Jobs for the boys?

[N Ireland Nets]

The more I see Kidd on the side of the court during a Brooklyn game the more I think, "what the hell have we done?"

When Kidd retired he wanted to be a top paid tv analysis but got little to no interest from the tv firms willing to take him on because he lacked the charisma and talking ability to do so. Then his agent says, "hey why not try being a coach?"

Within weeks Kidd is appointed head coach of the Brooklyn Nets. To me it's a crazy high risk move to install a rookie coach, never mind a rookie head coach, a rookie coach who has never coached in his life, in charge of such a talented roster. I mean, we're win now as a team and yet the guy meant to be running the show can't as yet draw up plays for players in the summer league.

Make no mistake, Lawrence Frank is the Brooklyn Nets head coach next season, Kidd is just in charge through title. It's the same sort of situation as Golden State Warriors had with Mark Jackson and Mike Malone. Malone drew all the plays up, decided what adjustments were being made and did all the x's and o's for GSW with Jackson being the public face and inspirational speaker for the team. Next year is the 1st year Jackson will really be running things for GSW so that will be interesting to watch.

Why are we taking such a big risk with a potential contender team by installing someone with no experience in what he is doing?

To watch Kidd stand outside a huddle while Frank draws up a play and lets Kidd give it to the players is actually quite embarrassing and just rams home the point that Kidd has never done this before. It was a "jobs for the boys" appointment that I can't get my head around.

So Kidd couldn't get into the line of work he thought he would be in (on tv) so his agent throws it out there about the Brooklyn job and he ends up getting it, that's beyond weird to me. People will sight Rivers and Bird as examples of players jumping straight into coaching but Bird didn't do it either, he didn't go directly from playing to coaching straight away. This is a huge risk and I can't understand it.

Golden State were able to do it because Jackson had time to learn on the job with a young team and Malone on his coaching staff, so the franchise as a whole were learning together. The Nets are a team ready to go now with a roster trying to win while the head coach is only at the very beginning of his learning curve with no idea what it takes to be a head coach. The warning signs that I was worried about are already there, when your head coach can't draw up plays at summer league, it's got to be worrying to people.

So are people happy having Frank as head coach with Kidd learning the ropes?

Why couldn't we appoint an experience assistant coach or a coach like Karl while adding Kidd as an assistant with a view of taking over some day down the line?

Sorry for rehashing an old discussion here but after watching both summer league games it just has made me nervous. Again nothing to do with the summer league scores or performances just what seemed to be most peoples fears about Kidd being mad head coach in the 1st place. Also it's more than likely Kidd will be suspended for the start of the season as well due to his DUI case coming up in the next week or so.

[vincecarter4pres]

I wasn't a fan of the move and still am not. Shaw was the guy I wanted. SVG was a guy I also loved, though he was never even on the radar. Rivers was also a dream candidate, but we jumped the gun for the splashy marketing move and I'd imagine Ainge really didn't want to let Rivers go in division. I don't even know what to think about this, I was never a fan of Opie when he was here, I thought he was an excellent assistant and would have made a great D1 coach at a big program, but as a lead guy I feel he's in over his head. I'm definitely apprehensive, but in the end, what can you do? We don't control the moves or work for the front office as much as a few of us here almost certainly would have done a better job.

[Paradise]

I do think if they knew they were going to be able to get Pierce/KG ahead of time, Kidd wouldn't have been hired.

His concepts are what sold him in his interview and he knows what wins from what doesn't. The problem I have with it mostly is the fact, he has a DWI case over his head and you still hire him as a head coach.

I'm sure he would have settled for assistant until he could prove to be trustworthy off the court.

[vincecarter4pres]

His concepts are what sold him in his interview and he knows what wins from what doesn't.

I don't buy this schtick. It was a marketing ploy, nothing else, nothing more. That and Billy King probably loved the idea.

[enetric]

Admittedly, I liked the hire of JKidd more before the big trade. While, I formatted, projected and wrote about that exact trade for months on this board...its not like I was sure it was ever going to happen.

