Official Speculation Thread (Pt.LIX Offseason Edition)

[Nyce_1]

The more I look at Dallas the more I think BBD would be a nice get for them, they have no size whatsoever, unless they think they can play Dirk at the 5 and Marion at the 4 full time?

Calderon/Harris/Larkin
Monta/Beabuois
Carter/marion
Dirk
?

Rumor is they're going after Dalembert for the C position. Regardless, I agree, and also think BBD would be a good fit for them.

[KingRobb02]

The more I look at Dallas the more I think BBD would be a nice get for them, they have no size whatsoever, unless they think they can play Dirk at the 5 and Marion at the 4 full time?

Calderon/Harris/Larkin
Monta/Beabuois
Carter/marion
Dirk
?

Well, Bernard James I guess. You should totally start a Big Baby for Ricky Ledo thread.

[OrlandO]

Ellis must feel like an idiot turning down the 3/36 EXTENSION on the already 11 he was slated to make next season

Dallas > Milwaukee, city and team. 3/30 is still a lot of money.

[rcklsscognition]

Ellis just fired his agent for a reason, he missed out on deals and didn't consult him well. Now he's with Feagan.

[LBPTarHeel27]

-Half kidding about the trade, but I do think the Knicks will struggle to get to 40 wins based on the number of no defense, no rebounding gunners they will be giving minutes to.

I think that is REALLY wishful thinking. The Knicks won 52 games this past season and they have made some great improvements. Bargnani fits in perfectly there. They retained Smith. Shumpert will only get better. Amare can't be any worse than he was. To say their total will go down by at least 12 is pretty crazy when every sign points to improvement.

-I am not sure why you think the Hawks are worse than last year's team. Milsap is an upgrade over Smith (not overall, but in terms of his fit on the team) and Lou Williams is actually healthy this year. What did they lose that will make them take a step back?

You said it. They lost their best overall player. He was a good defender for them and their best threat on offense. Teague has told Atlanta not to match, he clearly doesn't want to be there. So they've lost two of their best players and gained a hard working big man...something they already have. I hardly see Milsap as a better fit for them...he doesn't bring anything unique. Even if they pull of a S&T for Jennings...they aren't a good team. Far from a team that gets home court advantage.

-Two things have me down on the Bulls. 1) Thibs runs these guys into the ground, and I think Luol Deng's legs might fall off, and 2) I hear that their cheap owner probably forces a Boozer trade this year. Noah is hurt every year, and Rose is probably worth around 3 more wins than the missing Bellinelli/Robinson combo. They will probably be around 48 wins again. Not an insult, but this isn't the juggernaut from a couple years ago. They cheaped out on Asik, and they are still paying for it. unless you love a bench of Nazr and Hinrich.

OK, so they win around 48 games - which I see as the worst case scenario. That will still top Atlanta, who won 44 games this past season...and got worse. You love the addition of Milsap for Atlanta but you dismiss Chicago getting a former MVP back.

-Pacers? They were extremely lucky with health last season, and I can't hold that against them. They are probably number two after the Heat.

Lucky with injuries? You realize their best scorer went down for the season and that was exactly what they were missing in the playoffs.

I think the Hawks are battling with New Jersey for 3 and 4 spot. Anyone who saw KG during the regular season last year understands why I am down on the Nets as a regular season team. AK47 helps my opinion of them (assuming he's healthy). Basically my problem with them is you have a bunch of guys past their prime who are another year older. I think that they will be around 42-44 wins.

I can see the Nets disappointing...but even then, they CLEARLY have improved and they won 49 games last season. I don't see how you can justify saying that the Hawks win total will jump so much while these other teams that have blatantly improved will decline by a huge chunk of games.

[trebone]

I like the BBD/2nd for Ledo/Carter idea

[Noonskadoodle]

LMAO.

OT- but man the Mods on the GB really bug the heck outta me.

I make a thread with that best shooters breakdown image, & it gets locked with no explanation whatsoever after people were already posting in it?

Hmmm

[LBPTarHeel27]

I like the BBD/2nd for Ledo/Carter idea

BBD for Joel Anthony + Filler + Philly's 2014 First Round Pick

I won't give up on this until it isn't possible.

[OrlandO]

LMAO.

OT- but man the Mods on the GB really bug the heck outta me.

I make a thread with that best shooters breakdown image, & it gets locked with no explanation whatsoever after people were already posting in it?

