2013 Minor Leagues/Prospect Discussion Thread

[dagger]

Tonight in a nutshell, good outings by Norris and Nolin, a little less less good by Sanchez.

Norris - Pitched four innings, gave up one run earned, 3 hits and 3 walks but struck out 7. Had a pickoff, too.

Slavko Bekovic ‏@SBekovic 4h
After Daniel Norris walked the leadoff hitter, he picked him off and struck out the next 4 batters, hitting 97-98 on the gun. #Lugnuts

Nolin - Six shutout innings, not quite as dominant as last time with four hits and two walks, struck out five and never seemed in any difficulty which is one of his better traits. When he puts a baserunner on, he rarely puts a second on. By my count, he now has a scoreless streak of 13 innings. Wtih the win, he's 14-0 across two seasons, two leagues. Hasn't lost a game since 2011. Tonight: 97 pitches, 63 strikes. Duelled one of the better Twin prospects, Logan Darnell, who, ironically, was like Nolin a 2010 sixth round pick and is a left hander.

Sanchez - three innings, two runs (both earned on a first inning homer) two hits, two walks, two strikeouts.

Offensive note of the night so far - Dwight Smith of Lansing with his second homer and a pair of RBIs, raising his average to .289. He was 3-4 with a walk. Might be the guy to watch for the next callup to Dunedin.Christian Lopes 2-3 with a pair of walks. Also, Kevin Patterson with six RBIs, and Emilio Guerrero with a 2-4 night. Also, Kevin Pillar with a 2-5 night at NH.

[Graham's Cracker]

Tonight in a nutshell, good outings by Norris and Nolin, a little less less good by Sanchez.

Norris - Pitched four innings, gave up one run earned, 3 hits and 3 walks but struck out 7. Had a pickoff, too.

Nolin - Six shutout innings, not quite as dominant as last time with four hits and two walks, struck out five and never seemed in any difficulty which is one of his better traits. When he puts a baserunner on, he rarely puts a second on. By my count, he now has a scoreless streak of 13 innings. If he gets the win, he will be 14-0 across two seasons, two leagues. Hasn't lost a game since 2011. Tonight: 97 pitches, 63 strikes. Duelled one of the better Twin prospects, Logan Darnell, who, ironically, was like Nolin a 2010 sixth round pick and is a left hander.

Sanchez - three innings, two runs (both earned on a first inning homer) two hits, two walks, two strikeouts.

Offensive note of the night so far - Dwight Smith of Lansing with his second homer and a pair of RBIs, raising his average to .282.

Good to see Norris put together back to back good outings. The 7 K's are impressive.

Glad that Dwight Smith Jr is starting to regain some of his prospect status. Interesting looking back at that '11 draft for the Jays. The Jays managed quite well after the 10th round where there is alot of question (plus unsigned/traded players) marks on those selected 1-10.

Top 10 Rounds:
Beede
Jacob Anderson
Musgrove
Smith Jr
Comer
Gabryszwski
Stilson
Robson
Chin
Desclafani
Lopes
Biggs
Suarez
Garza

After the 10th:
(11) Andy Burns
(13) Matt Dean
(29) Taylor Cole
(32) Kevin Pillar

[Graham's Cracker]

Mike Crouse was back for Dunedin after missing a month and a half.

McGowan is up now for the Bisons (edit) and he retires the side in order. Two groundouts and one strikeout.

[dagger]

Mike Crouse was back for Dunedin after missing a month and a half.

McGowan is up now for the Bisons (edit) and he retires the side in order. Two groundouts and one strikeout.

was topping out at 95mph.

Seems as if Jays had a lot of pitcher injuries coming out of spring training. Nolin, Jenkins, Barnes, Stilson.

Barnes with a clean inning and a pair of Ks at Dunedin, good sign, assume he can get to NH before long.

[Graham's Cracker]

Mike Crouse was back for Dunedin after missing a month and a half.

McGowan is up now for the Bisons (edit) and he retires the side in order. Two groundouts and one strikeout.

was topping out at 95mph.

Seems as if Jays had a lot of pitcher injuries coming out of spring training. Nolin, Jenkins, Barnes, Stilson.

Barnes with a clean inning and a pair of Ks at Dunedin, good sign, assume he can get to NH before long.

should be alot of moving pieces in the next couple of weeks. Hopefully Carreno makes his way to AAA soon. Lansing has a few guys in the bullpen who are due for a promotion.

