Official Draft Thread Part 2

[Jamaaliver]

I would be surprised if we didn't start our planning with Horford, Lou Williams and Teague in mind. Jenkins and Scott are bench mainstays, too, for next year. Why would we throw talent away - especially young talent?

Understood. But we are so far frm even contending for a championship, it'd be shortsighted not to re evaluate every position and every player. It's not often teams geta chance at a fresh start like this.

We've missed out on so many opportunities the last few years because our GM didn't do due diligence and remained over committed to Joe, Josh and Al.

No need to commit to a player just because he is already on the roster. We are starting over from scratch come June. It's an amazing opportunity to do this the right way.

Even AL (my all time fave Hawk) isn't safe. Nor should he be. The players, the coaches, the training staff, everyone needs to be evaluated.

It's about improving the team and competing for a championship, not playing favorites with young players who, frankly, haven't won anything. No one on our roster is irreplaceable.

[No-Man]

Austin or Adams plus Karasev or Saric, that should be the plan.

[theatlfan]

Think I would rather have Goodwin over McCollum. The only way I would even consider McCollum is if Teague was going to get overpaid, none of the bigs I like will be available, and if he doesn't have any known issues. He's a talented guard, but Lou Will is a similar player.

Neither is really a great facilitator or natural PG. Their known for scoring, and McCollum is mostly a jump shooter. Defense is about the same. McCollum really doesn't offer much upside since he isn't a great athlete and is kind of old for a prospect. Besides McCollum being longer and taller, what really separates the 2?

Interesting comp. IF Goodwin reaches his ultimate upside, then he could be the best G in the NBA - bar none. There is nothing physically that you could ask for on top of what he provides (well - maybe an inch or two to his height, but that's minor considering his length). Unfortunately, not many think he will, and even if he does, it would be unlikely that this would happen while he's still on a rookie scale contract. Many see a player whose comp is more likely a shorter Terrance Williams with less passing than a taller Westbrook. I do think McCollum, OTOH, will be pretty good immediately albeit with much less upside. Personally, I side with the "Potential gets you fired" mentality over upside especially for Gs and where we're drafting, but I could see the other way around.

Not sure if I'd consider Jenkins a bench player at this point - he could be a 50/40/90 guy in a year or 2 and that plays.

I totally agree. The kid can shoot, of course, but what intrigues me is he can drive, dish and play a little PG. His defense is better than I feared, too.

I didn't want to say it because I thought it might just be the homer in me.

I'm a little wary of creating a homer echo here, but I agree. I wasn't completely on board with the pick when it happened (I wasn't completely peeved or anything - just thought there could be better options), but Jenkins has definitely proved me wrong. At this point, there's an article on ESPN saying he should model his game after Stephen Curry. Stephen Curry with the height/wingspan to guard the SG position? Yes, please.

I would be surprised if we didn't start our planning with Horford, Lou Williams and Teague in mind. Jenkins and Scott are bench mainstays, too, for next year. Why would we throw talent away - especially young talent?

Understood. But we are so far frm even contending for a championship, it'd be shortsighted not to re evaluate every position and every player. It's not often teams geta chance at a fresh start like this.

We've missed out on so many opportunities the last few years because our GM didn't do due diligence and remained over committed to Joe, Josh and Al.

No need to commit to a player just because he is already on the roster. We are starting over from scratch come June. It's an amazing opportunity to do this the right way.

Even AL (my all time fave Hawk) isn't safe. Nor should he be. The players, the coaches, the training staff, everyone needs to be evaluated.

It's about improving the team and competing for a championship, not playing favorites with young players who, frankly, haven't won anything. No one on our roster is irreplaceable.

What should be versus what will be is two different things though. Ferry has said he wants to compete and I don't think we can do that without taking some short cuts. One way to take a short cut is to simply go with what we've got, another is to buy someone in FA. Ferry has set himself up nicely for both of those avenues - I'd say that at least 2 of our best 3 players are under our control and possibly as many as 4 of the best 6. We have loads of cap space and access to a horde of cheap young talent through the draft. I think we'll walk down this path unless and until it proves that we've maxed out again before trying a different one. There's a Turkish proverb that translates to "No matter how far down the wrong path you've gone, turn around" and as long as we keep that in mind, I don't see a problem with what appears to be our current course.

