What is the point in putting a good player on the bench??

MagicTownBaller · Post #1 » by **MagicTownBaller** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:30 pm

I'm talking about Manu Ginobili and when James Harden was on the Spurs and now even J.R. Smith on the Knicks.

I never got why coaches would purposely put these players on the bench and start players who were inferior to them. I mean, is Pablo Prigioni better then J.R? Is Danny Green that much better then Manu? Is Thabo better then James? No, they weren't.

Another one that annoys me is when Lamar Odom was on the Lakers, I understand he was better at PF, but he could have started at SF and then played PF when Pau or Bynum checked out.

Blame Rasho · Post #2 » by **Blame Rasho** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:32 pm

There are only so many shots to go around...

Why is this a concept hard for you to understand?

TheChosen618 · Post #3 » by **TheChosen618** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:32 pm

They need someone to play with the 2nd unit, run their offense, and be their go-to guy. It only works when you already have plenty of offensive options in the starting lineup. It was clearly the case with Manu and Harden.

Also, it is not about who starts, it is more about who finishes. All of these guys finish games.

Nuntius · Post #4 » by **Nuntius** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:37 pm

MagicTownBaller wrote:I mean, is Pablo Prigioni better then J.R? Is Danny Green that much better then Manu? Is Thabo better then James? No, they weren't.

Because they provide better stability to the starting line-up.

Pablo Prigioni can run the offense and get everyone else involved. JR Smith cannot do that.

Danny Green is the definition of a 3 + D player. He can fit any line-up and provide stability. He is a great 4th-5th option alongside some great players. He wouldn't be that effective off the bench. Manu, on the other hand, will need as much rest as he can get. He needs to stay away from injuries. He's also a dynamic player that can both create and score in bunches. Danny Green cannot do that.

Thabo played ahead of Harden due to defense. Harden is a below par defender. Thabo is good. Also, Harden was excellent of the bench. He can score at will and generate offense. Thabo could not do that.

It's not necessary that your starting 5 contains your best player. What matters is that your starting 5 consists of players that compliment each others' skillset.

License2Lillard · Post #5 » by **License2Lillard** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:42 pm

When the other team's starters sit he's rested, so they take advantage of rotations. Plus they don't have to share the ball.

Buckeye-NBAFan · Post #6 » by **Buckeye-NBAFan** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:47 pm

Manu can't play starter minutes. He's been injury prone his entire career, and is older now too.

J.R. Smith needs his minutes reduced because he's a chucker. At least when you play him with the 2nd unit, he's not stealing shots from your better players.

There's no excuse for Harden not playing.

KnicksH20 · Post #7 » by **KnicksH20** » Sun May 19, 2013 6:51 pm

Because when Manu comes in, guys like Toney Allen will have already played 6 minutes and will be a bit winded. Manu comes in, fresh as hell, and can wreak havoc either on the first unit or the 2nd unit, which will clearly be inferior to him.

Why do people make such dumb threads?

MagicTownBaller · Post #8 » by **MagicTownBaller** » Sun May 19, 2013 7:16 pm

My theory is you always start your five best players. The only exception would be to have a big guy in there.

Egg Nog · Post #9 » by **Egg Nog** » Sun May 19, 2013 7:28 pm

Blame Rasho wrote:There are only so many shots to go around...

Why is this a concept hard for you to understand?

This.

tiderulz · Post #10 » by **tiderulz** » Sun May 19, 2013 7:40 pm

MagicTownBaller wrote:My theory is you always start your five best players. The only exception would be to have a big guy in there.

starting is overrated. As mentioned before, they finish the game and they get a majority of minutes, who cares if you start or not?

Fobbie · Post #11 » by **Fobbie** » Sun May 19, 2013 7:46 pm

MagicTownBaller wrote:My theory is you always start your five best players. The only exception would be to have a big guy in there.

Having a guy on the bench that can create/score is important as having the 5 best players starting. If you start your best 5 players, what happen when they need a breather? Guy gets tired all the time... No one can play all 48 minute effectively on both end of the floor.