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[Graham's Cracker]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

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[s e n s i]

so marcus stroman is kind of good

John Lott ‏@LottOnBaseball 17m

In his 2013 debut with New Hampshire, Marcus Stroman 5IP/4H/0R/1BB/6K. Commence jumping to conclusions.

[dagger]

so marcus stroman is kind of good

John Lott ‏@LottOnBaseball 17m

In his 2013 debut with New Hampshire, Marcus Stroman 5IP/4H/0R/1BB/6K. Commence jumping to conclusions.

He threw 90 pitches. He was utterly dominant the first 2.2 innings, then I think he began to waver a bit. Never got in serious trouble but 90 pitches is more than he has ever thrown in one game as a pro. He had a tendency to get ahead of batters, 0-2 and 1-2, and not finish them off, turned too many of those into 3-2 counts for my liking. I think he needs innings, lots of innings, and a little more challenge like maybe being a rotation pitcher in Buffalo where the starting rotation has been awful of late, in part because so many pitchers have been promoted to the Jays, never to return.

[dagger]

in other games, BUF beat Charlotte 11-6 as our old friend Zack Stewart had a Ricky Romero like start giving up 11 hits and two walks in five innings for the Knights (I so much want to call them the Hornets... LOL). David Purcey also pitched two innings for CHA, so it was a Jays homecoming.

For the Bison, Todd Redmond, another one of AA's waiver wire pickups, got a whooping, giving up six hits, five runs, two walks in 3,1, but on a positive not, John Stilson made his AAA debut with two innings of no-hot scoreless relief, giving up only a pair of walks and striking out 3. Offensively for BUF, it weas mainly Inspector Renaud's usual suspects: Negrych 3-5, Sierra 3-5, Thole 2-4, Luis Jimenez 2-3. Sierra also threw out Gordon Beckham, he of White Sox rehab fame, trying to stretch a single.

New Hampshire made it to .500 behind Stroman, Dunedin won 3-1, and Lansing won 7-3. Of the notable prospects in those wins, Dwight Smith Jr was 3-5 for Lansing, in his last 10 games he's hitting .350 with an .OPS of .935

[flatjacket1]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

Sent from my LG-P880g using RealGM Forums mobile app

The Lansing gun is so juiced. One of my friends that was a high-80's pitcher hit 94-96 on Lansing gun, and his parents called him right after the game because they heard and he said everybody experienced a velocity jump on the parks gun.

[dagger]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

Sent from my LG-P880g using RealGM Forums mobile app

The Lansing gun is so juiced. One of my friends that was a high-80's pitcher hit 94-96 on Lansing gun, and his parents called him right after the game because they heard and he said everybody experienced a velocity jump on the parks gun.

Was that this year?

[flatjacket1]

Was that this year?

It was 2012 but I don't remember hearing it has been fixed. It's been notoriously juiced ever since Syndergaard hit triple digits.

[dagger]

Was that this year?

It was 2012 but I don't remember hearing it has been fixed. It's been notoriously juiced ever since Syndergaard hit triple digits.

Interesting indeed, but I guess to get 7K over 4IP, Norris had to be in the low 90s at a minimum.

Anyway, here's a short feature update on Sean Nolin after his game yesterday. With Stroman today and even Deck McGuire showing some signs of life, the New Hampshire rotation is starting to get interesting to watch. Also, Marcus Walden.

http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ym ... b&sid=milb

[flatjacket1]

Was that this year?

It was 2012 but I don't remember hearing it has been fixed. It's been notoriously juiced ever since Syndergaard hit triple digits.

Interesting indeed, but I guess to get 7K over 4IP, Norris had to be in the low 90s at a minimum.

Velocity means very little in baseball. Having it helps but you can throw 100 and suck or throw 85 and kick butt. Mixing speeds, framing/calling behind the plate, confidence, and/or having a dominant pitch that day is what strikes guys out. Considering he only had 2 fly balls and 1 line drive through 4 IP it seems they weren't able to square up his stuff.

Sure you probably think I'm crazy for saying velocity means very little, and want to call up all type of names like Verlander and Pineda, but velocity is a great add on, not a foundation. If you throw with great movement at 95 MPH, you'll obviously get a lot of K's. If you throw 85 MPH with great movement, you are still a good pitcher. At this level (MLB) anybody can turn around a straight as an arrow 100 MPH fastball. Don't believe me? Justin Verlander allowed 8 ER in his last start, over only 2.2 innings.

