Bellator General Discussion and Info

[CPT]

Was hoping to get back into Bellator by checking out this week's event, but after seeing the card, I decided to pass.

Any highlights?

[REDDzone]

/FutonFighter

lulz.

[REDDzone]

War Machine just got a grappling lesson. I've watched a few fights lately (this one and the tuf fight...today, actually) where the guy on his opponent's back had a body lock and non traditional arm placement. Not having that seatbelt grip but alternating the choking arm which is more aggressive and offers more opportunity for chokes but sacrifices control. We've seen this often before but usually the guy whose back was taken is able to spin back into guard a la Fitch on BJ due to said lack of control after putting their weight on the side the legs are locked on. I'm sure these recent fights are more indication that the likes of War Machine is not the grappler Fitch is and not some new found back control that is more optimal that guys have discovered. Still interesting. I feel like we are seeing a lot of guys waltzing to their opponent's back on the feet (as opposed to on a scramble or setting it up with a guy turning away from strikes on the ground) nowadays. Maia is a good example of one who has done this often recently, despite recent failure.

[Starkiller]

I watched the fights with my g/f who is Ron Sparks neice, I felt bad for her watching that pathetic display he put on in that fight against Mighty Mo, horrible attempt at a take down and then pretty much looked worse than a new born baby on his back. Good lord. Didn't have the heart to tell her how **** he was but she kinda said the same thing while she was screaming at the tv at him lol.

[CPT]

If you get subbed by Mighty Mo, you should seriously reconsider your career path.

I only tuned in (well, downloaded illegally) to see Tiger. Looking forward to seeing him actually get tested.

[Cammo101]

If you get subbed by Mighty Mo, you should seriously reconsider your career path.

I only tuned in (well, downloaded illegally) to see Tiger. Looking forward to seeing him actually get tested.

Ron Sparks vs. Eric Prindle in a no-gi grappling match. Loser leaves Bellator. Make it happen Bjorn.

[Starkiller]

If you get subbed by Mighty Mo, you should seriously reconsider your career path.

I only tuned in (well, downloaded illegally) to see Tiger. Looking forward to seeing him actually get tested.

Ron Sparks vs. Eric Prindle in a no-gi grappling match. Loser leaves Bellator. Make it happen Bjorn.

I realize he is a "professional" athlete and peole say this hyperbole all the time, but watching that, even though he outweighs me by almost 80 pounds, I have all the confidence in the world that I could probably tap him, and I've never trained BJJ more than reading books in my life. That was about as bad as that Circus fight of Randy's against the boxer who's name escapes me right now.

[REDDzone]

I realize he is a "professional" athlete and peole say this hyperbole all the time, but watching that, even though he outweighs me by almost 80 pounds, I have all the confidence in the world that I could probably tap him, and I've never trained BJJ more than reading books in my life. That was about as bad as that Circus fight of Randy's against the boxer who's name escapes me right now.

Walk onto the mat, flying omoplata, tap tap tap, walk off the mat.

imho.

[cowboyronnie]

Pathetic fight from Brooks. Running and safe kicks and takedowns to guard + nowhere. Outright running to kill the clock. Awad was exhausted that third and Brooks didn't even consider going after him.

[cowboyronnie]

This Brendan Ward is pushing Doug Marshall for the biggest prick in all of MMA. But he's at least far more talented. That was some great boxing and serious hand speed, if he didn't quite seem to be turning his hips into any of those final 15 or so punches. Pretty vicious finish. And I think that was actually a legit stoppage.

Wait, Marshall and Ward could in theory meet? LOL.

[REDDzone]

Bellator unconditionally releases Ben Askren.

On one hand it seems like a bad decision, he's their best welterweight. On the other hand, he makes the rest of the division look so terrible that it actually may work out for the best for them.

[Jasen777]

On one hand it seems like a bad decision, he's their best welterweight. On the other hand, he makes the rest of the division look so terrible that it actually may work out for the best for them.

Totally makes sense from a business perspective, in the short/medium term at least.

[REDDzone]

Michael Chandler ‏@MikeChandlerMMA 13h
Just be glad he didn't "bore" us by smashing you RT @WarMachine170: Yay!!! Ben Askren can now go BORE people in a different organization!!!!

God I <3 Michael Chandler.

