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Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II

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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#921 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:29 pm

mhd wrote:Current Mock draft based on standings:

1) Bobcats-Noel (will tank another year for Wiggins and let Noel heal, they have the worst frontcourt in the NBA)
2) Magic-Mclemore (I think they go Mclemore over the PGs. They can grab a young PG with their 2nd rounder)
3) Cavs-Porter (Zeller is tempting, but Porter fits in well with Irving and Waiters)
4) Suns-Shabaaz (they go for best scorer available and hope Shabaaz can play off of Dragic)
5) Detroit-Smart (the Brandon Knight experiment has not gone well)
6) Hornets-Olapido (perfect fit as a wing 3&D player)
7) Minnesota-Len (ugh, no wings left to pick, they take best big available. Pekovic is a UFA, so center may be a need).
8) Kings-Burke (they see the Chris Paul comparisons that Ruz has first noticed. I think Burke's tournament play elevates his stock big time).
9) Wiz-Zeller (most ready to play, but scared as heck about his T-Rex arms).


I have a hard time seeing Pekovic leave a team with players named Kirilenko and Shved…

After doing research, turns out Peckovic does indeed want to stay in Minnesota:

http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/20 ... berwolves/

The Wolves’ summertime personnel moves have put them right at the NBA’s salary cap, but they can choose to exceed it and pay Pekovic as much as they want up to the maximum salary because he is already on their roster. Pekovic said he wants to stay in Minnesota. ‘I would like to stay here because of everything,’ he said. ‘I just like everything. I like the area. I like the team. I like all the stuff. Now I got some friends here. Now it’s real easy. It’s just nice, nice people, nice town. I would like to be here.’”
The Wizards shoukd have drafted Derik Queen

I told you so :banghead:
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#922 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:34 pm

stevemcqueen1 wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
DCZards wrote:Keep an eye on McAdoo. He's had a tough year at UNC because he's been asked to play out of position at center on a so-so Tar Heel team. I think he'll be a very good pro and wouldn't be surprised to see McAdoo move up the board to a 6-8 pick as we get closer to the draft.

If there's a player in this draft, other than Noel, who I think will be a star at the next level it's McLemore. He already has a sweet shooting stroke and a NBA body.

Actually, playing C should have helped his offensive numbers, because he should have been able to out-quick every college center and out-run them in transition. That was the case with Joe Smith in his MD career. And really, most NBA PF's played a lot of C in college. He's a very good athlete with a great last name and seems like a great kid, but he's not a very good basketball player. Imo, Hairston is the best NBA prospect on UNC (and very underrated), and Bullock's next.


I think playing McAdoo at C is not an ideal situation for him but it's what was best for the team because it let them get their best five on the floor when the lineups planned going into the season weren't working.

McAdoo was smaller than most 5s (thought he was stronger than several of the bigger guys). He's a face up forward that's more perimeter oriented. It wasn't a great fit for him offensively, UNC played him there mainly because he's their strongest body and because of his defense and rebounding ability. He's not going to score with his back to the basket in close. He needs to get the ball in a spot further from the basket where he can face up drive if he's going to create his offense.

All in all, I think he acquitted himself pretty well at the five considering he's a future NBA SF/PF hybrid. He's got one of the best bodies in the class and he's one of the best athletes IMO. One of the few guys who has a clear NBA ready frame and NBA level athleticism. As an athlete, he reminds me of a 6'9 version of Beal. Strong, quick, lean, ultra-smooth. Plays the game with a physicality that reminds me of Beal.

I think he's been slow to find his way at UNC and that's really been the story of the team's season since they got pillaged by the NBA draft last year. His weaknesses are on the offensive end. He doesn't have a good jumper and he can't shoot FTs. Doesn't have a versatile inside scoring game either. He's got a good post fade at around 13 feet but doesn't score with his back to the basket inside.

