Bill Simmons ranks Wall & Beal

[mhd]

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/920 ... lue-part-2

Beal is 29th and here is is snippet:

"In general, the 2-guard position has turned into a closer-by-committee of specialty guys.5 And that's what makes Beal such a commodity: 19 years old, sweet stroke, underrated rebounder, excellent 3-point shooter (48 percent since New Year's Day), hard worker. What am I missing? Other than the Brow, he's my favorite guy from the 2012 draft; only the residual stink of the Washington Professional Basketball Team could derail him. Meanwhile, Lillard is three years older and plays the league's deepest position; he's a below-average defender (and that's kind); and he leads a team that just lost 34 of its last 47 games (Good Stats/Bad Team alert!!!!). The good stuff: He heated up after the All-Star break (20.4 PPG, 45-40-83 splits) despite being saddled with an abysmal supporting cast; he somehow led the league in minutes (?!?!?!?!?!?); and Portland was a near-impossible 10.2 points worse per 100 possessions with him sitting. If Mike D'Antoni coached Portland, he would have played Lillard 57 minutes a game until his ACL's turned into fusilli."

Wall is 25th and here is his snippet:
"His last 21 games: 24.3 PPG, 8.3 APG, 5.0 RPG, 47-37-79 splits. In other words, GIVE ME A MAX EXTENSION THIS SUMMER! The poor Wizards have to roll the dice there and hope he stays healthy, if only because he's the same age as Damian Lillard. Historically, these decisions have always worked out poorly for the Wizards — and by "poorly," I mean "in ways that turn Wizards fans into alcoholics.""

HOWEVER, he's got Rubio ahead of him at 22 and I'd NEVER trade Wall for Rubio.

[Wallbeliever]

I think they got Beal right but the players in front of Wall……Brook Lopez, Al Horford, Ricky Rubio, Tony Parker, Kevin Love, Chris Bosh?

I wouldn’t trade Wall for any of them except maybe Love straight up, he missed on Wall by about 10 spots. We are talking about trade value not actual value.

Wall was ranked at that spot due to uncertainty of whether his escalated play is due to the dreaded "contract year" or if he is finally blossoming into what people expected. So I can understand that. I wish Simmons elaborated more instead of taking the cheap way out with a footnote analysis.

[stevemcqueen1]

Yeah he's got Wall too low. I think he's reflecting too much, rather than projecting. When you makes trades and personnel moves, they're based on projections.

It's a good projection that Wall will become a top ten player. He was basically the second best player in the league in March. When Wall is at his best, he is totally dominant on both ends. He's unguardable and an impact defensive playmaker. Like a mini LeBron at point. You don't give that player and that potential up for anything but another superstar or future superstar.

And before March, I would have agreed with his statement that a redone 2010 draft would have Wall going second behind Paul George. But not any more. Paul George is not the scorer nor facilitator that Wall is. Wall has the potential to be a superstar scorer, and he's done it since March. George does not IMO. George would go third behind Cousins IMO.

And he's also got Deron Williams way too low based on the small sample size of the first few months of the season. Deron is easily a top ten to fifteen player when he's playing at his best. He's a legit franchise player and a lot of the guys he's got in front of him are not. You can take Brook Lopez off the Nets and they'll cope. You can not take DWill off of them without destroying the entire build.

[nate33]

For two years now, the fashionable thing to do was to hate on Wall because the Wizards haven't been winners. Simmons is still living in the past.

[DCsOwn]

For two years now, the fashionable thing to do was to hate on Wall because the Wizards haven't been winners. Simmons is still living in the past.

I think Simmons is actually pretty fair when evaluating the Wizards/DC sports. One of his best friends is from DC, I've seen him in the city myriad times (once on a book tour, a few times when he was in town for PTI fill-ins and I saw him at a Gtown game once). I even had a chance to strike up a conversation with him. He has an affinity for the city/area (we talked about Gtown hoops and Bullets/Wizards futility mostly, but we also talked about a symposium taking place at the National Press Club and culinary options in the immediate area). He obviously traffics in a decent amount of snark to entertain his readers, but he seemed like a quality dude to me, and I haven't really seen him take any gratuitous shots at the Wizards.

[Dark Faze]

Seems really odd to have Rubio in front of Wall. Wall is better at everything except defense, and his obvious interest in playing good D + his physical tools give him a lot of potential to get better at that.

[FAH1223]

For two years now, the fashionable thing to do was to hate on Wall because the Wizards haven't been winners. Simmons is still living in the past.

