Otto Porter

[Nivek]

I had Noel rated as a better prospect than Porter. And Bennett. Of course, I had Zeller rated ahead of Noel too.

That said, I had Porter rated as a top 5 pick and I expect him to be a good pro.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Well I was pushing hard for Porter, and was sold on him especially after that Syracuse game where his complete skills were on full display. He was my personal favorite choice, and I'm glad we got him.

I was also high on Zeller. Tried to go back to my final rankings for the Wizards but couldn't find it, I'll look some more, but I think I had Porter and Zeller as 1 and 2. Although I only became high on Zeller after his combine performance, and recognizing his ability to transition to PF in the NBA. Noel, as well as Len I had lower mainly due to injury concerns. I was also interested in trade down scenarios.

Looking now at the Porter vs Zeller debate, Porter has been constantly injured since drafting him. Keeping both Webster and Ariza longterm (if Porter wasn't here) seems more plausible now than it did then. And Okafor going down, in hindsight all seem to favor taking Zeller instead. I also expected Porter to put on some muscle/weight a bit more between the draft and training camp than what he has given his age and work ethic. Seemed Beal made significant strides in that area same time last year.

Also factor in the drafting of Rice, another 3, and the possibility of Childress being here.

I'm not backing down from Porter... I am confident he will be everything expected and then some. But the argument for Zeller at this point can certainly be made. I think they will be similarly quality players with comparable low risk and good upside potential, versatility, and good mental makeup. The main argument point lies in their positions IMO.

[Ruzious]

I agree that very few strongly preferred Zeller over Porter. Did anybody in this forum actually rank Zeller higher than Porter on their draft board?
I won't get upset of Zeller outperforms Porter. I'll be real upset if Noel does though.

<raises hand> I had 1. Noah 2. Zeller 3. Porter. I didn't make a big stink about picking Porter, because I didn't want to whine about getting a qulity player - even if he wasn't the one I would have picked. They picked 3rd and got the 3rd best player. Basically, I rationalized.

I also had Noah, then Zeller, then Porter and Dipo tied. I thought both Porter and Dipo had elite roleplayer prospects, while Zeller has the potential to be a dynamic two-way PF.

I guess I thought of the entire top grouping as some variety of roleplayer or specialist; Zeller had the best chance to be an all-around positive asset, one of those underrated quasi-stars that really help teams win games.

We're like twins. I actually had Ola 3rd, but I moved him back to 4 just cuz there was no chance the Wiz would consider him.

[Knighthonor]

I wonder if there has been any good news regarding Porter.

[hands11]

And I think you might be right that, if anyone, Zeller will be the one that haunts us more. But very few people liked Zeller over Porter prior to the draft. This was a year when the top seven had almost no separation between them prior to the draft.

I agree that very few strongly preferred Zeller over Porter. Did anybody in this forum actually rank Zeller higher than Porter on their draft board?

I won't get upset of Zeller outperforms Porter. I'll be real upset if Noel does though.

I had Zeller over him. I liked Otto as a target early on in the process but as time went on, I put other players over him. There were a lot of players to consider this year. I think it was kind of a tough draft to pick in personally.

But as of Jun 15, 2013, looks like I had it like this...

" I would narrow it down to Zeller, VO and Len.""

I was also interesting in Burke, CJM and McLemore, but only as temporary solution with the idea of trading them longer term, except maybe CJM you could keep. If I end up wrong this year, if will be over Noel and Bennett. I was pretty vocally against them as pick. Kelly I thought would be ok a a PF S4 type, but liked other players better and felt you could get a S4 in the 2nd, which we didn't.

I felt Otto had more value to a team like Orlando, Charlotte, PHX, etc.

But Otto is a really nice young man. Hard to not pull for him. Like I said, he was one of my early favorite when he was way down the board and we were looking at picking 12th. He should be a good all around player. Solid defender who plays the angles. Will he be the best of that group? Probably not.

[hands11]

I think he'll become a big piece in a Wizards trade for Durant at some point.

Just a little long term planning from the front office.

[hands11]

Like most of us, I assumed that Noel would be gone, and that we'd be choosing between Bennett and Porter -- the meat of our debate here was between those two. A few guys had other ideas, notably CCJ who wanted to nab Olynyk and thought we could trade down to do it and that way get an additional asset.

But I'm pretty sure all of us had Noel ranked higher than either Porter or Bennett -- with his injury being the one concern.