Hmmm

It was too on-topic for their liking... they want more "Joakim Noah Scores A Goal In Soccer And Goes Crazy " and "Baron Davis Was Abducted by Aliens" type threads.

[Deadcellz]

LMAO.

OT- but man the Mods on the GB really bug the heck outta me.

I make a thread with that best shooters breakdown image, & it gets locked with no explanation whatsoever after people were already posting in it?

Hmmm

It was too on-topic for their liking... need more "Joakim Noah Scores A Goal In Soccer And Goes Crazy " and "Baron Davis Was Abducted by Aliens" threads.

Yeah unless its talk about kobe or lebron goat,whos best in east, whos best in west, epic towel, small market vs big market, or can x player be an allstar? then its insta lock haha

[KingRobb02]

I don't see how you can justify saying that the Hawks win total will jump so much while these other teams that have blatantly improved will decline by a huge chunk of games.

Because, the Hawks won't go into the season without a PG. Either they match Teague (ask Josh Smith how the "don't match thing worked in 2009") or they get Jennings, either way they are fine there. Josh Smith was not their best overall player. He was not good on offense. Milsap will fill a gap that Smith couldn't. Smith was basically a negative on offense and a positive on defense while Millsap is a positive on offense and neutral on defense. That is a net gain in my eyes. Plus, don't ignore the fact that Lou Williams will be healthy. Millsap + a healthy Williams is worth around 4 more wins to this team. That puts them in the 48 range.

You are griping with me picking the Pacers to finish second? Do you really think they are better than the Heat?

If you think the Knicks improved with adding the worst player in NBA history you are insane. That is not even up for debate. He is a 7 footer who averages 3 rebounds per game, a scorer who shoot 40% from the field, a center who doesn't even attempt to play defense. Adding him and giving him Novak's minutes is worth a loss of 6 or 7 wins. I'm not even joking. Amare is another tall guy who refuses to play defense and doesn't rebound. He's not a negative, because he can make shots, but any minute you give him had to come out of Chandler's minutes and that is costing you. If they ever roll out a Bargnani/Stoudemire front line, average teams will eviscerate them. I've been watching Iman Shumpert for 8 years now. He isn't improving enough to matter.

Nets "CLEARLY" got better? Not really. Do you remember a year ago when the Lakers "CLEARLY" got better? These things aren't always so cut and dry. My problem with their additions is that on offense you have three ball dominant guys and none of them are great off the ball. The smart play is Deron and Pierce play in the backcourt with AK47 at the other wing, but knowing the Nets, we will see the 5 highest paid guys taking most of the minutes. KG basically had his worst year ever last year, if you saw how slow he looked in the games he actually participated in. I doubt, that gets fixed. At the end of it all, I really doubt a rookie coach will be able to convince this team that the regular season matters enough to get more than 45 wins out of them.

The Bulls are getting Rose back. I gave them a 3 game improvement for that. Sorry, but I don't think he is 2010 Derrick Rose anymore. If he is 100%? Awesome, they will be fun to watch and hopefully Thibs doesn't kill anyone. 48 wins and they are in the battle for the 3 seed with Atlanta and Brooklyn.

[LBPTarHeel27]

I don't see how you can justify saying that the Hawks win total will jump so much while these other teams that have blatantly improved will decline by a huge chunk of games.

Because, the Hawks won't go into the season without a PG. Either they match Teague (ask Josh Smith how the "don't match thing worked in 2009") or they get Jennings, either way they are fine there. Josh Smith was not their best overall player. He was not good on offense. Milsap will fill a gap that Smith couldn't. Smith was basically a negative on offense and a positive on defense while Millsap is a positive on offense and neutral on defense. That is a net gain in my eyes. Plus, don't ignore the fact that Lou Williams will be healthy. Millsap + a healthy Williams is worth around 4 more wins to this team. That puts them in the 48 range.

You are griping with me picking the Pacers to finish second? Do you really think they are better than the Heat?

If you think the Knicks improved with adding the worst player in NBA history you are insane. That is not even up for debate. He is a 7 footer who averages 3 rebounds per game, a scorer who shoot 40% from the field, a center who doesn't even attempt to play defense. Adding him and giving him Novak's minutes is worth a loss of 6 or 7 wins. I'm not even joking. Amare is another tall guy who refuses to play defense and doesn't rebound. He's not a negative, because he can make shots, but any minute you give him had to come out of Chandler's minutes and that is costing you. If they ever roll out a Bargnani/Stoudemire front line, average teams will eviscerate them. I've been watching Iman Shumpert for 8 years now. He isn't improving enough to matter.

