Redick, Ayon & Smith to the Bucks for Harris, Lamb and Udrih

[paul]

I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for this post, but, what the hell...

From about 2006-2011 on this board, I wasted time on this board basically ripping every word that came out of Hammond's mouth, every trade idea, and every move. I thought he should have been fired on the spot for capping out a garbage team with RJ, the S-Jax trade was one of the more lulztastic things ever, etc.

However, myself and a few others would take the tanking complaints too far. "We're not going to tank" would be the response. Fine, I shut up.

I haven't watched the Bucks in almost 3 years but still follow because I was so fed up with some of their moves.

However, we trade one-legged Bogut way too late for a garbage player (would you want to be in the situation of considering resigning him right now?). Yes, I realize there were strong rumors of better deals on the table.

Now we get a solid player on an expiring deal and get his bird rights. We trade another expiring, a borderline NBDL player that everyone thinks is the next James Harden if he gets playing time, and a recent 2nd round pick.

And these last 2 trades are making people want to torch the Bradley Center? I mean, I get it...obviously we should not be making "win" trades sitting in the 8 seed. I've been in the crowd saying that for almost 10 years now. But I really think Bogut (post major injuries) and Tobias Harris have been horrendously overrated on this board.

Why would you get flamed for that post?

Aside from the fact that you got the details of Bogut's contract wrong (we wouldn't have to be considering resigning him given he's got another year left after this) it's the same stuff you've been telling us since 2007.

Doesn't make today's trade any less stupid btw, but disagreeing on how good a player is rationally shouldn't get you flamed (you weren't always quite so rational on these matters )

Also, this trade eats ass if I hadn't mentioned that. Just like the last one.

[humanrefutation]

I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for this post, but, what the hell...

From about 2006-2011 on this board, I wasted time on this board basically ripping every word that came out of Hammond's mouth, every trade idea, and every move. I thought he should have been fired on the spot for capping out a garbage team with RJ, the S-Jax trade was one of the more lulztastic things ever, etc.

However, myself and a few others would take the tanking complaints too far. "We're not going to tank" would be the response. Fine, I shut up.

I haven't watched the Bucks in almost 3 years but still follow because I was so fed up with some of their moves.

However, we trade one-legged Bogut way too late for a garbage player (would you want to be in the situation of considering resigning him right now?). Yes, I realize there were strong rumors of better deals on the table.

Now we get a solid player on an expiring deal and get his bird rights. We trade another expiring, a borderline NBDL player that everyone thinks is the next James Harden if he gets playing time, and a recent 2nd round pick.

And these last 2 trades are making people want to torch the Bradley Center? I mean, I get it...obviously we should not be making "win" trades sitting in the 8 seed. I've been in the crowd saying that for almost 10 years now. But I really think Bogut (post major injuries) and Tobias Harris have been horrendously overrated on this board.

Posts like this piss me off because they rely on strawman critiques.

No, the board isn't ready to torch the Bradley Center simply because of these two trades.

No, no one here is saying that Tobias was going to be the next James Harden.

Come on, now. It's like you removed the context from the whole damn debate and haven't been reading the frustration people have had with the direction of this team for the last decade. If that serves your argument, then fine. But it doesn't make it an accurate one.

[Garbs_7]

There's no room for rational posts here, we're Bucks fans. Shut up and grab your damn torches, we have a stadium to burn.

[ReddWing]

The Bucks got much better with this trade. This gives us some impressive depth. We have options at the 2 now and dont have to rely solely on Monta. We get the high percentage shooting of JJ and the athleticism/penetration of Monta. That's an asset in my opinion.

[Scoops]

No, the board isn't ready to torch the Bradley Center simply because of these two trades.

I know GJ acts like people are renouncing their fandom and trying to organize bag nights or something...

[paulpressey25]

Bogut should have brought back Steph Curry, who is arguably the best pure shooter in the game this season. Curry would have given this team much more hope not only for this season but long-term as well.