At the time, I was looking at this one round and out team with no cap, few prospects or picks of trade value...basically little upside for the next 3 years and hoping that King did well with HBAP.


The fun of having Kidd come in with a team that had little downside or upside to me was fine. I expected at worst if healthy, we are one round and out next year at absolute best we get to the conference finals....but realistically I figured we would be out in round 2 regardless of who the coach was given the flaws I saw all season with the roster and exposed come playoff time.

Could have hired a rock...who cares.

But now...you can see it. You can see if healthy if a good system is in place....the personnel is here to make a run at it. I dont know if we can beat the Heat. But personnel wise...if we are healthy is there anyone here who wouldnt be disappointed to see us fall short of the conference finals next season?

Kidd will be scruntinized now at a higher level at whatever point we do end up losing. So most likely....anything short of champs...I expect there will be plenty of Kidd bashing this year fair or not.


As for the list of coaches...SVG wasnt on the radar because he said I am not coaching this year. Doc wasnt because Boston from what I recall, Boston was telling people no at the time. I still could care less about not hiring Shaw personally. I wish him well...but I wasnt anymore enthusiastic about hiring an assistant coach who had no head coaching experience than I was at hiring one of the greatest minds for the game of our time with no head coaching experience. We can debate all day why its not the same thing...but lets not do that again.

I just didnt buy into the hype of Shaw being Phil 2.0....and I felt a part of his name being mentioned so often is that he was turned down for so many jobs all these years that he had become the gratuitous guy to have on your candidate list.

Honestly..its a shame the Doc Rivers thing didnt happen just a bit sooner or happened simultaneously with our trade. Could have changed everything and absolutely you would prefer Doc to JKidd.

Thrilled above all we didnt hire JVG.

You know...hope Kidd is fantastic. Would be a great story. But...worst case...wouldnt shock me if he is a train wreck...that we bring in an out of work veteran like LA did firing Brown for MDA last year.

Isnt Karl still out there?

[enetric]

His concepts are what sold him in his interview and he knows what wins from what doesn't.

I don't buy this schtick. It was a marketing ploy, nothing else, nothing more. That and Billy King probably loved the idea.

I disagree. And from all accounts King was the one NOT sold on the idea and that he was won over.

I just dont think you give the most important employee job to a guy for a marketing ploy. There are other ways to get the marketing buzz from bringing Kidd back in over head coach of your 300mil must win now payroll team.

If we were still small market with 9K fans in the stands I would buy that theory. But this isnt NJ, or GSW, or Sacramento.

That job is too important for you not to have also liked what you heard from the guy IMO.

Hopefully, it works out. It did with Larry Bird. And in Indy...I think you can sell the idea of a marketing ploy much more than here.

[Netaman]

I was against Kidd for a good portion of the pre-hiring discussion, because the window on this team was so short I wanted a playoff proven coach with a system - Sloan, Collins, and even Larry Brown. When he was hired I was skeptical, not understanding why we couldn’t have hired one of the older options and let Kidd be the AHC for a year or two. I got on-board with it when I realized that it basically doesn’t matter who has what role and with Frank on the staff it’s not that much different.

Now however, the more information that comes out, the more I like what I'm hearing from Kidd. Do I still stand by the initial preference for an experienced coach who will give us the best chance at winning this year? I guess. But the upside of Kidd as a long term answer, and uniquely qualified candidate, is evident.

Jason Kidd spoke with Rod Boone in Orlando Tuesday and used the opportunity to once again says the team will operate at a quicker pace, share the ball more, and will put an end to iso ball.
"You look at the league as a whole -- we’ll use the two teams [in the Finals] Miami and San Antonio -- they are teams that kind of stayed away from iso and moved the ball around and there was multiple touches," the Nets coach told Newsday's Boone Tuesday. "That's what we are trying to get to, being able to move the ball. Sacrifice is something I might say a lot. Something you’ll [also] hear me say a lot, is making a play for a teammate.

"Don’t be afraid to let go of the ball because a lot of times, when you do let go of the ball, the ball will find you. And so, that’s something that we are going to get away from because against the great defenses in this league, you won’t be able to win a seven-game series."