I think he'll be a better pro than people expect. Better pro than college player, and I think he'll slip farther than he probably should. A lot of guys with well developed skills and great collegiate production but nowhere near his athleticism or upside will get picked ahead of him because they can fill more immediate roles. I think he's the type of player the Spurs would love to get, they're not intimidated by taking smart/raw players with holes in their skills. If he makes it to the late teens or twenties, I could see them trading up to get him like they did Kawhi Leonard.


I think Hairston, Bullock, and McAdoo are all going to end up playing a lot of years in the NBA. Ruz, I think you're right that McAdoo is probably the third best out of the trio. He's got a great last name and that accounts for most of the buzz.

Hairston is the youngest and he's got great shooting with passing skills, he would make an ideal third guard. Bullock IMO is just as good or better as a 3 and D player. Hairston is just a deadly from deep as Bullock but not the physical rebounder Bullock is. I think Bullock might be the better player right now, but Hairston probably has the highest ceiling. Hairston is an NBA starting-caliber SG right now IMO.

Hairston and Bullock are guys I would prefer over James Michael McAdoo for the Wizards. All three can play.
The Wizards shoukd have drafted Derik Queen

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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#923 » by FAH1223 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:01 pm

Induveca wrote:I pray the Wizards don't take Zeller. He's an obvious bust. Perfect example of college talent which doesn't translate to the NBA.

His brother is completely overmatched, and they share the same warning signs.


Yup!
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#924 » by popper » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:18 pm

Dieng might be a smart move for us assuming we keep our pick. An off-season with Olajuwon could make a huge difference in his offensive production. Defensively, he's the type of player we need to replace Okafor.

I know it's a risky move but C.J. McCollum could create a 3 guard rotation second to none in the NBA. He would likely become very valuable trade bait as well.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#925 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:34 pm

popper, there's absolutely no reason not to draft McCollum or Dieng. McCollum reminds me of Walt Frazier. Dieng is a great defender.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#926 » by Dr Positivity » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:38 pm

Dieng's offense is underrated IMO. He has the Ibaka 20 footer, which means a lot for any center, while at PF more common it still gives him something to work with. He also has some smoothness in the post IMO and is a great passer. I don't think he's a hack offensively. In this game he looks darn good offensively:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpxLbcI_fQY[/youtube]
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#927 » by hands11 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:07 pm

popper wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if we package Vesely, Singleton or Booker and our first round pick for a decent player and a later pick in the first round. We really need to re-balance the roster given our overload at PF.

Nene - Booker - Vesely - Singleton


I wouldn't be surprised either. But what can you get for them. Ves only got 3 minutes in a blow out win over PHX.

As for players to look at, several of my likes seem to be on this list.

http://nbadraft.net/top-senior-prospects-0

I think this is where you are going to get value in this draft. There aren't a lot of upside star young types, so go with player where you know what you are going to get that will be able to produce in their first year.

CJ McCollum 6-3 190 PG Lehigh Sr.
McCollum has adept scoring and dead eye shooting ability. He was shooting a high volume of three pointers at a 51.6% clip, while averaging close to 24 ppg before going down with a broken foot.

Jeff Withey 7-0 240 C Kansas Sr.
Withey's defensive presence for Kansas the past few seasons has been invaluable. His shot blocking has been elite and his over 2:1 block to foul ratio shows he can do so without having to go to the sidelines for prolonged periods of time.

Plus a lot of other names that get mentioned a lot like Wolters, Plumlee

If we ended up with CJ and Withey, I wouldn't be upset at all. And Pierre Jackson. It wouldn't fix the longer term issues like replacing Nene, upgrading at PF and consolidating or a top level center, but it will fill out the roster nicely for next year. Then you come back the following year and make the bigger moves. By then they may even have a new GM. Thats when they have to figure out what to do with Okafor, Booker, Trevor A, Kevin S and Ves.

Wall/Temple/Pierre
Beal/CJ McCollum
Webster/Trevor A
Nene/Kevin/Booker
Okafor/Withey/Ves

Singleton to the DL

Trevor A act as your stretch 4 until you consolidate at PF.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#928 » by nate33 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:12 pm

I like Dieng a lot. Draft Express has him going #20 and I think that's late. He's worthy of a pick in the low to mid teens. His stats indicate a pretty high upside and production that will translate well in the pros. I love that he averages 1.7 steals per 40, which is a ton for a big man. He also shoots 70% from the free throw line which indicates that he will probably develop a serviceable midrange jumper. The biggest concern is that he is already 23.

