Wizards Summer League 2013 - Mini Camp 8th Games July 13

[mhd]

I still don't understand the Porter pick over Len/Noel

Because they want to make the playoffs this year and Len is a project. Noel won't contribute much for a year or two. A lot of teams were worried about his knee and the surgery that was performed.

This is the most ludicrous logic imaginable. Not attributing it to you, 80s. But if they really used the third overall pick on a player with the short-sighted goal of simply making the playoffs next year then that's truly pathetic. The goal should be to build a title contender, not make the playoffs. Not only that, but it became downright counterproductive to then overpay Webster a week after drafting Porter. I wasn't high on Len, but Noel has two elite skills, rebounding and shot-blocking. Those two skills, as well as his ability to run the floor with Wall and Beal, made him a perfect fit. We can make the playoffs with or without Porter next year. Just like we can make it had we drafted Noel even if he had to sit until January. The pick never should have been about next year, IMO. It should have been about the next 10 years.

They DID. Chad Ford was on Bill Simmons's podcast for a draft review and said he talked to all the front office people of the top 5 picks and all were afraid of taking Noel b/c he wouldn't play until January/February. Its a pathetic rationale for drafting.

[Benjammin]

I don't know why five teams passed on Noel---injuries or his associates? But I don't think you pass on him based on his ability. Everything being equal I wish the Wizards had taken him, but again why those five teams passed I don't know.

As for SL, good Lord people put way too much emphasis on it. I know you're starved for basketball, but come on. You'd think Olynyk was the second coming of Larry Bird or something. I know Dat has been really high on him even before the draft and he's not often wrong, but I will be shocked if Olynyk has a significant (better than Brad Miller) career. Not that Brad Miller was a bad player.

I'm not going to throw OP under the bus after one underwhelming SL game either.

[gambitx777]

It as his first game, and he as playing with no truly good PG. He will get more comfortable and he will be fine.

and the reason why 5 teams passed on noel is because he had so many red flags, His knees, the people around him, and his game out side of shot blocking and rebounding. It was a smart move not taking him. Porter made sense.

Colin Cowherd said it best.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F27bFkC1MGQ[/youtube]

[Earth2Ted]

Well, I guess if we want to continue the Greg Monroe comparisons for Otto:

Monroe also had a rough start his first summer league game- 8 pts on 4-13 from the field, 5 rb 4 TO and 0-3 from the line. By the end of the week, though, his last 2 games were 20 pts 6 rb, and 27 and 14.

Hopefully Porter can ramp it up in the same manner over the course of the schedule.

On another note- Vesely was a pleasant surprise today- he actually looked like an NBA player out there. Maybe there's hope for him yet.

[Soup's Uncle]

One game. And a Summer League game at that. I think everyone needs to calm down.

[WizKid25]

To be clear, Benjammin, I'm not throwing OP under the bus. I'm throwing EG under the bus.

My criticism of the pick started on draft night, when we passed on Noel after he slipped to us. It has nothing to do with anything we saw today or anything we'll see the rest of summer league. It's not my concern why the other teams passed on him. Teams pass on good players all the time. Doesn't mean we should follow their lead. Now, if Noel's knees are truly problematic that's another thing. But I'm not in the camp that believes we made the right decision just because four other teams (five including New Orleans) passed on him. What other teams do should not impact the decisions our front office makes.

With that said, what's done is done and I'm going to support OP and root for him like every other player on our team. But you better believe I'll also have a close eye on what Noel is doing in Philly.

[truwizfan4evr]

One game. And a Summer League game at that. I think everyone needs to calm down.

I agree.

[Dat2U]

I don't see any reason to write a book on Porter after one summer league game. Obviously some nerves were there. I liked early on how he made a shot off the dribble. He'll need to really develop that aspect of the game to maximize his potential.

As far as Porter needing to get stronger... well duh. I thought everyone might have known that already. That's only going to come with time.

I'm not too worried tho. EG did everyone an injustice by putting some terrible guards out there. I would have understood that if the plan was to actually run the offense through Otto but that didn't happen.

[mhd]

Hmm, perhaps this would have been the ideal trade:

Wiz trade #3 for 11+future NO 1st
Philly traded JHolliday+11 for #3+#6
NO traded #6+future 1st for JHolliday

Wiz could have taken Olynyk at 11.

[Sonny Carson]

Porter has too much IQ, savvy BB play, length, decent shot, etc. to not at least be an average NBA player..

The issue is....the draft was such a crapshoot that it pushed a guy who probably would have been in the back of the top ten or in the early teen's draft pick....into a top 3 pick.

Its why as Crazy as it seemed the Cavs gambling on Anthony Bennett...this was the draft to gamble.

I think it was the draft to gamble on a Noel or even Ben McLemore (who is struggling with his outside shot today...but at least looks the part)

10 years from now I'm sure Porter will be a decent starter in the NBA. Its just....one of the guys (might be someone I didnt mention...who knows...maybe Shabazz Muhammad or KCP for the Pistons?) is going to emerge...I think...

