Derrick Favors "Get outta My Way"

[pickIBL]

http://www.82games.com/1213/12UTA13.HTM

I will just provide some basic analysis. Favors is much more effective as a 5 than a 4.

As part of any plan to build towards contention I think that must include Favors @ the 5 spot. Over the summer I would focus on a couple of things and keep it pretty simple because it is.

Offensively
shoot over 50% from the field
Limit turnovers by teaching him to read match ups.
First recognize a double team as well as positioning. If you aren't where you want to be or they are sending double coverage... pass it right back out. Hold the ball up high, don't bring it down, and if you don't see what you like toss right back out. Read and react quickly! If you've got low post position & no double team.. make your move. That decision making is an IQ thing that you just drill. But the main thing is to get him touches earlier and not later in the shot clock. His game should consist of running the floor for dunks, low post moves, and put backs.

Defensively
Focus on rotations... again we aren't looking for the 3rd row shot block but the defensive stop.
Focus on rotations that lead to difficult shots later in the clock and limiting fouls away from the basket
He needs to become the defensive anchor that can stay on the floor by avoiding cheap fouls.

All of this is fairly practical & when given starter minutes I think in a couple of years he could be the starting all-star center out west. With Dwights injury issues (that I think are chronic) I see no reason why Favors isn't the future all-star starting center & could even start on Team USA next time as well. That's pretty crazy think about. But a real possibility if the Jazz focus on what Favors does well naturally. He's not a 4 he's a 5.

[StocktonShorts]

I will just provide some basic analysis. Favors is much more effective as a 5 than a 4.

I agree (and I've said as much on this forum before).

First recognize a double team as well as positioning. If you aren't where you want to be or they are sending double coverage... pass it right back out. Hold the ball up high, don't bring it down, and if you don't see what you like toss right back out.

I think he does this better than any of the other bigs on the roster right now. Perhaps it's his lack of confidence in his offensive game, but he tends to make the return pass to the distributing wing much more quickly (and more often) than Al, Enes or Paul.

He needs to become the defensive anchor that can stay on the floor by avoiding cheap fouls.

He's gotten a lot better at this, but he still has at least one cheap one each game. I hate to say it, but as he establishes a reputation as a good starting center, the refs will give him the benefit of the doubt more often.

He's not a 4 he's a 5.

The corollary to this is that Enes looks more like a four (offensively). "Great!" you're saying, "we've got the front-line of the future!" to which I would agree, with the caveat that I'm a little concerned about how that front-line would deal with stretch fours. Nevertheless, if that's their only weakness, I'll take it.

[countrybama24]

I was initially a little worried about Kanter playing the 4 if Favors went to his natural position at the 5. But I think Kanter's mobility is much improved, and even if he gets blown by, we have Favors to protect the rim. I really hope we play Kanter at the 4 whenever Derrick is on the court.

[pickIBL]

I don't like Favors & Kanter on the floor defensively against a lot of line ups. Kanter on Carmelo? Are you kidding me?

Lorbek is a great European example of a stretch 4. Melo was an ideal 4 man from the beginning despite how Denver used him. Derrick Williams from the T-wolves would interest me. & I still as a GM would roll the dice on a Beasley trade if I planned to put him @ his natural position (stretch 4).

North Texas has a nice young stretch 4 prospect as well. Some of his decision making is sketchy but I suppose that happens when you play for North Texas and they let you do whatever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3P0PNA_tT4
Lorbek 6'10 3/4 PF

[d-will8]

Beasley? Really? The guy's a walking cancer. I wouldn't touch him. Also, while it would be good to have somebody to put on stretch fours as necessary (I think DeMarre and/or Millsap would do the trick), I think the Favors/Kanter combo will be just fine defensively. They may struggle with stretch fours now, but they're both very mobile. Also, anybody who runs a smallish four against that duo will have to pay for it dearly on the defensive glass.