Now, given that I kind of assume there's at least some inside knowledge about health stuff that I just don't have, once Noel wasn't picked 1 or 2, I thought "there's some big injury problem here" and was scared away from wanting to pick him. I'd be willing to bet that lots of the rest of you had that same kind of thought.

Hence, I more or less give us a pass if in fact he turns out to be the best player in the draft or anyway a lot better than Porter. I don't give *Ernie* that pass (or the other GMs who passed on him), because whatever knowledge there was about Noel, they all had it.

I had Otto going 3rd to the Wizards and Noel going 6th. Looks like Rafael122 did also. So it wasn't all of us.

As for inside knowledge. It was known he had a broken growth plate in his knee. Known injury concerns there were before the draft. Him slipping past 2nd changed very little for GMs that had their boards set.

[hands11]

I always felt this was a draft where the GMs differentiate themselves. When the talent is close...

I don't have a high degree of confidence in EG... so I am still unsure of the pick - and maybe that isn't right.

I was hoping there was a way for us to move up in the second round and grab Olynyk... I still think he has the skills to be in a pretty good frontcourt rotation. Zeller surprised me in SL - he moves like a SF.

Which would be a reason he would narrow it down to Otto or Zeller. In this draft, those were two of the safe picks that would fit on this team. It probably came down to, getting Zeller meant they had to move Ves right away and it would mess with his head even more vs giving him one last chance to at least raise his value before a trade. Getting Otto meant they had protection to replace Trevor A who is in his last year, is a west coast guy and who might have a lingering knee issue.

Not defending the decision making. Just explaining what probably happened. I think a lot of us felt they would get Otto because of personality fit, general skills and Trevor A in his last year.

[payitforward]

I had Noel rated as a better prospect than Porter. And Bennett. Of course, I had Zeller rated ahead of Noel too.

That said, I had Porter rated as a top 5 pick and I expect him to be a good pro.

I agree. I think he'll be a very good player for a long time (barring injury).

I never warmed to Zeller the way many here did. It'll be interesting to watch how he develops.

edit: If you look at Zeller's college numbers, what stands out are a) his incredibly efficient 2-point scoring, and 2) his high % of offensive rebounds -- more than 1/3 of his boards both years were on offense.

I make the assumption (perhaps wrongly) that those 2 facts are connected, i.e. that he scored a lot on putbacks off missed shots. Given that overall he was not an outstanding rebounder at Indiana, I wondered whether he'd get those same kinds of opportunities for efficiency in the NBA.

Now, if all of a sudden he develops a 3-point shot or some other notable skill, that'll change the picture.

[dckingsfan]

I always felt this was a draft where the GMs differentiate themselves. When the talent is close...

I don't have a high degree of confidence in EG... so I am still unsure of the pick - and maybe that isn't right.

I was hoping there was a way for us to move up in the second round and grab Olynyk... I still think he has the skills to be in a pretty good frontcourt rotation. Zeller surprised me in SL - he moves like a SF.

Which would be a reason he would narrow it down to Otto or Zeller. In this draft, those were two of the safe picks that would fit on this team. It probably came down to, getting Zeller meant they had to move Ves right away and it would mess with his head even more vs giving him one last chance to at least raise his value before a trade. Getting Otto meant they had protection to replace Trevor A who is in his last year, is a west coast guy and who might have a lingering knee issue.

Not defending the decision making. Just explaining what probably happened. I think a lot of us felt they would get Otto because of personality fit, general skills and Trevor A in his last year.

Good points all... I guess playing it safe is the best route for EG - which isn't exactly and endorsement.

[GhostsOfGil]

I think my final draft day list was:
1A Noel
1B trade for Ersan
2 Bennet



3 Porter

We should dig up that thread. I'd bet we'd find a different tune regarding Porter...

[Illuminaire]

I think people were more positive about Porter when Noel seemed impossible to get. He lost some of his shine by comparison once the potential franchise big came available.

[Illuminaire]

Edit: Double post!

[Illuminaire]

Edit: Triple post!

[Dat2U]

I think people were more positive about Porter when Noel seemed impossible to get. He lost some of his shine by comparison once the potential franchise big came available.

Yep, it did to me. Mainly because at no point in the draft process did I have Porter over Noel. So while I was not despondent about the choice because I had liked Porter all along, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth that I can't get rid of.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

I think people were more positive about Porter when Noel seemed impossible to get. He lost some of his shine by comparison once the potential franchise big came available.