Nets "CLEARLY" got better? Not really. Do you remember a year ago when the Lakers "CLEARLY" got better? These things aren't always so cut and dry. My problem with their additions is that on offense you have three ball dominant guys and none of them are great off the ball. The smart play is Deron and Pierce play in the backcourt with AK47 at the other wing, but knowing the Nets, we will see the 5 highest paid guys taking most of the minutes. KG basically had his worst year ever last year, if you saw how slow he looked in the games he actually participated in. I doubt, that gets fixed. At the end of it all, I really doubt a rookie coach will be able to convince this team that the regular season matters enough to get more than 45 wins out of them.

The Bulls are getting Rose back. I gave them a 3 game improvement for that. Sorry, but I don't think he is 2010 Derrick Rose anymore. If he is 100%? Awesome, they will be fun to watch and hopefully Thibs doesn't kill anyone. 48 wins and they are in the battle for the 3 seed with Atlanta and Brooklyn.

I give up. You just said that Rose nets you a three game increase but the loss of Novak loses you 6 or 7 additional games. I can't argue completely nonsense.

[KingRobb02]

I like the BBD/2nd for Ledo/Carter idea

BBD for Joel Anthony + Filler + Philly's 2014 First Round Pick

I won't give up on this until it isn't possible.

Why would the Heat do that? Big Baby has no role on that team. As long as Birdman and Bosh are back, this team won 80% of it's games last year. I don't think they are looking to shake things up in terms of lineups. It's not like Big Baby helps them in any way. They already have the best defensive PF in the league, Davis doesn't rebound, and they already have the best shooting PF and C in the league. Not really an improvement.

[KingRobb02]

I give up. You just said that Rose nets you a three game increase but the loss of Novak loses you 6 or 7 additional games. I can't argue completely nonsense.

Not completely on Novak. Giving Bargnani 1500 minutes is worth 3-4 losses. he is literally that bad. Novak had a TS% over 60% while shooting mostly 3 pointers. That is worth something. Call it nonsense if you want. It's as simple as replacing a good shooter with an awful one is going to mean you lose more games. Replacing the best C in the East with Amare Stoudemire for long stretches is going to cost you some games.

[LBPTarHeel27]

I like the BBD/2nd for Ledo/Carter idea

BBD for Joel Anthony + Filler + Philly's 2014 First Round Pick

I won't give up on this until it isn't possible.

Why would the Heat do that? Big Baby has no role on that team. As long as Birdman and Bosh are back, this team won 80% of it's games last year. I don't think they are looking to shake things up in terms of lineups. It's not like Big Baby helps them in any way. They already have the best defensive PF in the league, Davis doesn't rebound, and they already have the best shooting PF and C in the league. Not really an improvement.

Because Bosh is awful out of position and Birdman still only plays minor minutes. You just named two guys that average a combined 49 MPG in the playoffs, when minutes are up compared to the regular season. Toss in Haslem and the number goes up to 65. Where do the other 31 minutes at PF/C come from?

Bosh is a MUCH better player when he can play PF. BBD can play at C, he proved that. He brings rebounding. Something they are AWFUL at. Exactly why Vucevic dominated them each time we played. They have the best defensive PF in the game? Who is that? That is another absurd remark. I don't see how you could say BBD isn't a rebounder. He isn't going to lead the league but he would immediately be one of their best.

He would be a big upgrade for them and they will absolutely shake some things up and look to get a little better. They trade a pick that won't be conveyed for a couple years for a vet that certainly improves their team. You don't win multiple titles by standing pat. The lost in the finals the first time around, so they added some capable guys. They then went on to win...but even then, they added Ray Allen. They will certainly look to build on what they have and get better. You don't keep winning by standing still and watching everyone else improve.

[KingRobb02]

Because Bosh is awful out of position and Birdman still only plays minor minutes. You just named two guys that average a combined 49 MPG in the playoffs, when minutes are up compared to the regular season. Toss in Haslem and the number goes up to 65. Where do the other 31 minutes at PF/C come from?

Bosh is a MUCH better player when he can play PF. BBD can play at C, he proved that. He brings rebounding. Something they are AWFUL at. Exactly why Vucevic dominated them each time we played. They have the best defensive PF in the game? Who is that? That is another absurd remark. I don't see how you could say BBD isn't a rebounder. He isn't going to lead the league but he would immediately be one of their best.