That being said...cant complain about Porter too much. It's just unfortunate that this wasnt the Wiggins, Parker, Julius Randle, etc etc draft.

I mean...Imagine Jabari Parker with Wall and Beal?? Yikes.

[relinquishy]

What would you rather have...a 3-13 (or maybe it was 14?) Porter or a 4-23 McLemore?
Once again...it's only one summer league game.

[jivelikenice]

You could have made the same "gamble" argument in the Vesely draft. We could have gone safe with Kawhi or Thompson. The point is no matter what kind of draft it is, it will be a huge setback if you miss.

In regards to Otto being drafted higher than he should have been; I still haven't seen on e good argument as to why MKG was a better prospect coming out and he went 2nd.

It's SL folks. Get a grip. He struggled but he was playing with terrible pont guards and for some reason was playing two guard. Ben McLemore just went 4-23. I guess he's a bum...same goes for Burke....

[jivelikenice]

What would you rather have...a 3-13 (or maybe it was 14?) Porter or a 4-23 McLemore?
Once again...it's only one summer league game.

Overreacting to SL in its entirety is foolish. Overreacting to the first game is beyond stupid.

[Sonny Carson]

What would you rather have...a 3-13 (or maybe it was 14?) Porter or a 4-23 McLemore?
Once again...it's only one summer league game.

Overreacting to SL in its entirety is foolish. Overreacting to the first game is beyond stupid.

No doubt.

But here's the thing you're missing. When it comes to summer league...its about the "eyeball test"

Google Derrick Rose/Dwight Howard's 1st summer league game stats. DREADFUL.

However, I watched both.....and they looked the part. Rose who get to certain areas of the floor, just couldnt figure out how to finish yet. Dwight could get in great position and show off his athleticism, but just wasnt use to his back to the basket yet. Both and many other great players have had awful 1st summer league games.

The thing is....you could see a flash or wow factor about them. It was all about figuring it out.

With McLemore....I wasnt as down on his play as I was with Porters. Not to say its a lock he will be better than Porter....but Ben could get to certain areas of the floor. He the proper two dribble pull up jumper....shots just werent falling. Heck, based on how he was in college...I was just glad to see him aggressive.

With Porter....he physically and mentally.....reminds me of Jeremy Lamb last year.

Not game wise. Just that like Lamb, he will need to probably a year in the weight room before he's truly ready to play. Now its ok for Lamb because there's less pressure. Not drafted as high. He has the opportunity to just work on his game and eventually just being an "average player" is a good get for OKC.

WIth Porter...he truly NEEDS to be good. His lack of handle, inability to get to the hoop/finish around the hoop, and he was never viewed as a great shooter at Georgetown. He was passive at times and he was physically weak..

Now he can improve on those areas. I think he'll be a solid player one day. But there was nothing that jumped out about him. Can he be a Shane Battier kind of player? Tayshaun Prince? James Posey? Trevor Ariza type? You bet. But wouldnt it be great if you knew he had the potential to be like a.....Rudy Gay? Paul George? (Again I'm not expecting a Melo, Durant or LeBron here......just a straight up good to very good small forward)

I'm not sure I'm seeing. Would love to be wrong on that. Seems like a great person.

Now.....Here's the positive for Porter...

If Wall/Beal take their game to SUCH A LEVEL.....

that they MAKE Porter into a All Star caliber player. Then things will pay off.

If Wall is just playing at such a high level, not needing Porter to create shots, not needing Porter to be a top 3 option on offense. If Porter is allowed to be the ultimate utility man that still gets 17 points a game because Wall and Beal makes things easy for him........

Then its all good.

If Wall makes life easy for Porter. Then Porter is a good pick.

[Dark Faze]

Not only are they not looking for Porter, but Porter isn't even looking to get it.

Neither is good IMO.

To be fair, this applies to Olynyk as well, he was just more efficient.

Other players never look to "stars" unless they play the point. Otherwise everyone is just trying to make the team or play shameball.

[Sonny Carson]

You could have made the same "gamble" argument in the Vesely draft. We could have gone safe with Kawhi or Thompson. The point is no matter what kind of draft it is, it will be a huge setback if you miss.

In regards to Otto being drafted higher than he should have been; I still haven't seen on e good argument as to why MKG was a better prospect coming out and he went 2nd.

It's SL folks. Get a grip. He struggled but he was playing with terrible pont guards and for some reason was playing two guard. Ben McLemore just went 4-23. I guess he's a bum...same goes for Burke....

MKG was overvalued because of the UK system. But then again he was also put in the worst situation with the LOLCats. I would fear for Porter even more than MKG if he went to that situation.

A sophomore MKG to the Wizards with Wall and Beal would be a great situation for him imo. (assuming he stayed in school...and drafted to a Wizards team with Wall/Beal..)

Better ball handler, gets to the hoop better, tougher rebounder/defender.

