Jan Vesely Part II: He a Bust

[DCZards]

^^^^^Yes, that was a sweet no-look dish by Double B.

[MikeTheKid]

I dont care about the dunk, that was a nice split the D drive to no look pass by Beal

[Dat2U]

Hey CCJ, Pelton went completely in on your boy.

Scouting report
+ Thin athlete who may be better suited for decathlons than basketball games
+ An air ball waiting to happen; bad hands and can't dribble, and horror show in post
+ Frostbite feel for the game; doesn't block shots despite hops, and fouls a ton

Analysis
Vesely has been paid millions to play basketball, but it's not clear whether he actually knows how to play. He may have the most hallow skill set in the league, but he'll continue to play because he's long, can jump through the roof and, let's face it, he was the sixth overall pick in 2011. The truth is that Vesely wouldn't sniff an NBA rotation if he were a second-round pick.

It's tough to stomach his game film, and the statistics are just as gruesome. He shot 30.8 percent from the free throw line, missed more than half of his layups, nailed a crisp 17.5 percent of his jumpers and registered six times as many fouls as blocks. He ranks among the worst at his position in just about every category.

Defensively, he can put a dent in pick-and-rolls because he's long and mobile, but he's a horrible basket protector who fouled at 6.4 per 36 minutes. Because of his length and bounce, he should be much better equipped to block shots, but Patrick Beverley registered the same exact block rate last season (2.2 percent). Vesely probably needs to go back to Europe or the D-League to build his skill set, because he's probably a sunk cost in the NBA at this point.

[DANNYLANDOVER]

Hey CCJ, Pelton went completely in on your boy.

Scouting report
+ Thin athlete who may be better suited for decathlons than basketball games
+ An air ball waiting to happen; bad hands and can't dribble, and horror show in post
+ Frostbite feel for the game; doesn't block shots despite hops, and fouls a ton

Analysis
Vesely has been paid millions to play basketball, but it's not clear whether he actually knows how to play. He may have the most hallow skill set in the league, but he'll continue to play because he's long, can jump through the roof and, let's face it, he was the sixth overall pick in 2011. The truth is that Vesely wouldn't sniff an NBA rotation if he were a second-round pick.

It's tough to stomach his game film, and the statistics are just as gruesome. He shot 30.8 percent from the free throw line, missed more than half of his layups, nailed a crisp 17.5 percent of his jumpers and registered six times as many fouls as blocks. He ranks among the worst at his position in just about every category.

Defensively, he can put a dent in pick-and-rolls because he's long and mobile, but he's a horrible basket protector who fouled at 6.4 per 36 minutes. Because of his length and bounce, he should be much better equipped to block shots, but Patrick Beverley registered the same exact block rate last season (2.2 percent). Vesely probably needs to go back to Europe or the D-League to build his skill set, because he's probably a sunk cost in the NBA at this point.

...brutally honest

[keynote]

Pelton's full of it. Vesely isn't nearly strong enough to compete in a decathlon.

[closg00]

NBA PM: Spurs Entering Kawhi Leonard Era?

Without the luxury of hindsight, though, Leonard slipped out of the lottery as the likes of Jan Vesely, Bismack Biyombo, Brandon Knight, Jimmer Fredette, Alec Burks, Markieff Morris and Marcus Morris – all of whom have yet to establish themselves in the NBA to this day – were taken ahead of him.

That created the opportunity for the Spurs to pull the trigger on a move that terrified them, but has turned into one of the best trades in the league’s history.

“We made that trade, we were all scared to death to be honest with you,” Popovich said. “George [Hill] was one of my favorite guys individually, a hell of a player, did a great job for the Pacers. It might be one of the best trades I’ve ever seen because both players have become so important for their respective teams. Indiana was helped tremendously by getting George; we were helped tremendously by Kawhi. That doesn’t happen that often, usually they’re one sided or someone doesn’t come through, that kind of thing.”

http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-pm-spurs- ... IhqDCmE.99

[doclinkin]

Tuned in late but from what I could see Jan played pretty well, defending and rebounding and making smart reads. Maynor kept dumping off to Garret Temple when he had Ves trailing though, that's not the smart play, lob it up for the dunking ninja, son. Whatever its worth he did look better than Seraphin, more confident than last year and even less hesitant at the FT line, he missed but he missed without a pointless hitch his wind-up and knock-kneed terror at the second of release.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

[rockymac52]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

I'm sorry, but I call BS. This is revisionist history at its finest. Vucevic was the 16th overall pick in a weak draft. Chad Ford didn't even have him in the 1st round until the last week of May. There were plenty of concerns with Vucevic, and while he's turned out to be quite the steal, it would have been absurd to draft him at 6th overall at the time.

