Official Trade Thread - Part XXIV

[rockymac52]

Ariza/2nd rd
For
D williams..

Be perfect for ariza, considering he'll be theyre best defender and wouldnt have to worry about scoring being surrounded by love and martin...
Budinger is injured and Minnesota is interested in gettin a sf until Budinger come back...

If otto was healthy we could maybe do a
Otto/2nd rd/booker
For
Williams/dieng


That solves our stretch and future defensive big man problems

Okay, I'm not even going to touch that second trade proposal, because that is ludicrous.

Now that Williams' team option has been picked up, I have no interest in him. He'd prevent us from signing a max FA like Monroe, which makes it a terrible trade.

Williams was 17/8 per 36 shooting 45%...
He fixes a problem we have which is scoring in the front court, we have 3 forwards not named otto
Dieng also fixes a problem...young shot blocking big...said to have serge ibaka potential
And nene blocks us from signing a max fa...even though we would still have room for monroe maxed...
Please explain why otto would be better than williams and dieng

I can't, I just can't.

The majority of statements you just made are incredibly false. I'm sorry I don't feel like wasting my time explaining all of the reasons why this would be a terrible trade right now. But, uh, yeah... you crazy.

[verbal8]

Ariza/2nd rd
For
D williams..

Be perfect for ariza, considering he'll be theyre best defender and wouldnt have to worry about scoring being surrounded by love and martin...
Budinger is injured and Minnesota is interested in gettin a sf until Budinger come back...


That solves our stretch and future defensive big man problems

Now that Williams' team option has been picked up, I have no interest in him. He'd prevent us from signing a max FA like Monroe, which makes it a terrible trade.

Without his last year exercised, I think Williams would be worth a look as a full-time PF, which he will never be in Minn.

I really don't see the point of exercising the team option on him, would any team give him a $6 million+/one year contract?

Even if he is a lot better this year, he could be signed to a long-term deal in the off season with Bird Rights.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

^otto? Now way. Nobody would have traded the third pick for Faried. If their new regime doesn't wan to sign him longterm and he's asking for a big contract, his value isn't that high regardless. My guess is one of Ernie's kids and a top 5-7 protected 1 gets it done. If not, add the rights to Sato as a sweetener.

I'd trade Porter for Faried 7 days a week and twice on Sundays - regardless that he's 2 years closer to free agency. He's a proven quality big man. Otto's a nice small forward prospect - no more no less. If I want to win, I take the proven quality big man over a nice small forward prospect every time. Then again, I'd take Favors over Hayward every time, but at least in that situation - Hayward's proven he can play in the NBA.

Why would Denver settle for a mid to low 1st round pick and junk for Faried?

Sorry to post this idea a third time, but in the Faried thread I suggested: Porter+Ariza for Faried+Chandler

Their new regime (Shaw, Lakers connection with Ariza) would value Ariza and cap relief more than playoff disappointment and old regime (Karl/Ujiri) favorite, WIlson Chandler.

Ariza's expiring deal freeing cap space would be very appealing. I could also see Otto doing very well in a triangle offense. Seems like a no-brainer for Denver if they know they're not into Faried long-term. Not sure if it's the best for the Wizards--I'm not a Wilson Chandler fan. Also, who's to say Otto doesn't turn into a good pro in 3 years? Also, the Wizards will have to give Faried a deal soon.

[deneem4]

I started with
nene/ariza/
for
pau

for the lakers
very realistic, kobe would love ariza back
nene can play pf while Kaman and hill fight the big bodies
laker become a contender

for us
that would make us legit contenders, especially when okafor comes back...
until then we start vesley and let gasol throw oops to him out the post
il even throw in a pick if lakers don't bite
*****end of realistic*****

then for fun... I got carried away, lol....
http://www1.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6342412

[rockymac52]

I started with
nene/ariza/
for
pau

for the lakers
very realistic, kobe would love ariza back
nene can play pf while Kaman and hill fight the big bodies
laker become a contender

for us
that would make us legit contenders, especially when okafor comes back...
until then we start vesley and let gasol throw oops to him out the post
il even throw in a pick if lakers don't bite
*****end of realistic*****

then for fun... I got carried away, lol....
http://www1.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6342412

Do you even realize how much of a self-serving bias you have in most of your posts?

According to you, Pau Gasol is so much better than Nene that despite losing Ariza as well, we would still become contenders. BUT, you also claim that the Lakers become contenders by adding Nene and Ariza instead of just Gasol. So which is it? It can't be both. Pick a side.

"Until then we start Vesely and let Gasol throw oops to him out the post." .......

