Raps' Official 2013 Offseason Transaction Idea Thread, Pt. 2

[sweetcity]

if we dont tank I suggest offering a package of

Kyle Lowry + T Ross + Gray + Knicks 1st for Rajon Rondo

DD + Amir for Monroe + Stuckey and CV

Rondo - Augustine
Stuckey - Buycks
Gay - Fields - Novak
Monroe - Daye - Novak
JV - Hansborough - CV

[ballislife]

I insist you start putting -ice at the end of your posts again.

-ice

^This

F**k it, start putting "-ice" at the end of your posts again.. It distinguishes u from others on this board.. I take what I said back. Do your thing homie.

[LoveMyRaps]

Rudy Gay trade rumors swirling out there on Twitter? Any truth to this?

[Ice102]

Rudy Gay trade rumors swirling out there on Twitter? Any truth to this?

My sources tell me that there is a chance Rudy could or could not be traded. In regards to the timeframe, I'm hearing within 12 months. There are multiple teams interested. Masai is said to be hearing offers.

-Doug Smith



(But seriously, are there rumours?)

[Ice102]

F**k it, start putting "-ice" at the end of your posts again.. It distinguishes u from others on this board.. I take what I said back. Do your thing homie.

-Ice

[LoveMyRaps]

Rudy Gay trade rumors swirling out there on Twitter? Any truth to this?

My sources tell me that there is a chance Rudy could or could not be traded. In regards to the timeframe, I'm hearing within 12 months. There are multiple teams interested. Masai is said to be hearing offers.

-Doug Smith



(But seriously, are there rumours?)

The twitter page name is @TheNBACentral...they broke the rumor first. Apparently Masai is trying to get rid of Rudy and his ugly contract.
@TheNBACentral has 5.3k followers and is following only 1 person.
Its the official NBA channel of DefPenRadio (never heard of that)

I don't know if any of this is true...but I hope it is.

[Ice102]

Rudy Gay trade rumors swirling out there on Twitter? Any truth to this?

My sources tell me that there is a chance Rudy could or could not be traded. In regards to the timeframe, I'm hearing within 12 months. There are multiple teams interested. Masai is said to be hearing offers.

-Doug Smith



(But seriously, are there rumours?)

The twitter page name is @TheNBACentral...they broke the rumor first. Apparently Masai is trying to get rid of Rudy and his ugly contract.
@TheNBACentral has 5.3k followers and is following only 1 person.
Its the official NBA channel of DefPenRadio (never heard of that)

I don't know if any of this is true...but I hope it is.

Thanks buddy, I hope so too. Hopefully get this tank rolling.

[sca]

Lol at "Elite 3rd Big"

This summer I've become a fan of both Zeller brothers. I think their talent is closer to the Gasol brothers than most people give them credit for. If they were European, people would probably come around to their potential, but since they're white Americans, they get knocked a bit more.

Tyler looked very good in the Team USA scrimmage and like his brother, will be a starting center within a few years.

I said elite 3rd big because we couldn't start him with Jonas even once Tyler is developed. So he'd be a bench big for us until a quality trade offer presented itself.

Depends on what you mean by "closer" but chances are you're really, really overrating the Zeller duo.

[Volcano]

To Toronto:
Greg Monroe 4.1
Arron Afflalo 7.75
Al Harrington 3.6
(Gives up Derozan 9.5, Ross 2.7, Hansbrough 3.2, NYK pick, two 2nd rounders)

To Orlando:
Terrence Ross 2.7
CharlieV 8.6
2 Toronto 2nd rounders
(Gives up Afflalo 7.75, Al Harrington 3.6)

To Detroit:
Demar Derozan 9.5
Tyler Hansbrough 3.2
Toronto's NYK pick
(Gives up Greg Monroe 4.1, CharlieV 8.6)

JonasV/Amir/Gray
Greg Monroe/Acy/Al Harrington
Rudy Gay/Novak/Daye
Afflalo/Fields/QRich
Lowry/Buycks/Augustin

Toronto
Gets a borderline all-star at PF with weak D. Gets a end-high 3+D role player at SG. Loses role players (at best) in TH/Ross, the "Bargnani picks", and Derozan.

Detroit
Win now-mode. Wants to get rid of Monroe. Has a hole at SG, receives a young up and coming volume scoring SG who's good buddies with Jennings. Receives a tough back-up PF. Both win-now players. Gets a low 1st round pick to top it off.

Orlando
Rebuilding. Wants to get rid of Afflalo. Gets a large expiring in CV31. Gets a young player in Ross. Gets two 2nd rounders to top it off.

