JV at EuroBasket 2013 is Done, Lithuania Gets Silver

Los Manos · Post #461 » by **Los Manos** » Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:23 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es2iPWsyti8[/youtube]

YoungG · Post #462 » by **YoungG** » Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:23 pm

For those like myself who couldn't see the game (crappy streams)...Here are the links for the full game as well as Jonas' highlights.

*Jonas Highlights*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYhqzd0V_Do

*Lithuania vs Sweden*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50dB-T71K60

UcanUwill · Post #463 » by **UcanUwill** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:59 am

AK47MVP wrote:...

I am a broken record focusing on one aspect of the game, just ball handling and keeping the ball safe, such minor nitpick, its just a point guard...
One aspect of the game could mean everything, and it does here. You could have all the skill in the world, yet one weakness could write off everything in basketball. If Cizauskas didnt had this problem, he would be an NBA player right now, you here me. I am aware of his skill fully. We can write scrolls of players who would be brilliant if not one aspect of their game, and vice versa.

What I am saying exactly, that he will not be better than any of his counterparts when he faces real competition. Your argument is that he is better, and he is not (neither of those players should be on a team by the way). It is called translating your game to next level, and he doesn't have the game (IMO). Just because one contributes more in first competition, does not mean he will be able to do the same against stronger competition. It is like you aren't aware of this concept. There is a reason why Raul Neto is more desirable prospect, tho he was not nearly as productive as Cizauskas in juniors.

Evaluate player's skill and try to predict his translation instead of looking at his plain numbers against the Swedish... Other team with quicker rotations and hands would often intercept those panicy passes and would give him way more trouble.

MEDIC · Post #464 » by **MEDIC** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:22 am

Los Manos wrote:[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es2iPWsyti8[/youtube]

Thanks Los Manos.

Jonas looking like a Lithuanian Tyson Chandler now that the beard is filling in. :lol:

I have a feeling JV is going to live at the FT line this season.

SkywalkerAC · Post #465 » by **SkywalkerAC** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:45 am

MEDIC wrote:
Los Manos wrote:[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es2iPWsyti8[/youtube]

Thanks Los Manos.

Jonas looking like a Lithuanian Tyson Chandler now that the beard is filling in.

I have a feeling JV is going to live at the FT line this season.

He's going to feast around the rim, from the line, and the midrange next year and for many years to come. Those consistent parades to the line really do pay off though when you hit at a high rate. It's the most efficient way to end a possession aside from assisting dunks, which you can't rely on.

Anatomize · Post #466 » by **Anatomize** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:04 am

I haven't been able to watch the games, but I'm assuming that his missed FTs are due to fatigue from the increased post play. That takes a lot out of you physically when you're constantly hitting big bodies on both ends.

BackseatBoss · Post #467 » by **BackseatBoss** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:39 am

I really like Jonas' new look. I mean he doesn't look pretty or anything like that, he looks intimidating. Hopefully he keeps the beard for a long time and doesn't just clean shave it.

Post #468 » by **Patman** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:30 pm

Anatomize wrote:I haven't been able to watch the games, but I'm assuming that his missed FTs are due to fatigue from the increased post play. That takes a lot out of you physically when you're constantly hitting big bodies on both ends.

That might mean he has to change his mechanics. Maybe a shot that has less movement. A shooting stroke that requires more fin motor skills is more prone to spells of fatigue.

pspot · Post #469 » by **pspot** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:56 pm

JV makes me want to watch basketball

AK47MVP · Post #470 » by **AK47MVP** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:57 pm

UcanUwill wrote: just ball handling and keeping the ball safe, such minor nitpick, its just a point guard...
One aspect of the game could mean everything, and it does here. You could have all the skill in the world, yet one weakness could write off everything in basketball. If Cizauskas didnt had this problem, he would be an NBA player right now, you here me. .

He is young kid and has all the time in the world to improve and get better - show me which PG from Europe was NBA level at his age? Tony Parker, Rubio ( who still turns the ball over at alarming rate so his ball handling skills are not up to you standard I guess, lol) and I basically that's it. To be honest we are not talking about NBA level player here. We are talking about backup PG for LT NT who at best will play 10 min in Eurobasket and will have very minimal impact. Since you agreed that we have no better backup PG available I think we can stop discussing Cizauskas ball handling issues.

Clementine9 · Post #471 » by **Clementine9** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:27 pm

Anatomize wrote:I haven't been able to watch the games, but I'm assuming that his missed FTs are due to fatigue from the increased post play. That takes a lot out of you physically when you're constantly hitting big bodies on both ends.

Nah, they aren't falling short or anything. None of them are ugly misses. I'd say usually it's back rim then out, or rattling around these unforgiving rims and then out. My guess is the issue lies more in his added strength. He'll adjust. 66% isn't horrible, we'd just all like him to get back into the 75-80 range

... WHICH HE WILL!

DarrylFlicking · Post #472 » by **DarrylFlicking** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:35 pm

Clementine9 wrote:
Anatomize wrote:I haven't been able to watch the games, but I'm assuming that his missed FTs are due to fatigue from the increased post play. That takes a lot out of you physically when you're constantly hitting big bodies on both ends.

Nah, they aren't falling short or anything. None of them are ugly misses. I'd say usually it's back rim then out, or rattling around these unforgiving rims and then out. My guess is the issue lies more in his added strength. He'll adjust. 66% isn't horrible, we'd just all like him to get back into the 75-80 range ... WHICH HE WILL!

