Official Speculation Thread (Pt.LIX Offseason Edition)

[Blue_and_Whte]

they are both overpaid

The I guess mo Williams, devin Harris, Rodney stuckey, jeremy Lin, and goran dragic are all overpaid.



....it's market value for pg's in that tier (outside of Jeremy's ridiculously back loaded contract.)

IMO, Lin, Harris and Mo now are overpaid. I dont watch enough Stuckey to have an opinion on him

Well Jameer outplayed Moe, Lin, and Stuckey. Jameer and dragic were a wash if you're just comparing stats. IMO they're overpaid but that's market value right now.

[trebone]

So hold up. What exactly are you saying, We should have taken Iggy? Is this a joke?

YES, You should have taken Iggy. He was an expiring. We could have EASILY traded him to a contender for picks and an expiring at the deadline OR he would have been expired, off the books and playing elsewhere (we may have even been able to sign and trade him if the team he wanted was over cap).

Instead of that, we are all standing here holding our crotch, praying that we can get rid of Afflalo and Harringtons salary that is on the books for three and two more years.


Iggy isn't/wasn't good enough to make us win, he was a much more valuable asset.

Where has it been said that we had an option to get Iggy in the first place anyway?

[InFlames]

So hold up. What exactly are you saying, We should have taken Iggy? Is this a joke?

YES, You should have taken Iggy. He was an expiring. We could have EASILY traded him to a contender for picks and an expiring at the deadline OR he would have been expired, off the books and playing elsewhere (we may have even been able to sign and trade him if the team he wanted was over cap).

Instead of that, we are all standing here holding our crotch, praying that we can get rid of Afflalo and Harringtons salary that is on the books for three and two more years.


Iggy isn't/wasn't good enough to make us win, he was a much more valuable asset.

Harrington's next 2 years are partially guaranteed. He is just going to get cut. I find it interesting you say we are holding our crotch and praying to trade Afflalo.

[Neon1]

90% of this board is crying about how/when can we trade/cut Afflalo and Al. If you took Iggy, this wouldn't be an issue, We would be free and clear of him and the money. Iggy's money

We ADDED 10million dollars in salary for the next TWO years plus. How can you guys NOT see that?

[orlando1214]

Oh we're back to complaining about having to pay Harrington $3.5 million after he's cut? Seriously, some people act like that cripples the franchise. It's really not that big of a deal. Would it have been nice not to have it, sure, but we don't know what went down in trade talks, maybe they needed him to make it work, or maybe that was the only way Denver would do the trade. Point is, paying him a little bit after he's waived isn't a big deal.

As for Afflalo, of course the Magic will get value for him. I mean even if he just plays out his time here the Magic, they would still get value for him because he's a pretty good player and it's not like he's overpaid going off of some of the deals that have been given to players this offseason. Still though, I would not be shocked to see him traded.

Oh and as for the whole Dwight got us out of cap hell, not Henngian, that's such crap. Of course the Magic would have still been in cap hell if Dwight was here because they would be trying to win a championship, and the best route to take when he wanted to leave was to get a lot of cap room to rebuild. But that doesn't take away from what Hennigan did and has done since then. Dwight was the cause, Hennigan was the one who did it. He's made a ton of good moves and I have no clue why some of you are complaining so much over such little things. I don't even want to think about what this team would look like right now if Otis was still running it.

I'm so ready for some summer league though, because it seem like anytime there isn't basketball on, people go insane. Like everybody who is getting annoyed that the Magic haven't done anything in free agency yet. How dumb would it be to make a move just to make one, that's how bad deals are made. Then there are the people the complain about the same stuff over and over again, like Harrington's contract or Jameer's contract. I'm just ready to watch our summer league team with a ton of talented young players, all of which Henngian brought in, a few of which was because the Magic did the Dwight trade and took on Harrington's contract. The future is bright for this team, and paying Harrington $3.5 million next year isn't going to hurt that.

[Driguez]

I swear this board is **** bipolar.

[MagicTownBaller]

For those who think Nelson is overpaid, Calderon, age 31 coming off a season of 11.3 and 7.1, got 7 mil a year. Jameer, age 31, got 8.5, and averaged 14.7 and 7.

they are both overpaid

The I guess mo Williams, devin Harris, Rodney stuckey, jeremy Lin, and goran dragic are all overpaid.