[sweetcity]

To Toronto:
Greg Monroe 4.1
Arron Afflalo 7.75
Al Harrington 3.6
(Gives up Derozan 9.5, Ross 2.7, Hansbrough 3.2, NYK pick, two 2nd rounders)

To Orlando:
Terrence Ross 2.7
CharlieV 8.6
2 Toronto 2nd rounders
(Gives up Afflalo 7.75, Al Harrington 3.6)

To Detroit:
Demar Derozan 9.5
Tyler Hansbrough 3.2
Toronto's NYK pick
(Gives up Greg Monroe 4.1, CharlieV 8.6)

JonasV/Amir/Gray
Greg Monroe/Acy/Al Harrington
Rudy Gay/Novak/Daye
Afflalo/Fields/QRich
Lowry/Buycks/Augustin

Toronto
Gets a borderline all-star at PF with weak D. Gets a end-high 3+D role player at SG. Loses role players (at best) in TH/Ross, the "Bargnani picks", and Derozan.

Detroit
Win now-mode. Wants to get rid of Monroe. Has a hole at SG, receives a young up and coming volume scoring SG who's good buddies with Jennings. Receives a tough back-up PF. Both win-now players. Gets a low 1st round pick to top it off.

Orlando
Rebuilding. Wants to get rid of Afflalo. Gets a large expiring in CV31. Gets a young player in Ross. Gets two 2nd rounders to top it off.

pretty good looking trade, looks realistic to me

[Ice102]

No it doesn't, sorry. Detroit would never trade Monroe for DeRozan because Monroe has more value than that. And unless Ross develops his game this season, Orlando probably passes as well.

[Volcano]

Considering the contracts they gave Ben Gordon, CV31 and how they got Jennings, I wouldn't say Detroit would never do it. Yeah, they don't have equal value, that's why the trade isn't only for DD.

DD also has name value, was on the Olympic select team, has had 3 seasons where he averaged more points than Monroe ever has, and the SG position is currently the weakest in the league. Josh Smith is his best at PF and moving him there would be in Detroit's best interest. Hansbrough is also a Piston-type of player and would have value to a competing team.

Monroe's actually had several HORRIBLE shooting games last season along with several games where his minutes got cut short. You'd think he'd get more minutes on such a talentless team. His FG% has also dropped every season. Every season Monroe tried to score more, his efficiency dropped. Lack of D from a big is also more detrimental than lack of D from a wing.

So what's Monroe's major advantage compared to DD with respect to his position? His passing? Well, getting a first round pick and a serviceable role player isn't too bad as compensation, considering Josh Smith basically replaces his passing and more. Detroit becomes MUCH more balanced, gets a little more depth, gets an equal or better volume scorer and the defense essentially stays the same. Anything they lose in Monroe would have been redundant with Josh Smith.

Orlando probably does it if we switch the Knicks pick with the two 2nd rounders. No team is going to purposely give a lotto pick for Afflalo. The fact that they can save money and gain capspace by getting an expiring has value as well. They also free up a space for Oladipo and helps their tank movement. To be honest, they don't need anymore young guys unless it's a superstar/all-star type..and nobody's gonna give them that for Afflalo. Their best bet is to tank.

[Ice102]

Great response.

However, my issue with DeRozan for Monroe, in DET's eyes, is that they can get more value than DeRozan (and Hansbrough is not enough to even things out). I'm not saying I'm a huge Monroe fan (he's good, but still a lot of question marks - by the way, since you listed many of those question marks, why the interest from a Raptors standpoint?), but his value is a bit higher than DeRozan's at the moment and bigs 'typically' have more value. Sure, Smith works better at the 4, but there's plenty of minutes for (a developing) Drummond, Smith and Monroe rotation. And if they want to trade Monroe, then they can probably get a bit more value elsewhere.

Orlando is going to tank regardless, with Afflalo or not. You say they don't need anymore prospects, but you're giving them Ross in the deal. From ORL's point of view, it's not a bad deal, just not very useful for them.

Not necessarily a bad deal, just stating my thoughts on it. I appreciate the detailed response, always interesting to discuss ideas.

[Ice102]

Not to mention in all of this, if you make this trade, then where do you see Toronto going forward? Playoffs I assume?

[sweetcity]

Detroit and Toronto make a tone of sense from a transaction standpoint... Jennings and DeRozan are buddies, smith and Gay are buddies, Detroit is win now, hopefully we are rebuilding.