Maybe you really were in love with Vucevic, and I'm wrong to call you out, and if that's the case i'm sorry, but this just feels like revisionist history to me. Vesely was obviously a terrible pick. There were several players taken later who turned out to be real steals. But at the time it wasn't like we were considering most of those guys with our 6th pick, other than Kawhi Leonard perhaps.

[payitforward]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

I'm sorry, but I call BS. This is revisionist history at its finest. Vucevic was the 16th overall pick in a weak draft. Chad Ford didn't even have him in the 1st round until the last week of May. There were plenty of concerns with Vucevic, and while he's turned out to be quite the steal, it would have been absurd to draft him at 6th overall at the time.

Maybe you really were in love with Vucevic, and I'm wrong to call you out, and if that's the case i'm sorry, but this just feels like revisionist history to me. Vesely was obviously a terrible pick. There were several players taken later who turned out to be real steals. But at the time it wasn't like we were considering most of those guys with our 6th pick, other than Kawhi Leonard perhaps.

Hands has claimed he wanted Vucevic w/ the #6 I think. I wasn't here at the time, so I can't confirm.

But, in fact 2011 was by no means a weak draft. It's looking to have been an outstanding draft from top to bottom. Compare it to 2010 for the number of guys who (in 1 year less) have added to the young core of the NBA. Imagine where this team would be now had EG taken Leonard, Faried and Parsons (those were my calls when the spots came up on draft night).

[Ruzious]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

I'm sorry, but I call BS. This is revisionist history at its finest. Vucevic was the 16th overall pick in a weak draft. Chad Ford didn't even have him in the 1st round until the last week of May. There were plenty of concerns with Vucevic, and while he's turned out to be quite the steal, it would have been absurd to draft him at 6th overall at the time.

Maybe you really were in love with Vucevic, and I'm wrong to call you out, and if that's the case i'm sorry, but this just feels like revisionist history to me. Vesely was obviously a terrible pick. There were several players taken later who turned out to be real steals. But at the time it wasn't like we were considering most of those guys with our 6th pick, other than Kawhi Leonard perhaps.

Yeah, I find it hard to believe ANYONE thought Vuc should go 6th before the draft. (That was the year to get players with foreign last names beginning with V.) I remember talking about him here as an underrated player during the NCAA tournament and don't recall a lot of folks posting that they concurred at the time. Now, I think he's gone from way underrated to overrated - because defense matters, and at least when I've watched him - he's got feet in mud disease on defense.

[closg00]

If you go-back and read the 2011 draft threads, there was plenty of discussion about taking Vucevic at 18, no-one had Vuc at 6 that I recall.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1112363&start=1440

[Dat2U]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

I'm sorry, but I call BS. This is revisionist history at its finest. Vucevic was the 16th overall pick in a weak draft. Chad Ford didn't even have him in the 1st round until the last week of May. There were plenty of concerns with Vucevic, and while he's turned out to be quite the steal, it would have been absurd to draft him at 6th overall at the time.

Maybe you really were in love with Vucevic, and I'm wrong to call you out, and if that's the case i'm sorry, but this just feels like revisionist history to me. Vesely was obviously a terrible pick. There were several players taken later who turned out to be real steals. But at the time it wasn't like we were considering most of those guys with our 6th pick, other than Kawhi Leonard perhaps.

Yeah, I find it hard to believe ANYONE thought Vuc should go 6th before the draft. (That was the year to get players with foreign last names beginning with V.) I remember talking about him here as an underrated player during the NCAA tournament and don't recall a lot of folks posting that they concurred at the time. Now, I think he's gone from way underrated to overrated - because defense matters, and at least when I've watched him - he's got feet in mud disease on defense.

Actually, it's not bs. Superballman was a huge Vucevic supporter. I remember because I disagreed with him strongly. I don't quite remember if he had Vucevic #6, but he definitely wanted Vucevic out of the draft over anyone else people were talking about.

And it's not the only time he's been right on a hugely underrated prospect. He deserved a lot of credit for nailing the Marc Gasol pick years back when Gasol was fat & slow 2nd rounder. He pimped Gasol's virtues endlessly, and I and many others weren't buying it at the time. Give credit where it's due.

[Ruzious]

Apolgies to Supe. I'll have to look over the draft thread when I have time. It's always interesting to look back at them.

[closg00]

Apolgies to Supe. I'll have to look over the draft thread when I have time. It's always interesting to look back at them.

One of Supes post. Again, lots of people liked Vucevic at 18.

My updated draft board:

#6
1. Kanter 2. Leonard 3. Valenciunas 4. Markieff 5. Vesely

Kanter is the hopeful please drop to us pick. I'm thinking Leonard is the probable pick.


