PJ Thread (Working Title)

[Brooklyn_Knight]

Don’t know who everyone blames for this recent bad play by the Nets, but I think PJ should be let go during the All-Star break.

First reason: Offense
They try to run simple plays and if they don't get what they want they run an isolation. Where are the second or third go to options on these plays. To me it looks like PJ and this coaching staff lacks any kind of offensive imagination. They don’t do a good job of getting players in the game to space the floor to let players like Crash, Johnson, and DWill to drive in the paint. To be honest I put most of the blame on this end on the players for not hitting their shots and for bad ball movement, but the coach is not putting the players in a position to succeed, with a poor strategy.

Second reason: Defense
There is no team defense. The only players that have done any help defense have been Lopez, and earlier Wallace (not much lately). Lopez is doing pretty well at help defense, but he gets none. A perfect example, in the Wizards game, Nene is abusing Lopez with lateral moves in the paint, he would start out on one side and move across the lane and get a basket every time. Where was the help defense coming from Reggie who I believe was on the other side? Nene did this multiple times, and he is not the first. Where is the coach telling Reggie or someone else to help Lopez, when Nene makes the move come and double him, or take a charge since he is coming across the lane at full speed? In addition, in each game there are blown defense rotations a couple times a game. In my opinion, good defensive teams don't need great defensive players, they just need a good defensive plan and understand where the help is coming from and have an idea of how to hide each team’s defensive flaws, the Nets do not right now.

Third reason: Managing players and Reggie in the starting lineup
I don't think Reggie should be in the starting line up or play that many minutes. He is a black hole on offense, don't need to say much here, but every time the ball is passed off to Reggie and the other team just fouls him, to me it almost feels like a turnover. I think he is overrated on defense, he is a good one on one defender, but I have seen multiple times in games where he is a horrible help and team defender. I love how Reggie gives it all he has but, I don't think he is smart enough to play good team defense, and that his rebounding is overated for team success. I like Marshon, and Tele, and I don't like how he gives them inconsistent minutes especially Tele, and takes them out if they don't hit a shot or play well. I believe he has put them both in a position to fail. That being said Marshon and Tele also need to just play better themselves. It also seemed like he blamed Marshon and Tele for the wizards lost, from them getting benched, seriously?

Forth reason: History
A lot of this is based on the grantland story below. Remember when he was coaching the Thunder. He wanted Durant to be a SG. He just wanted KD to come off screens and shoot. You have a young potential Star on your hands that is 6'10 to just take open shoots off screens? The most efficient shots in the league are at the rim, and you want to teach a young player to not be aggressive and not go to the rim. Also, you want him to guard 6'3 6'5 quick SGs. He did not put KD into a position to win. Brooks his assistant took over fixed this and over time KD became the player he is. Not to say Brooks made KD, but he clearly understood that the 3 was the best position for KD, and I would imagine that he most likely gave PJ his opinion on that prior to PJ getting fired and PJ most likely did not agree. I also remember hearing on the radio’s last night or this morning that the last time a team lead by 10 or more and then lost by more than 20 points was Golden State Warriors and PJ was coaching. That says a lot to me.
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/891 ... ba-history

Conclusion:
The system that was made by Avery and PJ is not working, clearly. The Nets have been embarrassed by good teams, not just beaten but embarrassed multiple times. An now the only thing that has changed is that the players who played the most minutes during those games are getting more time. I believe that a lot of the blame should go to the players, but for the most part the players are not going to change. The only other option is to change the system and coach. I think that Popeye or one of the other coaches should take over for the rest of the season. Let whoever takes over try to plan things out during the All-Star break. No good coach is going to take over midseason, but what is the worst that can happen, the Nets get blown out by another team. Last other telling sign that PJ should have left with Avery is that when Avery left, if I remember this correctly, he recommended to Billy that Popeye or one of the other coaches should take over, and not PJ. Doesn’t that say a lot about PJ?

I would like to hear your opinions about this.

[serp]

Should he be replaced ? Yeah he should be . The entire coaching staff should've been replaced before training camp. But after already firing Avery i don't think we fire a second coach this season.

[Keith Van Horn]

Proky will show some balls if he fires PJ this season. The media will go in a frenzy bashing this team and Deron Williams.

