Big Al's Paint: The Al Jefferson Thread

[Logander]

Also, Jefferson has never played with a good back court when he was with the Jazz. Really Mo Williams? Devin Harris?

If you gave the Jazz our backcourt players last season they would of been really dangerous. Kemba, Hendo, and MKG all probably start for that Jazz team....

Gordon Hayward isn't bad at all. I'd put him on the same level as Hendo when all factors are included. Probably better when I think about it.

[JMAC3]

@ Logander

Do you like any moves this team does? You and Jdm3 need to just go have a Bobcat hate party.... Its getting annoying reading your guys negativity every three posts. Its okay if you do not like the move, but there is no need to repeat the same basic idea 3 times per hour in every thread...

Also, were you even around for the last 3 years? How many games have you watched over that time? Seems like you just showed up and seem to be the expert over everybody else....

[Logander]

@ Logander

Do you like any moves this team does? You and Jdm3 need to just go have a Bobcat hate party.... Its getting annoying reading your guys negativity every three posts. Its okay if you do not like the move, but there is no need to repeat the same basic idea 3 times per hour in every thread...

Also, were you even around for the last 3 years? How many games have you watched over that time? Seems like you just showed up and seem to be the expert over everybody else....

In no way have I said I was an expert, I have a different viewpoint than you do. I have been watching Bobcat games the last 3 years, and all because I just recently decided to join a forum doesn't mean I am any less knowledgeable than someone who has been on here for longer. You sound silly man.

Edit: For the record I have been 100% on the Zeller train since we drafted him and honestly think hes going to be one of the best out of that draft class. I loved the Kemba and MKG signing as well. So to answer your first question I do like moves this team does.

[JMAC3]

@ Logander

Do you like any moves this team does? You and Jdm3 need to just go have a Bobcat hate party.... Its getting annoying reading your guys negativity every three posts. Its okay if you do not like the move, but there is no need to repeat the same basic idea 3 times per hour in every thread...

Also, were you even around for the last 3 years? How many games have you watched over that time? Seems like you just showed up and seem to be the expert over everybody else....

In no way have I said I was an expert, I have a different viewpoint than you do. I have been watching Bobcat games the last 3 years, and all because I just recently decided to join a forum doesn't mean I am any less knowledgeable than someone who has been on here for longer. You sound silly man.

Edit: For the record I have been 100% on the Zeller train since we drafted him and honestly think hes going to be one of the best out of that draft class. I loved the Kemba and MKG signing as well. So to answer your first question I do like moves this team does.

I am not saying that you are not knowledgeable, but we have been around the block on the forum longer, heard more ideas and debated about this team for longer. Clearly we have been more invested over the last three years and have been through the hard times. When you have seen the last three years up close and personal, you understand that tanking guarantees nothing and when you are given a chance to add an allstar type talent you take it and make it work.

[Logander]

@ Logander

Do you like any moves this team does? You and Jdm3 need to just go have a Bobcat hate party.... Its getting annoying reading your guys negativity every three posts. Its okay if you do not like the move, but there is no need to repeat the same basic idea 3 times per hour in every thread...

Also, were you even around for the last 3 years? How many games have you watched over that time? Seems like you just showed up and seem to be the expert over everybody else....

In no way have I said I was an expert, I have a different viewpoint than you do. I have been watching Bobcat games the last 3 years, and all because I just recently decided to join a forum doesn't mean I am any less knowledgeable than someone who has been on here for longer. You sound silly man.

Edit: For the record I have been 100% on the Zeller train since we drafted him and honestly think hes going to be one of the best out of that draft class. I loved the Kemba and MKG signing as well. So to answer your first question I do like moves this team does.

I am not saying that you are not knowledgeable, but we have been around the block on the forum longer, heard more ideas and debated about this team for longer. Clearly we have been more invested over the last three years and have been through the hard times. When you have seen the last three years up close and personal, you understand that tanking guarantees nothing and when you are given a chance to add an allstar type talent you take it and make it work.