[Jamaaliver]

I would be surprised if we didn't start our planning with Horford, Lou Williams and Teague in mind. Jenkins and Scott are bench mainstays, too, for next year. Why would we throw talent away - especially young talent?

Understood. But we are so far frm even contending for a championship, it'd be shortsighted not to re evaluate every position and every player. It's not often teams geta chance at a fresh start like this.

We've missed out on so many opportunities the last few years because our GM didn't do due diligence and remained over committed to Joe, Josh and Al.

No need to commit to a player just because he is already on the roster. We are starting over from scratch come June. It's an amazing opportunity to do this the right way.

Even AL (my all time fave Hawk) isn't safe. Nor should he be. The players, the coaches, the training staff, everyone needs to be evaluated.

It's about improving the team and competing for a championship, not playing favorites with young players who, frankly, haven't won anything. No one on our roster is irreplaceable.

What should be versus what will be is two different things though. Ferry has said he wants to compete and I don't think we can do that without taking some short cuts. One way to take a short cut is to simply go with what we've got, another is to buy someone in FA. Ferry has set himself up nicely for both of those avenues - I'd say that at least 2 of our best 3 players are under our control and possibly as many as 4 of the best 6. We have loads of cap space and access to a horde of cheap young talent through the draft. I think we'll walk down this path unless and until it proves that we've maxed out again before trying a different one. There's a Turkish proverb that translates to "No matter how far down the wrong path you've gone, turn around" and as long as we keep that in mind, I don't see a problem with what appears to be our current course.

Oh, no. I wasn't advocating dumping everyone. Just saying we shouldn't make Teague the PG for the next 5 years just because he's already here.

I LOVE AL Horford, but if there is another/better option which can lead us to elite status...pursue it. It'd be foolish to keep half our roster, when our roster is not exactly elite talent.

We already missed out on Gay, Pau, Harden, Lillard, Deron Williams, Andre Drummnond because we were afraid to break up our 'core' and trade for them.

Top flight talents were available. But we kept our roster intact, and what do we have to show for it?

Be prepared to pursue anyone.

How would OKC be as a franchise if they had been committed to keeping Ray Allen and thus passed on Durant, Westbrook or Harden? They started from scratch and built the right way.

[gurpilo]

I don't understand some of the discussions about fit or duplicity with Lou, we have only 3 players under contract for next year, Horford, Jenkins and Lou, probably Scot will be back too. We should draft the best player available, no doubt about it. If McCollum drops I think we should take him, he is considered a better prospect than Goodwin in every mock draft, he could be an instant impact player for us althought I have to admit that I like Goodwin and his upside a lot, but using that argument, would we give the SG spot to a rookie and a sophomore that are both undersized?

Our main objective for this draft should be to draft the Best Player Available with both picks. I think we have some chance that McCollum, MCW or Robinson could fall to us, that should be a no brainer, after all those are gone, McGary, Caldwell Pope, Adetokunbo, Adams, Gobert or Dieng should be the options we should consider before Karasev or Saric, they are better talent.

[Jamaaliver]

I don't understand some of the discussions about fit or duplicity with Lou, we have only 3 players under contract for next year, Horford, Jenkins and Lou, probably Scot will be back too. We should draft the best player available, no doubt about it. If McCollum drops I think we should take him, he is considered a better prospect than Goodwin in every mock draft, he could be an instant impact player for us althought I have to admit that I like Goodwin and his upside a lot, but using that argument, would we give the SG spot to a rookie and a sophomore that are both undersized?

Our main objective for this draft should be to draft the Best Player Available with both picks. I think we have some chance that McCollum, MCW or Robinson could fall to us, that should be a no brainer, after all those are gone, McGary, Caldwell Pope, Adetokunbo, Adams, Gobert or Dieng should be the options we should consider before Karasev or Saric, they are better talent.

I'm with you there, Gurpilo.

But I wanna go on record as being skeptical of McGary and Dieng being more than backup Centers.

