Should Lin come off the bench?

[junot111]

Those of you that say he would fit better with the 2nd unit... dont forget that he CAN play with the 2nd unit AND start at the same time, it's just a matter of McHale staggering his and Harden's minutes... which is what most Rockets fans wish for.

[junot111]

The Bucks don't need Asik. Ever since they signed Zaza Pachulia to a bargain deal, their front court depth is fine.

How's this?

HOU out: Asik Smith HOU 2014 1st
HOU in: Ilyasova Lopez

POR out: McCollum TRob Lopez
POR in: Asik Smith

MIL out: Ilyasova
MIL in: McCollum TRob HOU 2014 1st

HOU is not giving that much for Ilyasova

[ibraheim718]

It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

Well if you want to be confused further head over to the Knicks board where the status quo is that he sucks.

[Nuntius]

It doesn't matter who starts. It matters who finishes and who plays the most time with which unit.

Let's see the facts here:

1) Harden needs the ball in his hands. That's when he really shines. That's also the reason why OKC used him as a 6th man. Playing with the 2nd unit allowed him to have the ball in his hands and shine.

2) Lin needs the ball in his hands. That's when he shines as well. It wasn't a coincidence that Linsanity started when Melo went down and died when Melo returned.

3) Patrick Beverley is not great at running the offense (on the other hand, Harden and Lin are great at it). However, he is a great defender and can also shoot the 3. He doesn't need the ball in his hands and compliments clearly players that need the ball in their hands since he can absorb the defensive load for them and let them create.

So, what would any sensible coach do? He would try to stagger Harden's and Lin's minutes in order to ensure that the offense will never go blank. Keeping at least one of his two shot creators on the court at all times ensures that the offense will be continuously refreshed.

It's all about staggering Lin's and Harden's minutes and that's simply easier to do if Beverley starts.

[HotRocks34]

It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

And if you take away 2 months of the start of 12-13 season, he's been a pretty darn good player for 2/3 of his career . But no, let's take away the 2 peak months and instead focus on the 2 months after knee surgery, that's how we view all NBA players of course.

Just saw some stats that help point out how much the knee injury affected Lin.

2012 preseason scoring PER 36 = 09.0
2013 preseason scoring PER 36 = 19.4

To help put that last number into perspective, Lin's PER 36 scoring average during Linsanity in New York was 19.6

Anyone who thought Lin was healthy at the start of last season either didn't understand the situation or is just kidding themselves.

[ibraheim718]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

[Total_Package]

Last year Lin came in 2nd as the Western all-star starting point guard, with his marketability I don't think he's leaving the league anytime soon.

And that right there is why All-star voting should immediately be removed from fans. A bunch of racists voting for a player because he looks like them.

[HotRocks34]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

This was the plan, from what I have read. Apparently, though, Harden lost the memo on that concept after the first game of the 2013 preseason.

[tcorbin]

It doesn't matter who starts. It matters who finishes and who plays the most time with which unit.

Wrong, it does matter and it does matter how you team up the players you have, Lin shouldn't go past 50% of his playing time when Harden is on the floor, because Lin becomes useless when Harden is dominating the ball.

[Nuntius]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

If that's the case then Lin is the best option indeed. But will this help Harden's development?

[ibraheim718]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

This was the plan, from what I have read. Apparently, though, Harden lost the memo on that concept after the first game of the 2013 preseason.

I think if he's isolating at the end of games the way he did last year then you'll still have problems finishing games. But I don't think a ton of games are going to be close enough.

For Houston the biggest challenge is going to be in the playoffs.. how quickly do they learn how to win in the playoffs.. Howard has been there and so has Harden but of course never together... they need to learn how to close games out together... and when the games get tight in the post season. It may take them a year or two to figure that out but they're young enough to have that time and Harden is a smart enough kid to figure it out. He needs to realize that he could finish teams spotting up and shooting the 3 off of an inside-out scheme with howard and off of guard penetration or benefiting being the secondary penetrator. When he's dribbling down the shot clock up high all 5 defenders have eyes on him... as a secondary penetrator the defense has already been compromised by primary penetration and scoring opportunities will be easier.