I'd say Bogut's been rated rather appropriately given that.

You are measuring this wrong though.

Remember that Steph Curry wasn't worth this much at this time last year. This year he's broken out and stayed healthy. And he's signed to a long-term deal versus being an RFA. Steph Curry value today >>>> Steph Curry value a year ago.

Now would he have been a better option than the trade package we took? Sure. Could one have projected he'd get better? Sure. But no way does 2012 Bogut net you 2013 Curry under any GM's calculus. And I'm using March 2012 Bogut who had more value than current 2013 Bogut.

The value of everyone involved in that trade with Golden State has depreciated a lot the past year. Bogut is a microfracture patient heading for free agency next season, Monta can't shoot even 40% anymore and Udoh has decided to have his career trajectory head downward versus the upward arc he was on last March with Golden State.

They only guy whose stock has risen a lot is Curry. That's where a great GM comes in. They see things that haven't occurred yet.

[paul]

I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for this post, but, what the hell...

From about 2006-2011 on this board, I wasted time on this board basically ripping every word that came out of Hammond's mouth, every trade idea, and every move. I thought he should have been fired on the spot for capping out a garbage team with RJ, the S-Jax trade was one of the more lulztastic things ever, etc.

However, myself and a few others would take the tanking complaints too far. "We're not going to tank" would be the response. Fine, I shut up.

I haven't watched the Bucks in almost 3 years but still follow because I was so fed up with some of their moves.

However, we trade one-legged Bogut way too late for a garbage player (would you want to be in the situation of considering resigning him right now?). Yes, I realize there were strong rumors of better deals on the table.

Now we get a solid player on an expiring deal and get his bird rights. We trade another expiring, a borderline NBDL player that everyone thinks is the next James Harden if he gets playing time, and a recent 2nd round pick.

And these last 2 trades are making people want to torch the Bradley Center? I mean, I get it...obviously we should not be making "win" trades sitting in the 8 seed. I've been in the crowd saying that for almost 10 years now. But I really think Bogut (post major injuries) and Tobias Harris have been horrendously overrated on this board.

Posts like this piss me off because they rely on strawman critiques.

No, the board isn't ready to torch the Bradley Center simply because of these two trades.

No, no one here is saying that Tobias was going to be the next James Harden.

Come on, now. It's like you removed the context from the whole damn debate and haven't been reading the frustration people have had with the direction of this team for the last decade. If that serves your argument, then fine. But it doesn't make it an accurate one.

Wait, you mean you can't like Harris without thinking he's going to be the best player in the NBA? One doesn't equal the other?

Well color me confused.

[paul]

No, the board isn't ready to torch the Bradley Center simply because of these two trades.

I know GJ acts like people are renouncing their fandom and trying to organize bag nights or something...

This board constantly validates it's own self-worth by bringing up the fact that the first 'bag night' after a series of idiotic short-sighted moves got real change made within the organization.

Is your contention that it was either worthless or shouldn't have happened?

[humanrefutation]

No, the board isn't ready to torch the Bradley Center simply because of these two trades.

I know GJ acts like people are renouncing their fandom and trying to organize bag nights or something...

Read what I wrote again. Note the word "simply." Thank you.

[giraldo5]

I hate this organization.

I'll be back around draft time or when Herb thankfully dies.

[Jez2983]

Well, at least Harris may get a go.

Who the hell are Ayon and Smith?

Excellent trade. For the Magic.

[Garbs_7]

Yeah I'm a big Harris fan and I understand he doesn't warrant being untouchable or anything and I know he isn't going to be "the next James Harden". But He is young, a hard worker, great size, good kid with an already impressive skill set for the NBA and all he needed was consistent NBA minutes to learn and grow and I am sure he could become a solid starting 3 in this league or at least a very good role player.