I figure his upside could be a slightly poorer man's Ibaka. His downside is Biyombo.

I don't see us drafting a limited offensive player like that with our top pick. It would be great to acquire a mid first round pick and draft him though.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#929 » by hands11 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:49 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:Dieng's offense is underrated IMO. He has the Ibaka 20 footer, which means a lot for any center, while at PF more common it still gives him something to work with. He also has some smoothness in the post IMO and is a great passer. I don't think he's a hack offensively. In this game he looks darn good offensively:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpxLbcI_fQY[/youtube]



Looks good doesn't he. That shot looked smooth. Nice baseline more as well.

Several good things in that clip.
- he has good shooting form. He gets his elbow out and the ball is back. Only player blocking that is from behind. Kind of a Dirkish form.

- nice interior passing.
- on his blocks he gets in rhythm with the player.
- looks pretty nimble.

Concerns:
Why doesn't he dunk? Is he not good at leaping ?
Looks like he has to add some strength

Both he and Withey are moving up the DraftX charts.

Good news is they are both still in the Tournament.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#930 » by The Consiglieri » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:57 pm

nate33 wrote:
Upper Decker wrote:There are absolutely no players worth tanking for in this draft. I don't even think this draft projects to have a lot of starters.

Noel will probably be the only above average starter in the league (but he comes with risks). Porter, will likely peak as a solid starter and I see him as a John Salmons type player. Beyond that I wouldn't be surprised if the next wave of McLamore, Smart, Bennett, Zeller, and Olidapo get relegated to bench rolls rather quickly in their careers.

People are letting one lousy weekend influence their thinking too much. This draft is the same draft that we were looking at last week. Overall, the draft looks pretty deep with rotation caliber players, but has no stars (with the possible exception of Noel). It's actually a good draft to be picking in the 6-10 range. I'm sure there will be 8 to 10 quality starters to come out of this draft (though some of them might take some time). We just need to make sure we find one.

Whatever we do, I really hope EG is planning on acquiring a quality stretch four somehow. Whether that's drafting one or trading for one, I don't care. But this team really needs a closing lineup with Nene at the 5 and a good stretch 4. Lately, Wittman has been making it work with Trevor Ariza at PF, but he can only do that for a few minutes. Ariza can't bang against real power forwards for any length of time.

+1
I would add that I (and maybe I'm the only one) still have faith in the tank. I think we still have a strong shot at 4-7 due to the schedule (7 of 13 are on the road and 9 of 13 are against playoff squads. 29 to 30 wins seem likely barring teams sitting stars down the stretch. Bpa. In typical fashion we managed to fail to land any franchise player in 5 years of tanking and improved to mediocre just in time for a franchise transformative draft. It's 98-03 all over again. Not a chance this incarnation will ever be a legit contender barring a trade or blockbuster signing after next season or beyond.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#931 » by The Consiglieri » Sun Mar 24, 2013 7:16 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
mhd wrote:I'd honestly go with CCJ and have strong consideration and take McDermott at this rate. I KNOW he'll be a good NBA player and he's a team first guy and can be a stretch 4 for some phases. He's a leader, elite shooter, and his defensive deficincies will be masked somewhat by our overall team defense.

Finding a good young big is a priority IMO still. We have none, especially if Seraphin doesn't revert to last year's play (he's been better recently).


I think the Wizards need to do something along the lines of draft McDermott and trade Vesely, Singleton, or Booker with a 2014 unprotected 1st for John Henson. Washington is not going to be a lottery team next season IMO. They need to go all in on talent while they can.

I think the Bucks might be foolish enough to go for something like that.