I want PJ gone but this season is a lost cause anyway. On the other hand, I want to see the new players develop more and see these players respond differently to regime changes.

[PetroNet]

I cant blame PJ for bad team defense when we have a roster where 12 of the 15 guys are average or worse defenders, most of them bad defenders, especially at PG and C.

offensively alot is on PJ. the rotations could be better. but even with proper rotations, we are still a really bad mismatch of players offensively, on a team with no one even coming close to resembling a leader on the court.

I cant see firing PJ when he has to work with the trash that Billy King has given him to work with. i mean some blame also goes on PJ for allowing the players to not care and bring 0 effert on a semi-regular basis. but its also tough when you have a team of complacent followers who dont care about winning or losing.

i mean we are like 16-2 vs. sub .500 teams, so at least PJ has us beating bad teams for the most part. a better coach will help, but only an elite one who commands respect, and we wont find one in season.

[CalamityX12]

too bad we won't likely face a sub .500 team in the playoffs(if we make it)

[nycefnl]

Pj should be fired for continually starting Evans

and King should be fired for trading for Wallace.

[xam2k7]

do i think PJ should be fired? no... do i think he should go back to being the lead assistant while we bring in a new visionary and fresh voice? absolutely. Bring in someone new and keep PJ on... I think its obvious that the players respect PJ and like him in that regard, but he is not fit for making the big decisions. He's a top notch assistant but thats all he will ever be in my opinion.

[MrDollarBills]

I blame Prokhorov, his people, and King for not having the common sense to get a proven head coach in here during the summer. Instead, they chose to sit around and play this game with Avery and his staff full of morons.

Billy King should be fired for the Gerald Wallace trade, the Nets bid against themselves for Wallace.

[Pen Island]

Mutual support (also called self-help) groups are an important part of recovery from abuse. Mutual support groups exist both for persons who have suffered from the abuse directly and for their families or
supporters. These groups are one of the choices an individual has during the recovery process.

Mutual support groups are nonprofessional groups comprising members who share the same problem
and voluntarily support one another in the recovery from that problem. Although mutual support groups
do not provide formal treatment, they are one part of a recovery-oriented systems-of-care approach
to substance abuse recovery. By providing social, emotional, and informational support for persons
throughout the recovery process, mutual support groups help individuals deal with abuse (such as PJ Carlesimo's idiotic rotations).

Alumni:

Current President:

Current Vice President:

Other affected parties and their afflictions:

Deron Williams: Being run to the ground by an incompetent coach. Stagnant and inept offensive system that lacks creativity.

Joe Johnson: Being run to the ground by an incompetent coach. A man with a non-existent injury history suddenly has sore ankles.

Gerald Wallace: Being molded into a spot-up 3 point shooter.

Kris Humphries: Is terrible in his own right, but doesn't see the floor despite playing with equally terrible Reggie Evans.

Brook Lopez: 24 years old, can't play more than 30 minutes a night.

Reggie Evans: Great role player, terrible starter. No everyone hates him.

Tyshawn Taylor: "How can I show my coach that I can play...if I don't play?"

Toko: See above.

Andray Blatche: Top 5 in PER under Avery Johnson, bottom 5 in minutes played on this team with PJC.

Nets fans: Have to put up with his nonsense.

Please talk about your grievances and post anything relevant about how awful he is. It helps.

[Pen Island]

Proky was there tonight. And was none to pleased. BK doesn't sound to pleased with PJ either.

Mikhail Prokhorov left Barclays Center in a hurry Friday night, walking with a presumably wealthy posse, past the media and toward the downstairs garage.


Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z2LhoaqejL

General manager Billy King said the goal is to reduce playing time for Williams and Johnson, who were both in the NBA’s top 20 in minutes played before Friday’s games.

“If we can find time to get them rest, it would be good,” King said.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baske ... z2LhofuD00

[Paradise]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjQ39krfxrc&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

And somehow he wasn't benched like Mirza, Taylor, Kris get benched. That is favoritism at it's finest.

[Pen Island]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjQ39krfxrc&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

And somehow he wasn't benched like Mirza, Taylor, Kris get benched. That is favoritism at it's finest.

