most clutch players in NBA

[dynamic duo]

Lebron is not clutch.
(BTW it's not the end of the world for you Lebron bandwagoners that he is not clutch. He's still the best player right now).


The real question is ... where's Dirk?

I'm a bulls fan. LeBron is ridiculously clutch.
http://stats.nba.com/leaguePlayerClutch ... tOrder=DES

you were saying?

Lebron is not clutch

Do explain or are you one of those "eye test" guys.

[Dupp]

Any current list without Lebron and Durant at the top is wrong.

Edit - why do peopel post stats on last second shots as if thats proof one way or another. There more to being clutch than hitting game winners.

[springz]

Joe Johnson did an amazing job last season of playing like crap all game then hitting a ridiculous clutch shot.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI6AycDAJzQ[/youtube]

[T-D0G]

Rudy Gay is pretty clutch

[Rasho_libre]

Lebron is not clutch.
(BTW it's not the end of the world for you Lebron bandwagoners that he is not clutch. He's still the best player right now).


The real question is ... where's Dirk?

The Kobe myths lol. Statiscally, visual proof, team clutch stats all point to Lebron, dirk and cp3. Guys that go 6-24 and perform worse in big games compared to their rivals is not the not the most clutch player in the league. Unless you consider clutch a guy who will just shoot no matter the circumstance whether 1 guys on him or 3.

Im a knick fan and I concur. Watching the Miami/Pacers series after the Pacers beat us, Miami wasn't looking all that much better against them from a execution standpoint of their offense. The difference is in the biggest spots Lebron was able to take his game to a higher level than Carmelo could. It no longer was about the Heat or the big three. Lebron DID look like Cleveland Lebron there and its what carried hem over the top. People base clutchness on a last shot. Lebron has clutch quarters, games. I don't think I'll ever be a fan of Lebron but his greatness is undeniable.

But besides that I just wanna throw Stephen Curry's name out there. Dude is lethal at the wrong time, if you're playing against him.

But if he misses a three or does a costly turnover his haters forget all the times he is often clutch. Offensively and defensively. But what do we know they still haven't defined what clutch is.

[TheChosen618]

I honestly think "clutch" is just a bunch of b.s. that is used for cool narratives and stories. The most clutch players are already the best players. Players are clutch because they are already great players in the first place. Nobody gains some sort of superpower in the last minutes of the game because if that was the case we would see a bunch of mediocre players become dominant players at the end of games and that never happens.

Clutch is not a skillset. You could argue Player A is more clutch than Player B because he has a more dependable jump shot or has more moves in his arsenal but since we have so much data now on everything we can tell whether those theories are true or not. This seems to be the case when debating who is more clutch between Lebron and Kobe but just about every metric shows that Lebron is more clutch than Kobe. I don't think it's because Lebron is more "clutch" or "mentally tougher" than Kobe. I think it's just because he is simply a better player than he is.

The other important aspect when discussing "clutch" is fatigue. Some players are just more worn down than others because they have to do more of the heavy lifting in the first 3 quarters or play more minutes. This absolutely happened to Kevin Durant in the 2013 WCSF against the Grizzlies. It doesn't mean that player is worse or not as reliable as another but it simply means he is put in more of a situation to do poorly at the end of games than another.

Keep in mind that I do believe the mental aspect and the intangible aspect of the game exists but these are professional athletes here. They wouldn't be at this level if they were so mentally weak. We also have no idea what is running through their head unless they admit that the pressure got to them in a post-game conference. There is nothing more annoying than people acting like they know exactly what is running through another person's head.

[BmanInBigD]

Kobe has to be the most clutch. I saw him make a last second shot once about 10 years ago and they kept showing it over and over for weeks so I figured it most have been the most clutch, greatest shot in the history of ever.

[Rasho_libre]

Lets put it this way. If I need a shot and that shot for some reason has to be a wild fadeaway beyond 23 feet over 2 or 3 defenders,I take kobe. Maybe that's what Kobe fans mean. He is one of if not the best tough shot maker in nba history. That is as close to a compliment I can give right now regarding the clutch argument.

[Weems]

2000-2012 "clutch" shooting stats (playoffs included): http://tinyurl.com/6mblm2e

Nash and LeBron stand out as particularly great. Terry, Allen, Duncan, Dirk, KG very solid as well.

This is a LeBron post, so additionally I gathered his 2013 stats from NBA.com.

LeBron's 2013 regular season clutch stats (PER/36 minutes): 29.1 PTS, 11.8 REB, 11.2 AST on 55.6 TS%. A meaty triple double average. His 2013 playoff stats were similar, where his TS% managed to rise to 60.2% (15%+ higher than Durant, Parker, Pierce, Melo, Lawson, Duncan, Curry, Deron, J.R. to name a few) while his PTS dropped by 3.

He was 1st in AST and 8th in REB in the clutch on a per-minute basis during the regular season among fairly loosely qualifying players. Absurd.

If you're thinking he shies away from shooting in the clutch, the table from the earlier link indicates that he's comfortably placed 2nd in FGA in the clutch from 2000-2012 on a per-minute basis; he's only 4th in raw FGA due to having played fewer seasons than those ahead of him. Bonus: he averaged 49.6, 42, and 42 PTS PER/36 on insane efficiency in the clutch his last 3 seasons in Cleveland.