I can respect that for sure. But what you aren't understanding is I have had the same conversations ya'll are having now with a good group of guys,(we do fantasy basketball and football together), Go to as many games as we can so I've been there through the rough times. What I was saying just because I wasn't on this forum website doesn't mean I haven't invested as much time as another person whose been here longer, that's like saying you're a better Christian/Catholic than I am because you go to church more than me. Granted I am in no way saying that I know more than anyone else either. I am very passionate about this team and always will be. I realize I am probably sounding like a broken record though with the complaining and I apologize, I just want to see this team succeed and I just have a different approach when it comes specifically to this year and how this year will determine our future success. I love debating people though so that's why I've been all over the place today especially.

[vorbis]

personally i think we can do without the 'fanhood' litmus tests here. anybody who has followed the bobcats at all can safely be assumed to be legitimately involved. it's not like they've had success to draw bandwagoners. so long as there is productive discussion and airing of opinions, i feel like disagreement and emotions are fair game and as much a part of this as anything else.

[fatlever]

i saw the news on twitter when i was at my moms house. at first i saw "bobcats sign jefferson for 41 mil" and i got all excited. then i saw it was for 3 years instead of 4 and i got less excited.

i am on the fence about this move.

pros
1) when you have a chance to sign a legitimate big man as a bad small market team, you have to consider it
2) fills a huge need
3) 3 year deal is good idea
4) bobcats have to improve their image around the league
5) paying fans deserve to have a watchable product on the floor
6) should help the development of our young bigs
7) will take a ton of pressure off kemba and help him in pick and roll

cons
1) has never proven to translate what he does to wins
2) too much money
3) probably lowers our chances of landing one of the top 5 picks in the draft next year

what does this move say about al jefferson? here is a guy who has spent his entire career playing on bad to mediocre non-playoff teams. he has only made the playoffs twice in his 9 year career. has only made it out of the 1st round, once (and was not a starter on that team). he is 28 and entering what should be the last few years of his prime. he has made 72 million in his career. considering all the things above he still chooses to sign with the 2nd worst team in the league, most likely, only because that team offered the most money. he didnt even wait to see what happened with howard to make his decision. i understand that turning down millions of dollars is hard to do, even when you are already filthy rich, but doesnt jefferson have a burning internal desire to compete at the highest level, in the playoffs, while he is still in him prime? i just really have to question his heart and desire to compete based on this decision.

dont get me wrong, i also hate the ring chasers who think they are too good to play for anyone other than a contender. perhaps al likes the challenge of finally leading a bad team to the playoffs. but, i really think that when you have been in the league for 9 years and never really had a chance to compete in the playoffs on a good team you owe it to yourself to give yourself that opportunity while you are still in your prime.

[fatlever]

personally i think we can do without the 'fanhood' litmus tests here. anybody who has followed the bobcats at all can safely be assumed to be legitimately involved. it's not like they've had success to draw bandwagoners. so long as there is productive discussion and airing of opinions, i feel like disagreement and emotions are fair game and as much a part of this as anything else.

great post vorbis. thank you.

honestly, i dont see how any of us can really have a strong opinion about this one way or the other just yet, because as i just pointed out there are pros and cons on both sides and we have no idea where this move will lead.

[therebirth]

I remember how a bunch of you guys were calling indiana a threadmill team. Well their young players improve and they ended up in the EC finals. So what we don't draft a franchise player in the draft. Few teams get the chance to do that. We have been horrible the past two years and didn't get lucky. But we do have a bunch of assets... draft picks and expiring contracts. This is not like before when you have large contracts with players past their prime. Cats can be like memphis or indiana.

[bballin76]

I like the move and plan on going to more games this season because of it.

I've been a lifelong Sixers fan but started going to bobcats games after I moved here last year and have taken an interest in them. Plus MJ is the GOAT.

I like Zeller as a solid third big off the bench role player that was missing last year and Byombo and Jefferson will make the front court halfway decent on D and decent on O.

But all the lotto and tanking worries should end, this team even with Jefferson will not make the playoffs.