I also advocate using both picks to trade up for best player available. We should have a shot at 10 - 12 pick if someone we like is there. (McCollum, Gobert)

[Geaux_Hawks]

I don't understand some of the discussions about fit or duplicity with Lou, we have only 3 players under contract for next year, Horford, Jenkins and Lou, probably Scot will be back too. We should draft the best player available, no doubt about it. If McCollum drops I think we should take him, he is considered a better prospect than Goodwin in every mock draft, he could be an instant impact player for us althought I have to admit that I like Goodwin and his upside a lot, but using that argument, would we give the SG spot to a rookie and a sophomore that are both undersized?

Our main objective for this draft should be to draft the Best Player Available with both picks. I think we have some chance that McCollum, MCW or Robinson could fall to us, that should be a no brainer, after all those are gone, McGary, Caldwell Pope, Adetokunbo, Adams, Gobert or Dieng should be the options we should consider before Karasev or Saric, they are better talent.

Like I said earlier, if, and only if Teague will not be coming back would I consider taking McCollum, and even then, I still question McCollum as a PG. He doesn't have great vision, defense isn't really a strong point, and he isn't a great athlete. His jump shot is his main weapon, and without it, he would be kind of average because it really helps his ability to penetrate.

I agree that we should be taking the BPA, but we should also consider what we do have already. That's kind of how we shot ourselves in the foot the first time with Marvin, Shelden, Smith, Joe, and Chidress. We had to many guys playing the same position already. If McCollum is a legit upgrade over Lou or even Teague, then I would be all for it, but he really isn't. If he was anything like Lilliard, then he will definitely be gone early.

[Geaux_Hawks]

I don't understand some of the discussions about fit or duplicity with Lou, we have only 3 players under contract for next year, Horford, Jenkins and Lou, probably Scot will be back too. We should draft the best player available, no doubt about it. If McCollum drops I think we should take him, he is considered a better prospect than Goodwin in every mock draft, he could be an instant impact player for us althought I have to admit that I like Goodwin and his upside a lot, but using that argument, would we give the SG spot to a rookie and a sophomore that are both undersized?

Our main objective for this draft should be to draft the Best Player Available with both picks. I think we have some chance that McCollum, MCW or Robinson could fall to us, that should be a no brainer, after all those are gone, McGary, Caldwell Pope, Adetokunbo, Adams, Gobert or Dieng should be the options we should consider before Karasev or Saric, they are better talent.

Like I said earlier, if, and only if Teague will not be coming back would I consider taking McCollum, and even then, I still question McCollum as a PG. He doesn't have great vision, defense isn't really a strong point, and he isn't a great athlete. His jump shot is his main weapon, and without it, he would be kind of average because it really helps his ability to penetrate.

I agree that we should be taking the BPA, but we should also consider what we do have already. That's kind of how we shot ourselves in the foot the first time with Marvin, Shelden, Smith, Joe, and Chidress. We had to many guys playing the same position already. If McCollum is a legit upgrade over Lou or even Teague, then I would be all for it, but he really isn't. If he was anything like Lilliard, then he will definitely be gone early.

[tcorbin]

McCollum is a shooting guard.

[gurpilo]

Marcus Smart and Mcdoo not declaring, the options are getting slimmer and Burke is now the top PG of the class, the options that MCW or McCollum falls are getting lower. Seems we will have to go with upside pick, Adams is still my favourite big, and with the other perhaps we will be lucky and Kentavious Caldwell Pope could fall to us, McGary could also be a decent option.

[tcorbin]

Did the Hawks tank the last three games so that they can move up one spot in the draft over Chicago, and now have the 18th and 19th pick?

[gurpilo]

It's 17 and 18 th pick and I am glad they did it, we have increased our chances to land something valuable, basically we change our 20 th pick for 17th pick.

[gurpilo]

Ok, so finally is 17 and 18 th pick.

There is a general consensus on all mock drafts that 13 players will be gone by the time we pick. McLemore, Norel, Zeller, Porter, Bennet, Alex Len, Burke, Oladipo, Muhammad, Plumlee, Ollynk, McCollum, Michael Carter Williams. All of them would be no-brainers if they fall, except perhaps Plumlee for me, I really don't like him.

