Moose and Dre (Update: Dre OK'd for expanded minutes)

[Goldtop]

I thought I'd start a thread to chart the Drummond/Monroe combo over these last few weeks of the season.

So far in the 4 games starting together:

Drummond is avg 9 pts, 8 rebs, and 1 blk on 64% FG in 21 mpg.

Monroe is avg 19 pts, 11 rebs, and 4 asts on 49% FG in 34 mpg.

We are out-rebounding opponents, as a team, by an avg of 42 to 34, and have yet to be out-rebounded with them starting together.

One thing that is becoming apparent is Drummond not only makes our team better, but he is making Monroe better too, as teams now have to account for Dre, and Moose gets more single coverage.

His numbers are up across the board during this 4 game stretch, and he seems to be playing with a lot more confidence and aggression, likely a byproduct of no longer having to take on opposing frontcourts all by himself.

Its still only a 4 game sample, but so far so good.

[Jodi]

So far they've been great together...When Monroe get his mid range together there going to be unstoppable...

[Goldtop]

So far they've been great together...When Monroe get his mid range together there going to be unstoppable...

yeah, I noticed he seems to have more confidence in his jumpshot and its becoming more consistent now too. Maybe it was just a matter of having that other elite big out there with him to draw attention away from him, and allow him to be more decisive. Before he was always hesitating as both bigs keyed in on him. Now that he knows he only has 1 man to worry about, its probably easier to read the defense and have more confidence in his decision to take the jumpshot.

Also probably helps knowing that even if he misses it, there's a good chance Drummond can get the rebound.

[Minas]

Great thread. They really complement each other well. Although it's been a small sample size I hope (and see) them becoming the next dominant front court of the NBA.

[princeofpalace]

Having Drummond in the game, takes the pressure off Greg to both be the teams sole scorer in the paint and both cover the defensive ineptness of the perimeter players.

Greg still needs to work to improve his jumper and Drummond would be better served if he does the same. But the early returns on the duo are positive. Get them some scorers on the wing and we're set.

[Brapman]

An elite center - an all-star caliber PF

No question these two very young players are the key to everything the Pistons will do over the next decade. They should individually make big leaps as players, every year for the next 3 -5 seasons, especially Drummond.

Monroe will improve his range and reliability on his mid-range jumper, and his decision making as a key facilitator of our offense. He'll have to learn his defensive responsiblities at PF, but he'll do that. (If fast 3 pt shooting stretch PF's are going to hurt us, welcome to the club - those guys are pretty much unguardable by any team in the league. But good luck to those guys controlling Monroe as an all-around offensive player and as a great rebounding PF.

Drummond will improve by leaps and bounds in just about every aspect of the game and as a physical presence. He's got none of his man strength yet, and when he does, he's going to be a total monster.

And this duo will learn to play with each other, so that they become a seemless pair. Truthfully, there is no reason to think they won't be dominant at both ends of the court.

Everything, absolutely everything the Pistons do from now on will be to build a complimentary team around them. Maybe Knight, Singler, Middleton will be long-term players around them, and perhaps they'll become stars in their own right. Maybe our #1 pick this year and/or next year will also become big stars. We'll see. The team will be doing its best to sift through players until the team has the right combination of players so that 3-5 seasons from now, we're major contenders again.

Monroe's 22, Drummond's 19. They don't come into their young prime years for another 4 to 7 seasons, by which time, assuming [knock on the wood!] they stay relatively injury free, OMG! can you imagine how great they could be?!

[ImHeisenberg]

The question was neither whether they could play together on the offensive end, or rebound.

The problem was how much of a defensive liability Moose would be at PF. He couldn't handle centers, so how is he going to deal with faster PF's with greater shooting range?

Moose needs to become a better defender. He doesn't need to be all nba defensive team candidate, he just needs to be adequate enough that he doesn't constantly require help on basically everyone.

Monroe just needs to put more effort into his defense, and get his mid-range jumper FG% up to a respectable rate and these two will go together like peanut butter & jelly.

[Kilo]

Monroe is what he is. His defense will improve some with veteran guile over the years, but he doesn't have the athleticism to guard the new age fours. I think he is a center in today's NBA.

[Brapman]

Monroe is what he is. His defense will improve some with veteran guile over the years, but he doesn't have the athleticism to guard the new age fours. I think he is a center in today's NBA.

If a stretch 4 is playing way outside, those guys are very hard to guard for any PF in the NBA. If they make some 3 pt shots, you have to live with that. The Pistons will, by the time we're a better team and then a great team will have a strong team defense, so mobile PF's will meet with significant resistance, and we'll have Drummond in the paint - meaning that the rim is so well protected that the rest of his teammates will not be sucked into the paint as much to play help defense near the rim.

I think Monroe will be more than fine, and those "mobile" 4's are going to have to guard Greg and keep him off the boards. I'll gladly take my chances with an all-star caliber performer lining up next to an all-NBA center. And if a matchup isn't going well in some game, I trust we'll have some answers and options on the bench.