Melo/JR starting and both jumpers are off would create a lot of houses...

Bskey · Post #12 » by **Bskey** » Sun May 19, 2013 8:13 pm

2 reasons. If you have 3+ guys that are all high volume shooters there isn't much point in playing them all at once throughout the entire game. At times, yes, it's nice to overwhelm a defense. But most of the time there just aren't enough shots to really take advantage of the talent.

The other is that it allows you to keep pressure on the other team. 2 stars attacking their starting unit, and then a 3rd to dismantle their bench when starters rest.

So instead of having your 3 guys play 15 minutes together then all rest you get to keep the pressure on the other team throughout the game by having a fresh legged guy just as dangerous as the starters when the others rest.

daniel3 · Post #13 » by **daniel3** » Sun May 19, 2013 8:15 pm

James Harden on the bench is just plainly stupid, but Manu is as brittle as glass. Have to manage his minutes

.

spudwebb · Post #14 » by **spudwebb** » Sun May 19, 2013 8:20 pm

Egg Nog wrote:
Blame Rasho wrote:There are only so many shots to go around...

Why is this a concept hard for you to understand?

This.

The fact that there is:

>Only one ball
>48 minutes

Seems hard for people to understand

Carlos Arroyo · Post #15 » by **Carlos Arroyo** » Sun May 19, 2013 9:45 pm

Is it really this hard for you to understand this simple concept?
Even in 2K i never start my best 5 players lol

john248 · Post #16 » by **john248** » Sun May 19, 2013 10:40 pm

Carlos Arroyo wrote:Is it really this hard for you to understand this simple concept?
Even in 2K i never start my best 5 players lol

Off topic, but I wish I could control the starting line-ups and minutes in 2K.. as I play in My Player mode.

Smash3 · Post #17 » by **Smash3** » Sun May 19, 2013 10:49 pm

tiderulz wrote:
MagicTownBaller wrote:My theory is you always start your five best players. The only exception would be to have a big guy in there.

starting is overrated. As mentioned before, they finish the game and they get a majority of minutes, who cares if you start or not?

Interesting theory...

Buckeye-NBAFan · Post #18 » by **Buckeye-NBAFan** » Sun May 19, 2013 11:20 pm

tiderulz wrote:
MagicTownBaller wrote:My theory is you always start your five best players. The only exception would be to have a big guy in there.

starting is overrated. As mentioned before, they finish the game and they get a majority of minutes, who cares if you start or not?

Starting isn't overrated. Starting a player allows you to stretch their minutes over a longer period of time, allowing them to play more minutes because there is more opportunity for rest.

There has to be some strategy to not starting a guy. It can't just be because you need a scorer off the bench, because you can stagger when you rest your starters and achieve the same result of playing one of your starting scorers with the bench unit.

WillVanderbilt · Post #19 » by **WillVanderbilt** » Sun May 19, 2013 11:36 pm

But if Manu has a higher rating than Green he will start if you let the cpu automatically adjust the lineups!

_BBIB_ · Post #20 » by **_BBIB_** » Mon May 20, 2013 1:37 am

MagicTownBaller wrote:I'm talking about Manu Ginobili and when James Harden was on the Spurs and now even J.R. Smith on the Knicks.

I never got why coaches would purposely put these players on the bench and start players who were inferior to them. I mean, is Pablo Prigioni better then J.R? Is Danny Green that much better then Manu? Is Thabo better then James? No, they weren't.

Another one that annoys me is when Lamar Odom was on the Lakers, I understand he was better at PF, but he could have started at SF and then played PF when Pau or Bynum checked out.

Considering the Spurs multiple championships with Manu Ginobili I'd say it's worked out quite well

It's called a 2nd unit. Your starters don't play 48 minutes a game. It creates incredible depth on your bench and especially for a guy like Manu who can be a facilitator.

And as others have stated if you end the game, who the heck cares who started?