Finally, this is more about praising LeBron than disparaging Kobe. Once again from that earlier table, here are LeBron and Kobe's points per shot (no FTA) in the clutch and remember that this spans over 1,000 FGA each. Kobe .86 PPS and LeBron 1.012 PPS.

[Nutella]

LeBron/CP3

[mademan]

1. Lebron
2. Paul
3.Kyrie
4.Durant
5. R. Allen

[Dupp]

1. Lebron
2. Paul
3.Kyrie
4.Durant
5. R. Allen

Kyries not even close to durant. Im a cavs fan too but thats a ridiculous assertion.

[mademan]

1. Lebron
2. Paul
3.Kyrie
4.Durant
5. R. Allen

Kyries not even close to durant. Im a cavs fan too but thats a ridiculous assertion.

Probably selective personal bias, and probably because i'm a kyrie homer but the dude is remarkable in the 4th quarter.

[UnderdogRaptors]

1.) Melo (even tho i dont like his playing style)
2.) Durant
3.) LBJ
4.) Kobe
5.) Gay

[Rasho_libre]

My personal list

Lbj
Dirk
Durant
Cp3
Kobe

[TheOUTLAW]

1. Lebron
2. Paul
3.Kyrie
4.Durant
5. R. Allen

Kyries not even close to durant. Im a cavs fan too but thats a ridiculous assertion.

Probably selective personal bias, and probably because i'm a kyrie homer but the dude is remarkable in the 4th quarter.

I definitely wouldn't be surprised if his stats weren't completely ridiculous in clutch situations but yeah, I wouldn't want to mention him with Durant at this point.

[Dupp]

1. Lebron
2. Paul
3.Kyrie
4.Durant
5. R. Allen

Kyries not even close to durant. Im a cavs fan too but thats a ridiculous assertion.

Probably selective personal bias, and probably because i'm a kyrie homer but the dude is remarkable in the 4th quarter.

He is. But guys like lebron and durant do more and do it more often. The consistency part is a big thing for me and why i have those two head and shoulders above the rest because they always do it, with cp3 not far behind.

Kyrie at his best is as good as anyone in clutch situations but consistency is what makes the good great. We take for granted what players like lebron does in the clutch. He does it all, big rebounds, stops, buckets, changes the momentum in games etc the list goes on.

[Paradise]

I honestly think "clutch" is just a bunch of b.s. that is used for cool narratives and stories. The most clutch players are already the best players. Players are clutch because they are already great players in the first place. Nobody gains some sort of superpower in the last minutes of the game because if that was the case we would see a bunch of mediocre players become dominant players at the end of games and that never happens.

Clutch is not a skillset. You could argue Player A is more clutch than Player B because he has a more dependable jump shot or has more moves in his arsenal but since we have so much data now on everything we can tell whether those theories are true or not. This seems to be the case when debating who is more clutch between Lebron and Kobe but just about every metric shows that Lebron is more clutch than Kobe. I don't think it's because Lebron is more "clutch" or "mentally tougher" than Kobe. I think it's just because he is simply a better player than he is.

No. That's not how it works.

Joe Johnson was the clutchest player in the league last year. He was around 90% in 24 seconds or less I believe all season including postseason. That does not make him the "best" player and while he is Top 10 at his position, you can easily call him a mediocre player that dominates end of games.

Carmelo has more clutch last second percentages than Kobe. That doesn't make him the better player either. Clutch is a skill in my opinion.

[AshyLarry]

kobe is my second fav player, but lets be real. hes mediocre at clutchness.

how did kobe get that rep?
1. the same way he gets his last couple all defensive teams. through reputation
2. people knows hes the closest thing to jordan so why wouldnt ESPN promote kobe being clutch just like MJ?
3. kobe does make the toughest shots, but thats because he doesnt wanna pass in the 4th. thus, he makes tough shots
4. kobe doesnt care about missing. yes this is true, its good to have confidence, but its also wise to have good shot selection and have trust in your teammates.

now as for the thread.
i think its safe to say lebron and dirk stand out after post jordan era. i wouldnt put melo in yet (although hes pretty clutch in the regular season), but he doesnt have enough post season success to back it up. durant is on his way, then kobe.

[TheChosen618]

Joe Johnson was the clutchest player in the league last year. He was around 90% in 24 seconds or less I believe all season including postseason. That does not make him the "best" player and while he is Top 10 at his position, you can easily call him a mediocre player that dominates end of games.

I would like to know the actual numbers and the actual context you are talking about with that Joe Johnson stat.

Is the game tied up then? I'd also like to see some sort of source that that's true because that sounds completely made up.

It shouldn't be a surprise though because Joe Johnson is a scorer, maybe the best scorer on the team, so he is given the opportunity to take these shots and he has made them. He is not taking over a game by making one shot. A top 10 player in his position is not a mediocre player either. He is probably at worst above average which is still good.

As I said, players who are clutch are already damn good in the first place especially as scorers and generally great.

Carmelo has more clutch last second percentages than Kobe. That doesn't make him the better player either. Clutch is a skill in my opinion.

And what numbers are these? Last second shots?

In terms of the difference between +/- 5 points, Kobe actually averaged better clutch numbers than Melo did. Kobe is a better player than Melo too but that's because Melo might not even be a top 10 player, at least if you value things beyond inefficient and volume scoring.