Again, if these two guys fulfil their potential, we're a championship caliber team with some smart choices to fill out the rest of the roster.

[Goldtop]

Keith Langlois ‏@Keith_Langlois 6m
2 quick notes: Drummond's minutes OK'd to expand, LFrank says; and Will Bynum (hand) won't play at MIN, but might vs. CHI on Sunday.

Great news. Now we should get to see even more Moose/Dre together.

[Kilo]

For tank purposes, hopefully Noah plays on Sunday. He said he's close.

[Goldtop]

For tank purposes, hopefully Noah plays on Sunday. He said he's close.

I want to win that game. I hate CHI and rather not carry over that streak into next year.

We're going to win at least 1 more game. If I had to choose that would be the one I'd want to win. So I'd rather Noah stay out

[ComboGuardCity]

Question is, is Dre ready for more minutes? He's looking winded out there.

[Kilo]

^We'll beat Charlotte and Cleveland. So you're hoping for a 3rd win here vs Chicago. Problem becomes New Orleans would likely drop below us with our 3rd win and they'll be looking at the same needs/holes we are at the draft.

[MrBigShot]

Monroe is what he is. His defense will improve some with veteran guile over the years, but he doesn't have the athleticism to guard the new age fours. I think he is a center in today's NBA.

They have to guard him as well, don't forget that.

[DetroitSho]

Monroe is what he is. His defense will improve some with veteran guile over the years, but he doesn't have the athleticism to guard the new age fours. I think he is a center in today's NBA.

If a stretch 4 is playing way outside, those guys are very hard to guard for any PF in the NBA. If they make some 3 pt shots, you have to live with that. The Pistons will, by the time we're a better team and then a great team will have a strong team defense, so mobile PF's will meet with significant resistance, and we'll have Drummond in the paint - meaning that the rim is so well protected that the rest of his teammates will not be sucked into the paint as much to play help defense near the rim.

I think Monroe will be more than fine, and those "mobile" 4's are going to have to guard Greg and keep him off the boards. I'll gladly take my chances with an all-star caliber performer lining up next to an all-NBA center. And if a matchup isn't going well in some game, I trust we'll have some answers and options on the bench.

Again, if these two guys fulfil their potential, we're a championship caliber team with some smart choices to fill out the rest of the roster.

THANK YOU!!! Seems like half the forum wants to trade Moose for cats like Ryan Anderson and Kevin Love. Yeah lets do that and watch Moose come back and murder them downlow. Oh the irony.

[GSL Charles]

I really like seeing both playing together, however it would be great to see Monroe improve on the defensive end of the court. In my opinion, worst case scenario for Drummond is that he becomes Tyson Chandler. Great defender and rebounder, and will only be able to score off of hustle points and lobs.
Pair him with Monroe though, because of his offensive ability, we have a pretty awesome frontcourt to look forward too. Now just to get the SF and backcourt positions all figured out... haha

[Blkbrd671]

The question was neither whether they could play together on the offensive end, or rebound.

The problem was how much of a defensive liability Moose would be at PF. He couldn't handle centers, so how is he going to deal with faster PF's with greater shooting range?

Moose needs to become a better defender. He doesn't need to be all nba defensive team candidate, he just needs to be adequate enough that he doesn't constantly require help on basically everyone.

Monroe just needs to put more effort into his defense, and get his mid-range jumper FG% up to a respectable rate and these two will go together like peanut butter & jelly.

Moose wasn't a bad defender against centers, he just struggled because centers are a lot bigger. His man to man is decent. The reason why moose and dre compliment each other is dre makes up for any defensive shortfalls of moose and moose makes up for any offensive shortfalls of dre. Another reason Moose has been dominating is because he's getting defended by PF's now instead of centers.

[DocRI]

I think a major positive early sign here is Monroe's average of four assists per game. We all celebrated what a great passing big man he was when we drafted him, and yet so far in his career that skill set has been woefully under-utilized. Maybe playing with Drummond (i.e. playing PF) allows him more chances to create for his teammates? With the current state of our back court and all the debate about our PG position and whom should be playing it, I'd honestly love to see our half court offense run through Monroe more often, the same way Sacramento used Webber in their heyday. Of course, that's also why I really wanted to see Adleman hired as our head coach, but that's a conversation for a different thread ...

[Blkbrd671]

I think a major positive early sign here is Monroe's average of four assists per game. We all celebrated what a great passing big man he was when we drafted him, and yet so far in his career that skill set has been woefully under-utilized. Maybe playing with Drummond (i.e. playing PF) allows him more chances to create for his teammates? With the current state of our back court and all the debate about our PG position and whom should be playing it, I'd honestly love to see our half court offense run through Monroe more often, the same way Sacramento used Webber in their heyday. Of course, that's also why I really wanted to see Adleman hired as our head coach, but that's a conversation for a different thread ...

I think it has to do with where he catches the ball as a Pf. seems to be more at the top, where he can face up and look at the options. also its a factor of the offense. Additionally it doesn't help when you have a PG that is ball dominant