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BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani

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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4981 » by JustaKnickFan » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:18 am

ezmoney707 wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:
ezmoney707 wrote:Ginobli is not the rule he is the exception.

Chalmers found himself in a good situation. Chalmers drafted to the Kings would be fighting for his career.

The Spurs and the Heat have had plenty of 2nd rounders that didn't stick or were traded.

I we are going to commend these teams for their commitment for looking for late round talent, why not give the Knicks credit in its current regime for looking for gems overseas or undrafted players that can contribute.

There are many ways to skin a cat. Picking up cheap players in free agency and trade is more reliable successful way to get contributing players than hoping for 2nd picks to stick.

You kinda lost me with this.

The Spurs are where they are because they value all their assets, they have decades of history in such.

Miami is an expansion team and has more rings than the "storied" franchise and they have done it through solid trades, free agency and the draft, and if you're gonna lose...lose hard.

We had a 100 page draft thread....why? because we know the team needs help and the draft is one method of such.

I know this thread is severely OT at this point, and maybe thats good as it takes away from the topic which most dont approve of.

Like I had said previously it's been a while for a trade that most dont like at all.

But at the end of the day think about what your arguing now. We were terrible for years because of poor management. We have been digging ourselves out of holes for years.
When we get ahead of the 8 ball we take a step back in some capacity.

With this current team it's downfall has been the contract of Amare and his health. It forces your hand to go all in or sit back without any improvement or drastic measure blow it up. We have to give up these picks because we have a man making 20 million dollars that can't contribute.

Should we have use our amnesty on Amare instead of Billups yeah probably, but it's all hindsight.

If Bargs plays to his potential those picks will look like cupcakes. We have to take risk with our position.

Right now you're going with Bryan Colangelo logic.

For 7 years, Toronto has tried to get Bargs to play to his potential, and he's only gotten worse.

Anyway, I'm done arguing for today. All I'm saying is that, you guys need to actually watch Bargs in real games and not in highlights, or talk to Raptors fans who have. He's not that good, and this potential is a load of BS that Bryan Colangelo lost his job because of.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4982 » by kNicksGmen » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:21 am

no idea why some posters on here are spending so much time and energy to convince others that bargs sucks... we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. regardless i don't get the motive behind having 50+ posts in here all saying the same thing over and over.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4983 » by Thugger HBC » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:21 am

ezmoney707 wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:
ezmoney707 wrote:Ginobli is not the rule he is the exception.

Chalmers found himself in a good situation. Chalmers drafted to the Kings would be fighting for his career.

The Spurs and the Heat have had plenty of 2nd rounders that didn't stick or were traded.

I we are going to commend these teams for their commitment for looking for late round talent, why not give the Knicks credit in its current regime for looking for gems overseas or undrafted players that can contribute.

There are many ways to skin a cat. Picking up cheap players in free agency and trade is more reliable successful way to get contributing players than hoping for 2nd picks to stick.

You kinda lost me with this.

The Spurs are where they are because they value all their assets, they have decades of history in such.

Miami is an expansion team and has more rings than the "storied" franchise and they have done it through solid trades, free agency and the draft, and if you're gonna lose...lose hard.

We had a 100 page draft thread....why? because we know the team needs help and the draft is one method of such.

I know this thread is severely OT at this point, and maybe thats good as it takes away from the topic which most dont approve of.

Like I had said previously it's been a while for a trade that most dont like at all.

But at the end of the day think about what your arguing now. We were terrible for years because of poor management. We have been digging ourselves out of holes for years.
When we get ahead of the 8 ball we take a step back in some capacity.

With this current team it's downfall has been the contract of Amare and his health. It forces your hand to go all in or sit back without any improvement or drastic measure blow it up. We have to give up these picks because we have a man making 20 million dollars that can't contribute.

Should we have use our amnesty on Amare instead of Billups yeah probably, but it's all hindsight.

If Bargs plays to his potential those picks will look like cupcakes. We have to take risk with our position.

I still think it's part of terrible management....kinda how like some feel about JR, is i guess how i feel about bargnani.

I dont think I've ever been adamant of a Knicks acquisition i flat out dont like at all, under any circumstance.

The picks have never been my debate, it's on my dessert plate...i dont like the main course.

i could take the rationale of well it was for Novak and Camby, but i have no positive regard for them either.

I was sour on Camby since training camp and Novak from last season, but did view him as a tradeable piece, as team need three point shooters.

I just do not see the team improving with Bargnani...i vision the team elevating him to 2nd option and that would make the team worse on both ends of the court.

I'd rather eat the crow, but check my history I'm rarely wrong about player related items....but would be glad to be wrong here.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4984 » by ORANGEandBLUE » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:23 am

StephNYKurry wrote:

There isn't anyone out there with this potential. Guys who can get 30+ on a night don't get acquired for scraps and that's essentially what we did. 2nd rounders...Schmecken Rounders. (Please don't misconstrue my posting of these videos for what I think he'll do on a nightly basis) The ability to do this on any given night, with a high side of being more consistent with these types of efforts, is good enough for me to make the deal.