Some days pitchers come in and they find one of their pitches to be nasty. Sometimes a 4 seamer will dance and a 2 seamer will look like a slider but cutting inside to righties (RHP). Pitchers catch on early and stick to whats working. Pitching is really just making do with what you have.

[dagger]

It was 2012 but I don't remember hearing it has been fixed. It's been notoriously juiced ever since Syndergaard hit triple digits.

Interesting indeed, but I guess to get 7K over 4IP, Norris had to be in the low 90s at a minimum.

Velocity means very little in baseball. Having it helps but you can throw 100 and suck or throw 85 and kick butt. Mixing speeds, framing/calling behind the plate, confidence, and/or having a dominant pitch that day is what strikes guys out. Considering he only had 2 fly balls and 1 line drive through 4 IP it seems they weren't able to square up his stuff.

Sure you probably think I'm crazy for saying velocity means very little, and want to call up all type of names like Verlander and Pineda, but velocity is a great add on, not a foundation. If you throw with great movement at 95 MPH, you'll obviously get a lot of K's. If you throw 85 MPH with great movement, you are still a good pitcher. At this level (MLB) anybody can turn around a straight as an arrow 100 MPH fastball. Don't believe me? Justin Verlander allowed 8 ER in his last start, over only 2.2 innings.

Some days pitchers come in and they find one of their pitches to be nasty. Sometimes a 4 seamer will dance and a 2 seamer will look like a slider but cutting inside to righties (RHP). Pitchers catch on early and stick to whats working. Pitching is really just making do with what you have.

i agree, we tend to obsess about velocity, in part because with prospects, pre-draft or in their first couple of years, speed is what stands out. The mastery of variables speeds, and location, tends to develop over time. I'm reasonably comfortable in believing that Norris, with his lack of success until recently, is showing good velocity with a little better location because it would be hard to master the nuances you speak of from one game to the next and this was really just his second good game (in succession) of this season.

But I am general agreement, and point to guys I have made a policy to follow who have been essentially ignored by most on this board precisely because they didn't have overwhelming stuff. Guile, consistency, confidence, smarts, are factors that aren't easily measured on a speed gun, and tend not to get you on Baseball America's Top 100 list. But then look at a guy like Sean Nolin who does nothing but win, win, win, moves up a level and wins again, and does it by attacking hitters, commanding corners and keeping them off balance with a variety of pitches. (Being a LHP hasn't hurt). I'd guess that 90% of the people here who assiduously follow our prospects still don't believe Nolin will amount to anything at the major league level, and they may be right, but it's fun watching an off-the-radar guy force his way into the discussion, with AA even suggesting he'll get to the Jays for at least a trial start very soon.

[Graham's Cracker]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

Sent from my LG-P880g using RealGM Forums mobile app

The Lansing gun is so juiced. One of my friends that was a high-80's pitcher hit 94-96 on Lansing gun, and his parents called him right after the game because they heard and he said everybody experienced a velocity jump on the parks gun.

I read (I think Gerry McDonald) say that the Jays integrated the guns with Pitchfx at all affiliate parks this year but I know the Lansing gun is inaccurate as confirmed by numerous sources.

[Graham's Cracker]

If Gustavo Pierre could take an occasional (and I mean occasional) walk and play better D we might have something there. He's batting 270 with a slg of 467 but he has a K:BB of the 0:39 and 14 errors in 31 games with an .811 fielding pct.

[dagger]

If Gustavo Pierre could take an occasional (and I mean occasional) walk and play better D we might have something there. He's batting 270 with a slg of 467 but he has a K:BB of the 0:39 and 14 errors in 31 games with an .811 fielding pct.

I don't know, we have a catcher with two walks for the season and a K:BB almost as bad, with a .240 OBP and he hit cleanup yesterday for the Jays. The errors are another matter.

[turtle_15]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

Sent from my LG-P880g using RealGM Forums mobile app

Do you know or anyone else know what was the velocity on Justin Jackson's fastball, and also what types of pitches he has???

[Graham's Cracker]

Norris was hitting 97-98 on the gun last night. Justin Jackson worked another scoreless inning but gave up two baserunners.

Sent from my LG-P880g using RealGM Forums mobile app

Do you know or anyone else know what was the velocity on Justin Jackson's fastball, and also what types of pitches he has???

The Lansing play-by-play man said he was touching the low 90's. As discussed earlier, the radar gun is notoriously inaccurate. Over at Battersbox there was a good scouting report of his repertoire by someone that goes to the games in Lansing. He's obviously a major project.