wade-like team he is going to have to act like Wade, not like Dwight.

[WinCity]

The interesting part is the unknown i.e. how long has team Rose been on the FO's case about spending/making moves? I think at least since last season. My guess is when Rose saw how big the gap was between them and MIA in the ECF he started lobbying for better scorers.

I want to reiterate something to be very clear: I have no problem at all with Derrick and his representatives pressuring the FO to make moves. And I can even imagine more than one scenario in which doing it publicly would be defensible and prudent. But what happened today, under the circumstances of Rose's injury and how this team has battled with him out, is utterly disgraceful and sends up MAJOR red flags about the character of either Rose personally, or his camp which he is permitting to rule the roost. One way or the other, its a bad, bad day to be a Bulls fan.

Well I totally disagree. This season can not be spoiled because the Bulls arent going to win this season. Rose is obviously leveraging his rehab, which he controsl entirely, to pressure the FO. Now if he goes so far as to sit out the whole season even though he is ready then I may get mad, as Rerisen pointed out. But I dont see him doing that. I think its just a way to make his point. I think the circumstances mean this is the perfect time for Rose to make this kind of play. If he did it when he was healthy/ playing and the team had a legit (although underdog) shot to win the title, that would be screwed up IMO. Basically, I dont think Rose has undermined anything important enough to "ruin" things. I actually kind of admire the ballsiness of it. Obviously, Rose and his camp have spoken to the FO about these issues and felt they weren't being heard so they are making the point this way. If they waited until the off season it wouldnt be as impactful as hopefully it will be

[ryan44]

Rose is a money making cash cow, who unfortunately I guess, also wants to win desperately. If he would only shut up and let us continue to be profitable playoff also rans forever and ever, eh.

If all Rose cared about was money, he is getting plenty, from both the Bulls and Adidas. He could easily enter into this agreement with the Bulls where they both get rich and no one rocks the boat.

At worst, you can criticize him for an over protective, over zealous, brother. But I can't see how Bulls fans should be mad about what this shows about Rose's motivations.

I'm not mad at Rose, I just don't get the mentality of some around here that Rose can literally do no wrong. We're just supposed to shrug and let him say/do whatever he wants about the FO?

[DuckIII]

[
If he's interested in making Chicago look like a more desirable destination to potential teammates, yeah. The FO could certainly do things to help shed the conservative label, that doesn't mean that Rose bashing them is a good idea and he should get a free pass.

To sum it up, Rose's jobs include:

1) Carry the team on his back
2) Recruit the best players
3) Be unlike almost every single superstar of the past 10 years and be completely and absolutely private in your frustrations with your organization. And even if you privately complain to the organization and they don't listen, you still never say anything publicly.

What else does he need to do, wash the floors?

And if he doesn't do every single one of these things, be prepared for Bulls fans to turn on you and start talking about your SATs.

You keep calling everyone who disagrees with your opinions a joke. The reality is this fan base has been slavishly defensive and passionately dedicated, often beyond all rationality, to Derrick Rose. Until today, while he takes perfectly fair criticism and questions about where his head is as a teammate. So who you crappin?

[coldfish]

By the way, to Coldfish, Ryan, and anyone else arguing that Reggie's statements will hurt recruiting because they paint the FO in a bad light:

Remember how Michael Jordan constantly trashed and humiliated Jerry Krause? Remember how much tension he had with the Bulls FO?

Yes. Remember all those superstars that came to Chicago? Oh, wait, Jordan never got a superstar to come to Chicago to join him like what you guys want. He left an image in Chicago that reportedly made it very difficult for the team to recruit in 2000, even after he left.

Again, you are making my case.

Also, do you remember what Jordan wanted? He hated Kukoc. He didn't want Cartwright. What he wanted was idiotic and if the Bulls had listened to him, they wouldn't have been as good. The Bulls won titles because MJ was the best player in the game and the Bulls drafted very well.

[LobosJordan]

Rose can say whatever the hell he wants Duck. Sorry if he isn't in the mold of the Paxson golden boys Deng and Hinrich. If Rose wants a superstar next to him, the front office better listen, or they haven't seen what LeBron did not 3 years ago.

[ryan44]

By the way, to Coldfish, Ryan, and anyone else arguing that Reggie's statements will hurt recruiting because they paint the FO in a bad light:

Remember how Michael Jordan constantly trashed and humiliated Jerry Krause? Remember how much tension he had with the Bulls FO?

If Rose helps the team win an NBA championship or multiple championships while simultaneously feuding with the front office, he can feud all he wants. I also don't recall Jordan ever lobbing veiled threats about not playing even if he was healthy because he didn't get exactly what he wanted.

[Shill]

OK, let's look at the team that Reggie cited, the Miami Heat. How were they created? Well, they tanked for huge capspace in 2010. Then, their leader spent literally years working over the best players in the game trying to get them to join him. Once convinced, that player took less than a max contract to make sure it all worked.

Rose? He sent Lebron a text and left Wade a voicemail. When the new Rose-rule was put in place, he gladly gobbled up a full max contract putting Chicago into lux tax land creating problems for things like sign and trades.

If Rose and his team aren't happy about looking up at the Miami Heat, they need to look in the mirror.

I don't think I need to pull out my front office bashing credentials. I'll call them out but what Reggie Rose did today was completely and utterly ridiculous. Beyond that, it lacked any amount of nuance or intelligence. If he really wanted to build a winner in Chicago:
- He should have been pushing much harder in 2010, his best chance
- He should have been putting on public pressure this summer or before the trade deadline (you know, when the Bulls could have done something) and done so in a constructive fashion. His quotes sound less intelligent and informed than my 10 year old son.

For those that are bringing up Cleveland . . . think about it. They gave a near max contract to Larry Hughes to get a second creator. They went all in for guys like Jamison to put shooters around Lebron. They got Mo Williams. They catered to every whim of Lebron and Maverick and it didn't work because they were all stupid panic moves made to placate Lebron. You guys wanting to trade the Charlotte pick for the likes of JJ Reddick and his expiring deal are pushing the same things . . . if not worse.

Man, I can't wait for tonight. This is going to be hot on TNT. Reggie Rose just nuked his brother's image. This is Dwight territory if not worse (Dwight was always PC in public). Rose would have done less damage by raping someone like Kobe did.

I think that last part in bold is a severe overreaction.

Derrick is not his brother. He's not demanding a trade, he's not asking out, he's not moping around. This will blow over.

[FrenchieBully]

Rose better be doing more than exchanging texts or IMs with Love and EGordon.