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

deneem, I like Nene/Ariza for Pau Gasol.

Pau's a couple year's older than Nene and he's clearly not the player he was 3-4 years ago. Yet, I'd take him in a heartbeat with his contract expiring. I think that might even be worth the Wizards including a first round pick, and maybe getting back the Laker's round two pick.

Pau would be good paired with any of Okafor, Seraphin, Vesely, and Booker. I think Wall, Beal, and Webster would love Pau's passing, because he's an even better passer than Nene.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I started with
nene/ariza/
for
pau

for the lakers
very realistic, kobe would love ariza back
nene can play pf while Kaman and hill fight the big bodies
laker become a contender

for us
that would make us legit contenders, especially when okafor comes back...
until then we start vesley and let gasol throw oops to him out the post
il even throw in a pick if lakers don't bite
*****end of realistic*****

then for fun... I got carried away, lol....
http://www1.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6342412

Do you even realize how much of a self-serving bias you have in most of your posts?

According to you, Pau Gasol is so much better than Nene that despite losing Ariza as well, we would still become contenders. BUT, you also claim that the Lakers become contenders by adding Nene and Ariza instead of just Gasol. So which is it? It can't be both. Pick a side.

"Until then we start Vesely and let Gasol throw oops to him out the post." .......

I'm not sure Pau is better than Nene. Not a healthy Nene.

However, I tracked Pau's games during the Laker's playoff run last season. Gasol played GREAT. He's clearly due for a bounce back season. I trust his health, even at two years older and coming off a bout with plantar fasciitis and other lower leg injuries himself, more than I trust Nene's.

I would do the deal because of the cap more than anything else. I don't know that it doesn't help LAL and WAS. The Lakers are being built on quickness and Mike D'Antoni's system. They need Nene's defense and his speed compared to Pau. They'd LOVE Ariza back, particularly with MWP gone. I think Farmar and Ariza both have rings from years back with them. They'd love Ariza back also for his defense.

Pau seems like a future-HOF guy who would be very efficient with just about any combination of Wizards players.

[rockymac52]

I believe Pau will have a bounce back year as well. Although I think part of the reason his performance dropped off last season was because of D'Antoni's system, so maybe he won't be that much better this year after all.

But yeah, despite his age and recent injuries, I still feel a lot more confident going forward with Pau than I do with Nene. That's mostly because of Nene's injury problems.

I definitely would not include a 1st round draft pick in a trade for Pau. You just can't trade a mid 1st round pick in a hyped draft for a 33 year old big man coming off a down year and an injury. There are rare cases where that would work out well because the old big man is a true legend, and not to take anything away from Pau because he's probably a HOFer, but I don't see Pau necessarily being one of those guys. He COULD, but if I'm giving up our draft pick, I want to be a lot more sure of it.

I also like that Pau plays 6-8 more MPG than Nene, which means that Vesely or Seraphin sees 6-8 less MPG. Kind of an addition by subtraction type situation there.

[deneem4]

Pau is tht much better than nene...pau can get hot and go for 30/14...nene sadly wont, not to mention pau can post high or low and pass out of double teams effectively (slashing vesley)...he can also defend and willing to defend against bigger centers until okafor comes back

nene is better on the lakers because how they play, remember how nene excelled back in Denver in tht fast paced offense...also ariza is the lakers golden child and kobe said hes one of the best defenders, being in tht environment might bring back the old ariza

and u sayin nene is better than a healthy pau but a healthy pau is in another league compared to a healthy nene...and neither are they old self but pau is healthier than nene right now and hes only 2 yrs older

I would definite include a pick, thts extreme cap space while being more than jus a 1st rd sweep considering we face knicks or brooklyn we might see the 2nd rd...okafor and gasol can go head to head with any big man combo in the league, and gasol has multiple championship experience...

and we go into next season with space to sign 2 max contract with room for quality bench depth...fck a draft, we cant develop bigs anyway

[payitforward]

Here's what I think of Faried: I'd swap next year's UNPROTECTED 1st round pick plus whatever scrub salary was necessary to get him. Add Faried and the Wizards are a playoff team.

Me too! He's a fantastic player. How we didn't take him I'll never know.

Might of had something to do with my frequent posts and emails to the Wizards FO, starting over a year before the draft, saying Faried would be great.

No, not in my case at least -- I joined this forum way after the 2011 draft. Heck, I'd been hoping he would come out in 2010, as that year I was pretty sure we could get him with our #30 pick (wch we wound up using in a trade up to #23 to get Booker).