But the Wizards aren't winners.

[nate33]

For two years now, the fashionable thing to do was to hate on Wall because the Wizards haven't been winners. Simmons is still living in the past.

But the Wizards aren't winners.

They have been with Wall.

In general, I like Simmons and think he is smarter than most basketball commentators (Celtics bias aside). I just think his comments on Wall sound like they were made three months ago before Wall broke out. There is absolutely no way a rational person should rank Rubio ahead of Wall at this point. It's ludicrous.

[Higga]

Beal at 29 is pretty generous, but it's a list ranking value and if he becomes a quality SG on a rookie deal he's a hell of a value.

Wall is undervalued at 25 but if he gets a max or near max deal, 25 is probably about right, though maybe he should be a bit higher. We'll see if he can maintain his elite level of play over an entire season after he gets paid.

[MikeTheKid]

2 things to seriously consider guys, 1 were still not good its all on potential and health so until Beal and Wall do this for a full season I actually think this is fair ranking for both right now. It took Beal so time to get accustomed to the NBA game. Wall showed hes the real deal once the max talk started lets be real I love the way Wall turned it up just like everyone else but the "getting paid" factor is there. Remember the last guy we paid big money too after he did good after the ASB, Mr. Burger King himself!!!

[milellie111]

For two years now, the fashionable thing to do was to hate on Wall because the Wizards haven't been winners. Simmons is still living in the past.

But the Wizards aren't winners.

They have been with Wall.

In general, I like Simmons and think he is smarter than most basketball commentators (Celtics bias aside). I just think his comments on Wall sound like they were made three months ago before Wall broke out. There is absolutely no way a rational person should rank Rubio ahead of Wall at this point. It's ludicrous.

lol.

Since drating Wall:

2010-2011: 23-59
2011-2012: 20-46
2012-2013: 29-53

Hopefully, you were just being sarcastic

[FAH1223]

lol.

Since drating Wall:

2010-2011: 23-59
2011-2012: 20-46
2012-2013: 29-53

Hopefully, you were just being sarcastic

He's referring to the 25-19 record with Wall back before the 6 game losing streak to end the year when all the better players were pulled for the crappy young guys we have.

[nate33]

lol.

Since drating Wall:

2010-2011: 23-59
2011-2012: 20-46
2012-2013: 29-53

Hopefully, you were just being sarcastic

He's referring to the 25-19 record with Wall back before the 6 game losing streak to end the year when all the better players were pulled for the crappy young guys we have.

Yeah. I'd say 5-28 without Wall followed by 25-19 with Wall implies that Wall does a great deal to help the team win games.

[pancakes3]

Well, first off this isn't a talent ranking but rather a trade value ranking. Age and contract factor as much, if not more as basketball ability.

Also, I can't say there's a DC bias because Beal at 29 is overreaching and Wall at 25 is underreaching.

Plus, both are ranked higher than both Vucevic and Pekovic, two of the best young C's in the league. As good as Beal is, I'd pull a McLemore + Pekovic for Beal + Nene trade in a heartbeat at the expense of delaying our playoff push another season.

Also, it's tiered. Beal is on a lower tier than Wall even if the two of them are only separated by 4 spots.

[nate33]

I agree that Beal is a little high. I think he's up there so high because of his extremely young age. At 19, there's a major "potential" factor with him that doesn't exist with guys like Vucevic.

[dangermouse]

I watched a few Twolves games this year, Wall is way ahead of Rubio in terms of development. I wouldnt make that trade either.

[DaRealHibachi]

Is Rubio really better defensively than Wall..?? And if so, based on what..??

[pancakes3]

Wow. The real travesty is that Wall is sitting at #25, Tier G slumming it with Brook Lopez and Kyrie Irving hasn't shown up at all. Simmons has Irving ranked higher than 19th, and at least 2 tiers better. Regardless of where you fall on Irving/Wall, 7+ spots and 2+ tiers is too wide a disparity between Wall and Irving.

[dangermouse]

Is Rubio really better defensively than Wall..?? And if so, based on what..??

Honestly from what I saw, they are about even. Rubio has a nose for the ball just like Wall does, but both have to learn when to gamble and when to front their man.

[GhostsOfGil]

Rubio has a better defensive understanding. Wall is a solid defender because of his size and length. Right now I would put Rubio slightly above Wall in terms of defense.

Trade value on the other hand... Wall should be at least a tier above Rubio.