GT #11: Wizards @ Cavs 7 PM CSN

[closg00]

The Bench is totally unsorted. We've got a lot of dead weight on the bench right now. If Vesely keeps playing like he has, then he'll be one good player in our rotation. When Porter gets back in a week or two, hopefully he'll be another.

Maynor, Harrington, Seraphin are not pulling their weight and we're a better team when they don't play. Ariza is going to be redundant when Porter plays. Booker and Temple haven't done a whole lot. That's six players where replacing them with a few upgrades would significantly improve the team.

.......and, why haven't we waived Singleton?

[payitforward]

Was happy after 3 quarters. Now I don't care that we win. I'm disgusted.

The breakdown at the end of the game was to be expected -- we were on the 2d game of a back to back, and they'd had 3 days off.

[hands11]

Was happy after 3 quarters. Now I don't care that we win. I'm disgusted.

It's hard to win in this league. Especially when you've never done it before.

Just be happy with the win and hope they improve.

They won. On to TOR. Sure would be nice to have Ariza back to guard
Gay and/or deRozan.

At this risk of setting the bar low, they didn't win a road game last year
until what, January? 2nd road win, fugly but it's a win. We saw the best
and worst all within a short period of time.

Well he got injured Wed, Nov 13 and the next game is Fri, Nov 22 and we are going to have another back to back with a game on Fri, Nov 23. At least that 2nd game is at home.

Adding Trevor A and or Otto to the rotation would be huge because right now none of the role players main strength is scoring, except Kevin who has been inconsistent. Ves and Temple are defense and rebounding and Maynor is just a setting up an offense type. Kevin can actually score but he isn't discipline enough mentally for Randy to trust him right now. So adding Trevor A back would be huge since Randy hasn't figured out how to stretch some of his scoring into the 2nd line up. So once they have Otto, Trevor A, Singleton available, the extended roster should look better.

Still missing a few things even when totally healthy though. They need another SG that can shoot unless Temple or Glen can find their stroke. They also need a player like Blair off the bench. And ball handing whenever the can add it. Someone that can drive. I thought that was Glen but he doesn't seem very sharp. Looks like another Nick Young type.

So the core of Wall, Beal, Webster, Trevor A, Nene, Gortat with Ves, Otto, Temple and Maynor looks pretty good specially if AH is sitting on the bench as another 3 pt shooter.

Question is, what to do with Singleton, Booker, Kevin and Glen. I would be looking around other teams benches to see whats available from team that are bad that want to move players that have some know skills that produce reliably off the bench. Kevin and Glen have upside and Booker has utility. Someone might bit. I might keep Singleton around and see if he can do a Ves. He could be another utility bench defender and he was supposed to be a catch an shoot guy coming out of college. Maybe something is still there. He has played well in moments over the past. Maybe things are come together enough for him to find a role now that he realizes he won't ever be a starter in this league. Sometimes plays need to just focus on realistic goals to get better.

So Booker, Kevin and Glen for a big body center or PF. Maybe a Brooks type SG or a speedy back up PG.

[payitforward]

The Wizards drafted an even better PG, Nate Wolters.

Wolters has looked pretty damn poised so far. He's got those 4 years of college experience.

He could have been a Wizard the next 10 years--the first two years on a rookie deal.

Money spent on Maynor could have been used on a PF/C like Dejuan Blair.

The good news is Temple is a decent backup PG because he is a terrific defender and the Wizards did right to resign him.

You can sign a round 2 pick for 3 years -- doesn't have to be only 2. And you don't have to guarantee him either. A high Round 2 pick is one of the biggest bargains of any asset available to a GM.

Unfortunately, among his many flaws as a GM, Ernie way undervalues Rd2 picks. "How long do does an average 2d round pick usually play in the league -- 3-4 years?" I heard him ask at a press conference. As if a) guys picked *at the top* of Round 2 were the same as guys picked in the 50s and b) as if the best you can hope to do is "average."

He prefers to fill the back of his roster with marginal veterans who are cheap. Hence, he never builds in the potential to be pleasantly surprised. (Edit: Temple is an exception. I agree he is a solid player.) He traded up for Rice, because the kid had been called a potential round 1 pick.

