The Lebron Thread (Pt. 2)

therealbig3 · Post #1361 » by **therealbig3** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:04 am

LeBron in this series:

28.4 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 5.4 apg, 2.8 TOpg, 60.1% TS

LeBron last year against the Pacers:

30.0 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 6.2 apg, 2.8 TOpg, 55.7% TS

LeBron has sacrificed volume for efficiency, but has overall probably been playing at a higher level, especially when you consider the difference defensively between Indiana last year and this year. And especially when you consider the fact that Wade has been largely useless throughout this series, while he at least showed up in the last 3 games in 2012.

And Miami's offense last year against Indiana overall was +3.2. This year through the first 4 games, Miami's offense has been +17.6. LeBron's improvement offensively goes so far beyond the box score, he's leading a dominant offense without obviously dominating the stat sheet. It's incredible to watch.

TheChosen618 · Post #1362 » by **TheChosen618** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:09 am

therealbig3 wrote:LeBron has sacrificed volume for efficiency, but has overall probably been playing at a higher level, especially when you consider the difference defensively between Indiana last year and this year. And especially when you consider the fact that Wade has been largely useless throughout this series, while he at least showed up in the last 3 games in 2012..

You ignored how Bosh was out for last year's series while he is playing in this one.

Bosh hasn't been productive in this series, but he has been important in terms of spacing the floor and pulling Hibbert out of the paint. This obviously makes Lebron life and everybody else's life easier since they won't have to deal with Hibbert contesting and altering shots.

GSP · Post #1363 » by **GSP** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:19 am

Thats a good point TC618 plus they have Birdman and Ray hardly the same Heat team that faced the Pacers. I think Lebrons burts and explosions this year are unlike anything weve seen from him ITO control and iq.

therealbig3 · Post #1364 » by **therealbig3** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:23 am

TheChosen618 wrote:
therealbig3 wrote:LeBron has sacrificed volume for efficiency, but has overall probably been playing at a higher level, especially when you consider the difference defensively between Indiana last year and this year. And especially when you consider the fact that Wade has been largely useless throughout this series, while he at least showed up in the last 3 games in 2012..

You ignored how Bosh was out for last year's series while he is playing in this one.

Bosh hasn't been productive in this series, but he has been important in terms of spacing the floor and pulling Hibbert out of the paint. This obviously makes Lebron life and everybody else's life easier since they won't have to deal with Hibbert contesting and altering shots.

Bosh has been horrible in this series though. Haslem has severely outplayed him. I thought he was going to be a much bigger factor because of his spacing ability, but it's not just the fact that he's not scoring well (12.6 ppg on 57.2% TS...back to back 7-point performances), it's the fact that he's getting MANHANDLED on the boards, and he's not even playing good defense on West or Hibbert. His high for the series in rebounding is 5 rebounds! Averaging 3.6 rpg for the whole series! Hibbert is averaging 22.6 ppg and 10.8 rpg on 61.9% TS. This was one of the worst offensive centers in the league during the regular season. West is averaging 18.2 ppg and 8.4 rpg on 53.6% TS. Both of these guys have been extensively defended by Bosh in this series.

Whatever Bosh is providing offensively, he's been giving it back and then some on defense. When you're constantly giving up points, it affects your offense too.

LeBron clearly had better support around him in 2012 imo, if only because Wade was still a top 10 player. Current Wade doesn't even deserve to start, in all honesty.

therealbig3 · Post #1365 » by **therealbig3** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:27 am

And Ray Allen has played like crap against the Pacers, and he's constantly killing Miami's flow on offense.

Adding Birdman and Bosh doesn't make up for what they've lost in terms of Wade's decline, and how badly Bosh is getting destroyed, which is at the center of their struggles with Indiana.

TheChosen618 · Post #1366 » by **TheChosen618** » Fri May 31, 2013 7:31 am

therealbig3 wrote:LeBron clearly had better support around him in 2012 imo, if only because Wade was still a top 10 player. Current Wade doesn't even deserve to start, in all honesty.

He was getting better production from his teammates in 2012, but he clearly has more talented teammates now.

