Otto Porter

[Ruzious]

I was:
1. Noel
2. Zeller
3. Oladipo/Porter
5. Burke

[Ruzious]

I can only remember Jroseth as a big Zeller supporter, Dipo also. In retrospect, I can also see Closg00 and Zonk being staunch supporters. Ruz and McQueen had their hands in too many honeypots to make an impression on me.

I think Sev was also a big supporter of Zeller and Dipo, but that Ruz guy and McQueen were Zeller's biggest and most consistent supporters.

[Kanyewest]

I can only remember Jroseth as a big Zeller supporter, Dipo also. In retrospect, I can also see Closg00 and Zonk being staunch supporters. Ruz and McQueen had their hands in too many honeypots to make an impression on me.

I think Sev was also a big supporter of Zeller and Dipo, but that Ruz guy and McQueen were Zeller's biggest and most consistent supporters.

Yup. And for the record I wasn't

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I had Noel rated slightly ahead of Porter. But only slightly. Porter rates in YODA as a solid prospect worthy of being picked in the top 5.

When Noah was available at 5 I was stunned. News of his knee also being injured when he was in HS gave me concerns.

I thought Olynyk and Zeller both made more sense than Porter. Olynyk in a trade down was a very clear best case on draft night.

I also would have been fine with Zeller at 3 because I liked Cody in the Beal draft. Zeller slumped this season, but he's still a top prospect.

[pancakes3]

I can only remember Jroseth as a big Zeller supporter, Dipo also. In retrospect, I can also see Closg00 and Zonk being staunch supporters. Ruz and McQueen had their hands in too many honeypots to make an impression on me.

I think Sev was also a big supporter of Zeller and Dipo, but that Ruz guy and McQueen were Zeller's biggest and most consistent supporters.

Sorry Ruz. Please take it in the spirit it was intended. You may well have been consistent in your support. It just didn't make a CCJ-esque stamp in my consciousness because you raised convincing arguments for many different prospects instead of being a single-issue campaigner. Plus, on top of that, Zeller got very little press. It was Bennett vs Porter for months and months and months.

[tontoz]

When word got out that he could shoot from the perimeter i said that i would be ok with Zeller but still preferred Porter. I seem to remember Ruz being Zeller's most consistent supporter, even when people were dogging him after his tourney performances.

[GhostsOfGil]

[tweet]http://twitter.com/WashWizards/status/364787910291111937[/tweet]

[stevemcqueen1]

Where were all the Zeller supporters in the draft thread?

Felt like Ruzious and I were damn near the only ones who liked him. All year long it was basically nothing but "T Rex arms, future bust, overrated, big white stiff, etc." whenever we brought him up.

Hey! I was there. Just not a volume poster. I said my piece, got mocked and trivialized, and I was done. Only so much IU hate I can stand.

I actually remember your posts because I was desperately searching for positivity about Zeller after a certain point.

Its pretty exhausting when 90% of everyone disagrees with you.

[Ruzious]

Where were all the Zeller supporters in the draft thread?

Felt like Ruzious and I were damn near the only ones who liked him. All year long it was basically nothing but "T Rex arms, future bust, overrated, big white stiff, etc." whenever we brought him up.

Hey! I was there. Just not a volume poster. I said my piece, got mocked and trivialized, and I was done. Only so much IU hate I can stand.

I actually remember your posts because I was desperately searching for positivity about Zeller after a certain point.

Its pretty exhausting when 90% of everyone disagrees with you.

And particularly after you go through that, it's nice to get a little recognition if/when it turns out you're probably right - as opposed to someone saying - meh, I don't remember you talking up such and such, for example. I've been guilty of doing that myself.

[stevemcqueen1]

I can only remember Jroseth as a big Zeller supporter, Dipo also. In retrospect, I can also see Closg00 and Zonk being staunch supporters. Ruz and McQueen had their hands in too many honeypots to make an impression on me.