I believe a lot of people here thought the Singleton pick was a good one, btw -- don't know whether you were among them. I didn't. I had Faried ahead of him (obviously), and I had Tobias Harris ahead of him as well.

Again, given the real sequence of picks, as our turns came up I had Leonard, Faried and Chandler Parsons (who looked very good in pre-draft videos and had put up quite good college numbers -- better than Singleton for example!).

I'm not right all the time, of course; no one is. I didn't think Monroe would be as good an NBA player as he's turned out to be.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I didn't like Singleton, but i waffled, pif. I hated the Singleton pick early on. I knew he was nowhere near as good as Faried. However, by draft night I didn't object vehemently to Singleton other than to say they should have picked Faried. I would have been okay with Singleton/Faried instead of Vesely/Singleton.

(FWIW, I wanted Leonard and Faried, and was also very high on Marshon Brooks for the Wizards 2011 draft)

I have to confess I softened (wrongly) from my initial thoughts about Singleton. Hated him early on but thought by draft night after reading other posters' thoughts that maybe Chris would do well.

pif, if you hated Chris Singleton as a pick all the way you were better than I on draft night.

(All of us, and I mean virtually all, did not want Vesely as the pick).

[payitforward]

U obvious is oblivious to real basketball...u probably believe lebron would beat kobe in a 1on1

I love some of your posts, deneem, especially when you are being funny!

That said, your ability to analyze and pick players is abysmal. And you demonstrate why in the simple sentence above. "Real basketball" isn't 1-on-1. Real basketball is played by two teams who each have 5 players on the court.

And real basketball results aren't determined when one player "beats" another. Real basketball results are determined by the numbers on the scoreboard. At the end of the game, they don't add up who looked great, who dunked on whom, who had the highest vertical, etc. They just give a L to the team w/ the lower number on the scoreboard and a W to the other team.

1-on-1 is meaningless. If you were to pit two guys (both terrific players) who had very different skill sets against each other, the winner would be determined by which skill set is better for 1-on-1. What does that tell you, given that 1-on-1 is not how basketball is played? Nothing much.

[payitforward]

... in the Faried thread I suggested: Porter+Ariza for Faried+Chandler

Their new regime (Shaw, Lakers connection with Ariza) would value Ariza and cap relief more than playoff disappointment and old regime (Karl/Ujiri) favorite, WIlson Chandler.

Ariza's expiring deal freeing cap space would be very appealing. I could also see Otto doing very well in a triangle offense. Seems like a no-brainer for Denver if they know they're not into Faried long-term. Not sure if it's the best for the Wizards--I'm not a Wilson Chandler fan. Also, who's to say Otto doesn't turn into a good pro in 3 years? Also, the Wizards will have to give Faried a deal soon.

It does seem obvious that the new regime in Denver is a downgrade from Ujiri, hence they might well be willing to trade Faried. I can't imagine Ernie trading Porter this quickly, but I'd do the trade. You have to give up something to get a guy as good as Faried. And if Chandler played as well this year as he did last year, you'd extend him. If he went back to the lower productivity of all his previous years, let him expire.

[payitforward]

I started with
nene/ariza/
for
pau

for the lakers
very realistic, kobe would love ariza back
nene can play pf while Kaman and hill fight the big bodies
laker become a contender

for us
that would make us legit contenders, especially when okafor comes back...
until then we start vesley and let gasol throw oops to him out the post
il even throw in a pick if lakers don't bite
*****end of realistic*****

then for fun... I got carried away, lol....
http://www1.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6342412

Do you even realize how much of a self-serving bias you have in most of your posts?

According to you, Pau Gasol is so much better than Nene that despite losing Ariza as well, we would still become contenders. BUT, you also claim that the Lakers become contenders by adding Nene and Ariza instead of just Gasol. So which is it? It can't be both. Pick a side.

"Until then we start Vesely and let Gasol throw oops to him out the post." .......

This is what I mean about deneem -- funny, yes. Take his ideas seriously? No.

[Ruzious]

^otto? Now way. Nobody would have traded the third pick for Faried. If their new regime doesn't wan to sign him longterm and he's asking for a big contract, his value isn't that high regardless. My guess is one of Ernie's kids and a top 5-7 protected 1 gets it done. If not, add the rights to Sato as a sweetener.

I'd trade Porter for Faried 7 days a week and twice on Sundays - regardless that he's 2 years closer to free agency. He's a proven quality big man. Otto's a nice small forward prospect - no more no less. If I want to win, I take the proven quality big man over a nice small forward prospect every time. Then again, I'd take Favors over Hayward every time, but at least in that situation - Hayward's proven he can play in the NBA.

