Wiz vs DET Game Thread 2/27/13 7PM - fake dagger game

[dobrojim]

Man, I thought that went through.

It did look that way on TV. Man. Truth is we didn't deserve to win.

[dobrojim]

Wow, Buck fooled me.

Remember, those guys don't sit courtside this year.
They sit in the back row of the section facing the Wizards bench.
From that angle, it wasn't hard to get fooled.
If they had been sitting where Ted now sits, they
don't miss that call.

[dobrojim]

I can totally see why Buck missed that call. From that angle, it absolutely looked like the ball went in.

exactly

remember where Buck and Phil are now sitting. It's not courtside next to
the Wizard bench as it was for so many years.

[dobrojim]

I don't really think he's full of himself. He seems humble and soft spoken in most interviews. I think he's just really hard on himself and is trying to externalize it. I do it sometimes when I'm on the court.
Remember, he legit thought he was going to be an all star this year. And everything is going wrong. You can see his confidence is shaken by his body language.
He still shouldn't have said that, but I think it was more out of frustration than arrogance.

That and he's not too articulate, Poor choice of words, but I'm not so sure that was his intended message.

I agree MS.

To date, finger pointing has not been his way.

[dobrojim]

Everybody goes through hard times. The question is how Wall responds. Does he sulk and never improve or does this light a fire in him to do whatever needs to be done to get better? I'm not ready to write the guy off yet.

+1000

+1000^2

[dobrojim]

Pistons' announcers missed it too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1FYMHmUauI

proving my point. They all sit in the same area.

[pancakes3]

Everybody goes through hard times. The question is how Wall responds. Does he sulk and never improve or does this light a fire in him to do whatever needs to be done to get better? I'm not ready to write the guy off yet.

+1000

+1000^2

So we should be expecting the response from Wall's rookie year and sophomore year any time now? Or does the fire take 3 full years to stoke?

[dobrojim]

No. I'd just say some things are not as easy to fix as we fans would
like them to be. No more complicated than that.

And we're all emotionally beat-up after a difficult loss
to a team we think we should beat, but don't.

[pancakes3]

so just +500 for the first half. I can concede that. Everyone does go through hard times. However, let's not sugarcoat what Wall is or is not, or continue to project his ceiling. By a lot of metrics, he's regressed quite a bit, especially relative to others at his position.

[dobrojim]

I agree and will say that I personally and generally have
stayed away from that. The one thing I think I have done
is say my dream re what JW's possible ceiling might be
is a cross btw Payton and AI. I will readily concede that
especially at this time, it's hard to continue to envision
that.

[FAH1223]

Dammit - my Verizon guide said the game started at 8:00...just started watching like 10 minutes ago. Ariza and price look good.

Mine too but I caught it ahead of time. The game was orig schedule for an 8 o'clock start
which is why the TV schedule was wrong.

game was supposed to be on ESPN but they scrapped it for Knicks Warriors

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Specially when they were not great passes. They were difficult passes made in the post, close distant, clogged lanes, to big men. How when Price came in, those same player caught his passes and the pick and roll looked much more open and smoother.

What worries me so much about Wall is... if you don't get it, you don't get it. First things first. You have to understand and identify the right problem. His problem isn't that he can't shoot, its his decision making.

Like I mentioned in a previous post, he was interviewed and asked about his shooting vs driving, his answer was, my shooting is better then my driving. Wow.

1) If that is really true, we are in big trouble
2) If he really does get it at that level, we are in bigger trouble.

Wall seems to live in his on little world were facts don't enter. It appear his ego won't allow it. He bought into the press clipping of his potential and what they really looks like on a basketball court.

It doesn't even pass the sniff test. He took more shots then Jose did and Jose can actually shoot. So why didn't Jose shoot more. Answer. He is a PG. He knows it doesn't matter if he scorer or his team scores. Its about getting it done efficiently. So instead of shooting, he team needed him to set them up last night, so he did that instead. 18 assists. Great game.

So while Jose was racking up 18 assist with only 6 shots in 36 min, Wall took 9 shots with only 4 assists n 7 turnovers ( should have been 8 turnovers because they blamed Okafor for one that was really on Wall )

Seems to be the same thing with Wall every year. He sucks. Then he trims his game back and gets better. Then he tries to do to much again and he sucks. Then he trims back his game and does better. Every time I think he finally gets it, he reverts to being clueless. Very frustrating and not trending in the right direction. He seems to be running in circles.

Thing is, people rarely change there mind set or approach to things. They may add some skills but they usually don't change their approach. I just don't trust Walls decision making and I don't see that changing. If it is problem now, imagine being in a big playoff game. There is just to much for him to learn mentally. Cut bait when you can. Find a better decision maker. He will be fun to watch over his career, but I don't see him as a winner that takes the team anywhere. The bigger the stage, the more he will force things.