Is Lawrence Frank essentially the coach for this year? Yeah pretty much, but I like Kidd’s vision for the team. It’s impossible to not like his credibility, instincts, and competitiveness.

[enetric]

I never like or agree with the comments about an assistant be it Malone, Opie, Thibs or whoever over the years being the "real" head coach. The head coach IS the head coach. Having a strong member of your staff to help you in whatever you deem necessary is fine. But the final choices for play calling, subs, time outs...running your practices..what you teach and emphasize falls to the guy in the top seat in any managerial structure.

[HelloBrooklyn]

There was definitely somewhat of a marketing move by hiring Kidd. However, I don't think that was the full reason on why we hired him. I think it's was a combination of his coaching schemes, the team's problem, culture changing ability, and marketing move.

I didn't think our front office have much of a choice on who to hire. The main objective of the Nets AND the main marketing move that we are targeting is to win the chip for the next 3 years? This is such an important task because this is the ultimately best way to rebrand our franchise. And looking at it in a business standpoint this is a genius idea considering how well off the Knicks are even though how **** their franchise had been in the last 20 years. My point is this is a buyers market and the perfect opportunity is to strike now. If the Nets can have a culture change even somewhat comparable to the Lakers that would be enough to take over the market in NY. This is why Proky was so adamant about taking a team in the Tri-state area.

So considering all of those variable there is no way in hell they would hire Kidd strictly only for a marketing move.
That would only last for a year and everyone will forget about it. The Nets are looking at the bigger picture. This is the reason why we are throwing 300 mill like it's nothing.

Considering all of those variable they didn't have much of choice in the coaching pool. The only coach they should be looking at is: Doc and Phil and everyone else are nobody. The fact that they were impossible to get, the team needed to make a bold play which is where Shaw, and Kidd looked good.

Shaw would've been the safer pick up between the two. However, I think King saw that there is more of need to what Kidd brings into the table. Which is the fact that he is one of the best leader in the NBA. The fact that D-Will can't make a shot in the last 2 minutes into the game shows that this is the most important talent that this team need is the leadership ability/culture changing skills.

So if you think about it Kidd was the perfect guy for this Job. Which is exactly what Billy is thinking.

[Hello Brooklyn]

I really don't care.

As long as Kidd doesn't make bone headed substitution and plays, this team will be fine.

KG, Pierce, D-Will and these boys know what they are doing at this point in time. They know how to win. Kidd is not going to be the difference.

As long as he can be a half decent coach, we will be fine.

[Paradise]

All Kidd has to do:

-Preach and continue to instill his vision of ball movement and selfless teamwork, his vision of team defense and team trust.

-Proper logical rotations. This has to be the easiest part and where being a former player will really help. Knowing how and when to limit minutes and make the right subs.

-Keep the younger guys accountable specifically Deron, Blatche, Bojan, Mirza, Evans, Mason, etc.

Those were the main factors on why he was hired. Frank and the rest of the staff can handle the deeper Xs and Os aspect on a game.

Especially with this roster, Kidd can't do any worse than what we've already endured. His lack of experience would be more evident with a roster filled with younger guys and rookies.


Was the hire also related to a marketing scheme of "the Nets all-time player is back!", yes it was. But there is no question, the hire also had to deal with Kidd's IQ and relationship with his peers and ability to connect with players. Avery and PJ came off as if they were out of touch with today's players.

[Keith Van Horn]

They should have given Frank a 1-2 year deal as head coach with Kidd as an assistant, hoping that in that time period he would learn from Frank. IDK, maybe that would have worked better and we wouldn't have looked so desperate to make a big splash.

[Basileus777]

It looks like John Welch, former George Karl assistant will be running the offense with Frank running the defense. Kidd will oversee both and manage the team.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/nets/the ... ntent=Nets

Looking up Welch brings up some interesting stuff like this:

Asked to talk about Welch's importance, Nuggets executive Masai Ujiri said: "I don't want to talk about him — because I don't want any other team to take him. He's the best, he's the best in the NBA, there's no doubt about it. No disrespect to anybody, but he's the best player development coach in the NBA. He takes basketball seriously — his work, his trade."

