Wiggins "average" in practices - How good will Wiggins be?

[fansinceforever]

Like I said, I haven't seen a ton of the kid but from the little I have seen I don't really see any reason to hit the panic button. He has every tool and god given attribute a basketball player could ask for...

[mattg]

No I did not see Rose play in HS.

If you were supposedly the best player in your class. You are a sure fire #1 pick. You show up to campus, a great and historic program, with all of these other high profile guys. Don't you think you want to dominate in those practices to show your peers how good you are? I feel like you have that competitive spirit or you don't. You don't turn that off and on and become great. Imagine Jordan just slacking off in pick up games or practices with TEAM USA. Most of us have seen the documentary, you should want to PROVE you are the best, even in practice.

You would have called him a sure fire bust then. Rose took like 2 shots in his HS state championship game. Never looked to assert his will on the game and completely take it over. He was a team first guy who legitimately liked to see his teammates do well, same with wiggins. If you look at rose at Memphis it's a similar scenario. Very solid team, but rose took a backseat to CDR a lot of times and didn't try to dominate games all the time.

Have you ever joined a new team or something, that was already extremely established? Not many people step right in and go all alpha mode in a scenario like that,especially not when going away to college for the first time which is already a shock enough for many people since its so different.

People also need to remember that Michael Jordan didn't come out of the womb a cold blooded killer ala dream team era mike. He became that over time. 3 years in college and then all the disappointments of his first couple years in the nba. He was always ultra competitive but there's a drastic difference between prime mike and 18 year old mike.

[stevescheffler06]

Let's bottom line it for the Bucks staff here.

It doesn't matter if Wiggins flames out this year and isn't even drafted. WE WANT A TOP 3 PICK AND A SHOT AT REAL CHANGE. You're not going to convince the 'Tankers' crowd otherwise. Period.

[mattg]

Let's bottom line it for the Bucks staff here.

It doesn't matter if Wiggins flames out this year and isn't even drafted. WE WANT A TOP 3 PICK AND A SHOT AT REAL CHANGE. You're not going to convince the 'Tankers' crowd otherwise. Period.

If they actually paid attention they'd also notice many of us bringing this exact issue with wiggins up long before there was an espn article about it, mostly to quell the hype a bit as certain posters would get unrealistic expectations for the kid. But even still, that doesn't deter me from being excited about a top pick whatsoever. There are always good players to be drafted, you just have to scout well. It could be the worst draft ever and I'd still be psyched about having a top pick because I always believe there is someone there worth taking. Its not an indictment against picking at the top of draft/tanking when a team's scouts mess up and blow the pick like we see argued so much. "Look where taking got them, they still suck!". Don't blame the strategy when it's a FO being unable to execute the plan correctly.

[HurricaneKid]

Why would a staff say something like this? He is clearly the best recruit Kansas had had since Wilt Chamberlain and undermining him 3 weeks into practice seems uncalled for. They are just attempting to motivate him. Its a non-issue until he doesn't perform in games.

The big issue is that McLemore had these exact issues last year and this is something that will stain the program if they cannot address them.

[Mikeylikesit]

Let's bottom line it for the Bucks staff here.

It doesn't matter if Wiggins flames out this year and isn't even drafted. WE WANT A TOP 3 PICK AND A SHOT AT REAL CHANGE. You're not going to convince the 'Tankers' crowd otherwise. Period.

I made this thread because it would bring discussion. It had nothing to do with "lets not tank this guy sucks anyway" - which people are somehow making it out to be. I said I HAVE NO IDEA if he was going to be as good as advertised but people are saying he isn't, yet. That doesn't mean "LETS WIN". It just means maybe, just maybe, if we were lucky enough to get the #1 pick it might be someone else. That is all.

[HurricaneKid]

The article is also highly suspicious. He is a known slasher and distributor yet the article hits him for his 3 point shooting saying he will shoot ~30%. Well when LeBron was 18 he shot 29.0%.

And the notion that MJ imposed his will as a Frosh at UNC is hilariously inaccurate.

[mattg]

Why would a staff say something like this? He is clearly the best recruit Kansas had had since Wilt Chamberlain and undermining him 3 weeks into practice seems uncalled for. They are just attempting to motivate him. Its a non-issue until he doesn't perform in games.

The big issue is that McLemore had these exact issues last year and this is something that will stain the program if they cannot address them.

Mclemore was rated as the number 34 player in his class. He played PF until very late in high school and also dealt with a terrible home life/situation. Not comparable to wiggins at all as a prospect. If anything it shows how great of a coach self is to get mclemore drafted so high despite all that. The fact is that Kansas players regularly do better than the expectations placed on them by recruiting rankings and stuff like that.