After this list, 4 players seems to be climbing on mock drafts: Robinson, Gobert, Caldwell Pope and McGary. I would love to get Robinson, he would fill a need and become one building block at the SF spot for us. I wouldn't mind to get either Caldwell Pope or McGary, I think by the draft day McGary would pass Plumlee on all mock drafts and would be part of the first list, he is an athletic PF with good size, very good rebounder, active on defense, has a decent jumper, his dominance against Withey, Young and Syracuse will make his stock go up. Caldwell Pope is a great SG with great size, he can defend both SG and SF and fits our game. About Gobert, I prefer Adams than Gobert although I understand his size is huge but he is so skinny that I doubt he will be able to compete at NBA level.

Then it comes the list where we should be picking. Adams, Dieng, Withey, Goodwin, Mitchell, Franklin, Saric and Adetokunbo.

I think we should be picking a big, Adams would be my choice, best combination of size/production/upside, I like him more than Dieng and Dieng more than Whithey.

The other pick should be a wing unless McGary is available, if McGary, Robinson or Caldwell Pope are gone, right now this will be my order alghouht I'm sure I will change my mind on draft day: Adekotunbo, Goodwin, Franklin, Mitchell and Saric. Adekotunbo has a lot of upside and fits our needs, Goodwin has a lot of upside although his position and size are the same as Jenkins, but he was considered top 5 pick and that is because of a reason, Franklin would help a lot on rebounds, Mitchell is a tweener not great upside at this point but could develop onto a Smith type of player and Saric I think is the weaker of all of them, not a SF, not a PF...

Other names as McDermott, Karasev, Kabongo, Tim Hardaway, Jaiteh or Austin I think could be found on 2nd round, we should trade our 2 2nds for a higher 2nd round pick.

[tcorbin]

^ I would be ecstatic if the Hawks were able to grab GRob. after watch more UCLA vids, i have GRob over Muhammad now.

Muhammad looks good, but not great to me. i think he will be a good NBA player, but only on the same level as prime Jerry Stackhouse. a savvy iso player who does a great job at getting to the line.

GRob on the other hand, reminds me of Paul Pierce. High IQ, good team work, and has clutchness in him.

Adams would be my number one choice for the #19th pick, with McGary as my second option.

[tcorbin]

It's 17 and 18 th pick and I am glad they did it, we have increased our chances to land something valuable, basically we change our 20 th pick for 17th pick.

So it is official..... Hawks trade away Joe Johnson for the 17th pick in the draft

[theatlfan]

Ok, so finally is 17 and 18 th pick.

From what I'm seeing, it looks like a coin flip between HOU's pick and CHI for 18/19. LAL is also tied for the pick, but it would seem rather insulting for HOU to be able to fall past LAL, but I think CHI might be able to. The order would be inverse for the 2nd round.

There is a general consensus on all mock drafts that 13 players will be gone by the time we pick. McLemore, Norel, Zeller, Porter, Bennet, Alex Len, Burke, Oladipo, Muhammad, Plumlee, Ollynk, McCollum, Michael Carter Williams. All of them would be no-brainers if they fall, except perhaps Plumlee for me, I really don't like him.

Muhammad is a faller as well, although it could be from top 5 to later in the lottery. I've also seen Len as a faller, but I don't see any consensus there.

After this list, 4 players seems to be climbing on mock drafts: Robinson, Gobert, Caldwell Pope and McGary. I would love to get Robinson, he would fill a need and become one building block at the SF spot for us. I wouldn't mind to get either Caldwell Pope or McGary, I think by the draft day McGary would pass Plumlee on all mock drafts and would be part of the first list, he is an athletic PF with good size, very good rebounder, active on defense, has a decent jumper, his dominance against Withey, Young and Syracuse will make his stock go up. Caldwell Pope is a great SG with great size, he can defend both SG and SF and fits our game. About Gobert, I prefer Adams than Gobert although I understand his size is huge but he is so skinny that I doubt he will be able to compete at NBA level.

I would love to land Robinson. Kind of get the feeling that Gobert will be the most talked about prospect for us (and many other teams) between now and D-Day. Will be interesting to see where he lands. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if Gobert got in the top 10 or fell out of the 1st entirely. Caldwell-Pope is a stat lovers guy and jumped up from the 2nd round to our area when an ESPN guy put some numbers out. I'm a UGA alum and big fan, but I have to admit that I'm not in love with KCP. That could be unfair - he had some large expectations coming in and the rest of the team was truly awful, so I could be looking at him with some shaded glasses.