We are just talking about Lebron here, not the Miami Heat. The Heat are struggling as a whole because everyone has been bad and inconsistent except for Lebron James.

My point was that Bosh and all those role players presence (for spacing) are helping Lebron put up better numbers this season than last season. Bosh, Allen, Battier, and all of those shooters are struggling, but nevertheless the Pacers are not going to leave them open just because they have been missing more shots than usual. Plus, it's the Pacers gameplan to defend everybody 1 on 1 and to stay at home on the shooters and that's probably the biggest reason for their struggles and Lebron's success too.

You can say Lebron's series vs. the Pacers this year was better than last, but his overall playoffs have been better last season than this season.

Dupp · Post #1367 » by **Dupp** » Fri May 31, 2013 9:53 am

Lebron took over today. His defense is so good, i'd say he's comfortably better than George in that area. Dont think he gets enough credit for how good his playoff defense.

Mutnt · Post #1368 » by **Mutnt** » Fri May 31, 2013 11:09 am

LikeABosh wrote:Huh? This is nonsensical considering Joel played significant minutes against Indy last year and rebounded better than Bosh currently is

Last year isn't this year. Indiana is better this year individually and collectively and Joel is most likely worse than last year since he's been glued to the bench since the start of the season.

JordansBulls · Post #1369 » by **JordansBulls** » Fri May 31, 2013 12:00 pm

If Indy wins Game 6, then in game 7 what they should do is always have 2 guys on Lebron. Maybe not from the beginning of the game by after half time if the game is close that way it would be difficult for Miami to adjust.

SideshowBob · Post #1370 » by **SideshowBob** » Fri May 31, 2013 2:19 pm

therealbig3 wrote:And Miami's offense last year against Indiana overall was +3.2. This year through the first 4 games, Miami's offense has been +17.6.

Make that +15.7 through 5 games now, and their first positive defensive performance of the series (though Indy's offense had a lot to do with that).

LeBron's improvement offensively goes so far beyond the box score, he's leading a dominant offense without obviously dominating the stat sheet. It's incredible to watch.

Yeah, that's what I've been trying to get at for a while now. Their offense has been +11.4 (+10.2 if we go by BBR's counted possessions instead of formula estimate) in the PS so far, and +13.4 in the last two rounds. That's Bird/Magic territory, and Nash territory in the SF and CF, and that's with relatively underwhelming overall support (the Pacers' defense deserves credit here). I mean, I thought Wade was key to powering their 2nd half RS offensive explosion, but they're maintaining a higher level than that with him playing pretty poorly by his 2013 RS standard.

colts18 · Post #1371 » by **colts18** » Fri May 31, 2013 2:23 pm

With LeBron the Heat are 115.4 O rating (+15.6) vs the Pacers. That's Steve Nash like on offense. They have a 52.4 eFG% which is +7.1 eFG% above the Pacers league leading mark

LikeABosh · Post #1372 » by **LikeABosh** » Fri May 31, 2013 3:47 pm

Mutnt wrote:
LikeABosh wrote:Huh? This is nonsensical considering Joel played significant minutes against Indy last year and rebounded better than Bosh currently is

Last year isn't this year. Indiana is better this year individually and collectively and Joel is most likely worse than last year since he's been glued to the bench since the start of the season.

Joel is going to get tired because he's been resting all year long and because Indy got better as a team....okay, man. I'll end the conversation here

GetItDone · Post #1373 » by **GetItDone** » Fri May 31, 2013 3:50 pm

JordansBulls wrote:If Indy wins Game 6, then in game 7 what they should do is always have 2 guys on Lebron. Maybe not from the beginning of the game by after half time if the game is close that way it would be difficult for Miami to adjust.

Doubling LeBron is the dumbest thing a team can do.

One of LeBron's best skills is finding the open man.