Maybe he eventually gets it, but its not going to be here and its would take a min of 3 years for that level of eye opening to happen. Get some value for him while you can. I said the same thing about Gil. Its not the talent/skills, it the decision making and hero ball mentality.

hands, you explained a lot better what I have been trying to call a lack of insight.

I don't think trading Wall now because of backlash or negative things is the right call, unless the Wizards can get something like Walker and a pick, Isaiah Thomas and a pick, or Jimmer and the Kings pick, etc. Wall can help this team a lot and he's worth more to the team than for his own individual trade value. So, they probably need to ride with him believing this is the best of John Wall.

[DCZards]

So we should be expecting the response from Wall's rookie year and sophomore year any time now? Or does the fire take 3 full years to stoke?

That's a good question,pancakes. I think we all are disappointed in John's play thus far. But what I don't think we can do is say with any real certainty that Wall has reached his ceiling nor can we put a concrete timeline on when that happens.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

So we should be expecting the response from Wall's rookie year and sophomore year any time now? Or does the fire take 3 full years to stoke?

That's a good question,pancakes. I think we all are disappointed in John's play thus far. But what I don't think we can do is say with any real certainty that Wall has reached his ceiling nor can we put a concrete timeline on when that happens.

What I will say is all three years look the same, but that isn't the worse thing.

Not every player is very well rounded. Build around Wall knowing his weaknesses, if he's the future (but keep his pending deal in mind as a sole reason to trade him). Know what Wall can and cannot do and grow the team with those limitations in mind, or go another direction. Any player Wall is traded for will have flaws. Wall has some egregious ones but he's also electrifyingly good in many areas.

Also, another coach might have sat Wall that last play in favor of Price, but I think Wittman would get run for doing so. As it is, I think the next few games will be very telling for Wittman more than Wall.

[Ruzious]

I just read some of Wittman's post-game comments in today's Washington Post - he seemed extremely unhappy about players supposedly complaining they're not getting enough shots and not enough playing time and certain players being very selfish and taking too many shots. I'm looking at the boxscore, and I have no clue who these offending players are. The 4 players who took 10 or more shots all made at least half. Any clues? Maybe Webster? Since his minutes were a bit low, and he only got 6 shots? But Wittman made it sound like it's several players with bad attitudes.

Personally, I thought - other than Wall - the team played fairly well on offense - especially considering Nene was out. It was the defense that was a much bigger problem, imo.

[dobrojim]

I was at least somewhat encouraged that once Wall did get in the game
at the very end, he actually made a nice assist to TA for the 3 that
brought us within 3. He wants to win.

[W. Unseld]

On a different note I feel sorry for poor Buckhantz, his erroneous call at the end is being played for comic effect all over sports radio. An honest mistake that was quickly retracted, poor Buck...

[queridiculo]

Ruzious, Wall played only 24 minutes last night and appeared to get pulled in part because of his turnovers. It would sort of explain Wall's extremely defensive answer to the question concerning the TOs.

Seraphin was another player that appeared to be sulking on the bench. In his defense, Booker is simply awful and shouldn't be playing over Kevin, but what I can't get into my head is how little Seraphin has learned since getting extended bench time.

6 of 10 shots doesn't look bad until you realize that they came in 17 minutes, and that the misses were the sort of shots he has to learn to cut out. As far as I am concerned Wittman should yank Seraphin every time he throws up a rushed 20 footer early in the shot clock.

[queridiculo]

On a different note I feel sorry for poor Buckhantz, his erroneous call at the end is being played for comic effect all over sports radio. An honest mistake that was quickly retracted, poor Buck...

It's absurd, especially when you consider that the Pistons announcers thought the shot was good as well. The angle made it look like a winner, heck, I thought we pulled out the W as well.

[Ruzious]

Ruzious, Wall played only 24 minutes last night and appeared to get pulled in part because of his turnovers. It would sort of explain Wall's extremely defensive answer to the question concerning the TOs.

Seraphin was another player that appeared to be sulking on the bench. In his defense, Booker is simply awful and shouldn't be playing over Kevin, but what I can't get into my head is how little Seraphin has learned since getting extended bench time.

6 of 10 shots doesn't look bad until you realize that they came in 17 minutes, and that the misses were the sort of shots he has to learn to cut out. As far as I am concerned Wittman should yank Seraphin every time he throws up a rushed 20 footer early in the shot clock.

Thanks. I had a feeling Seraphin was one - since Wittman pretty much always seems irritated with Seraphin during games. And if Seraphin's actually whining about minutes and shots, I could see how that would set off Wittman on a tirade.