[StocktonShorts]

I don't like Favors & Kanter on the floor defensively against a lot of line ups. Kanter on Carmelo? Are you kidding me?

That's probably the worst-case scenario, but I think you might gain enough on the other end to make it worthwhile. Remember, Melo would have to guard Enes (or Favors), too.

[pickIBL]

Beasley? Really? The guy's a walking cancer. I wouldn't touch him.

Beasley is NOT a cancer as of today. What has he done in PHX this season that would lead you to think this guy's attitude or behavior would do anything to hinder the growth and development of the roster? I've heard nothing but praise for Beasley despite him not having the success he'd like on the court. People can grow up... and Beasley... coming out after one campaign... made mistakes.

Having put that to rest a lot of having success in the NBA is getting the right shot. Beasley is still a young guy who killed it @ Kstate. I'm not yet ready to write him off. For instance I get sick of people telling me Marcus Fizer is a draft bust. It is all out of context and doesn't include factors such as position and injuries. Fizer was in the race for 6th man of the year at one point and I've watched him score more than 30 points in a game. Fact is Floyd drafted him after Brand and wanted him to play the SF. That's not his position and he clearly was not capable to do it... he got injured multiple times and a promising career was derailed.

Beasley is not a 3... he's a stretch 4 who needs other talent around him.. In the right role Beasley could be a nice starter and I would not be afraid to trade for him if I had that role available.

[reapaman]

I don't like the dynamics of a Favors and Al/Kanter pairing. Al and Kanter get killed by stretch 4's and most teams have stretch 4's so thats a defensive problem almost every game. Thats why Favors always plays PF with those two. The thing about Favors playing PF is it takes him away from the post alot which often hurts his main strength which is help defense, so thats a huge problem. Offensively isn't a huge problem but neither Al or Kanter are pure stretch 4's (well Enes isn't yet) in the sense that they mix it up between jump shooting (which can vary from inside the post and outside) and operating inside the post oppose to mostly jump shooting outside the post or attacking the basket. This is significant because Favors primarily operates in the post and its difficult for two guys to operate in the post at the same time ala gasol & Dwight/Bynum. If you really pay attention, Favors often shows sign of struggling offensively because of this (or Enes and Jefferson do sometimes but its usually Favors) although he's not that good offensively anyway but still ...

Actually both Favors and Enes tend to look best with Millsap. So someone similar to Millsap would work but not Millsap because many people have issues with him. If we could get a guy whose offense revovles around attacking the basket (as oppose to actually posting up) and jumpshooting outside the post then that would be the best for either one of Favors or Enes. That guy should also be able to guard stretch 4's.

Also Favors needs to bulk up and needs to stop fouling so much because he gets into foul trouble almost every game and even nearly fouling out way too much for comfort. I'm still trying to forget he played that bobcats game because he was just down right putrid. How is it possible to foul out while blowing a team out? How?!!!!?

BTW did someone say Beasley? Just stop it, no beasleys on this team please.

[StocktonShorts]

You know who would do a good job guarding stretch fours when necessary? Marvin Williams.

Assuming Paul and Al are both gone I think Marvin might see most of his minutes next year at PF. You have a starting lineup of Favors/Kanter, and if you're getting killed by a stretch four you make a sub and adjust.

Of course, this also brings up another one of my pet peeves, the notion that the starting lineup for an NBA team is a sacred thing that must not be messed with unless someone gets hurt or plays so horrible he ends up in the coach's doghouse. I'd love to see more teams adjust their starting lineup tactically based on the opponent.

[pickIBL]

Yep Marvin is a 4 IMO. Starting line-ups are all about ego... but the great thing is down the stretch if the coach has half a brain he does adjust. I'd be the type to mix and match based on the strengths and weaknesses of the opposition.

[SoCalJazzFan]

http://www.82games.com/1213/12UTA13.HTM

I will just provide some basic analysis. Favors is much more effective as a 5 than a 4.

