Is John Gibbons safe this season/whats his future?

changes · Post #1 » by **changes** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:20 pm

If this team keeps rolling downhill fast and is heading towards a high 60s/low 70s win total, does anyone think he might get fired this year?

Also take into account AAs recent comments "its not a talent issue, they haven't performed".

As far as Gibbons is concerned I don't think too much is to blame on him, but at the same time I am not and was never a big fan of his. Behind his cross legged, laid back attitude, I don't find him to be much of a motivator.

If I had to guess I'd say he will probably finish out the season, but will be on a very tight leash at the beginning of next year.

Secueritae · Post #2 » by **Secueritae** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:26 pm

There was a lot of talk that Gibbons would be able to motivate this team and was strict enough to get his guys to play their best, but you're right his laid back attitude doesn't sound motivating at all.

This season reminds me a lot of Bobby V's one and only season last year for Boston, a bad record, injuries and potentially some players and coaches who might turn on him by the end of the year.

dagger · Post #3 » by **dagger** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:35 pm

I'd wait out the year, then fire him. Let's face it. Motivation is an issue. So is preparation. Maybe it's more on the coaches than Gibbons, but it would be hard to fire the entire orchestra and spare the conductor.

Post #4 » by **LittleOzzy** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:42 pm

dagger wrote:I'd wait out the year, then fire him. Let's face it. Motivation is an issue. So is preparation. Maybe it's more on the coaches than Gibbons, but it would be hard to fire the entire orchestra and spare the conductor.

I agree. I don't care when they do it at this point, I just don't want him back next season.

He should have never returned in the first place. He wasn't great 9 years ago, why they thought it would be different this time around I'm not sure. He must give a great interview.

Raptor_Guy · Post #5 » by **Raptor_Guy** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:28 pm

I sometimes really wonder how much difference a manager makes from a "motivation" stand point, I mean, I like Gibbons in terms of how he makes his lineup and uses the bullpen. I just don't see how the team's struggles can be blamed on him not motivating them enough, why does he have to motivate professional baseball players to play well? It's their job..

I've always thought a team's manager is overrated. It is funny though, thinking for example:

Cito Gaston wins 85 games in 2010 with what was supposed to be a bad roster, despite his bad decision making at times. Now John Gibbons has what was supposed to our best roster since the 90's and it looks like we could have our worst season since 2004 despite being a better decision maker than Gaston and Farrel IMO.

Maybe motivation is an issue? I really have no idea, I'm just spitballing..

Santoki · Post #6 » by **Santoki** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:15 pm

LittleOzzy wrote:
dagger wrote:I'd wait out the year, then fire him. Let's face it. Motivation is an issue. So is preparation. Maybe it's more on the coaches than Gibbons, but it would be hard to fire the entire orchestra and spare the conductor.

I agree. I don't care when they do it at this point, I just don't want him back next season.

He should have never returned in the first place. He wasn't great 9 years ago, why they thought it would be different this time around I'm not sure. He must give a great interview.

He didn't interview for the job. AA called him out to dinner and just gave it to him.

Lateral Quicks · Post #7 » by **Lateral Quicks** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:17 pm

Gibby is fine, but I think AA/Gibby really bungled the coaching staff this year. They assembled a veteran-laden team, and then hired rookie hitting and pitching coaches. Not only that, but they inexplicably kept last year's hitting coach on the roster, a serious WTF move if there ever was one.

I'd be very surprised if Walker and Murphy are back next season.

TheMainEvent · Post #8 » by **TheMainEvent** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:30 pm

Unless they're absolutely horrid, I'm generally not a "fire him!" kinda guy unless I have another replacement or name in mind. At the moment, I don't have a hypothetical replacement... so meh. I'll say no for now. Generally, I don't care either way.

I don't think Gibby's been terrible... his biggest strength was supposedly use of relief pitching, and that had been top notch for most of the season so far. There's not much a manager can do with injuries and I don't see him having too big an influence on the suckiness of Dickey and Johnson (and Morrow).

But ultimately, I think the biggest influence a manager has on a game -- on par with, or maybe after, relief pitching -- is non-quantifiable... like an intangible or whatever. It's just a presence he provides amongst the clubhouse... motivation at the right time, calming at the right time, strict with this, loose with that... *shrugs* And considering he's never been much of a winning manager, maybe that's something Gibby kinda lacks.

Fairview4Life · Post #9 » by **Fairview4Life** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:38 pm

I'd keep him through next season.