"Point guards — he loves point guards — he teaches pick-and-roll stuff, angles," Karl said. "And when you defend this particular way, what your options are, what you have to do. The perimeter guys, he works with their footwork to get ready to shoot the ball. And he can handle the big guys very well too. He does big-men footwork drills and catches. ... What I think he does very well is he takes what I want and incorporates it into his drills and repetition. John and I are very seldom not on the same wavelength."

http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci_21 ... tant-coach

[vincecarter4pres]

Kidd was basically gifted the role Phil Jackson wanted.

[jerseyjac]

Kidd was basically gifted the role Phil Jackson wanted.

Phil talks a lot...one week he says he is looking to coach again and then you watch an interview where he states he's only interested in management...

Kidd will do more with this roster than any coach we had last year, maybe you wanted more...you want to call it a team effort as far as the reality of Frank and the rest of the staff doing a lot coaching, I have no problem with that...

But you have to remember Kidd is learning how to become a coach, he'll look, sound and seem like he has no clue at times because he is a rookie coach and is learning literally on the fly...maybe Shaw could of done a better job right out of the gate...maybe Frank will do more coaching than Kidd in certain areas...I just believe, regardless of Kidd being a marketing tool for the Nets, JKidd will put his stamp on this team this year through communication and hopefully between the veterans we acquired, he we also add to the glue that makes this team stick...

[vincecarter4pres]

Kidd was basically gifted the role Phil Jackson wanted.

Phil talks a lot...one week he says he is looking to coach again and then you watch an interview where he states he's only interested in management...

Kidd will do more with this roster than any coach we had last year, maybe you wanted more...you want to call it a team effort as far as the reality of Frank and the rest of the staff doing a lot coaching, I have no problem with that...

But you have to remember Kidd is learning how to become a coach, he'll look, sound and seem like he has no clue at times because he is a rookie coach and is learning literally on the fly...maybe Shaw could of done a better job right out of the gate...maybe Frank will do more coaching than Kidd in certain areas...I just believe, regardless of Kidd being a marketing tool for the Nets, JKidd will put his stamp on this team this year through communication and hopefully between the veterans we acquired, he we also add to the glue that makes this team stick...

I hope so Jac. Kidd is one of my favorite players of all time and my 2nd favorite Net of all time, well maybe 3rd if Deron redeems himself from being such a diva haha.

He has the chance to be a really great HC, and hopefully he's at least good, or solid, even average, but it just smacks of such a questionable hire, such a Brett Yormark and Billy King type of move and if it does workout, it's almost by accident, although I'd be fine with that because at this point I'd like to be more about the bottom line.

But you know I was never an Opie fan and it scares me our fate for at least this season is actually mainly in his hands while Jason Kidd is a figure head motivational speaker and media puppet, which is mainly what he is as reality at least for this season while he learns to actually be a coach.

[N Ireland Nets]

Here's the thing, I hope it works out and if it does we have a coach long term taking the franchise forward BUT most people here are basically saying he won't have to do much due to the roster having so much experience and stars that will help him run the show.

But as I see it, if Kidd isn't going to add much in the next season or so, why didn't we add a coach like Karl with experience to help push this group forward. If Kidd isn't really needed by the stars of the team, he isn't going to really add anything to the franchise win wise while an experienced coach would definitely add value to the team and highly likely wins as well.

It's a really interesting debate though that will go on and on but I just wanted others opinions.

[therealbig3]

I'm not a Lawrence Frank fan either...but he's clearly better than Avery and PJ. Our roster last year was a 2nd round team if we simply had better coaching. IMO, above all else, the vast disparity in coaching between PJ and Thibs is why we lost that series.

Now, we have a vastly improved roster and a much better coaching situation, over a team that basically was a 2nd round team that got screwed up by some epically bad coaching imo.

And there's a lot to being a coach beyond the Xs and Os...communication, substitutions, and motivation are big parts of being a coach as well, and I don't think Kidd needs a learning curve in order to understand those parts of the job.