[Never Wrong]

Shouldn't even get off the couch.

[ibraheim718]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

If that's the case then Lin is the best option indeed. But will this help Harden's development?

I think in order for the Rockets to get where they want to go.. Harden needs to focus on being a factor on defense and he needs to develop some sort of back to the basket kind of game... nothing extravagant... just a change from his typical ball dribbling-face up game.

Btw.. same for PG.. he needs to add a little back to the basket game.. a little fade away.. saw him hit one tonight on the highlights. But it's nice to see he's in good form so early.

[Nuntius]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

If that's the case then Lin is the best option indeed. But will this help Harden's development?

I think in order for the Rockets to get where they want to go.. Harden needs to focus on being a factor on defense and he needs to develop some sort of back to the basket kind of game... nothing extravagant... just a change from his typical ball dribbling-face up game.

I can agree with that. Harden certainly has to improve his D and acquiring a back to the basket game would be good for him as well.

Btw.. same for PG.. he needs to add a little back to the basket game.. a little fade away.. saw him hit one tonight on the highlights. But it's nice to see he's in good form so early.

I also agree that a back to the basket game would be great for PG.

[HotRocks34]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

This was the plan, from what I have read. Apparently, though, Harden lost the memo on that concept after the first game of the 2013 preseason.

I think if he's isolating at the end of games the way he did last year then you'll still have problems finishing games. But I don't think a ton of games are going to be close enough.

For Houston the biggest challenge is going to be in the playoffs.. how quickly do they learn how to win in the playoffs.. Howard has been there and so has Harden but of course never together... they need to learn how to close games out together... and when the games get tight in the post season. It may take them a year or two to figure that out but they're young enough to have that time and Harden is a smart enough kid to figure it out. He needs to realize that he could finish teams spotting up and shooting the 3 off of an inside-out scheme with howard and off of guard penetration or benefiting being the secondary penetrator. When he's dribbling down the shot clock up high all 5 defenders have eyes on him... as a secondary penetrator the defense has already been compromised by primary penetration and scoring opportunities will be easier.

I agree with this. Harden is playing in a way that simply does not need to be played in any longer given the talent upgrade (especially Dwight) on the team. Iso TO's, Iso bricks, etc. With the firepower on the team, it's just unnecessary. And I really hope the coaches rein him in on it. If not, Houston seems unlikely to achieve their potential until Harden grows out of those habits, IMO.

Things looked great in the first preseason game. Since then, less great. At least in my opinion.

[HotRocks34]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

If that's the case then Lin is the best option indeed. But will this help Harden's development?

Lin has never seemed to be an impediment to Harden's game. I posted this over at ClutchFans last night and will repeat it here:

Second, the "no chemistry" unit of Lin and Harden put up these numbers in Taiwan:

JL -- 17/2/4
JH -- 21/3/5

Which reminded me of this stat line from last year in a win over OKC

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278524

JL -- 29/6/7
JH -- 46/7/6

That 46 points is a career-high for Harden, I believe.

So, if Harden and Lin don't have very good chemistry, then I'm thinking we may want to stick with the "poor chemistry" formula.

Contrary to popular belief, Lin and Harden work well together. And if Harden wants to play better defense and conserve his energy, then I would think having someone to share playmaking duties with would assist in those goals.

I'm not sure Harden sees things this way, though, based upon how he has appeared to dominate the ball the last two games in terms of running the point and having Jeremy off the ball. We will see how things play out.

[Nuntius]

I'll defer to Rockets fans on this Nuntius.. but I was of the thinking that coach Mchale was going to ease Harden's workload as far as handling the ball and facilitating.. I thought they were going to move him off the ball a little more then they did last year.. so he could have more energy to expend on defense.

This is what I thought I was reading.

If that's the case then Lin is the best option indeed. But will this help Harden's development?