....it's market value for pg's in that tier (outside of Jeremy's ridiculously back loaded contract.)

Again, I'm saying this, HE ONLY WOULD HAVE HAD A BACK LOADED DEAL IF HE WAS MATCHED BY THE KNICKS! If the Knicks matched, his contract would have been $5M, $5M, $15M. If the Knicks DIDN'T MATCH, his contract then goes to $8.3M per year!

[Driguez]

It's pretty ridiculous how many people in here seem to think they have ANY clue as to what Henny did or did not pursue.

Does it really surprise you? You've been a poster for a long time too, it doesn't surprise me one bit, we have a weird board w weird fans TBH lol

[Neon1]

Where has it been said that we had an option to get Iggy in the first place anyway?

Is this real life???????

LAL - Howard, Duhon and Clark
ORL - McBob, Eyenga and Bynum

ORL -Harkless, Vucevic, Igoadala (to Orlando)
PHI - Bynum (goes to Philly), Richardson

^^^Where do you see the need for Denver in this? Denver only came in because we wanted Afflalo, Harington and that 1st for Iggy.

[Darth Magic]

90% of this board is crying about how/when can we trade/cut Afflalo and Al. If you took Iggy, this wouldn't be an issue, We would be free and clear of him and the money. Iggy's money

We ADDED 10million dollars in salary for the next TWO years plus. How can you guys NOT see that?

I'm sitting here wondering how you don't see that this is horrible logic. Why on God's green earth would we trade for a player who leaves at the end of the year and we get nothing in return? Can't you see that's insane? We need ASSETS not cap space. I'm sure Denver would give an arm and a leg to have that trade back. We can move Afflalo for more assets including pure capspace young players or picks if we wish. We can cut Harrington or trade him if we wish. We already have a pick from the deal already. It's called flexibility. We didn't have that with the expiring contract of Iggy. It was either trade him at the deadline for what we could get or lose him for nothing cause we sure as he'll weren't gonna resign him. How can you not see this? Am I taking crazy pills?

[sportsrock37]

So hold up. What exactly are you saying, We should have taken Iggy? Is this a joke?

YES, You should have taken Iggy. He was an expiring. We could have EASILY traded him to a contender for picks and an expiring at the deadline OR he would have been expired, off the books and playing elsewhere (we may have even been able to sign and trade him if the team he wanted was over cap).

Instead of that, we are all standing here holding our crotch, praying that we can get rid of Afflalo and Harringtons salary that is on the books for three and two more years.


Iggy isn't/wasn't good enough to make us win, he was a much more valuable asset.

We aren't going to be players in free agency this year so what does having the cap space this year get us? Harrington is pretty much gone. Afflalo may not of worked out like Hennigan had imagined with Afflalo shooting his worst percentages last year as the #1 option, but he is on a much cheaper contract to try out then Iggy. We could flip him for something later on if we need to. If not, he's a good locker room guy, good role player, the younger guys look up to him. He's a hard worker. He's the type of guy you want your young guys to be around. Plus he allowed us to lose more games last year. Do you really think Iggy would have "been injured" at the end of last year in a contract year? If we had Iggy, we may not have flipped JJ for Harris. We were able to make that trade cause Afflalo was still on contract for next year.

[Noonskadoodle]

Henny has been as great as we could hope for.

All you have to do is go to the GB & there seems to always be a thread about us & how Henny has done a GREAT job & a ton of fans wishing they had him as GM.

We will just go back to Otis then, he sure liked to make some noise & stay in the headlines....

[Driguez]

I always get a kick of recliner GMs.

[Deezy]

Go back and revisit the trade. Nearly everyone was questioning why we were only able to get AA/Harrington/pick for Iggy. That was horrible value then and the fact that AA has yet to net us a valuable piece, plus the inevitable that we'll have to buy Harrington out...yeah, that's where the skepticism comes into play.

[orlando1214]

Where has it been said that we had an option to get Iggy in the first place anyway?

Is this real life???????

LAL - Howard, Duhon and Clark
ORL - McBob, Eyenga and Bynum

ORL -Harkless, Vucevic, Igoadala (to Orlando)
PHI - Bynum (goes to Philly), Richardson

^^^Where do you see the need for Denver in this? Denver only came in because we wanted Afflalo, Harington and that 1st for Iggy.