Why would Denver settle for a mid to low 1st round pick and junk for Faried?

Sorry to post this idea a third time, but in the Faried thread I suggested: Porter+Ariza for Faried+Chandler

Their new regime (Shaw, Lakers connection with Ariza) would value Ariza and cap relief more than playoff disappointment and old regime (Karl/Ujiri) favorite, WIlson Chandler.

Ariza's expiring deal freeing cap space would be very appealing. I could also see Otto doing very well in a triangle offense. Seems like a no-brainer for Denver if they know they're not into Faried long-term. Not sure if it's the best for the Wizards--I'm not a Wilson Chandler fan. Also, who's to say Otto doesn't turn into a good pro in 3 years? Also, the Wizards will have to give Faried a deal soon.

I like you're thinking there. I think we'd still need to get a 3rd team involved, because Porter's not a good fit for Denver. The 3rd team would have to have a quality shooting guard that they wouldn't mind trading in exchange for Porter.

[rockymac52]

I'd trade Porter for Faried 7 days a week and twice on Sundays - regardless that he's 2 years closer to free agency. He's a proven quality big man. Otto's a nice small forward prospect - no more no less. If I want to win, I take the proven quality big man over a nice small forward prospect every time. Then again, I'd take Favors over Hayward every time, but at least in that situation - Hayward's proven he can play in the NBA.

Why would Denver settle for a mid to low 1st round pick and junk for Faried?

Sorry to post this idea a third time, but in the Faried thread I suggested: Porter+Ariza for Faried+Chandler

Their new regime (Shaw, Lakers connection with Ariza) would value Ariza and cap relief more than playoff disappointment and old regime (Karl/Ujiri) favorite, WIlson Chandler.

Ariza's expiring deal freeing cap space would be very appealing. I could also see Otto doing very well in a triangle offense. Seems like a no-brainer for Denver if they know they're not into Faried long-term. Not sure if it's the best for the Wizards--I'm not a Wilson Chandler fan. Also, who's to say Otto doesn't turn into a good pro in 3 years? Also, the Wizards will have to give Faried a deal soon.

I like you're thinking there. I think we'd still need to get a 3rd team involved, because Porter's not a good fit for Denver. The 3rd team would have to have a quality shooting guard that they wouldn't mind trading in exchange for Porter.

Dion Waiters and the Cavs, perhaps?

[tontoz]

Speaking of unintentional comedy we haven't heard from WizD in awhile. The board isn't the same without his elite-post-footwork-low-to-the-ground-dribble rants although i am sure Nivek doesn't miss the surface to air missles being lobbed his way.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Sorry to post this idea a third time, but in the Faried thread I suggested: Porter+Ariza for Faried+Chandler

Their new regime (Shaw, Lakers connection with Ariza) would value Ariza and cap relief more than playoff disappointment and old regime (Karl/Ujiri) favorite, WIlson Chandler.

Ariza's expiring deal freeing cap space would be very appealing. I could also see Otto doing very well in a triangle offense. Seems like a no-brainer for Denver if they know they're not into Faried long-term. Not sure if it's the best for the Wizards--I'm not a Wilson Chandler fan. Also, who's to say Otto doesn't turn into a good pro in 3 years? Also, the Wizards will have to give Faried a deal soon.

I like you're thinking there. I think we'd still need to get a 3rd team involved, because Porter's not a good fit for Denver. The 3rd team would have to have a quality shooting guard that they wouldn't mind trading in exchange for Porter.

Dion Waiters and the Cavs, perhaps?

I think they're good with Bennett and they like Waiters, but this works talent-wise and pick-wise.

I could really see New Orleans offering up Austin Rivers to Denver to get Porter. This one would make me ill seeing how good the Pelicans would be with Otto and Anthony Davis years from now. NO really has no need for Rivers, since they've got Gordon back healthy and they just acquired Tyreke Evans.

http://www.nola.com/pelicans/index.ssf/ ... st_48.html

I bet Rivers gets traded, probably to the Clippers and his dad as coach, if nothing else.

[Nivek]

Speaking of unintentional comedy we haven't heard from WizD in awhile. The board isn't the same without his elite-post-footwork-low-to-the-ground-dribble rants although i am sure Nivek doesn't miss the surface to air missles being lobbed his way.

I miss WizDynasty. I'll always be grateful that he taught me about the value of bowleggedness in evaluating basketball players.

[nuposse04]

speaking of MIA posters, w/e happened to AFM.