Congratulations Joe D and co.

vege · Post #1 » by **vege** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:01 pm

In 65 years of Detroit Pistons history this year will be the second time our franchise goes 4 years in a row with a sub 40% record. Last time was between 1963-1967 but during that period we actually improved and went to almost .50 ball at the 5th year, this time we're going downhill.

I wonder if Joe D and Frank will make it 5 in a row next year for the all time low achievement in our franchise history.

This year will very likely be our worst record since 1993-1994...

Even in our darkest moments we managed to turn things around after 2 horrible seasons but this time, despite of being gifted Greg Monroe who is a hell of a player and Andre Drummond who is a complete beast, our brilliant GM managed to turn this team into a laughing stock.

This achievement should be put in Gores account as well, since he decided to go with Joe Dumars as our GM despite of what he has been doing the past few years and he was an active voice in Frank's hiring.

The good news is, we rarely bring a head coach back 3 years in a row, the big majority is gone after 2 seasons, so the odds are that Frank will be gone next season, if Joe D is still the GM we should have another fail Head Coach tho, so I'm not sure if this is really good news.

After Chucky Daily the ONLY head coach to stay 3 entire seasons as our head coach was Flip Saunders. Doug Collins was fired after 45 games into his 3rd season.

chrbal · Post #2 » by **chrbal** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:28 pm

Oh good lord. We lost the centerpiece to our defense and we traded a glue player. Did anyone think this season would be amazing. Not to mention almost all of our key players are really young.

retrolenny · Post #3 » by **retrolenny** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:11 pm

Are you really blaming Dumars?? I believe Frank was Gores choice. Dumars has made the right moves over the last 2 years. He dumped Gordon, Prince (as much as I enjoyed him), Picked up Moose, Dre, Knight (who still has much to prove), Picked up a real PG, and freed up a boat load of $$ to make a splash in the off season. I think you're stopping at the end of your nose rather than looking at the big picture (no disrepect).

We have a great draft pick coming, hopefully Stuck can finish the season starting so we can trade him for something, and hopefully we keep Bynum for Dre next season.

MrBigShot · Post #4 » by **MrBigShot** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:21 pm

^Dumped Gordon for a pick. Hardly worth it, considering he would likely become an expiring before we were a contender or even close to one. Sure, we got salary cap relief in return...but I have no faith that Joe will use that wisely after 2009....

Post #5 » by **dVs33** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:49 pm

i think i may be the only fan on here who actually likes frank and dumars.

i think coaches get too much heat when a team is playing badly.

No one could have predicted how badly stuckey was going to play this year. He should have been a nice fit next to knight, but he's struggled all season. He even sucked as a lead guard off the bench. I think he's bad play was key to the lack of success this season, but how much can we blame frank for that?
Also having 5 rookies is very hard to manage.
Singler, english, Middleton and Slava are all 2nd round picks, so they can't expected to produce right away and drummond needed to time to develop too. I agreed with easing Drummond into more minutes.

It's been a very tough time as a fan for the last few years but the team was coming off one of the most successful times in it's history.
With Monroe, Drummond and Knight we now have some high potential guys that could very well lead us to being an actual contender instead of just a run of the mill team (bucks etc) I think patience is key here.

Jodi · Post #6 » by **Jodi** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:55 pm

^Good post, but Frank is an awful coach...

BadMofoPimp · Post #7 » by **BadMofoPimp** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:59 pm

Jodi wrote:^Good post, but Frank is an awful coach...

Frank is an awful coach. I knew it was all going downhill the day the Pistons signed him.

Piston Pete · Post #8 » by **Piston Pete** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:24 pm

Joe D hasn't been a good GM since trading for Sheed.

Clarity · Post #9 » by **Clarity** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:24 pm

personal insults = uncalled for ~ roc

Goldtop · Post #10 » by **Goldtop** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:31 pm

Fans can't have it both ways. We can't root for them to tank to get better players in the draft, and then complain when they don't win.

Post #11 » by **theBigLip** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:31 pm

Lately, Joe has been spot on. I think the BG trade and the Prince trade were both smart moves. The Drummond pick was awesome, although I think that was a no-brainer. So in the last year, Joe's moves have been fine with me. He will also look a lot smarter if we win the up-coming lottery.

That being said, he will seriously be judged on what he does this summer. Everyone (including Joe) is pissed about how BG and CV worked out, so I can't imagine us wasting our cap space this summer. If anything, he will probably be too conservative. So we've got a draft and free agency coming up, with a possible trade or two. This will decide his fate, but I'm optimistic that our lottery days are done for many years.

BadMofoPimp · Post #12 » by **BadMofoPimp** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:36 pm

Didn't Joe draft BK and Monroe with like picks 8 and 9. Also, Kyle Singler was a quality late round find as well as Jerebko, Maxiel and Stuckey. Finding good role players in later rounds is extremely hard to do as most draft picks don't even last 2 years in the NBA.