First, the Magic also got 2 draft picks from Denver, you keep leaving that out. More than anything that is what a rebuilding team needs. Also, if we're going to play the hypothetical game and say we got Iggy instead, I'd say there would have been a very good chance the Magic would have gotten a worse draft pick this year. Also, who knows what the Magic might one day get for Afflalo. I get that a little more salary cap is nice, but we have no clue how things are going to pan out with the assets the Magic got from Denver. The Magic also would have got absolutely nothing for Iggy as well, if things played out the same way as they did for Denver, and I think that would have been pretty crappy.

And also, maybe, just maybe, there was more of a reason Denver was involved than just the fact that the Magic wanted draft picks. The thing is we will never know because we weren't there listening to the trade talks. You make it sound like that trade was so simple, that it could have just been done that way because that's your opinion. Well we don't know that and I think it's silly to get annoyed at Hennigan or the deal because of that because we simply don't know.

[Def Swami]

Neon1 is right that the Magic specifically targeted Afflalo and Harrington; we easily could have taken Andre Iguodala, who would have expired or could have been traded at the deadline. I speculate that our FO didn't really care about salary complications as much as getting two locker room guys to help develop the right culture in our franchise that would set the tone for young players. And I'm okay with that. I'm reserving judgement on this particular part of the transaction until Afflalo is traded to see the return we get for him.

Otherwise, I have no quarrels with Hennigan and his team so far. I'm not sure I follow the whole "proactive" debate. I'm not sure how one could really judge that without knowing what deals are proposed and not proposed. NBA trades are pretty difficult to pull off and we completed 2 last season, and won both in a landslide. I'd say he's doing fine so far. We got rid of J-Rich and Duhon. And where I think Hennigan and co. have shined the most is in scouting. I thought acquiring Vucevic was good, but acquiring Tobias made me a believer.

[silent1900]

I also think those of you that are praising Hennigan are doing so from the perspective of comparing him to our esteemed GM legacy of Otis and Weisbrod...OF COURSE he is TONS better than those guys.

But you need to compare him to his competitor/peers...the other current GMs in the league. Hennigan did not start with a bare cupboard...he had a ton of assets to work with to get us to this point, and the question is: has he done more with those assets than his peers would have?

My answer to that is, no, not really. It is pure guesswork, absolutely, no doubt about it. But I see only one deal (JJ for Tobes) that he has made that the average GM would not have pulled off. The rest have been either at or below par to what I imagine the more competent GMs in the league would have done (c'mon...ANY GM...well, except Kupchak... would have walked away with nice assets for Dwight...and probably some picks that were actually worth something).

As far as drafting goes, I think he locks in on 'his guys' too rigidly and doesn't react well to the ever-changing environment of draft night. Do I have proof of that? Nope. But it is certainly the vibe that I get.

[Deezy]

No one is saying Hennigan sucks or that we'd rather have another GM. Some of us are just not willing to kiss the ground that he walks on prior to sending unjust praise his way. He did nothing to set us up cap wise; had we stood pat, we'd still be players in upcoming free agencies.

[Neon1]

Harrington's next 2 years are partially guaranteed. He is just going to get cut. I find it interesting you say we are holding our crotch and praying to trade Afflalo.

Look you guys, nobody is saying Henny sucks so far or has done a bad job, but to act as if there hasn't been a single misstep in his learning is just burying your head in the sand.


Harrington is a partial at 3.5 and 3.8 million, and Afflalo is making 7.75.

$7,750,000 - $7,750,000 - $7,937,500
$3,574,300 - $3,804,900

We took on:
+$11,324,300 '13-'14 offseason (right now)
+$11,554,900 '14-'15 next offseason
+ $7,937,500 '15-'16 offseason

This is cap space we gave away just to have Afflalo and a late 1st rounder. We gave away so potentially HUGE cap space that we should be ready to use in a year or two.

[sportsrock37]

Go back and revisit the trade. Nearly everyone was questioning why we were only able to get AA/Harrington/pick for Iggy. That was horrible value then and the fact that AA has yet to net us a valuable piece, plus the inevitable that we'll have to buy Harrington out...yeah, that's where the skepticism comes into play.

Why do we have to net a valuable piece for Afflalo already? The rebuild isn't over, we don't have to turn all of our assets into something else immediately. We are still planning on sucking next year.