The signing isn't a bad one at all, if you want to talk about mediocrity treadmills look at Philly until Hinkie came in.

Cheer up guys.

[TommyTBolt]

i saw the news on twitter when i was at my moms house. at first i saw "bobcats sign jefferson for 41 mil" and i got all excited. then i saw it was for 3 years instead of 4 and i got less excited.

i am on the fence about this move.

pros
1) when you have a chance to sign a legitimate big man as a bad small market team, you have to consider it
2) fills a huge need
3) 3 year deal is good idea
4) bobcats have to improve their image around the league
5) paying fans deserve to have a watchable product on the floor
6) should help the development of our young bigs
7) will take a ton of pressure off kemba and help him in pick and roll

cons
1) has never proven to translate what he does to wins
2) too much money
3) probably lowers our chances of landing one of the top 5 picks in the draft next year

what does this move say about al jefferson? here is a guy who has spent his entire career playing on bad to mediocre non-playoff teams. he has only made the playoffs twice in his 9 year career. has only made it out of the 1st round, once (and was not a starter on that team). he is 28 and entering what should be the last few years of his prime. he has made 72 million in his career. considering all the things above he still chooses to sign with the 2nd worst team in the league, most likely, only because that team offered the most money. he didnt even wait to see what happened with howard to make his decision. i understand that turning down millions of dollars is hard to do, even when you are already filthy rich, but doesnt jefferson have a burning internal desire to compete at the highest level, in the playoffs, while he is still in him prime? i just really have to question his heart and desire to compete based on this decision.

dont get me wrong, i also hate the ring chasers who think they are too good to play for anyone other than a contender. perhaps al likes the challenge of finally leading a bad team to the playoffs. but, i really think that when you have been in the league for 9 years and never really had a chance to compete in the playoffs on a good team you owe it to yourself to give yourself that opportunity while you are still in your prime.

i like your list of pros and cons and it was a quick way to sum up what i tried to say in a long winded post.

On the cons i would only like to point out that you can't predict next years lotto and/or who will be bust or all stars right now we haven't seen enough of these guys yet and like someone else listed a bunch of 6-11 guys that seems worst case scenerio and you can find good talent there especially in a great draft class. He didnt go back to the Lebron/Carmelo/Wade/Bosh draft but thats a good example of what we could see next year where the 4/5 players in the draft are franchise cornerstones which is why I think Bobcats made a good move here. The years when its a loaded draft are the years where the number of your pick doesn't matter as much whether your no.1 or no.10 but in slim years like this year it was better to be higher because its more roleplayers with very few stars. If the Bobcats miss the playoffs next year they should have a good pick and be able to help the team with a young talent and if they make the playoffs that means Kemba/MKG really became players and Jefferson performed up to expectations which means the team is coming together and the young talent is developing. Personally I think Charlotte did real well to put themselves in a good spot next year.

[TommyTBolt]

I like the move and plan on going to more games this season because of it.

I've been a lifelong Sixers fan but started going to bobcats games after I moved here last year and have taken an interest in them. Plus MJ is the GOAT.

I like Zeller as a solid third big off the bench role player that was missing last year and Byombo and Jefferson will make the front court halfway decent on D and decent on O.

But all the lotto and tanking worries should end, this team even with Jefferson will not make the playoffs.

The signing isn't a bad one at all, if you want to talk about mediocrity treadmills look at Philly until Hinkie came in.

Cheer up guys.

This guy I love as a Knicks fan but bobcats no. 2 I sympathize alot. Again no disrespect by being a Knicks fan I got more respect for true hardcore Bobcats fan like you guys than any fanbase but as a former Charlottean I adopted the Cats as my no. 2 team. I went to a few games and now im in Raleigh not making enough money to ever splurge on an NBA game (sad i know) but if I was still in Charlotte I would definitely be more interested in going to some Cat's games this year because of this guy at least I feel I would be entertained.