[Bernman]

Patricio Pitbull and Vitaly Minakov never stopped being beasts. It's just that if you fight in a major org outside the UFC, people think you should have zero problems with opposition, or you're ordinary. We see a bigger sample of performances against different opposition on different nights, and we regain the perspective that they are studs. Now, don't forget it. They are killers. They are well-rounded, and it only takes one punch from them to put you out. Congrats to Minakov, the NEW Bellator HW champion. It was long overdue. And a title would be for Pitbull too, now he has to reach the mountaintop as well. And he will I think, after his next fight. He probably just has to defeat an opponent he already has in Danny Straus.

As far as the Rampage fight is concerned, he got the ko against Beltran, which is kind of an achievement. He's not an easy man to put down. And he is respectable, given the fact he should have gotten the last two w's against Pokrajac and Maldonado. But he's still worse than Rampage has faced in quite a while. So you can't say he's back off that performance. Probably the same guy who lost to the top 10 in UFC, and probably would lose to the top few in Bellator in Vegh, Newton, and Mo. But it'll be interesting how they use him, in order to face those guys. Will he just be a feature fighter and avoid them? Will he bypass the tourney format for a title shot. Will he get the Mo treatment in a 4-man tourney protecting him? Because I don't think they want to risk him losing, which he probably would in a full-fledged tourney, before they get their headlining title fight w/ Rampage on the next ppv attempt.

[Cammo101]

I'd love to see Bellator either ditch the tourneys or stack the tourneys big time for next season. The tourneys this year have been super weak, either go big or ditch it. No more keeping the best fighters out of tourneys and having them fight night club bouncers or used car salesmen instead like they did tonight with Galvao.

Something like:

HW - Peter Graham, Blagoi Ivanov, Lavar Johnson, Ryan Martinez, Mighty Mo, Vinicius Spartan, Alexander Volkov, Rich Hale.
LHW - Rampage, King Mo, Vladimir Matyushenko, Liam McGeary, Christian M'Pumbu, Tito Ortiz, Jacob Noe, Mikhail Zayats.
MW - Brett Cooper, Eugene Fadiora, Perry Filkins, Mikkel Parlo, Mamed Khalidov, Brian Rogers, Vyacheslav Vassilevsky, Kendall Grove.
WW - Karl Amoussou, Nah-Shon Burrell, Ryan Ford, Andrey Koreshkov, Joe Riggs, Ben Saunders, Cristiano Souza, Brent Weedman.
LW - Saad Awad, Rick Hawn, Mike Guymon, Patricky Pitbull, David Rickles, Tiger Sarnivskiy, Paul Sass, Lloyd Woodard,
FW - Pat Curran, Guiti Yamuchi, Fabricio Guerreiro, Rad Martinez, Frodo Khasbulaev, Diego Nunes, Mike Richman, Shahbulat Shamhalaev.

[REDDzone]

I hate how people say "x shouldn't have to go back through the tournament". Like Pat Curran, heard someone say he shouldn't have to go back through. Whether he SHOULD have to or not is one question, but if he did, that is certainly one way to get me to tune in. I'd be interested in watching it.

If you don't want guys going through tournaments, then scrap tournaments.

[Jasen777]

If you don't want guys going through tournaments, then scrap tournaments.

I like the idea of tournaments, but with injuries and medical suspensions (do they have those on reservations?) they're just too hard to pull of nowadays. Plus it can make your champs wait too long.

In other news Rampage won, even if he didn't try to make 205.

[REDDzone]

Yea, like what are the odds Rampage can make 205 that many times in such a short period? He didn't even care enough to get to 205 for his debut.

I actually didn't see the fight, I tuned in for his post fight speech (damn the luck), but it was funny how he called out everyone in "my division" after the fight. Really, what division is that? Pretty sure he's the only guy fighting catchweight at 210 or whatever in bellator right now...

[Cammo101]

I hate how people say "x shouldn't have to go back through the tournament". Like Pat Curran, heard someone say he shouldn't have to go back through. Whether he SHOULD have to or not is one question, but if he did, that is certainly one way to get me to tune in. I'd be interested in watching it.

If you don't want guys going through tournaments, then scrap tournaments.

Exactly. If you sell your company as being a level playing field for everyone, then all these guys need to be fighting in the tourney. This season's tourneys have had zero intrigue because the talent level was very low.