#18
1. Singleton 2. Vucevic 3. Harris 4. Faried 5. Honeycutt

Again Singleton is the please fall to us guy, and the target if we get Kanter at 6. If we go Leonard at 6 I think Vucevic becomes the target. I'd also be very pleased with either Harris or Faried.


#34
1. Thompkins 2. Harper 3. N.Smith 4. Parsons 5. Holiday 6. Hansbrough

I like Thompkins whether we go Kanter/Singleton or Leonard/Vucevic to add skill & depth to our PF spot. Harper would make me happy also, either would be a steal here IMO.

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1112363&start=1440#sthash.EbuWeKzj.dpuf

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Apolgies to Supe. I'll have to look over the draft thread when I have time. It's always interesting to look back at them.

One of Supes post. Again, lots of people liked Vucevic at 18.

My updated draft board:

#6
1. Kanter 2. Leonard 3. Valenciunas 4. Markieff 5. Vesely

Kanter is the hopeful please drop to us pick. I'm thinking Leonard is the probable pick.


#18
1. Singleton 2. Vucevic 3. Harris 4. Faried 5. Honeycutt

Again Singleton is the please fall to us guy, and the target if we get Kanter at 6. If we go Leonard at 6 I think Vucevic becomes the target. I'd also be very pleased with either Harris or Faried.


#34
1. Thompkins 2. Harper 3. N.Smith 4. Parsons 5. Holiday 6. Hansbrough

I like Thompkins whether we go Kanter/Singleton or Leonard/Vucevic to add skill & depth to our PF spot. Harper would make me happy also, either would be a steal here IMO.

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1112363&start=1440#sthash.EbuWeKzj.dpuf

Thanks for the support Dat2u... but seems I am corrected. My bad.

I went back, and I was sure I had posts showing Vucevic's workout vids and stating he was as good as Kanter... but from what I can go back and find, I was pretty consistant in thinking (wrongly) he'd still be there at 18 for our 2nd pick.






Re: Lather me with blather -- DRAFT thread 4

Postby SUPERBALLMAN on Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:44 pm

The guy I think is under the radar is Vucavic. If we don't get Kanter at 6, I'd like to go with a forward there & shoot for Vucavic at 18.

He isn't too far off from Kanter IMO, is a true center with good length & size, fundamentally strong, can rebound and shoot. Perfect pick n pop guy for Wall.

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1117467&start=1065#p28372038


Re: Draft 2011 Part V

Postby SUPERBALLMAN on Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:54 am

6 & 18 for Kanter? I do it, but I'm not thrilled. I am anticipating that 18 pick. The other route is maybe move down to Bobcats 9 & 19, maybe end up with something like Singleton, Vucevic, Honeycutt. I am really high on Vucevic, and I'm not convinced Kanter will be better. I like Kanter alot more at 6 than moving up.

But if that's what we do I'm fine with it. Kanter & Nolan Smith at 34 would be a pretty sweet draft.
"You might be able to save your powder for the following summer, but a plan will be in place. But it's not something that happens overnight. It's going to be a process" - Ernie Grunfeld

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1121354&start=15#sthash.JHyQiuYU.dpuf



It seems I actually proposed Singleton with our top pick and trying to get Vucevic with our 2nd pick. Geez was I wrong on Singleton.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Also... I've been thinking the Vesely pick was out of left field, but looking back at the posts there was alot of Vesely talk surprisingly.

I didn't want him, but I actually found this gem of a prediction, I believe this was even pre-lottery...

Re: 2011 DRAFT blather goes here. Part 3...

Postby SUPERBALLMAN on Sun May 15, 2011 1:33 am

This may of been posted before... but this is from nbadraft.net

Jan Vesely 6-11 230 SF/PF Czech Republic 1990 The Wizards are extremely high on Vesely and it's unlikely they would allow him to slip by them at 4. He's is ultra long and athletic and has the ability to play either forward position. He's a tweener but a good tweener in the sense that he can create mismatches due to his size. He will need to add strength and could struggle some guarding on the perimeter due to lack of foot speed, but his incredible length and improving skill set make him a projected high lottery pick. He's been compared to both Dunleavy's (Mike senior and junior) due to his shooting ability and adroit ball handling skills. He has had a strong end to the season for Partizan Belgrade after starting off slowly.

I can see this being Ernie's guy considering his past picks of Nowitzki and Pecherov.

"You might be able to save your powder for the following summer, but a plan will be in place. But it's not something that happens overnight. It's going to be a process" - Ernie Grunfeld

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1112363&start=30#sthash.cnRflNeT.dpuf


And here's WizarDynasty!!

Re: 2011 DRAFT blather goes here. Part 3...