Lets just do

Gay + DeRozan + Amir + for Calwell Pope + Monroe + Jerebko + CV + Stuckey

Detroit jumps into top 5 contention and we suck

Jennings - Billups - Bynum
DeRozan - Singler - Magette
Gay - Datome - Magette
Smith - Amir - Mitchell
Drummond - Amir - Harrellson

Lowry - Buycks - Augustine
KCP - Ross - Stuckey
Fields - Daye - Novak
Monroe - CV - Daye
JV - Hansborough - Gray

trade lowry for a pick (draft a PG) Nab Wiggins or Parker resign Monroe

[Volcano]

Great response.

However, my issue with DeRozan for Monroe, in DET's eyes, is that they can get more value than DeRozan (and Hansbrough is not enough to even things out). I'm not saying I'm a huge Monroe fan (he's good, but still a lot of question marks - by the way, since you listed many of those question marks, why the interest from a Raptors standpoint?), but his value is a bit higher than DeRozan's at the moment and bigs 'typically' have more value. Sure, Smith works better at the 4, but there's plenty of minutes for (a developing) Drummond, Smith and Monroe rotation. And if they want to trade Monroe, then they can probably get a bit more value elsewhere.

Orlando is going to tank regardless, with Afflalo or not. You say they don't need anymore prospects, but you're giving them Ross in the deal. From ORL's point of view, it's not a bad deal, just not very useful for them.

Not necessarily a bad deal, just stating my thoughts on it. I appreciate the detailed response, always interesting to discuss ideas.

I'm skeptical about the deals as well, but that's the argument I would tell the opposing teams. I usually don't like proposing trades where we don't get the best bang for our buck. It's probably something similar to what I would start out with if we're actually discussing a deal between these teams. How other organizations value different players need to be taken on an individual basis, so it's always good to start out assuming they regard our own players on the higher end.

Another point is, names sell in this league. Like Colangelo, for instance, went after more well known names without looking at how they actually played or what their situation was. Kapono shoots 50% from 3 and Miami gets to the finals? He picks him up for big money. Hedo makes the finals and a few highlight plays? Goes after him. JO is a former all-star? Goes after him. There are GM's like that.

Another example, we'd be hard pressed to get great value for Amir. On the other hand, we thought we'd only get trash for Bargnani and that we'd have to give away a pick just to get rid of him. Instead, we got 3 picks (albeit low picks) back just because he was associated with being our main player. In fact, a lot of teams had trouble playing against Bargnani because he's such an unorthodox player. Sometimes the perception of those one or two plays/game where Bargnani had the opposing D bamboozled is all you need. Didn't he get like 41 points vs the Knicks before? Fans wanted to amnesty him, Ujiri wanted to get the most value out of him.

I think Derozan's a big enough name and Hansbrough is also a well recognized name and has a well-known reputation around the league. I don't necessarily think Monroe's a much bigger name than DD. Just because we don't value DD doesn't mean other teams don't. If Detroit really wants to trade Monroe, then they likely don't value him as much as us fans do.

I actually don't like Monroe that much, the reason I built a trade around him is because he was mentioned here and there were rumours about Detroit wanting to trade him. Still, he's a little more versatile than DD (good off rebounder, good passer). Our team lacks passing more than Detroit. Also, we need to spread the floor better and it's hard to do that with DD at SG (unless he develops a 3). I don't think we need Monroe to score that much either. He doesn't need to be the #1 option anymore and I think that'll raise his percentages.

As for Orlando..their only major incentive in this trade is if their owners are stingy and want to save money while gaining some minor assets along the way. Their other option is to look for another Bledsoe, but there aren't that many scenarios like that in the league (a young player oozing with potential on a contending team not getting minutes because he's playing behind another superstar).

[jimmy keys]

To Toronto:
Greg Monroe 4.1
Arron Afflalo 7.75
Al Harrington 3.6
(Gives up Derozan 9.5, Ross 2.7, Hansbrough 3.2, NYK pick, two 2nd rounders)

To Orlando:
Terrence Ross 2.7
CharlieV 8.6
2 Toronto 2nd rounders
(Gives up Afflalo 7.75, Al Harrington 3.6)

To Detroit:
Demar Derozan 9.5
Tyler Hansbrough 3.2
Toronto's NYK pick
(Gives up Greg Monroe 4.1, CharlieV 8.6)

JonasV/Amir/Gray
Greg Monroe/Acy/Al Harrington
Rudy Gay/Novak/Daye
Afflalo/Fields/QRich
Lowry/Buycks/Augustin

Toronto
Gets a borderline all-star at PF with weak D. Gets a end-high 3+D role player at SG. Loses role players (at best) in TH/Ross, the "Bargnani picks", and Derozan.