I think this idiot tried to Euro Step. Did you see that? And our bigger idiot head coach didn't pull him for that immediately. Marshon misses a rotation? Pulled! Mirza misses a shot? Pulled! Blatche dribbles? Pulled?

Reggie goes YOLO and gets more time.

Look at Deron's reaction. Dear Lord.

[MrDollarBills]

I can't believe the garbage that I saw last night.

[PetroNet]

normally id call some of this stuff plain haterade, but since this is a kill PJ thread i will pile on instead

- Dude refuses to EVERdjust his lineup at halftime. like i think he thinks there is a rule where you have to have the same lineup to start the half that you started the game with

- Doesnt take his own advice... on the association they say he was always on avery for not playing brook and blatche together... but he never does it himself. i can see you can do it a ton cause we have no other backup up center, but no reason we cant go to it extensively in the 4th

- how come we can ride the hot hand with some guys and go with them over starters(blatche) but not others(mirza)

- Its like dude has amnesia right after the game.... if mirza killed it, next game its like PJ doesnt take that into consideration and guy gets liek 6 straight DNPs.

[Sharcm1]

Pj is making the same mistakes that avery made. Plan and simple. The only reason he still has a job is because they are winning. Problem is if the things that are wrong aren't corrected they will be one and done in the playoffs. And the goal for a team with three players that are supposed to be top players in ther positions should not be just to make the play offs.

He started off playing marshon and mirza. He gave them a chance and the nets won games. They won a few games because of those two. Games that they would have lost if they didn't play. Now they are Not consistent yet but that is difficult to do when you not playing consistently. Any player will tell you that if they don't know when and about how much they are going to play it's hard to be ready and play consistently especially for a young player like marshon.

Marshon played well when he was in the game and then only played 10 mins. Why. Can't remember him doing anything that was bad.

The way that pj pulls players because they made one bad rotation or one bad shot and then leaves others in after they do it repeatedly is beyond me. He will pull out brook for blatche if blatche is having a good game even if brook was dominating but he will leave dwill in even though his man is killing him and he is clearly struggling and leave in jj even though he has missed most of his shots. Why. We have players that can fill in at those positions. Even if Watson and Brooks are having good games he has to go back to jj and dwill. Why.

That's the thing that frustrates me the most of pj and was the same with Avery. He also has a hard time seeing when a player is tired. If a player is hot he will rid him till he drops. If blatche is hot great but when you constantly go to him and rid him till he starts missing then take him out because he is tired and needs a rest. Constantly he pushes them too much and then they stop hitting shots and the other team goes on a run,

[PetroNet]

Pj is making the same mistakes that avery made. Plan and simple. The only reason he still has a job is because they are winning. Problem is if the things that are wrong aren't corrected they will be one and done in the playoffs. And the goal for a team with three players that are supposed to be top players in ther positions should not be just to make the play offs.

we cant fire PJ now... it would make this someplace no one would want to coach... if we were gonna replace PJ, it had to be early when he was first tagged an interim coach. now we have no choice but to wait it out.

He started off playing marshon and mirza. He gave them a chance and the nets won games. They won a few games because of those two. Games that they would have lost if they didn't play.

this isnt really accurate. brooks has played rougly the same amount of mintues with the same kind of (in)frequency as he did under avery. one 5 minute or so rotation with the occasion string of 15 minutes performances sprinkled in. Brooks has played really well in a few games where he was a big reason we won, but those came more recently (the last bulls game for instance) and less so when PJ first took over.

mirza on the other hand, you are correct, he got alot of burn when PJ first took over and now gets 5 minutes a game. really a head scratcher, although i guess hump needs minutes too.