JulesWinnfield · Post #1374 » by **JulesWinnfield** » Fri May 31, 2013 3:59 pm

Don't want to make too much of this, but ever since Lebron turned the left ankle late in the 3rd quarter of game 4 his attack has been more perimeter oriented than it has basically been all season. Good thing they've been falling though. Also, when he had the open breakaway dunk yesterday he elected to jump off his right leg. Be nice for Miami to close this in 6 and get the extra rest heading into the finals just in case this is even a minor issue

If Lebron wins this title, history will do these events a major disservice if the name power of Wade and Bosh lead people to believe this was some awesome supporting cast. He is carrying these guys right now

orangeparka · Post #1375 » by **orangeparka** » Fri May 31, 2013 4:41 pm

Loved Bron's game in the second half. He stayed aggressive and really carried the team.

Even in the fourth, when he wasn't shooting so well. His aggressiveness really opened things up for the team and secured the win.

I'll take one of those games over a passive, 60% FG game anyday.

sp6r=underrated · Post #1376 » by **sp6r=underrated** » Fri May 31, 2013 4:49 pm

He is so far above the rest of his generation that it is frightening. Lebron generates significant open shots for teammates simply because the defense has no choice but to collapse on him due to his athleticism and now solid jumper.

E-Balla · Post #1377 » by **E-Balla** » Fri May 31, 2013 5:04 pm

sp6r=underrated wrote:He is so far above the rest of his generation that it is frightening. Lebron generates significant open shots for teammates simply because the defense has no choice but to collapse on him due to his athleticism and now solid jumper.

It's frightening because he might be the last legendary player for awhile...

JordansBulls · Post #1378 » by **JordansBulls** » Fri May 31, 2013 5:55 pm

GetItDone wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:If Indy wins Game 6, then in game 7 what they should do is always have 2 guys on Lebron. Maybe not from the beginning of the game by after half time if the game is close that way it would be difficult for Miami to adjust.

Doubling LeBron is the dumbest thing a team can do.

One of LeBron's best skills is finding the open man.

Wouldn't you rather his teammates shoot than give Lebron whatever?

TheChosen618 · Post #1379 » by **TheChosen618** » Fri May 31, 2013 5:57 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
GetItDone wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:If Indy wins Game 6, then in game 7 what they should do is always have 2 guys on Lebron. Maybe not from the beginning of the game by after half time if the game is close that way it would be difficult for Miami to adjust.

Doubling LeBron is the dumbest thing a team can do.

One of LeBron's best skills is finding the open man.

Wouldn't you rather his teammates shoot than give Lebron whatever?

Seeing that he is surrounded by shooters, probably not.

The choices are playing Lebron 1 on 1 and have him beat you himself or doubling him and having his shooters get open looks and beat you.

Pacers have decided to go with the first one, similar to what they did with Melo and the Knicks.

It's a tough gamble on either side against the Heat though because they have great shooters everywhere and Lebron is unstoppable 1 on 1.

Dr Positivity · Post #1380 » by **Dr Positivity** » Fri May 31, 2013 6:14 pm

JulesWinnfield wrote:Don't want to make too much of this, but ever since Lebron turned the left ankle late in the 3rd quarter of game 4 his attack has been more perimeter oriented than it has basically been all season. Good thing they've been falling though. Also, when he had the open breakaway dunk yesterday he elected to jump off his right leg. Be nice for Miami to close this in 6 and get the extra rest heading into the finals just in case this is even a minor issue

If Lebron wins this title, history will do these events a major disservice if the name power of Wade and Bosh lead people to believe this was some awesome supporting cast. He is carrying these guys right now

Lebron beating the Spurs if the team remains this centric reliant on him, would be amazing and underappreciated forever. Lebron against the Spurs looks like it's going to be the elephant trying to survive with 8 cougars hanging off him.

I have no idea what the Heat are going to do after 13-14. They'll be in a situation where keeping all of Lebron, Wade and Bosh would take a massive financial commitment because of the repeater luxury tax. If you're Lebron, is it really appealing to play on a Heat team after eg. they cut Bosh loose, leaving just old broken down Wade and role players? Or do the Heat keep Bosh and make the hard decision by pulling the plug on Wade instead? I think that's the better decision but not the sentimental one. Really starting to think Cleveland is a threat next summer.