Detroit
Win now-mode. Wants to get rid of Monroe. Has a hole at SG, receives a young up and coming volume scoring SG who's good buddies with Jennings. Receives a tough back-up PF. Both win-now players. Gets a low 1st round pick to top it off.

Orlando
Rebuilding. Wants to get rid of Afflalo. Gets a large expiring in CV31. Gets a young player in Ross. Gets two 2nd rounders to top it off.

You're not getting Monroe for DeRozan dude. Common man get real, this is homerism at it's finest.

[LoveMyRaps]

Toronto IN: Greg Monroe, Vince Carter, Rodney Stuckey, Charlie Villanueva, 1ST Round Pick 2014 (Dallas)
Toronto Out: Rudy Gay, Demar Derozan, 1ST Round Pick 2016 (NYK), Terrence Ross

Dallas IN: Terrence Ross, K. Caldwell Pope, 1ST Round Pick 2016 (NYK)
Dallas Out: Vince Carter, Jae Crowder

Detroit IN: Rudy Gay, Demar Derozan, Jae Crowder
Detroit Out: Greg Monroe, Rodney Stuckey, K. Caldwell Pope, Charlie Villanueva
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Thoughts on this deal??
I think its a pretty good deal.

Dallas gets rid of an expiring contract and receive 2 solid prospects!

Toronto gets rid of two overpaid players and receive a Greg Monroe one of the best young big men in the league, and ALSO an unprotected first rounder (which potentially could be a high pick) and VINSANITY RETURNS TO T.DOT (to finish off his career)

Detroit wants to contend! Give em Rudy and Demar!! A line up of Jennings/Derozan/Gay/Smith/Drummond is NASTYYY!!

[sca]

To Toronto:
Greg Monroe 4.1
Arron Afflalo 7.75
Al Harrington 3.6
(Gives up Derozan 9.5, Ross 2.7, Hansbrough 3.2, NYK pick, two 2nd rounders)

To Orlando:
Terrence Ross 2.7
CharlieV 8.6
2 Toronto 2nd rounders
(Gives up Afflalo 7.75, Al Harrington 3.6)

To Detroit:
Demar Derozan 9.5
Tyler Hansbrough 3.2
Toronto's NYK pick
(Gives up Greg Monroe 4.1, CharlieV 8.6)

JonasV/Amir/Gray
Greg Monroe/Acy/Al Harrington
Rudy Gay/Novak/Daye
Afflalo/Fields/QRich
Lowry/Buycks/Augustin

Toronto
Gets a borderline all-star at PF with weak D. Gets a end-high 3+D role player at SG. Loses role players (at best) in TH/Ross, the "Bargnani picks", and Derozan.

Detroit
Win now-mode. Wants to get rid of Monroe. Has a hole at SG, receives a young up and coming volume scoring SG who's good buddies with Jennings. Receives a tough back-up PF. Both win-now players. Gets a low 1st round pick to top it off.

Orlando
Rebuilding. Wants to get rid of Afflalo. Gets a large expiring in CV31. Gets a young player in Ross. Gets two 2nd rounders to top it off.

You're not getting Monroe for DeRozan dude. Common man get real, this is homerism at it's finest.

It's actually Monroe and Afflalo... but wait, there's more! Order now and you'll get a free sample of Al Harrington!

Yeah, not going to happen.

[sweetcity]

Toronto IN: Greg Monroe, Vince Carter, Rodney Stuckey, Charlie Villanueva, 1ST Round Pick 2014 (Dallas)
Toronto Out: Rudy Gay, Demar Derozan, 1ST Round Pick 2016 (NYK), Terrence Ross

Dallas IN: Terrence Ross, K. Caldwell Pope, 1ST Round Pick 2016 (NYK)
Dallas Out: Vince Carter, Jae Crowder

Detroit IN: Rudy Gay, Demar Derozan, Jae Crowder
Detroit Out: Greg Monroe, Rodney Stuckey, K. Caldwell Pope, Charlie Villanueva
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Thoughts on this deal??
I think its a pretty good deal.

Dallas gets rid of an expiring contract and receive 2 solid prospects!

Toronto gets rid of two overpaid players and receive a Greg Monroe one of the best young big men in the league, and ALSO an unprotected first rounder (which potentially could be a high pick) and VINSANITY RETURNS TO T.DOT (to finish off his career)

Detroit wants to contend! Give em Rudy and Demar!! A line up of Jennings/Derozan/Gay/Smith/Drummond is NASTYYY!!

doesnt make sense, KCP + Ross + A 1ST for VC? way way way way way too much