He's not a 4 he's a 5.

Umm.... don't the stats support just the opposite conclusion???

[SoCalJazzFan]

I'll admit that Favors often looks more DeAndre Jordan than Blake Griffin. However, if Favors is more of a true center, then we should trade either Favors or Kanter (who would both be centers) for a high draft pick to get that PG or wing player to compliment the remaining center and Hayward as otherwise we would be trying to play two players with similar skill sets at the same time.

[StocktonShorts]

http://www.82games.com/1213/12UTA13.HTM

I will just provide some basic analysis. Favors is much more effective as a 5 than a 4.

He's not a 4 he's a 5.

Umm.... don't the stats support just the opposite conclusion???

His PER is worse, but the team's net points vs. points allowed is MUCH better with him at C. Remember that PER is basically an offensive metric.

[TheStig15]

I'll admit that Favors often looks more DeAndre Jordan than Blake Griffin. However, if Favors is more of a true center, then we should trade either Favors or Kanter (who would both be centers) for a high draft pick to get that PG or wing player to compliment the remaining center and Hayward as otherwise we would be trying to play two players with similar skill sets at the same time.

Did you not just read this entire thread? That was exactly what everyone addressed.....

[RyanStorm]

Kanter PF
Favors C

This is the most logical positions for them both offensively and defensively. Of course Kanter can play both, I see Kanter being more like an oversized Malon player with Favors in the paint like Eaton. Both are versatile, I just think Favors has the block ability that you want in a C, and Kanter is over-sized for PF making it hard for anyone to stop him. And even if C's come help the PF's, that leaves Favors wide open to do his beast mode..

[SoCalJazzFan]

What the 82games.com stats tell me is that Al Jefferson is a weight on the team as either Favors or Kanter give a better net pt outcome for the team. What it also tells me is that Kanter is by far the better center of the bunch according to this stat. In fact, the Milsap/Kanter combo frontcourt is the best.

So, according to all of this, not only should we not resign Al, we should trade Favors for that POGTF and either resign Sap or a true PF replacement.

[SoCalJazzFan]

I'll take it further, from what I have seen on 82games, the lineup of either:
(insert PG), Burks, Hayward, Sap and Kanter; or
(PG) Hayward, Carroll, Sap and Kanter-

significantly increases the defensive rating of the team, increases the free throws attempted and the number of rebounds obtained and thus the net pts.

Are we too enamored with Favors (myself included)??

[Inigo Montoya]

I'll take it further, from what I have seen on 82games, the lineup of either:
(insert PG), Burks, Hayward, Sap and Kanter; or
(PG) Hayward, Carroll, Sap and Kanter-

significantly increases the defensive rating of the team, increases the free throws attempted and the number of rebounds obtained and thus the net pts.

Are we too enamored with Favors (myself included)??

i don't think so. favors pays the price for being a good defender in general, and a good help defender in particular. our back court can't defend anything, and our defense if porous because of it. favors helping causes him to foul players who get all the way to the rim = more FT. favors helping and trying to block other players takes him out of position to contend for rebounds, which leaves only one big man (at best) to try and get the rebound, and with our horrible defensive rebounding back court and\or with hayward at the 3 (poor rebounder for some reason) it causes many offensive rebounds for the other team. if we had decent defenders on the back court things will look a lot different. if we actually had a PG who can play the position and create opportunities for others, favors' numbers would be completely different. if he didn't play next to a bad defender in big al, his numbers would look much better. kanter usually don't play with al and his numbers are better because of it on both ends, since al's bad defense don't hurt his defensive numbers and al's dominance on offense doesn't hurt his offensive numbers, which is the case with favors.

[roll]

Give Favors a time. He needs to play regular starter minutes to be in rhythm and feel confidence. Too early to draw a conclusion about his ceiling. Nikola Vucevic could not make 76ers roster half of season. Now in team which trust in him he is one of the best rebounders in NBA.