Then it comes the list where we should be picking. Adams, Dieng, Withey, Goodwin, Mitchell, Franklin, Saric and Adetokunbo.

I'm thinking Adetokunbo might be more internet sensation than Top 20 NBA prospect. His level of competition has been incredibly weak and he needs a lot of time in a weight room. He has tools, but he also has a long way to go - seems like a stash pick, but I'm not sure he can be. I can't see Ferry going after either Goodwin or Franklin. I've talked on Goodwin, but Franklin is in a similar boat - great athleticism but lacks skills that would be valued for a perimeter player. Franklin does bring more now though, so I could see him more than Goodwin.

I think we should be picking a big, Adams would be my choice, best combination of size/production/upside, I like him more than Dieng and Dieng more than Whithey.

The other pick should be a wing unless McGary is available, if McGary, Robinson or Caldwell Pope are gone, right now this will be my order alghouht I'm sure I will change my mind on draft day: Adekotunbo, Goodwin, Franklin, Mitchell and Saric. Adekotunbo has a lot of upside and fits our needs, Goodwin has a lot of upside although his position and size are the same as Jenkins, but he was considered top 5 pick and that is because of a reason, Franklin would help a lot on rebounds, Mitchell is a tweener not great upside at this point but could develop onto a Smith type of player and Saric I think is the weaker of all of them, not a SF, not a PF...

Other names as McDermott, Karasev, Kabongo, Tim Hardaway, Jaiteh or Austin I think could be found on 2nd round, we should trade our 2 2nds for a higher 2nd round pick.

I'm thinking Jaiteh just made the 1st round at the Nike Summit when he measured 6'11" in shoes with a 7'4" wingspan and 250 pounds. One of the things keeping him down was that many viewed him as an undersized C or a low post PF, but now that he measurement match up to be a "true" C, he should get a nice bump. I'd think that we should see him with the late 1st Cs you listed above pretty soon. He needs some work, but he's still 18. I see Kabongo in the 1st as well. There are supposedly some teams that love him and the NCAA suspension shouldn't hold any weight with the NBA. The fact that he rode it out instead of bolting somewhere might even be a point in his favor. Karasev is the interesting case. I can see a lot of team that are looking for an immediate role player with a little upside jumping on him. Considering that the late 1st is typically for playoff teams that need cheap talent to fit under the LT and could help now, he could be a fit for many teams in the late 1st area.

I do agree that packaging the 2 2nds to move up in the the mid-to-late 30's would be ideal, but I don't know who would be willing to deal. The obvious candidate would be someone looking to simply sell their picks so being able to divest the one pick into 2 (and picking up some $$ for the effort) could be appealing. I don't know who that would be though...

[Jamaaliver]

I do agree that packaging the 2 2nds to move up in the the mid-to-late 30's would be ideal, but I don't know who would be willing to deal. The obvious candidate would be someone looking to simply sell their picks so being able to divest the one pick into 2 (and picking up some $$ for the effort) could be appealing. I don't know who that would be though...

Mami, OKC or another contender with 0 cap room.

[parson]

It's 17 and 18 th pick and I am glad they did it, we have increased our chances to land something valuable, basically we change our 20 th pick for 17th pick.

So it is official..... Hawks trade away Joe Johnson for the 17th pick in the draft

Aaaaaand, enough capspace - just from the Joe trade - for a shot at a major FA. Doubly good.

[tcorbin]

Oh well, it looks like Glen Robinson III is going back to college.

[gurpilo]

I do agree that packaging the 2 2nds to move up in the the mid-to-late 30's would be ideal, but I don't know who would be willing to deal. The obvious candidate would be someone looking to simply sell their picks so being able to divest the one pick into 2 (and picking up some $$ for the effort) could be appealing. I don't know who that would be though...

Mami, OKC or another contender with 0 cap room.

OKC could trade us 31, they already have 10 and 30th pick so perhaps we could trade our 2 2nds and cash consideration, Sacramento, Philadelphia, perhaps someone is interested if not I think there will be still some talent to be drafted.