His jump shot is just broke as crap. However, I think he'll ultimately be a better "utility man" role than Porter, again imo, in this situation.

I know he's athletic enough to run and defend with Wall/Beal.

But as I've said earlier. If Wall truly takes his game up to another level....he'd make things easier for MKG/Porter or whoever.


I guess the real issue or problem is. The draft in general. It would have been great to see the Wizards get a Jabari Parker or Julius Randle in the draft. Or even a Willie Caulie Stein. Just another big time potential impact player.

You nailed it with the Wall and Beal picks. Sure it sucks that Jan sucks. But at least you have your two guys.....it would be great to have a 3rd big time player/potential type.

Then again...

Maybe I'm wrong. I've been wrong before.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Neither is good IMO.

To be fair, this applies to Olynyk as well, he was just more efficient.

Other players never look to "stars" unless they play the point. Otherwise everyone is just trying to make the team or play shameball.

I meant they weren't looking for him is not a good sign and him being passive and not looking for the ball is not good either. That's what I meant about "Neither is good IMO." The faith in Otto by others and motivation of Otto to take the shot at the end. (Rice was the go to guy).

That said, DF, I'm not panicking on Otto at all.

I summarized my feelings on Porters debut in previous posts:

--Good start the first 5-6 minutes, disappeared the rest. Looks like he won't finish inside without much added strength. Looks like a good player to pair with Wall and Beal because he won't have to force it inside and his midrange will be effective. I'm not worried, but he's 2-3 years from being good. Webster and Ariza being on the team makes me not worry about Otto. As with Beal, he'll be fine and at least an above average player.

Also said right now, Porter is nowhere near as good as Olynyk, who is 3 years older. My signature says how I feel about the two, and I haven't changed it since right after draft night. I would have drafted Olynyk. Still feel that way. And all who said stuff about short arms and lack of athleticism being reasons to avoid Olynyk were IMO quite wrong.

As for the bad guard play on the SL team, I wish they stuck with Wolters. Rice Jr. could make me look wrong. We'll see. Wth Maynor and hopefully, Robinson, guard depth might be alright. Rice could be fine, too.

[hands11]

I understand those who are choosing to be patient with Porter. But what exactly does he do at an elite level? He's not great at anything as far as I can tell. I mean, they're talking about him having to learn how to run the floor. Really??

Well he was a good shooter in college, and while today isn't really evidence of that I think he'll end up being a considerably better shooter than Ariza. defensively he isn't terrible IMO, just needs to get stronger, but I knew that would be at least take a year to add on good weight. I think he could be a very good rebounder from the SF position, maybe not Leonard good (who is the best rebounding SF I think) but he has top 7 potential in rebounding for the 3 spot. He's definitely not a 2 guard, we shouldn't be asking him to try to take 2 guards off the dribble, that really highlights the averagness of his handles, but I don't think they're terrible. There are other young SFs whose handles aren't really all that great either, Barnes, Leonard, Pondexter.

Its ok to critique, but I guess since its summer, and we're all wiz fans, we have a tendency to tear into w/e negativity we can find.

Its summer league. This is practice ball.

The Wizards said they aren't changing their approach to these games just because the NBA changed the format. Otto at SG is practice to work on ball handing in a like game environment.

People commenting about how I said this and said that... just step away from the keyboard. Youre way over reacting. So far the summer league ball I have seen looks less organized then HS ball.

Curtain players should put up stats in these games. Some of that will translate. Some won't.

B. McLemore was 4-23 today. So what.

Trying to watch some CHI vs MEM. Man is this some ugly ball. Wish they have the PHX vs POR game on instead. I want to see CJM.

http://www.nba.com/games/20130713/PHXPOR/gameinfo.html
Look at these rosters. I would think one or both will do well against these other rosters.

[Sonny Carson]

DraftExpress2 ‏@DraftExpress2 4m
Ben McLemore goes 4-23 in debut. Next two worst 4 make VSL shooting performances? John Wall and Kevin Durant had 4-19 games as rooks.

[payitforward]

Obviously, to be fair, if we judge on one game, then Porter and Rice are terrible, and Jan Vesely is an utter stud.

I remember the same reactions to Beal's first outings in SL. I also remember Lin making Wall look like a complete bust in SL.

As to the notion that Porter was drafted so we'd make the playoffs this year -- how does that fit w/ the same people saying it'll be years before he has an NBA body and can succeed, etc.? In fact, if that was our goal, trading down for Olynyk, much further along in his body and game development, would have been the strategy.

It's not impossible of course that Noel ends up the better player (and therefore the better pick). Drummond is going to be a better player than Beal, and that's not to say anything critical about Beal. Andre is going to be a superstar -- imagine having taken Terrence Ross over him as Toronto did!

But we don't *know* Noel will be better than Porter. And we didn't learn from Porter's work today that he will.

OTOH, it is frustrating to see our third year players look less polished and effective than the undrafted Kent Bazemore! And it's annoying to realize that except for the guys we drafted we don't have a single real prospect on our squad.