He would be a big upgrade for them and they will absolutely shake some things up and look to get a little better. They trade a pick that won't be conveyed for a couple years for a vet that certainly improves their team. You don't win multiple titles by standing pat. The lost in the finals the first time around, so they added some capable guys. They then went on to win...but even then, they added Ray Allen. They will certainly look to build on what they have and get better. You don't keep winning by standing still and watching everyone else improve.

You realize, Lebron and Battier played the majority of their PF mins right?

[LBPTarHeel27]

Because Bosh is awful out of position and Birdman still only plays minor minutes. You just named two guys that average a combined 49 MPG in the playoffs, when minutes are up compared to the regular season. Toss in Haslem and the number goes up to 65. Where do the other 31 minutes at PF/C come from?

Bosh is a MUCH better player when he can play PF. BBD can play at C, he proved that. He brings rebounding. Something they are AWFUL at. Exactly why Vucevic dominated them each time we played. They have the best defensive PF in the game? Who is that? That is another absurd remark. I don't see how you could say BBD isn't a rebounder. He isn't going to lead the league but he would immediately be one of their best.

He would be a big upgrade for them and they will absolutely shake some things up and look to get a little better. They trade a pick that won't be conveyed for a couple years for a vet that certainly improves their team. You don't win multiple titles by standing pat. The lost in the finals the first time around, so they added some capable guys. They then went on to win...but even then, they added Ray Allen. They will certainly look to build on what they have and get better. You don't keep winning by standing still and watching everyone else improve.

You realize, Lebron and Battier played the majority of their PF mins right?

They were matching up. You can't tell me that Battier at PF is a good thing. He was awful throughout the playoffs and regular season until game 7. LeBron plays chunks of minutes at PF because they have no other big guys and someone has to fill that 31 minutes hole that I brought up.

[KingRobb02]

Because Bosh is awful out of position and Birdman still only plays minor minutes. You just named two guys that average a combined 49 MPG in the playoffs, when minutes are up compared to the regular season. Toss in Haslem and the number goes up to 65. Where do the other 31 minutes at PF/C come from?

Bosh is a MUCH better player when he can play PF. BBD can play at C, he proved that. He brings rebounding. Something they are AWFUL at. Exactly why Vucevic dominated them each time we played. They have the best defensive PF in the game? Who is that? That is another absurd remark. I don't see how you could say BBD isn't a rebounder. He isn't going to lead the league but he would immediately be one of their best.

He would be a big upgrade for them and they will absolutely shake some things up and look to get a little better. They trade a pick that won't be conveyed for a couple years for a vet that certainly improves their team. You don't win multiple titles by standing pat. The lost in the finals the first time around, so they added some capable guys. They then went on to win...but even then, they added Ray Allen. They will certainly look to build on what they have and get better. You don't keep winning by standing still and watching everyone else improve.

You realize, Lebron and Battier played the majority of their PF mins right?

They were matching up. You can't tell me that Battier at PF is a good thing. He was awful throughout the playoffs and regular season until game 7. LeBron plays chunks of minutes at PF because they have no other big guys and someone has to fill that 31 minutes hole that I brought up.

They won 66 games this year, and are coming off back to back titles. Battier was not awful. 62% TS% and played passable defense. Would you rather they have Baby out there taking shots away from Lebron and clogging the lane? They play with Bosh and Battier shooting 3s for a reason, they have the guy who was the best shooter at the rim playing PF.

Whether you want to call Battier the PF or Lebron the PF, those two work better together than Lebron and Baby would.

Just for fun...
Haslem: .114 WP48, 51.4% eFG, 13.7 Reb/48, 1.5 TO/48
Davis: (-.032)WP48, 44.8% eFG, 11.1 Reb/48, 2.9 TO/48

[rcklsscognition]

The Magic informed DQJ he will not be on the team this season. Feel for the guy, had a good game too.

[RickB-Orlando]

Ellis must feel like an idiot turning down the 3/36 EXTENSION on the already 11 he was slated to make next season

Dallas > Milwaukee, city and team. 3/30 is still a lot of money.

Plus no state income tax. Probably close to a wash, or at least close enough to make the team culture a factor. What player not named Lamar Odom wouldn't want to play for Mark Cuban's team?