The reason myself and others are angry is because you don't give that up (Along with Lamb and Udrih) for 1/3 season rental "7th seed push" of JJ Redick... In a bigger deal for a borderline all star then ok but not a JJ rental, not even to start, to sit behind Monta Ellis.

[paulpressey25]

Read what I wrote again. Note the word "simply." Thank you.

People should listen to some of these podcasts on WSSP from the big show today.

http://www.sportsradio1250.com/

The second half of the 4 o'clock hour is a good start.

http://podcast.sportsradio1250.com/wssp2/3871070.mp3

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

[europa]

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

Yup. Some of us who hate this trade actually like JJ Redick. That distinction continues to be lost in all the hubbub.

[giraldo5]

Bogut should have brought back Steph Curry, who is arguably the best pure shooter in the game this season. Curry would have given this team much more hope not only for this season but long-term as well.

I'd say Bogut's been rated rather appropriately given that.

You are measuring this wrong though.

Remember that Steph Curry wasn't worth this much at this time last year. This year he's broken out and stayed healthy. And he's signed to a long-term deal versus being an RFA. Steph Curry value today >>>> Steph Curry value a year ago.

Now would he have been a better option than the trade package we took? Sure. Could one have projected he'd get better? Sure. But no way does 2012 Bogut net you 2013 Curry under any GM's calculus. And I'm using March 2012 Bogut who had more value than current 2013 Bogut.

The value of everyone involved in that trade with Golden State has depreciated a lot the past year. Bogut is a microfracture patient heading for free agency next season, Monta can't shoot even 40% anymore and Udoh has decided to have his career trajectory head downward versus the upward arc he was on last March with Golden State.

They only guy whose stock has risen a lot is Curry. That's where a great GM comes in. They see things that haven't occurred yet.

I respect you Press but this is an awful post. Isiah Thomas could have seen Curry's value. He hasn't broken out whatsoever this year. He simply has stayed relatively healthy. Hes just doing what he's been doing since entering the league. Hammond chose the asset that was 90% sure to stay healthy and 100% suck over the guy who was 50% sure to stay healthy and 80% do what he's doing. And the sane posters all said so at the time. It wasn't rocket science.

[humanrefutation]

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

Yup. Some of us who hate this trade actually like JJ Redick. That distinction continues to be lost in all the hubbub.

Thank you.

[giraldo5]

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

Yup. Some of us who hate this trade actually like JJ Redick. That distinction continues to be lost in all the hubbub.

Thank you.

[Garbs_7]

Read what I wrote again. Note the word "simply." Thank you.

People should listen to some of these podcasts on WSSP from the big show today.

http://www.sportsradio1250.com/

The second half of the 4 o'clock hour is a good start.

http://podcast.sportsradio1250.com/wssp2/3871070.mp3

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

That's a bingo

[paul]

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

Yup. Some of us who hate this trade actually like JJ Redick. That distinction continues to be lost in all the hubbub.

Fasho (me and you Bobbo, I know you're out there reading this sh*t somewhere)

[Scoops]

Read what I wrote again. Note the word "simply." Thank you.

People should listen to some of these podcasts on WSSP from the big show today.

http://www.sportsradio1250.com/

The second half of the 4 o'clock hour is a good start.

http://podcast.sportsradio1250.com/wssp2/3871070.mp3

People don't care whether we "won" or "lost" the Redick trade. The bigger issue is that today was once again a moment where the franchise could define itself and show that it has a vision or a plan.

But once again we saw Herb Kohl reach for 30-games of "playoff run" and defer off trying to solve all the long-term franchise problems that continue to haunt us.

What trades were out there to define our franchise?

A serious win now move (trading Henson) would have people going ****.

Trading our good players for trash in hopes of tanking (Larry, Ersan, BJ) would have people going ****.

Doing nothing would have people going ****.

Nobody wants Monta.

Your answer is going to be well a good GM would have made something happen. You may or may not post a picture of Larry Harris with a goofy grin on his face.