Michael Bradley · Post #10 » by **Michael Bradley** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:52 pm

I don't have an issue with Gibbons, but I definitely think his job is not safe at this point. Someone will have to be the scapegoat for the team playing as badly as they have, and Gibbons is the easy guy to throw under the bus (as he was in 2008). If they team won 83 games and missed the playoffs, it would be a different story, but they look like a low-to-mid 70 win team at this point, and that's unacceptable for the amount of talent on the roster (and money being spent).

MikeM · Post #11 » by **MikeM** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:33 pm

I think Gibbons has about 1% of the blame. He's tried his best to keep things straightened out.

I liked how he moved Jose and EE up in the order when everyone was hurt instead of just inserting a scrub into the 2 hole like *every manager in baseball* does every year. And then he returned them to their normal spots when they cooled off.

Bullpen management has been top notch despite starters going 1 inning a game. There's only been a couple questionable bunt attempts but even last night was not the wrong decision with Lawrie. Statistically, you have a better chance of scoring just 1 run (and we only needed 1) if you bunt there then attempting to hit (I'm pretty sure).

I think people blaming motivation are just silly. We don't have a single starter worth a damn and they look like they're trying pretty hard. JJ's a FA next year ffs.

If you want to blame a coach, look at pitching and then hitting.

Post #12 » by **Geddy** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:56 pm

I wasn't a fan of the Gibbons hiring but I don't think firing him would change anything considering the way the team is built.

I would rather get rid of the hitting coach.

BigLeagueChew · Post #13 » by **BigLeagueChew** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 5:39 pm

Trade Gibbons for a utility infielder.

augustine · Post #14 » by **augustine** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:32 pm

Gibbons should be fired at the end of the season. He entered the season unprepared (did he even use his regular lineup in spring training?), he cannot put a lineup together (DeRosa 4th? Bautista 2nd?), he does not motivate players (this is the second players only meeting where they are forced to motivate themselves), he does not win you close games (example, safety squeeze to pick up an important run), he does not get his players to focus (so many wasted at bats - every at bat is a war that the player is being payed thousands of dollars to fight, an at bat is not a chance to stroll up to the plate and take three swings), and he has no air of gravitas which instils confidence.

Look at the other 4 AL East Managers:
The Red Sox where bad last year, until they switched managers
Yankees are getting the best out of former Jay rejects
Rays are always near the top with no payroll
The Orioles used to be a bad team, until they switched managers

The other AL East teams are prepared, have a system wide philosophy that works, and consistently have players that perform at their peak abilities. This is what it takes to win.

frizzer1 · Post #15 » by **frizzer1** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:08 pm

If the fans are to keep coming you have to sell hope.
While it makes no sense to me to fire him during this season, the jays have to bring in a new manager for a fresh start,next season..
Bringing Gibbons back would be a major mistake imo.

And although it has nothing to do with baseball...this guy Gibbons puts me to sleep...I can't listen to his interviews..it's just one long cliché....boring boring boring..

DonYon · Post #16 » by **DonYon** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:14 pm

I think firing him would be only be change for the sake of change. While that may spark the team, I would hesitate to point at Gibbons' incompetency as a manager as I believe he's doing his job just fine.

I agree with the interview stuff though... he has a tendency to ramble on and on about the same thing.

Post #17 » by **Rhettmatic** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:41 pm

I'm really rather indifferent, but I could see him being fired as a face-saving gesture.

JoeyBats · Post #18 » by **JoeyBats** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:45 pm

I rather have Gibbons, than say Farrall. Better bullpen management, less stupid base stealing attempts, and less popped up bunts.

SonOfRoy · Post #19 » by **SonOfRoy** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:21 pm

Fire Gibbons' ass! Not that the Jays record is entirely his fault, but he's not helping. I would make Demarlo Hale the manager today and see how he fares the rest of the season.

I never liked Gibbons. I don't think he provides anything.

Tyrone Slothrop · Post #20 » by **Tyrone Slothrop** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:56 pm

SonOfRoy wrote:Fire Gibbons' ass! Not that the Jays record is entirely his fault, but he's not helping. I would make Demarlo Hale the manager today and see how he fares the rest of the season.

I never liked Gibbons. I don't think he provides anything.

Good bullpen management is the most important thing a manager can provide. Gibbons provides that as well as any manager in baseball.

People talking about motivation are absolutely ridiculous. Do people really think a manager can motivate players to hit or pitch better??? I'm in shock that this line of thinking still exists amongst fans.

Should Gibbons be fired?