Not a fan of the hiring either, but I'm going to reserve judgement until we actually see how the regular season unfolds. I am slightly optimistic though, because beyond being a Popovich or a Thibs, a head coach can only do so much, and it's really the players that get stuff done. And we have great players.

[drza]

I guess I look at Kidd's hiring a bit differently. Yes, there is an Xs and Os component to coaching. But at the NBA level, the best coaches are rarely spoken of as Xs and Os monsters. To me, it seems that the best coaches are known for a) inspiring loyalty and trust, b) running effective systems (whether they created them or not), and c) managing personalities to get them all moving the same direction.

Phil Jackson is known for his Triangle Offense, but he neither invented nor seemingly messed much with the nuts and bolts of the system...he let Tex do that. The reason that Phil is so great is that he knew how to communicate with his players in an effective way, he knew how to earn their trust, and he could convince even the most compulsively egocentric players in history to buy into a team concept.

And I think Kidd, right now, has the capability to do those things. He can give big-picture concepts of what he wants his team to look like and let Frank and Welch figure out the nuts and bolts for how that vision could become reality. But what's most important is that Kidd can go look his team leader right in the eye and tell him that he (Kidd) KNOWS what it is to run a championship caliber team as an elite point guard, and that if Deron would just trust him and buy into what Kidd's selling then he can teach Deron to do the same. Kidd can look Johnson in his eyes and tell Johnson how some of the greatest players of this generation, from Dirk to Vince to Melo to Kidd himself have had to sacrifice certain parts of their games for the team to succeed.

A non-player can be a great coach, but he has to come from a different angle with a stronger system or Xs and Os background in order to win the players' trust. But a former player...especially an all-history player from this exact generation (e.g. not an "old fossil") has an immediate level of cache with the current players, an immediate amount of credibility. And Kidd should have that.

So with all of that said, could Kidd still crash and burn as a coach? Of course he could, we just don't know. But from what I've heard so far, he seems to be taking the exact approach I'd like and he's in a great position to succeed. He's hired specialist coordinators for both the offense and defense and made it clear that he'll listen to them in those areas where they're strong. He now finds himself with three championship-tested veterans to be his lieutenants on the court, one of whom is particularly lauded as one of the great leaders/teammates of this generation. This should put Kidd in the position where all he has to do is set the big picture goals, be a leader of men (which he showed himself very capable of during his almost two-decade career), and keep the ship pointed in the right direction. I think that he's capable of doing that, and will look forward to seeing it play out live action.

[Paradise]

I'm not a Lawrence Frank fan either...but he's clearly better than Avery and PJ. Our roster last year was a 2nd round team if we simply had better coaching. IMO, above all else, the vast disparity in coaching between PJ and Thibs is why we lost that series.

Now, we have a vastly improved roster and a much better coaching situation, over a team that basically was a 2nd round team that got screwed up by some epically bad coaching imo.

And there's a lot to being a coach beyond the Xs and Os...communication, substitutions, and motivation are big parts of being a coach as well, and I don't think Kidd needs a learning curve in order to understand those parts of the job.

Not a fan of the hiring either, but I'm going to reserve judgement until we actually see how the regular season unfolds. I am slightly optimistic though, because beyond being a Popovich or a Thibs, a head coach can only do so much, and it's really the players that get stuff done. And we have great players.

And to add to this, these are the biggest areas Avery and PJ failed at the most because you can win games with these guys just with a competent Power Forward alone but those were the areas of the game that turned the players off on them much more than anything.

Kidd should have the best knowledge of that coming into it as a player, coming into it seeing what managed and mismanaged minutes look like. He should also be able to help a guy like Terry if he goes through a rough patch of shooting and relate that to his struggles with the Knicks towards the end of the season, Kidd is 6'4 and spent the last 3 years playing SG and guarding bigger players, he can relate that to Deron or Terry and show them the small tactics he used to defend a bigger player. Some coaches simply can't relate to that experience or connect to players on certain levels.

Those are the distinct factors that gave the whole Jason Kidd as a coach a second and third thought aside from the marketability or loyalty side of it.