I think Sev was also a big supporter of Zeller and Dipo, but that Ruz guy and McQueen were Zeller's biggest and most consistent supporters.

Sorry Ruz. Please take it in the spirit it was intended. You may well have been consistent in your support. It just didn't make a CCJ-esque stamp in my consciousness because you raised convincing arguments for many different prospects instead of being a single-issue campaigner. Plus, on top of that, Zeller got very little press. It was Bennett vs Porter for months and months and months.

A lot of people talked about Bennett, but I don't think Bennett actually had much support. I spent a lot of time arguing Bennett's positives, and even I preferred Porter over him. I'd actually say that, by draft day, the fan base would have rather had Zeller than Bennett. But most people assumed Noel would be gone and Porter was the overwhelming first choice.

This is roughly the timeline of the Zeller conversation:

- Beginning of season up until combine, "Big white stiff, T-Rex arms." Near total opposition, consensus that he's overrated, just a few intrepid posters that like him.
- Immediately post combine, "Wait a second." Interest starts picking up rapidly, start to see lukewarm support.
- Post workouts where he started shooting, "I'm fine with Zeller." Opposition to Zeller bleeds away, very few people prefer him, but lots would be OK with him now.

By contrast, the conversation about Bennett was fairly limited until after the season was over. Not much being said for or against him mid season. A lot of people saw Zeller play some games first hand this year and last. He was a face of college basketball. Bennett not being on TV here very much meant a different type of conversation. Not many people had a big problem with him until the draftnik echo-chamber wrote the book on him during the offseason. A few unflattering segments from a DX highlight video and some critical articles basically got taken as gospel because so few people actually watched his games during the season.

I can't remember exactly how I had it reasoned out in my head, but my top four was either

1.) Noel
2.) Porter
3.) Bennett
4.) Zeller

or

3.) Zeller
4.) Bennett

Zeller and Bennett were pretty evenly ranked for me. My top four ended up having three of the actual top four picks. That was a huge surprise to me. And an even bigger surprise was that Noel wasn't one of them.

[stevemcqueen1]

Hey! I was there. Just not a volume poster. I said my piece, got mocked and trivialized, and I was done. Only so much IU hate I can stand.

I actually remember your posts because I was desperately searching for positivity about Zeller after a certain point.

Its pretty exhausting when 90% of everyone disagrees with you.

And particularly after you go through that, it's nice to get a little recognition if/when it turns out you're probably right - as opposed to someone saying - meh, I don't remember you talking up such and such, for example. I've been guilty of doing that myself.

Yeah it is nice to get that validation. No matter how confident you are in your observations, doubts will still creep in if you're faced with pretty widespread disagreement.

But I actually don't mind when people don't remember all the times I was right about players in the past because it usually means they also don't remember all of the times I was wrong.

[dobrojim]

Don't break your arms patting yourself on the back re Zeller. There were a number
of folks, myself among them, that thought Zeller would be a decent pick although
most of us thought of him as a trade down target. Fish was another Zeller fan.

The season and seasons to come will show how right or wrong we were.

I also liked Olynyk. edit to add - AND Dipo.

[stevemcqueen1]

I find I can always remind people myself of when I was right about a player in the past. I can dig up old posts where, for example, I jumped on the RGIII bandwagon and called him being a top two pick after the game against TCU in week one of his junior year.

On the flip side, nothing need be said about other predictions, like how much I liked Blaine Gabbert .

[Zonkerbl]

I only had strong opinions about one guy. Glad I was right (well, so far at least) but I would've just chalked it up to IU homerism if I was wrong (well, what do you expect me to do? Not support an IU guy?).

[stevemcqueen1]

I only had strong opinions about one guy. Glad I was right (well, so far at least) but I would've just chalked it up to IU homerism if I was wrong (well, what do you expect me to do? Not support an IU guy?).

I try not to develop strong negative feelings about players, though I'm not always successful with that. I don't like getting into camps about players because I believe there are usually many paths that lead to success. I don't want to feel compelled to accept arguments I don't really believe because I've committed to one player and must reject another simply because he's different.