Piston Pete · Post #13 » by **Piston Pete** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:48 pm

theBigLip wrote:Lately, Joe has been spot on. I think the BG trade and the Prince trade were both smart moves. The Drummond pick was awesome, although I think that was a no-brainer. So in the last year, Joe's moves have been fine with me. He will also look a lot smarter if we win the up-coming lottery.

That being said, he will seriously be judged on what he does this summer. Everyone (including Joe) is pissed about how BG and CV worked out, so I can't imagine us wasting our cap space this summer. If anything, he will probably be too conservative. So we've got a draft and free agency coming up, with a possible trade or two. This will decide his fate, but I'm optimistic that our lottery days are done for many years.

It depends....

IMO, if he re-signs Calderon, the trade will be a failure. If he lets Calderon walk and uses that savings on actual assets to improve the team moving forward, then it was a good deal.

If he re-signs either Maxiell or Bynum, it will be another shot to his credibility.

I agree this offseason is huge for him -- he's set up perfectly to make a huge difference. I hope he doesn't mess it up.

vege · Post #14 » by **vege** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:56 pm

Clarity wrote:Message boards are also for clueless casual fans who are frustrated too I suppose.

It's also a place for people who don't add any content at all and insult posters who actually post something worth discussing.

Goldtop · Post #15 » by **Goldtop** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:58 pm

I've always understood the situation Joe was in with the ownership change, so I'll never put those years on him.

Like others have said, thats now all in the past, and this offseason it is on him to make the right decisions. If not, he should be accountable. But I like what he's been doing the last couple years now (BG trade, drafting Drummond, Prince trade, etc), so I'm not concerned at all with him going into this offseason. I feel confident he's going to get us some good players in FA or trades, and we are going to be a much improved team next year.

vege · Post #16 » by **vege** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:09 pm

dVs33 wrote:i think i may be the only fan on here who actually likes frank and dumars.

i think coaches get too much heat when a team is playing badly.

No one could have predicted how badly stuckey was going to play this year. He should have been a nice fit next to knight, but he's struggled all season. He even sucked as a lead guard off the bench. I think he's bad play was key to the lack of success this season, but how much can we blame frank for that?
Also having 5 rookies is very hard to manage.
Singler, english, Middleton and Slava are all 2nd round picks, so they can't expected to produce right away and drummond needed to time to develop too. I agreed with easing Drummond into more minutes.

It's been a very tough time as a fan for the last few years but the team was coming off one of the most successful times in it's history.
With Monroe, Drummond and Knight we now have some high potential guys that could very well lead us to being an actual contender instead of just a run of the mill team (bucks etc) I think patience is key here.

Stuckey is Dumars product. Dumars made a bet that Stuckey would be our PG of the future, it didn't work out, instead of move on, Dumars gave him a fat extension when Stuckey clearly said he DID NOT wanted to stay and did everything he could to go somewhere else.

If Stuckey had this season there are 3 responsible for it, Stuckey itself obviously. Frank and Joe Dumars.

We have 5 rookies in our roster because Joe Dumars signed all 5 rookies, so that's another fact against Joe. So, so far we have Stuckey and the horrible roster he assembled to blame on Joe D.

Monroe has started indicating he does not have much more patience left. Knight has been absolutely brutal, yes he has shown flashes but so did Stuckey and Stuckey failed miserably.

Knight wasn't developed properly, he was forced to be our team's starter PG when he was clearly nowhere near to be ready for that. We had no veteran to guide him, he has been playing for a laughable head coach and the team has no identity.

We continue losing like this and Drummond is the next to be unhappy and we become the next Sacramento Kings or the LoLcats.

Gores should have canned Dumars a while ago, the team is unwatchable, the few good players we have are not happy and will likely walk away at the first opportunity, we are going through the worst period of the franchise's story and who put us into this mess was no one other then Joe.

vege · Post #17 » by **vege** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:09 pm

double post.

ComboGuardCity · Post #18 » by **ComboGuardCity** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:24 pm

Yeah lets not forget this team was playing decent ball before the Calderon trade and Dre injury. We were 4.5 out of the playoffs. Take away injuries amd the trade and we're 9th in the east

Jodi · Post #19 » by **Jodi** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:30 pm

vege wrote:Stuckey is Dumars product. Dumars made a bet that Stuckey would be our PG of the future, it didn't work out, instead of move on, Dumars gave him a fat extension when Stuckey clearly said he DID NOT wanted to stay and did everything he could to go somewhere else.

When did Stuckey say this??. And don't say it was a rumor from the media...

kurtis48239 · Post #20 » by **kurtis48239** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:14 pm

Have to think glass half full,if joe does a good job this year with draft pick and signings,then thats great for all the nay sayers, about joes gm abilities.If he messes up this year then its still good for all the nay sayers of joe because then you get what you want (joe gone).I believe that joe will do fine and we will look 10x better next year and we wont have to suffer thru another season like this,its so bad I dont even comment in the game threads anymore because theres nothing to say .