The way that pj pulls players because they made one bad rotation or one bad shot and then leaves others in after they do it repeatedly is beyond me. He will pull out brook for blatche if blatche is having a good game even if brook was dominating but he will leave dwill in even though his man is killing him and he is clearly struggling and leave in jj even though he has missed most of his shots. Why. We have players that can fill in at those positions. Even if Watson and Brooks are having good games he has to go back to jj and dwill. Why.

with brooks you have to play that way, because he simply doesnt learn otherwise. he has way too many bad habits, and they just keep popping up every game. its different with veteran guys, who realize their mistakes when they make one. you arent teaching dwill any new lessons if you sit him for playing hero ball or throwing the ball away. broosk needs to learn that its play the game the right way or dont play at all.

with lopez, i think its frustration. brook can look dominate one game and then look like the biggest pansy in the game the next. blatche, he is a bonehead, but you get the same effort from him every game. plus brook is on a minutes restriction wether they admit it or not

That's the thing that frustrates me the most of pj and was the same with Avery. He also has a hard time seeing when a player is tired. If a player is hot he will rid him till he drops. If blatche is hot great but when you constantly go to him and rid him till he starts missing then take him out because he is tired and needs a rest. Constantly he pushes them too much and then they stop hitting shots and the other team goes on a run,

our margin of error is just too small. and PJ steps over that line way too often. we cant afford his mismanagement. its like he doesnt even watch the games. its frustrating because he is really a great basketball mind, and when you hear him talk outside of the games and outside the post game conference he says all the right things. then he doesnt make those adjustments that he himself harped on (i.e. brook and blatche together, getting dwill rest, playing 3 gaurds, sticking with the hot hands, etc)

[NyCeEvO]

Pen, I love the way you started the OP .

But to get to the point of the topic, I never envisioned that I would purposely miss or plan other things over watching the Nets on TV when we finally had a playoff bound team again.

I started off watching almost every game at the beginning of the season and my frustration just grew and grew till I just decided that I was no longer going to devote my time to the Nets whenever they play.

Now, I just make sure that I'm multi-tasking when I'm watching the game so at least if PJ isn't being productive leading this team, I know I'm being productive doing something else. It makes me feel good when I know that I'm not completely wasting 2.5hrs of my life watching this circus act.

I know there are areas where the players have to be responsible and do their job well, but PJ has to put them in the position to succeed and he's not doing it.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure that we're like 0-7 the last 7 games Proky has come to watch the Nets. Pitiful...

[PetroNet]

Pen, I love the way you started the OP .

But to get to the point of the topic, I never envisioned that I would purposely miss or plan other things over watching the Nets on TV when we finally had a playoff bound team again.

I started off watching almost every game at the beginning of the season and my frustration just grew and grew till I just decided that I was no longer going to devote my time to the Nets whenever they play.

Now, I just make sure that I'm multi-tasking when I'm watching the game so at least if PJ isn't being productive leading this team, I know I'm being productive doing something else. It makes me feel good when I know that I'm not completely wasting 2.5hrs of my life watching this circus act.

I know there are areas where the players have to be responsible and do their job well, but PJ has to put them in the position to succeed and he's not doing it.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure that we're like 0-7 the last 7 games Proky has come to watch the Nets. Pitiful...

i wish i could turn it off or do something else... cant pry myself away even if i wanted to....

whats frustrating is it is like 3 tiered:

- PJ's coaching is awful
- Kings management is awful
- Players effort is awful

and each one masks the other, so you have a circle jerk of excuses to point at one another... and someone can always get away on "well if we just fixed this we'd be set". a good coach make us better, not great. better effort improves us, but only to an extent. king... well, no, replacing kind with prichard bobblehead doll would make a big differnece, so there is that.

i hate having to 'wait till next year' again. and having to rely on our GM to bring in a good defensive minded coach who demands respct along with trusting him to turn humphries contract into a legit PF.

it blows because i would legit be satisfied with a 4-6 seed team that gets ousted in the first round and be thrilled to root for them if they played hard and had a competent coach... but its just so frustrating to watch a team with no fire led by an imbecile.

[Pen Island]

The excuse I hate the most is "The team is 19-8 with PJ coaching" or "The team is playing /.600 ball with Reggie starting."

How can people be that dense? How can people not see the forest from the trees?

[NyCeEvO]

The excuse I hate the most is "The team is 19-8 with PJ coaching" or "The team is playing /.600 ball with Reggie starting."

How can people be that dense? How can people not see the forest from the trees?

That's why I was happy in hearing Proky say "We weren't even playing good in our wins" when Avery was getting fired.

The lack of analysis from people who say "The team is playing /.600 ball with Reggie starting." is just mind-boggling.

EDIT: I meant when Avery was getting fired.