If you watch the highlights, his form looks great! Same shot he always takes with good arc and backspin. He also looks very calm at the line. Everyone dips a little in stretches (even Nash, Caldy, Allen), but he looks like a career 75% FT shooter to me.

Post #473 » by **pbj** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:44 pm

Let's not settle for 75%..he should aim to tie Jose's record for season %, but on 10 times more attempts

UcanUwill · Post #474 » by **UcanUwill** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:52 pm

AK47MVP wrote: He is young kid and has all the time in the world to improve and get better - show me which PG from Europe was NBA level at his age? Tony Parker, Rubio ( who still turns the ball over at alarming rate so his ball handling skills are not up to you standard I guess, lol) and I basically that's it. To be honest we are not talking about NBA level player here. We are talking about backup PG for LT NT who at best will play 10 min in Eurobasket and will have very minimal impact. Since you agreed that we have no better backup PG available I think we can stop discussing Cizauskas ball handling issues.

You keep missing the point. Where did I said I want NBA caliber player? I wanted to shoe I am aware of his separate skill, and that one aspect of the game can mean the world. Team has better option, how come player, who most likely be absolutely unplayable in my opinion, be the best option? He is not the option whatsoever.

P.S. So you asked, he is 21 years old, he would have been junior in college. Yeah, we get 21 year old NBA caliber players, one German was drafted this year and hes looking good, dont worry about it.

Clementine9 · Post #475 » by **Clementine9** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:15 pm

DarrylFlicking wrote:
If you watch the highlights, his form looks great! Same shot he always takes with good arc and backspin. He also looks very calm at the line. Everyone dips a little in stretches (even Nash, Caldy, Allen), but he looks like a career 75% FT shooter to me.

Agreed!

SkywalkerAC · Post #476 » by **SkywalkerAC** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:41 pm

pspot wrote:JV makes me want to watch basketball

Amen to that. He plays "the right way" but it's also a joy to watch, like everything he touches turns to gold. Okay, that's a bit of hyperbole but you know what I mean, even his passing game from the high post is starting to look nice. If you get him shots around the rim or where he's able to go to work 1 on 1, you're going to get high percentage looks time in and time out, even at the NBA level.

Yes, he's going to struggle with defensive pressure, especially if we tank on him but I think his bball acumen and stamina are ready to take on that challenge.

What if we actually learn how to get him on the pick and roll?

AK47MVP · Post #477 » by **AK47MVP** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:54 am

UcanUwill wrote:
You keep missing the point. Where did I said I want NBA caliber player? I wanted to shoe I am aware of his separate skill, and that one aspect of the game can mean the world. Team has better option, how come player, who most likely be absolutely unplayable in my opinion, be the best option? He is not the option whatsoever.

P.S. So you asked, he is 21 years old, he would have been junior in college. Yeah, we get 21 year old NBA caliber players, one German was drafted this year and hes looking good, dont worry about it.

You said if he had good ballhandling skills he would be in NBA - so other skills like passing, defense, rebounding and shooting must be on NBA level? I am very curious to finally see what is "better option " since you bashing Cizauskas since first post but not naming anybody who should be LT backup PG in your opinion.
Schroeder was drafted - does not mean he can play or will be successful in NBA. He is same unproven rookie like anybody else. I like him a lot and I think he will be great but to mention him as NBA level is a bit premature.

VanGuard · Post #478 » by **VanGuard** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:28 am

Javtokas, Kleiza and Seibutis are not playing today

rmnts · Post #479 » by **rmnts** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:39 pm

Last game I was hopping to see lineup of cizauskas, juskevicius, kuzminskas, d-mo and JV. Maybe this time we'll be lucky. Last time it was 4 of them on court at the same time. This time hoping for all 5. In all seriousness I think first one to go will be juskevicius. He brings nothing to the table.

UcanUwill · Post #480 » by **UcanUwill** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:05 pm

AK47MVP wrote: You said if he had good ballhandling skills he would be in NBA - so other skills like passing, defense, rebounding and shooting must be on NBA level? I am very curious to finally see what is "better option " since you bashing Cizauskas since first post but not naming anybody who should be LT backup PG in your opinion.
Schroeder was drafted - does not mean he can play or will be successful in NBA. He is same unproven rookie like anybody else. I like him a lot and I think he will be great but to mention him as NBA level is a bit premature.

Cizauskas was a pretty damn good player in juniors. Granted, his superior built and athleticism helped a lot, but he does have skill. Yeah, if he had at least Calderon handle, he would end up in the NBA. His defense and rebounding could be NBA level, I mean not from day one, but there are players in the NBA, who are way worse in those categories. Cizauskas is superior to Neto in a lot of individual categories, and Neto was drafted, and he does look like he has a shot.

I think you are a casual fan. By saying this, I aint mean bad, and not saying I am right, but you are not doing a good job trying to convince me otherwise. You are making casual observations unrelated to my point I think.

Player could have a very good game, but you, as evaluator, could still form a negative opinion. Thats because you are not writing a grade of the game, but because you break him down and try to predict how his game will translate against better players.
Cizauskas always had a game breaking red flag for me, and it was very present in the last game. It wasn't looking good for him at all in my opinion. Fact he produced smth against the Swedish does not change that fact. When you said he looks good I shook my head. Maybe I am overreacting, but I dont think I am, I saw him ''handling'' tight defense before, and it was terrible, its when scouts leaves the building. The last game was a reminder.

Lithuanian team obviously has near to none to choose from. But the best option remains that Delininkaitis guy by a landslide. He can handle the ball at least, though not a real PG, he is playable, he is not a game breaker by any means.