In round 2 pick Wolters or Isaiah Canaan.
trading out '14 #1 under any circumstances is insane. We have no idea what will happen and that draft is a gold mine. Any injury to wall or other cornerstones in combo and we cld be looking at nov/dec '12 redux. Any trades shld incorporate 2nd roinders and or any of the non big 2.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#932 » by likwitdesi » Sun Mar 24, 2013 7:44 pm

We have to take a look at Khalif Wyatt in the late 1st / early 2nd. I live in Philly so I've been following Temple. Ihave questioned his draft stock because he is probably a below average athlete but what a feel for the game...
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#933 » by fugop » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:20 pm

Gorgui would be a great fit on the Wizards. He doesn't have superstar potential, and people shouldn't have that expectation for him. But he can be a starter on a championship team, an elite role player. When I'm really fantasizing out there, I think he can have a Dikembe Mutombo like impact on the next level. He has a ridiculous impact on the defensive side of the ball.

First, a couple of caveats. Pitino's sets are extremely different from anything you see in the pros. His players are not prepared for the pro game. You can see it with Earl Clark, who's taken a few years to develop into a serviceable defender, despite being very solid in Pitino's system. Other recent Louisville bigs who declared for the draft -- Samardo Samuels, Terrance Jennings, even Derrick Caracter (sort of) were drafted late or not at all and ultimately struggled to adapt to the pro game. Gorguis rebounding, blocks, and steals numbers will not reliably translate to the next level.

Even last night, against Colorado State, Gorgui's job was rarely to actually defend the post. Siva and Smith put so much pressure on CSU's guards that they couldn't pass the ball into the post. Maybe three or four times all night did they get the ball to Colton Iverson with any time on the clock. Gorgui's job, which he performs extremely well, is to play safety in the zone, and either protect the rim against guard penetration when the press is broken, or cheat up and intercept the long pass.

When the ball is thrown into the post, Gorgui's job is to slow the post player down and force indecision, giving the other Louisville guys a chance to double and go for the steal. He does this well also.

A guy like Colton Iverson, in a regular half court game, and a 1 on 1 setting, would give Gorgui problems. Gorgui's not exactly easy to move, but he's got a high center of gravity, and he will struggle a bit against random big Eastern European centers.

Gorgui also doesn't have a reliable post game. He routinely takes a "Patrick Ewing" step, which is called for a travel as often or not. He's got big, loping strides, and it looks like he travels, even when he may not. He doesn't have a great hook, drop step, up and under, nothing. It's not a good idea to throw the ball into Gorgui and let him score in the low post.

The good, now.

Gorgui can shoot. He's got great touch with the basketball. He shoots free throws well, he can shoot the midrange jumper from the top of the key with surprising efficiency. He shoots a set shot, but with his length, it's rarely a problem. He has reliable range out to the college three point line, though he doesn't take that shot in games.

Gorgui can pass. In Louisville's sets, he works out of the high post, almost exculsively, but especially against the zone. Behanan and Harrell work the baseline. He had 8 assists against Syracuse, and was really the reason Louisville came back against Syracuse in the BET championship. He sees the court well, he's got good touch on his passes, and he doesn't make a lot of stupid decisions.

Gorgui can rebound. He's often out of position for defensive rebounds because of his rim protection, but he can rebound outside of his zone, boxes out well, and has good hands. He will never be a Mutumbo-level rebounder in the NBA, but I think Okafor-level is within reach.

Gorgui is an outstanding help defender. He blocks and alters shots without regular foul trouble. He is laterally quick enough to stop penetration from guards and swing men. He's just a very good defender.

Gorgui has more room for improvement than his age suggests. Giving leeway to older draftees because they came to the game late is usually foolish. But I've watched Dieng for three years, and his improvement has been amazing. He couldn't shoot, wasn't comfortable with the pace of the game (constantly out of place on rotations), couldn't pass, and was rail thin his freshman year. He's improved very quickly and impressively. Watching him, I don't see any reason to think he's met his potential. He can gain a bit more strength in the lower body, and he can develop a post game. This does exacerbate my first caveat, though -- he's a veritable mater of Pitino ball, but will take time to learn a new set.