Also while I'm at it because I'm new to this board when I first moved to NC at 11/12 in Raleigh in Parks and Rec basketball I remember our jerseys were reversible teal and purple and we got Hornets training cards with Morning, LJ, Mugsy, ect. I wanted to congratulate you guys on the Hornets rebrand and I can't wait I think its great for Charlotte, North Carolina, and the NBA. I hope this move works out for you guys as true Charlotte diehards and can't wait to see a competitive and respectable team in Charlotte again!

[TommyTBolt]

I remember how a bunch of you guys were calling indiana a threadmill team. Well their young players improve and they ended up in the EC finals. So what we don't draft a franchise player in the draft. Few teams get the chance to do that. We have been horrible the past two years and didn't get lucky. But we do have a bunch of assets... draft picks and expiring contracts. This is not like before when you have large contracts with players past their prime. Cats can be like memphis or indiana.

Great comparison man. Not every team lucks into Durant or Rose like OKC or Chicago (big market too). There is nothing wrong with building a team like Memphis or Indiana has. Be shrewed in trades, get the decent free agents you can, and draft the best guy you can or trade well no matter where you are in the draft. I hate the idea of tanking, especially for a team that set the winning percentage record two years ago. Enough is enough and just make smart moves to keep improving the team and go as far as you can like Indiana has and everybody wins. The fans, the players, the coaches, the management. We all know North Carolina is a basketball state and if this team can compete and play hard and respectable against the Miamis of the world like Indiana even if they come up short because they didnt tank and get lucky or aren't big market and cant get Lebron or whatever I'm sure we will all be proud of the team and enjoy the hell out of the run they have. I'm personally tired of seeing such bad basketball in a city/state with the basketball heritage that runs here in NC.

[Diop]

cons
1) has never proven to translate what he does to wins

3) probably lowers our chances of landing one of the top 5 picks in the draft next year

Seen this written a lot, if he is so bad at getting wins, shouldn't we not have to worry about our draft pick?

[JMAC3]

Jazz won 43 game last year... 9th in the West. Would of been 7th in East and only 2 games behind 5th

Which team is better?

Mo Williams- Tinsley
Foye-Burkes
Hayward- Demarre Carroll
Millsap- Favors
Jefferson-Kanter

or

Kemba- Sessions
Hendo- Gordon
MKG- Taylor
Zeller- McBob
Jefferson- Biz

Take into account that Milsap, Favors, Big Al, and Kanter all cant play at the same time...

[James Gatz]

I would still say the Jazz. I'm optimistic about Zeller but there is still no guarantee he plays incredibly well his rookie year.

[Logander]

Jazz won 43 game last year... 9th in the West. Would of been 7th in East and only 2 games behind 5th

Which team is better?

Mo Williams- Tinsley
Foye-Burkes
Hayward- Demarre Carroll
Millsap- Favors
Jefferson-Kanter

or

Kemba- Sessions
Hendo- Gordon
MKG- Taylor
Zeller- McBob
Jefferson- Biz

Take into account that Milsap, Favors, Big Al, and Kanter all cant play at the same time...

I happen to think the Horncats look better because I really think Cody Zeller is going to be in contention for ROTY. Well see though.

[fatlever]

cons
1) has never proven to translate what he does to wins

3) probably lowers our chances of landing one of the top 5 picks in the draft next year

Seen this written a lot, if he is so bad at getting wins, shouldn't we not have to worry about our draft pick?

meaning he isnt good enough to lead a team to the playoffs as the best player, but also no doubt he will make us immediately better. so with jefferson perhaps we win 30-35 wins, w/out him perhaps 25-30.

[BeesWax]

Between this signing and drafting of Zeller I am much less likely to go out of my way to watch games this year. I loved watching last year because I could see the plan in action and watch the young guys grow. Now that there is not a plan in the works and not a team good enough to do damage, except to its own future, there is no reason to watch.

This has completely killed our chances at becoming anything more than a middle of the pack joke.

[-Ian-]

God, we don't want to be a middle-of-the-road team again. I just hope Cho would use Jefferson as a trading chip in the future.