[TroyD92]

Let's bottom line it for the Bucks staff here.

It doesn't matter if Wiggins flames out this year and isn't even drafted. WE WANT A TOP 3 PICK AND A SHOT AT REAL CHANGE. You're not going to convince the 'Tankers' crowd otherwise. Period.

I made this thread because it would bring discussion. It had nothing to do with "lets not tank this guy sucks anyway" - which people are somehow making it out to be. I said I HAVE NO IDEA if he was going to be as good as advertised but people are saying he isn't, yet. That doesn't mean "LETS WIN". It just means maybe, just maybe, if we were lucky enough to get the #1 pick it might be someone else. That is all.

Why? What's the point of making a thread about this when you could just put it into the Lottery thread? This is a non issue (in general actually) until he doesn't perform.

[Mikeylikesit]

The article is also highly suspicious. He is a known slasher and distributor yet the article hits him for his 3 point shooting saying he will shoot ~30%. Well when LeBron was 18 he shot 29.0%.

And the notion that MJ imposed his will as a Frosh at UNC is hilariously inaccurate.

Freshman didn't get to do as much back then. The fact that Jordan was only the 4th freshman EVER to start at UNC should have told you something. This was when there was a rule in place (hell of a lot more talent in college than there is today). Ever heard of "The only person to stop Michael Jordan, was Dean Smith?" Nowadays you can start all freshman because you can get away with it. Guys are constantly leaving after 1 year and you don't have those GREAT veteran guys. These guys have the chance to impose their will during the season because they're allowed to. There is no doubt Jordan would have done the same if given the opportunity that guys get today.

[HurricaneKid]

Why would a staff say something like this? He is clearly the best recruit Kansas had had since Wilt Chamberlain and undermining him 3 weeks into practice seems uncalled for. They are just attempting to motivate him. Its a non-issue until he doesn't perform in games.

The big issue is that McLemore had these exact issues last year and this is something that will stain the program if they cannot address them.

Mclemore was rated as the number 34 player in his class. He played PF until very late in high school and also dealt with a terrible home life/situation. Not comparable to wiggins at all as a prospect. If anything it shows how great of a coach self is to get mclemore drafted so high despite all that. The fact is that Kansas players regularly do better than the expectations placed on them by recruiting rankings and stuff like that.

It was evident he was one of the elite talents of the class and many thought he had an inside track at the 1 or 2 pick going into the NCAA tourney. In the first round he made two shots. Against W Ky. In the second rd he was far worse and went 0/9 against UNC. And people said he had become passive and his stock fell significantly.

[Mikeylikesit]

Let's bottom line it for the Bucks staff here.

It doesn't matter if Wiggins flames out this year and isn't even drafted. WE WANT A TOP 3 PICK AND A SHOT AT REAL CHANGE. You're not going to convince the 'Tankers' crowd otherwise. Period.

I made this thread because it would bring discussion. It had nothing to do with "lets not tank this guy sucks anyway" - which people are somehow making it out to be. I said I HAVE NO IDEA if he was going to be as good as advertised but people are saying he isn't, yet. That doesn't mean "LETS WIN". It just means maybe, just maybe, if we were lucky enough to get the #1 pick it might be someone else. That is all.

Why? What's the point of making a thread about this when you could just put it into the Lottery thread? This is a non issue (in general actually) until he doesn't perform.

Why? Maybe because the majority of people on here want to tank. I thought people might find interest in the article. You don't have to post here if you don't like it. And obviously the majority find it interesting enough to be discussing it.

[AussieBuck]

Poor man's Caron Butler. Stick with the vets Milwaukee, it's the honorable thing to do.

[TroyD92]

I made this thread because it would bring discussion. It had nothing to do with "lets not tank this guy sucks anyway" - which people are somehow making it out to be. I said I HAVE NO IDEA if he was going to be as good as advertised but people are saying he isn't, yet. That doesn't mean "LETS WIN". It just means maybe, just maybe, if we were lucky enough to get the #1 pick it might be someone else. That is all.

Why? What's the point of making a thread about this when you could just put it into the Lottery thread? This is a non issue (in general actually) until he doesn't perform.

Why? Maybe because the majority of people on here want to tank. I thought people might find interest in the article. You don't have to post here if you don't like it. And obviously the majority find it interesting enough to be discussing it.

I understand it just seems like you intentionally put this thread out there to tell those realgm guys that maybe they should shut up, because the consensus #1 pick isn't living up to the hype two weeks into practice.