Luckily, he's an intelligent and decent guy. He's popular on campus, is a bit of a momma's boy (in a good way). Speaks five languages, gets good grades. He goes to soccer games (his first sport), the womens' team games, baseball games, etc. I'm somewhat concerned that he'll be Okafor-lite (a bit too cerebral, not enough fire in the belly), but that's not the worst outcome.

He's going to measure extremely well. He's a legit 6'10", and he's probably got standing reach well into the 9'3" range. He's got a good wingspan. He is going to surprise some people in the agility and athleticism scores.

In short, he's a good guy, and will be a good player in the pros. I wouldn't be disappointed at all if only consolation for the Wizards ridiculous season were Gorgui Dieng.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#934 » by hands11 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:21 pm

I don't know much about the next year draft. Who are all these franchise players ? I know there is Andrew Wiggins. But then again, I heard Shabazz Muhammad was supposed to be all that this year. Doesn't look that way anymore.

As for other drafts. We did get Wall and last years draft was very good and we got Beal. Actually, Walls draft class produced some good talent. Every draft class does. You just have to know how to identify it and you need some luck.

Had we gotten Nikola in the Ves draft, we would be sitting pretty good going into this draft. I would still be targeting most of same players I have been listing but I would be a little less worried about getting a C with the first pick and it would be a lot easier to use Okafor as trade bait if I wanted.

Wall
Beal
Webster/Trevor A
Nene
Nikola/Okafor

Problem is, you just can't blow an entire draft like they did.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#935 » by Mr. Grundle » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:32 pm

Cody Zeller's post-up game needs a ton of work, especially when he tries to go left. He already gets rejected a ton in college and he will get swatted or stripped every time at the next level if he keeps the ball that low in traffic.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#936 » by TGW » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:37 pm

If the Wizards are picking between #7 and 11, then I'm all for trading down and getting McDermott. That white boy can play. He would be consolation for missing out on Porter, and he's arguably in the top 5 most talented offensive players in the draft. After watching us clang shots last night, it would be nice to get some more shooting on this team.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#937 » by hands11 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:54 pm

Mr. Grundle wrote:Cody Zeller's post-up game needs a ton of work, especially when he tries to go left. He already gets rejected a ton in college and he will get swatted or stripped every time at the next level if he keeps the ball that low in traffic.


I have watched him several times not and I have never once walked away thinking I was impressed.

They say he is athletic. I don't see it. Plus thin shoulders.

His post offense is based on his getting his body into players on the way to the hoop. That isn't going to happening in the pros where players are stronger.

I am just utterly unimpressed. If we end up drafting this bust, I will personally hunt down EG myself.

I would much rather have Withey, Plumlee, or Gorgui Dieng and of course Noel.

This draft has a lot of players with C next to their names but not many are actually centers at the next level.

This is the going to be the draft of the bust center.

Zeller is so over rated.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#938 » by hands11 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:57 pm

TGW wrote:If the Wizards are picking between #7 and 11, then I'm all for trading down and getting McDermott. That white boy can play. He would be consolation for missing out on Porter, and he's arguably in the top 5 most talented offensive players in the draft. After watching us clang shots last night, it would be nice to get some more shooting on this team.


Big game for him tonight at 9:40 Duke vs Creighton
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#939 » by nate33 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:00 pm

likwitdesi wrote:We have to take a look at Khalif Wyatt in the late 1st / early 2nd. I live in Philly so I've been following Temple. Ihave questioned his draft stock because he is probably a below average athlete but what a feel for the game...

He's certainly playing out of his mind in the Temple/Indiana matchup. It's tough to make a judgement off of any single game, but I really like what I see so far. And it's just that he's got 30 points. He's also made a ton of nice passes to set up his teammates (who have generally blown it every time). He might make a nice instant offense 3rd guard.

His numbers aren't great though. He's a low percentage shooter despite being a senior. He looked better as a junior.
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Re: Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#940 » by stevemcqueen1 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:03 pm

Wow, Indiana really turned it on down the stretch. Zeller/Dipo is such a lethal combination.

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