But is that what we needed? Another guy who can put up 30 every so often? For the same overall value, I would have focused on consistency and defense.

My problem is not with the move so much as the underlying philosophy of ignoring weaknesses and adding redundant players.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4985 » by Thugger HBC » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:23 am

kNicksGmen wrote:no idea why some posters on here are spending so much time and energy to convince others that bargs sucks... we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. regardless i don't get the motive behind having 50+ posts in here all saying the same thing over and over.

be honest, have you ever seen a knicks trade that the majority didnt like at all?
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4986 » by StephNYKurry » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:25 am

JustaKnickFan wrote:But why waste picks on this very slim chance.


Because 2nd round picks are an even slimmer chance at developing and as I've detailed before, that's years down the line.

JustaKnickFan wrote:You guys act like there's a real possbility he goes back to dropping 20 points, which he needed about 17 shots to do so. He's not getting the shots, and he's definitely not getting the points.


Okay, so he won't score 20. Would Novak? Would Camby? If he scores 15 on a solid percentage, he's a MAJOR upgrade.

JustaKnickFan wrote:The thing about Bargnani is yeah he scores....but he does it inefficiently. He also can't rebound or play help D.


His rebounding is relative. He's a better rebounder than Kidd or Prig and those are the guys he'd be replacing in the starting lineup should he play there. His help defense is an issue and I've already conceded that. I'm hoping Woody can get through to him with it.

JustaKnickFan wrote:Reason supports my stance plenty. If you want to argue that Bargs is efficient, can rebound well, and can play help D well then go ahead, but logic won't be on your side.


I've said that he's better than pretty much every other option for the price that we acquired him for and that's pretty much indisputable. Your "efficiency" kick is tied to his shot totals and not his shooting percentage. He shoots it fine from the field for me and well enough from behind the arc to command respect. He's another solid ball mover, live body off the dribble and is another guy who can hit a tough shot.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4987 » by Im Coming Home » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:27 am

He's a Knick now, get over it and root for him, he makes us more talented, and have higher potential as a team overall and since we're capped out thats all you can ask for in a trade.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4988 » by ezmoney707 » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:28 am

JustaKnickFan wrote:
ezmoney707 wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:You kinda lost me with this.

The Spurs are where they are because they value all their assets, they have decades of history in such.

Miami is an expansion team and has more rings than the "storied" franchise and they have done it through solid trades, free agency and the draft, and if you're gonna lose...lose hard.

We had a 100 page draft thread....why? because we know the team needs help and the draft is one method of such.

I know this thread is severely OT at this point, and maybe thats good as it takes away from the topic which most dont approve of.

Like I had said previously it's been a while for a trade that most dont like at all.

But at the end of the day think about what your arguing now. We were terrible for years because of poor management. We have been digging ourselves out of holes for years.
When we get ahead of the 8 ball we take a step back in some capacity.

With this current team it's downfall has been the contract of Amare and his health. It forces your hand to go all in or sit back without any improvement or drastic measure blow it up. We have to give up these picks because we have a man making 20 million dollars that can't contribute.

Should we have use our amnesty on Amare instead of Billups yeah probably, but it's all hindsight.

If Bargs plays to his potential those picks will look like cupcakes. We have to take risk with our position.

Right now you're going with Bryan Colangelo logic.

For 7 years, Toronto has tried to get Bargs to play to his potential, and he's only gotten worse.

Anyway, I'm done arguing for today. All I'm saying is that, you guys need to actually watch Bargs in real games and not in highlights, or talk to Raptors fans who have. He's not that good, and this potential is a load of BS that Bryan Colangelo lost his job because of.

The Bryan Colangelo logic would to build around him and to put your team in cap hell thinking your only a move away without any true superstars.

I have watch Bargs play live. I will go off my eyes saw and not what disgruntle fans looking for a scapegoat do.

True story one of my boys is a Nuggets fan. Loved Melo to death over the years he was there. But the last few years he kind turned on Melo used him as the scapegoat why they never won. 3 years later he wishes he had Melo on the Nuggets and misses his value to the team. What I am saying is fans of teams find faults in their players and blame them for their teams short comings and blame things on a player. We did it with David Lee. We all called him the doorman and this and that, but we all would take Lee back with this current group because Lee was in a role of being the best player on his team so we used his short comings as scapegoats for us not winning.