[Mikeylikesit]

Why? What's the point of making a thread about this when you could just put it into the Lottery thread? This is a non issue (in general actually) until he doesn't perform.

Why? Maybe because the majority of people on here want to tank. I thought people might find interest in the article. You don't have to post here if you don't like it. And obviously the majority find it interesting enough to be discussing it.

I understand it just seems like you intentionally put this thread out there to tell those realgm guys that maybe they should shut up, because the consensus #1 pick isn't living up to the hype two weeks into practice.

I'm not on this site enough to know who people like. Obviously he was the #1 guy. It was just interesting to hear other people that are closer to the program and some that have seen him, saying he isn't. The college season will confirm whether he is or isn't. We all thought Noel was going to be the #1 pick last year too. Things change and this class has enough talent for guys to make a jump. Just something for people to keep an eye on if these things are true or not. Honestly, he should still dominate even if he can't shoot. Evan Turner is a prime example of how that is possible.

[mattg]

Why would a staff say something like this? He is clearly the best recruit Kansas had had since Wilt Chamberlain and undermining him 3 weeks into practice seems uncalled for. They are just attempting to motivate him. Its a non-issue until he doesn't perform in games.

The big issue is that McLemore had these exact issues last year and this is something that will stain the program if they cannot address them.

Mclemore was rated as the number 34 player in his class. He played PF until very late in high school and also dealt with a terrible home life/situation. Not comparable to wiggins at all as a prospect. If anything it shows how great of a coach self is to get mclemore drafted so high despite all that. The fact is that Kansas players regularly do better than the expectations placed on them by recruiting rankings and stuff like that.

It was evident he was one of the elite talents of the class and many thought he had an inside track at the 1 or 2 pick going into the NCAA tourney. In the first round he made two shots. Against W Ky. In the second rd he was far worse and went 0/9 against UNC. And people said he had become passive and his stock fell significantly.

You do know that Mclemore redshirted a season at KU right? The kid was extremely raw and his class ranking always reflected that. The mere fact that he was in the conversation for the number 1 spot says it all. There's also the circumstance that the draft had no consensus up top and Noel got hurt as well.

And Mikey, that "only person to ever stop Michael jordan was dean smith" is nonsense. Read up on Jordan's response to it sometime. Also not really sure what you're trying to argue in that paragraph. Jordan is more competitive than wiggins? sure, but you could say that about any other player ever so its pointless. It also doesn't change the fact that Mike at 18 wasn't nearly the same player as mike as a rookie, or any other point in his career.

And Freshman play now because coaches play the guys who are the best players regardless of class, simple as that. People finally realized how dumb it was to not have lew Alcindor playing varsity because he was a frosh. So yes talented freshman will tear it up when given the chance to play in any era, everyone knows that. Not every kid is setting out to go all alpha at practice though and 'impose their will', especially not at established programs.

[ReasonablySober]

I think people are going overboard here. No one is saying he's going to be a bad player. No one is saying he won't be worthy of a high lotto pick. Even the people here that haven't bought into him being a once in a generation prospect are still saying they'd love for the Bucks to land him.

[stellation]

Some of us non-interns have been saying this for quite a while already. This is still an ideal draft to have high picks.

Ahhh, but what is better? A high pick or multiple second round picks?

Does anyone else think that instead of taking his wife out for dinner at a nice place on the night of their anniversary that Hammond probably takes her our to McDonald's every night for a week instead?

[JimmyTheKid]

How good will Wiggins be?

Easy answer. Nobody knows. Remember when Shabazz Muhammed was a "can't miss sure fire #1 overall pick?" A year or two later, after a pedestrian campaign at UCLA, he's drafted in the teens and may not contribute at all this season. Happens all the time. Just look at Chad Ford's "Big Board," or ANYONE's for that matter, in October, and watch how much it fluctuates until the draft. Familiar names falling, rising, falling, rising with every good and bad performance. Unknown foreign players getting in the mix. Its a crapshoot.

[mattg]

How good will Wiggins be?

Easy answer. Nobody knows. Remember when Shabazz Muhammed was a "can't miss sure fire #1 overall pick?" A year or two later, after a pedestrian campaign at UCLA, he's drafted in the teens and may not contribute at all this season. Happens all the time. Just look at Chad Ford's "Big Board," or ANYONE's for that matter, in October, and watch how much it fluctuates until the draft. Familiar names falling, rising, falling, rising with every good and bad performance. Unknown foreign players getting in the mix. Its a crapshoot.

Halfway down the page http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1190374&start=165



And I know someone will bring up me liking Austin rivers but I don't care. Still think he turns out solid eventually.