Personally, I think they have enough talent now to scrap the tourney format all together.

[Bernman]

I'd love to see Bellator either ditch the tourneys or stack the tourneys big time for next season. The tourneys this year have been super weak, either go big or ditch it. No more keeping the best fighters out of tourneys and having them fight night club bouncers or used car salesmen instead like they did tonight with Galvao.

Something like:

HW - Peter Graham, Blagoi Ivanov, Lavar Johnson, Ryan Martinez, Mighty Mo, Vinicius Spartan, Alexander Volkov, Rich Hale.
LHW - Rampage, King Mo, Vladimir Matyushenko, Liam McGeary, Christian M'Pumbu, Tito Ortiz, Jacob Noe, Mikhail Zayats.
MW - Brett Cooper, Eugene Fadiora, Perry Filkins, Mikkel Parlo, Mamed Khalidov, Brian Rogers, Vyacheslav Vassilevsky, Kendall Grove.
WW - Karl Amoussou, Nah-Shon Burrell, Ryan Ford, Andrey Koreshkov, Joe Riggs, Ben Saunders, Cristiano Souza, Brent Weedman.
LW - Saad Awad, Rick Hawn, Mike Guymon, Patricky Pitbull, David Rickles, Tiger Sarnivskiy, Paul Sass, Lloyd Woodard,
FW - Pat Curran, Guiti Yamuchi, Fabricio Guerreiro, Rad Martinez, Frodo Khasbulaev, Diego Nunes, Mike Richman, Shahbulat Shamhalaev.

I agree that the mismatches, like Galvao's are frustrating. But I don't think simply having tournaments and putting their best in them is going to solve all situations like his. There were 2 bw tourneys around his time. They just decided not to put him in one because the potential of a Dantas rematch so soon. Sometimes timing doesn't work out for a fighter to be in a tournament, or they aren't ready. In those cases I think they should more have the attitude that they want to put those fighters in match-ups that are still interesting for the fans, and worthwhile for the fighters, so whatever happens happens against an opponent with a pulse, and if they lose, put the other guy in the tournament. They shouldn't have so many fighters that are protected and their guys. Their pre tourneys don't operate under the spirit of tourneys. UFC has a much more meritorious system leading up to fighters being contenders, after which point merit doesn't much matter.

As far as your tourney selections, they are alright, but I disagree with a lot of your picks.

fw - Frodo is in a title fight. I was probably the one who RZ was annoyed at saying Pat shouldn't have to go thru a tourney. I don't think he should drop 3 rungs on the ladder to slum it with unproven prospects like Goiti. But maybe do another 4-man with him and other proven guys like Shah, Richman, and bring back Aoki; and that would be perfect. Goiti can wait.

lw - Derek Anderson beat Pitbull. Sinclair is a no brainer. Campos has got to be in there. And what about Marcin Held? My god, Marcin Held!?! He looked great last time.

ww - Amoussou just lost, albeit controversially. Ford can't travel to the States, and I think is in WSOF now. Saunders needs a break. Weedman could use one. You missed Adam McDonough. Also, Nate Coy. Parlo should drop. They also need to go outside the organization and get Grimaud and guys like that. This is a weakened division, like mw.

mw- speaking of mw, that's an optimistic projection. You have Khalidov and Vasilevsky on there. I don't think they can have a mw tourney, unless it's 4-man, and they find a way to get (back) Vasilevsky and Khalidov.

lhw - that's not how I'd play the LHW tourney at all. They are pretty loaded with prospects. I do a separate 4-man for the established higher level vets like Rampage, Mo, Tito, M'Pumbu, and Zayats. Then for the prospects and lower level vets, like Oezdemir, McGeary, Vassell, Eduardo, Lins, Halsey, DeBlass, Beltran, and Matyshenko.

hw - Hale has worn out his welcome as a hw. Rapha Butler is an obvious one you missed. So was Ruslan Magomedov. Volkov can take a break.

Stacking the tourneys reasonably like that, instead of setting it up for 1-2 guys to win, would go the rest of the way of solving the problem of mismatches, though. Look at what we get for a ww final because they tried to protect War Machine. And it didn't even work. Bellator has to stop doing that with their faves like War Machine and King Mo. It's hurting the tournaments. If they stacked them, Bellator could still be interesting week in and out, in spite of all the attrition.