Yep, it did to me. Mainly because at no point in the draft process did I have Porter over Noel. So while I was not despondent about the choice because I had liked Porter all along, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth that I can't get rid of.

When it comes down to it, I don't know how much difference it will make. Porter is likely to be something along the lines of Prince or Battier. Zeller may be Troy Murphy. Noel may be Noah...

I don't think there was an MJ or LeBron in the draft so it's all relative. The main area of debate is probably regarding player positions rather than talent.

I just hope drafting Porter isn't reminiscent of drafting Dixon... seemed like a good idea at the time. Nivek, just out of curiosity, you got how Dixon rated in YODA out of college??

[hands11]

I think people were more positive about Porter when Noel seemed impossible to get. He lost some of his shine by comparison once the potential franchise big came available.

Yep, it did to me. Mainly because at no point in the draft process did I have Porter over Noel. So while I was not despondent about the choice because I had liked Porter all along, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth that I can't get rid of.

When it comes down to it, I don't know how much difference it will make. Porter is likely to be something along the lines of Prince or Battier. Zeller may be Troy Murphy. Noel may be Noah...

I don't think there was an MJ or LeBron in the draft so it's all relative. The main area of debate is probably regarding player positions rather than talent.

I just hope drafting Porter isn't reminiscent of drafting Dixon... seemed like a good idea at the time. Nivek, just out of curiosity, you got how Dixon rated in YODA out of college??

I recall ( maybe incorrectly ) Zeller being ranking pretty well in Yoda.

I think the way you describe it is fair. I think the gem of the draft was VO, but he wasn't even available to us. That said, keep your eyes peeled on CJM. I think he will be a Eric Gordon type. Lets see if he can stay healthier. I also think Burke is going to be a legit good PG. Zeller. I think he will be a work horse. A Hansbourgh motor with outside shooting. Zeller will be a good player. And don't sleep on Len. In 3 years he is going to look real interesting. Big Z Jr v2.0

VO and Burke are the two clear starter types. Zeller could be also. And then there is Len. Len is a 3-5 year project before he is fully established. But so what. Look at Hibbert. Legit centers often take time. Its a tough position to play. Specially if you are going to be the defensive anchor and score. Len will contribute along the way, but as a starter on a good team, 3 year est. I put Noel behind Len and with more injury risk.

Everyone else seems more like 6th man quality. They could start, but not on a good teams or at least not unless they have other stars around them such that they start just as a matter of fit. Otto seems to be at that level. McLemore is an interesting talent, but I question his mind. Doesn't seem like a lead dog and stud SG should have that.

Considering we needed a young C/PF prospects, we should have probably drafted Len or Zeller. I can understand the thinking that they already have a clutter of PF prospects which is why they wouldn't go Zeller ( though they could have and traded Ves for nothing ), but Len would have made sense. Specially with Okafor on the last year of his contract.

I would have been more then fine if they picked Len and tried to resign Trevor A instead of picking Otto. I think that was the better move for a 2-3 year plan.

[nate33]

When it comes down to it, I don't know how much difference it will make. Porter is likely to be something along the lines of Prince or Battier. Zeller may be Troy Murphy. Noel may be Noah..

Noah is a FAR superior player to those other guys. Those other guys are average starters at best. Noah is a top 5 center.

Also, I think Zeller's upside is a little better than Troy Murphy, who was never even an average starter. I think a better Zeller comparison would be someone like David Lee.

[GhostsOfGil]

Not only that but I have trouble understanding why people were so adamantly against the Ersan trade if we all know his ceiling is inferior guys like Prince or Battier.

[hands11]

When it comes down to it, I don't know how much difference it will make. Porter is likely to be something along the lines of Prince or Battier. Zeller may be Troy Murphy. Noel may be Noah..

Noah is a FAR superior player to those other guys. Those other guys are average starters at best. Noah is a top 5 center.

Also, I think Zeller's upside is a little better than Troy Murphy, who was never even an average starter. I think a better Zeller comparison would be someone like David Lee.

Yeah, David Lee is an interesting comp, but Lee is shorter and didn't get to the line as much. Lee was also a 30th pick and didn't really start his first 3 years. I think Zeller is more ready to contribute sooner. And he is 7-0 David Lee is listed a 6-9

How do they compare in leaping ?

Zeller will have a green light where he landed and will start right away.

Maybe there is a better comp than D Lee.