We just need to give the player a chance. Stop reviewing the book before we get to the end of it.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4989 » by BernardKing » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:54 am

If Bargs finally lives up to his draft status in NY, I'll refer to him by the nickname: "sleeper cell". When he shook Stern's hand back in '06, is that a wink I detected? :wink:
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4990 » by StephNYKurry » Mon Jul 8, 2013 3:55 am

We've got to get him back to this and the space our offense provides should certainly assist with that.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARHGyt-AbbY[/youtube]

Look at how he attacks the closeouts off the bounce. Look at how aggressive he is in running the floor. You can also tell how quickly he can process things. He's making quick and sure decisions in this video.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4991 » by mamadontcry » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:05 am

JustaKnickFan wrote:
mamadontcry wrote:
JustaKnickFan wrote:

Yeah, but you don't worsen your future to make a lateral at best move. Bargs doesn't make this team better than Indy, Chicago, or Miami.

On paper I can agree with you. As Mike Miller on paper was a lateral move for Miami. Or on paper an injured Granger didn't improve Indy team.You can't predict how much a player can boost or not a team just enough to beat Mia Indy Bkn Chi. It's not how much he can produce on a regular basis but how much/how little those teams will have to adjust their tactics in PO. It's not about Bargnani, it's about giving Melo more freedom to finish it all without having a triple D on him.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4992 » by TrueWarrior » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:11 am

Also dont forget we did nab CJ Leslie. He was basically our 2nd rounder. Already has a training camp invite and will get every chance to make the team.

CJ had a top 40 grade in the draft pretty much everywhere with some thinking he could slip into the 1st round. If he came out after his soph year he was an easy 1st rounder too. The guy has some work to do and Im not his biggest fan, but it was a complete no risk move. The athleticism/potential is there. Get him working with Hopla on his J and he could become a solid versatile bench player for us, and a decent trade chip.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4993 » by Berserk_Raptor » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:19 am

kNicksGmen wrote:no idea why some posters on here are spending so much time and energy to convince others that bargs sucks... we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. regardless i don't get the motive behind having 50+ posts in here all saying the same thing over and over.


most of them raptors fans, and thats because they are afraid Bargs succeeds in NY... at least you notice Bargs is encouraged to turn around things and thats good news eh?? Unfortunately, Andrea gave up with the Raps early during the last season, he said Raptors were the worst team, that he would welcome a trade, etc... Bargs didnt want to play for the Raps anymore, it sucks for us, so in the end everyone wins with this trade... you guys dont need to build your team on draft picks, NY is a big market which can land stars. The pick is important for Raptors because they will rebuild and if lucky will get a decent player. Bargs has his second chance and is ready to show hes up to this challenge... good luck to evryone
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4994 » by Capn'O » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:34 am

Look at what the Suns pulled off a few days ago. They snagged Bledsoe with basically nothing but capspace. While the Knicks closed the door on draft options, they opened the door to pick up young talent via trade. If the Knicks play their cards well, they'll be able to acquire young talent just fine as a part of a 2015 reconstruction.

The move isn't lateral and the Knicks didn't mortgage their future. There is, however, legit concern about which Bargs well get.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4995 » by LBnySuaveJav23 » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:40 am

C'mon 5,000 dammit!!
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4996 » by NYKat » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:50 am

StephNYKurry wrote:We've got to get him back to this and the space our offense provides should certainly assist with that.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARHGyt-AbbY[/youtube]

Look at how he attacks the closeouts off the bounce. Look at how aggressive he is in running the floor. You can also tell how quickly he can process things. He's making quick and sure decisions in this video.


He can space the floor, no doubt, and does well when hes attacking but if that's him at his most aggressive, JR and Stat don't have worry about any threats to their "second option" status. He's still charmin soft. An above average defense can easily take him right out of the game.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4997 » by mamadontcry » Mon Jul 8, 2013 4:56 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf1lN0-xl88[/youtube]

soft skills :nod:

he loves Indiana

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqXpONiTnyA[/youtube]

a lot :lol:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSHOhLS-x9o[/youtube]
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4998 » by TheBigBoss » Mon Jul 8, 2013 5:01 am

mamadontcry wrote:[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf1lN0-xl88[/youtube]

soft skills :nod:

he loves Indiana

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqXpONiTnyA[/youtube]


Yup, Bargs is totally useless against Hibbert.

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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#4999 » by TheBigBoss » Mon Jul 8, 2013 5:04 am

NYKat wrote:
StephNYKurry wrote:We've got to get him back to this and the space our offense provides should certainly assist with that.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARHGyt-AbbY[/youtube]

Look at how he attacks the closeouts off the bounce. Look at how aggressive he is in running the floor. You can also tell how quickly he can process things. He's making quick and sure decisions in this video.


He can space the floor, no doubt, and does well when hes attacking but if that's him at his most aggressive, JR and Stat don't have worry about any threats to their "second option" status. He's still charmin soft. An above average defense can easily take him right out of the game.


Obviously we have to wait for the games, but on paper Bargs compliments Melo better than Amare or JR.
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Re: BREAKING **** NEWS: Deal #done Knicks acquire Bargnani 

Post#5000 » by TheBigBoss » Mon Jul 8, 2013 5:05 am

LBnySuaveJav23 wrote:C'mon 5,000 dammit!!


Patience patience my friend. :)

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