Lin has never seemed to be an impediment to Harden's game. I posted this over at ClutchFans last night and will repeat it here:

Second, the "no chemistry" unit of Lin and Harden put up these numbers in Taiwan:

JL -- 17/2/4
JH -- 21/3/5

Which reminded me of this stat line from last year in a win over OKC

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278524

JL -- 29/6/7
JH -- 46/7/6

That 46 points is a career-high for Harden, I believe.

So, if Harden and Lin don't have very good chemistry, then I'm thinking we may want to stick with the "poor chemistry" formula.

Contrary to popular belief, Lin and Harden work well together. And if Harden wants to play better defense and conserve his energy, then I would think having someone to share playmaking duties with would assist in those goals.

I'm not sure Harden sees things this way, though, based upon how he has appeared to dominate the ball the last two games in terms of running the point and having Jeremy off the ball. We will see how things play out.

I think that you misunderstood me a bit. I didn't imply that there is a poor chemistry between Lin and Harden.

My whole argument revolves around the stable flow of offensive production that a possible staggering of Harden's and Lin's minutes could provide.

Using this same argument I have supported the opinion that my Pacers could consider starting Solomon Hill and letting him play 5 minutes at the start of each half while bringing both Stephenson and Granger off the bench in order to have this same stable flow of offensive production from our wings. That's the basis of my idea.

It isn't solely about the fact that both Lin and Harden are ball dominant players. A lot of it has to do with the idea of staggering their minutes in order to get the most out of them.

If someone who watches every Rockets game like you believes that this combo works well then I can certainly believe you since you know more about your team than the rest of us. But as I said the basis of my idea is not that "they don't work well together"

[Kabookalu]

One thing I noticed a lot of good teams have is a good point guard off the bench that can maintain the flow of the game. Beverly doesn't fill that role, but Lin could. Having Lin come off the bench could really boost the team and strengthen the second unit.

The idea of having Lin be the sixth man is more for the benefit of the team overall than it is seeing him demoted.

[HotRocks34]

I think that you misunderstood me a bit. I didn't imply that there is a poor chemistry between Lin and Harden.

My whole argument revolves around the stable flow of offensive production that a possible staggering of Harden's and Lin's minutes could provide.

Using this same argument I have supported the opinion that my Pacers could consider starting Solomon Hill and letting him play 5 minutes at the start of each half while bringing both Stephenson and Granger off the bench in order to have this same stable flow of offensive production from our wings. That's the basis of my idea.

It isn't solely about the fact that both Lin and Harden are ball dominant players. A lot of it has to do with the idea of staggering their minutes in order to get the most out of them.

If someone who watches every Rockets game like you believes that this combo works well then I can certainly believe you since you know more about your team than the rest of us. But as I said the basis of my idea is not that "they don't work well together"

My mistake, I did misunderstand. Sorry about that. I think I may be getting my message boards mixed up. Would not be the first time. LOL

If Lin is needed to play 6th Man or if that is the best way to maximize his effectiveness, so be it. Lin has done well paired with Harden, though. But I'm open to various combinations. We will see how things play out.

[Nuntius]

I think that you misunderstood me a bit. I didn't imply that there is a poor chemistry between Lin and Harden.

My whole argument revolves around the stable flow of offensive production that a possible staggering of Harden's and Lin's minutes could provide.

Using this same argument I have supported the opinion that my Pacers could consider starting Solomon Hill and letting him play 5 minutes at the start of each half while bringing both Stephenson and Granger off the bench in order to have this same stable flow of offensive production from our wings. That's the basis of my idea.

It isn't solely about the fact that both Lin and Harden are ball dominant players. A lot of it has to do with the idea of staggering their minutes in order to get the most out of them.

If someone who watches every Rockets game like you believes that this combo works well then I can certainly believe you since you know more about your team than the rest of us. But as I said the basis of my idea is not that "they don't work well together"

My mistake, I did misunderstand. Sorry about that. I think I may be getting my message boards mixed up. Would not be the first time. LOL

If Lin is needed to play 6th Man or if that is the best way to maximize his effectiveness, so be it. Lin has done well paired with Harden, though. But I'm open to various combinations. We will see how things play out.

Eh, my post was a bit vague so it doesn't surprise me that someone could end up misunderstanding it