Basketball is such a dynamic game that it leads to a very wide variety of playing styles, both for players and teams as a whole. There are a lot of different ways to make the ball go in the hoop.

When I was a kid I shot free throws underhanded one season. My Grandpa taught me how to do it. Kept pointing to Rick Barry. I know I looked stupid as hell but I was a terrible shooter and didn't have the strength to release the ball high over my head and that shot worked better for me at the time.

[montestewart]

Don't break your arms patting yourself on the back re Zeller. There were a number
of folks, myself among them, that thought Zeller would be a decent pick although
most of us thought of him as a trade down target. Fish was another Zeller fan.

The season and seasons to come will show how right or wrong we were.

I also liked Olynyk. edit to add - AND Dipo.

Hey! What about me? I don't watch college ball, didn't recommend anyone, and said trade the pick.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I only had strong opinions about one guy. Glad I was right (well, so far at least) but I would've just chalked it up to IU homerism if I was wrong (well, what do you expect me to do? Not support an IU guy?).

I try not to develop strong negative feelings about players, though I'm not always successful with that. I don't like getting into camps about players because I believe there are usually many paths that lead to success. I don't want to feel compelled to accept arguments I don't really believe because I've committed to one player and must reject another simply because he's different.

Basketball is such a dynamic game that it leads to a very wide variety of playing styles, both for players and teams as a whole. There are a lot of different ways to make the ball go in the hoop.

When I was a kid I shot free throws underhanded one season. My Grandpa taught me how to do it. Kept pointing to Rick Barry. I know I looked stupid as hell but I was a terrible shooter and didn't have the strength to release the ball high over my head and that shot worked better for me at the time.

If you want to beat young guys in horse, underhanded free throws is good trick shot to use. Young guys don't seem to try that shot. Steve, your Grandpa taught you well.

Good points about there being many ways to put the ball in the hole. I think players can learn to shoot better be trying unconventional shots. Non-dominant hand free throws and practicing shooting one-handed set shot threes helps your jumper IMO. Being balanced and taking the same number of shots from both sides and with either hand helps. I almost never do them, but shooting free throws with your eyes closed is a confidence builder if you're able to drop shots in rhythm. Even with your eyes closed your shooting motion goes from your feet up to your knee bend up your hands and your release. I think great shooters don't even need to see the rim. A hand in their face doesn't bother them. I haven't done this part from game experience, but I think this would help anyone shoot better.

I'm not a shooting coach but I have seen these help my shooting.

[thricethefun]

I favored Noel, Len, and Mclemore all over Porter in this draft. Would've been ecstatic with Noel and very happy with Len. Mclemore to me is a less intelligent Beal with a slightly higher ceiling which if reached could make him great trade bait in the future. Thought Zeller would've been a reach at 8 and certainly a reach at 3. He looked good in summer league but lets see how he does against real NBA Centers. Porter screamed late lottery talent to me so I think it was a big reach picking him where we did.

[closg00]

http://wizardsxtra.com/2013/07/22/why-c ... i-leonard/

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

http://wizardsxtra.com/2013/07/22/why-cant-otto-porter-be-the-next-paul-george-or-kawhi-leonard/

closg00, I enjoyed the link. Leigh Allen's projections are hopefully going to be accurate.

Using George and Leonard’s stats as a blueprint, a rookie season average of 9ppg, 4rpg, an assist and a steal while shooting 35% from three would be more than sufficient in my opinion. Some Wizards fans might be upset with this production but if we use these stats as a guide and compensate for development with increased responsibility, then his stats will naturally increase similarly to George and Leonard. In his sophomore season, expect small increases but for his third season, the pressure will be on to identify whether he is capable of being an All-Star or just a supremely good DTA – something Kawhi Leonard is going to be judged upon in this upcoming season.

I already agree with the general idea that Otto Porter is going to take a while but will eventually become a very solid NBA player.