Postby WizarDynasty on Wed May 18, 2011 5:04 pm

i think i might go vesely too. i see 3 and d for sure with him. 6'11 quickness is a nightmare for perimeter oriented teams which is the majority of nba now. jeffries with a three point shot.

- See more at: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1112363&start=270#sthash.Kn0jr4gc.dpuf

[stevemcqueen1]

A lot of people were wrong about Singleton. I was fine with the pick at the time. I only saw him play once, @ VT I think. He was OK from what I remember, the commentary gushed about him. And then I read a lot of articles before the draft gushing about how fast he was, how great he'd be defensively, how special his lateral quickness was, etc.

I didn't have high expectations for 18. Just wanted a useful role player and thought we were getting that from Singleton. I liked Faried and Klay Thompson and Marshon Brooks too, didn't really have a preference between any of them and Singleton. He's been a big disappointment.

[stevemcqueen1]

I do remember Ves having a bit of a reputation as a budding shooter in Europe. It wasn't an explicit weakness, thought everyone remarked on what a lousy FT shooter he was. I think he was just a better shooter for Partizan Belgrade and that his shooting ability went down the crapper with his confidence when he came here.

But I'm surprised anyone touted his shooting ability before the draft. I don't remember that being a mainstream evaluation of him. I think most people said he was just passable.

The main positives I remember hearing about Vesely were:

- Height & Length.
- Motor.
- Speed.
- Leaping ability.

And I think all of that was actually accurate. He's very tall and very fast for his height, and he can certainly sky. Obviously that hasn't translated into him being a successful NBA player thus far. Nothing has really gone according to plan with him.

I thought he could be like Kirilenko. That was the most common projection of his upside as I recall.

I wasn't posting on here back then, but I do remember my preferences for our pick in discussions on another forum. I remember being demoralized about that class when both Jared Sullinger and Harrison Barnes went back to school. I think Irving and DWill were the clear top two guys and we knew they wouldn't be there at our pick. I wanted Kanter, then Valanciunas, then Vesely, and in that order. But I really wanted Kanter or Valanciunas. I just didn't know as much about Vesely. I do remember thinking the Cavs reached so hard on Tristan Thompson, thought for sure they were going to take Valanciunas.

I remember not being a huge Kawhi Leonard fan even though he had a lot of appealing qualities because he had a reputation of being a lousy shooter before that draft. His improvement as a shooter once he got into the NBA was really sudden and shocking. Most guys take a lot longer than he did to improve their shooting. Our shooting problems seemed so acute back then before Beal and Webster arrived and Wall started shooting better. Felt like taking on yet another project shooter on the perimeter would be such a burden. It's the exact same reason I couldn't really get behind MKG even though I loved everything else about his game.

[hands11]

Still drives me crazy we passed on Vucevic. We had need at center, and had supposed interest in Kanter. At the time I felt Vucevic was very comparable to Kanter as a prospect. To me once Kanter was off the board Vucevic was an obvious choice.

He had the Euro aspects Ernie loves with high level college experience and productivity to back it up. His size, rebounding and shooting skill was obvious.

Looking at our roster now how much better off would we be with Vucevic in place of Vesely.

I'm sorry, but I call BS. This is revisionist history at its finest. Vucevic was the 16th overall pick in a weak draft. Chad Ford didn't even have him in the 1st round until the last week of May. There were plenty of concerns with Vucevic, and while he's turned out to be quite the steal, it would have been absurd to draft him at 6th overall at the time.

Maybe you really were in love with Vucevic, and I'm wrong to call you out, and if that's the case i'm sorry, but this just feels like revisionist history to me. Vesely was obviously a terrible pick. There were several players taken later who turned out to be real steals. But at the time it wasn't like we were considering most of those guys with our 6th pick, other than Kawhi Leonard perhaps.

Hands has claimed he wanted Vucevic w/ the #6 I think. I wasn't here at the time, so I can't confirm.

But, in fact 2011 was by no means a weak draft. It's looking to have been an outstanding draft from top to bottom. Compare it to 2010 for the number of guys who (in 1 year less) have added to the young core of the NBA. Imagine where this team would be now had EG taken Leonard, Faried and Parsons (those were my calls when the spots came up on draft night).

I pimped Vucevic a good bit. Really liked the young man. He was working really hard on his game. We needed a young center. He was mature already. And he was already eating right. His approach to getting better was exactly what you want. He eat right, practice a ton and got his rest. Thats all he did. He was focused. And he already showed skills.

Not sure if I suggested drafting him at #6 as my main idea because it seemed clear he would be available later. I was looking for them to trade down, pick up an additional asset, and get Big V.

Not being in the inner circle of GM, I have no idea if a trade down was available to the Wizards.

Should be a good year to evaluate that class as they are coming into their 3rd year.