Meanwhile, Wolters is *starting* for the Bucks and playing pretty well for a 22 year old rookie PG. Jae Crowder, whom he should have taken in 2012, is now a very solid 20-minute a night SF (putting up excellent numbers), Kyle O'Quinn, whom he should have taken with the #46 pick in 2012 that he gave away in the Okariza trade, is one of the best young and developing bigs in the league, and Chandler Parsons, whom we should have taken when we took Mack, starts and plays 38 minutes a night for the Rockets -- a team with a *good* GM.

...and those are just his round 2 mistakes and only over 3 years -- the guy is obviously an embarrassment.

[hands11]

Cavs are f*cked. That team is terrible save for Kyrie and he looks like he's sick of it.

The Wizards starting lineup is really starting to mesh together into a cohesive unit. I really like Webster in there opposed to Ariza. Wall, Beal & Webster just have a really nice synergy together.

But the bench problem isn't going away though. We survived tonight, but it's going to be a nightly struggle. We can't continue playing guys 40 minutes a night. Wall was completely done by midway 4th quarter and basically became a 5th option and got torched defensively. Beal was having all sorts of issues in a lead ball handling role late as he nearly fell apart. Deep into the 4th quarter of a back to back playing heavy minutes, guys are going to tire.

As well as Ariza was playing, I agree with you. What has impressed me recently with
Webster (last 2 games) is that he has been boarding really well. This team needs everyone
on the floor to do their part grabbing broads.

Plus, Webster is a great interview. He was on the radio after the MIN game and
just comes across as a very cool cat. He not a 'dumb jock', that's for sure.

Webster should have been the starter all along. Its more than about his production. Its about how he is on the team. He is emotional glue.

[payitforward]

...Webster is a great interview. He was on the radio after the MIN game and
just comes across as a very cool cat. He not a 'dumb jock', that's for sure.

Martell is going to have a BIG career in the media after he is done playing!

[tontoz]

Speaking of second round picks Isiah Thomas has been beasting.

[jivelikenice]

The 4th quarter breakdown was predictable. Its difficult to keep a team down for 4 quarters on the road, especially on the back end of back to backs and especially when your starters are logging have minutes to compensate for the terrible second unit.

The Big 3 Wizards for a time were known for epic meltdowns because of how quick into the shotclock they'd shoot even with a lead. Typically thats not how you'd like to do things but with this team not having a reliable halfcourt threat, is that how they should play? Keep running and hoping that things open up in transition? Or should they stick with this and hope either the Wall/Gortat or Wall/Nene pick or Beal's halfcourt game continue to evolve?

[DCZards]

They also need a player like Blair off the bench. And ball handing whenever the can add it. Someone that can drive. I thought that was Glen but he doesn't seem very sharp. Looks like another Nick Young type.

Hands, I know you don't mean any harm when you do it, and maybe I'm the only one who is bothered by it, but I hate it when you question the intelligence of a player/person based on scant evidence.

[fishercob]

i like when we win

Excellent summary of the game. I agree with all points of your analysis.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X9E9n6GHC8[/youtube]

[tontoz]

They also need a player like Blair off the bench. And ball handing whenever the can add it. Someone that can drive. I thought that was Glen but he doesn't seem very sharp. Looks like another Nick Young type.

Hands, I know you don't mean any harm when you do it, and maybe I'm the only one who is bothered by it, but I hate it when you question the intelligence of a player/person based on scant evidence.

It is ironic that someone who routinely butchers the English language is questioning someone else's intelligence.

[Higga]

Count on the Wiz to make a 25 point 2nd half lead a close game late, but good win in the second of a back to back.

Wall has gotta step his game up. Right now there is too much of a load on Beal.

[AFM]

I'll never doubt CCJ's abilities again. Wish we had kept Wolters, he's way better than Maynor, who honestly makes me cringe. GRJR may end up a good player, but he's not a player we need. We need a back up PG desperately.

[WizarDynasty]

Don't want you back up point guard to be to good otherwise, it causes chemistry problems. You want your back up point guard to be a change of pace from your starter. Maynor's asset is that he isn't a threat to wall and he prepares Wall for things JWall hasn't experienced.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Adding AH back wouldn't help, it would hurt.

He has been terrible. No D. No passing. High usage. AH isn't what they need. Now Trevor A would help.

Wittman played Al more than Maertell. At the same time Booker started and Vesely didn't play several games. Most were saying get rid of Vesely.

I am glad injuries forced change.

Ariza plays well with Webster. Harrington has had hot streaks and he is a savvy veteran who has a ton of heart. Golden State upset a one seed in the playoffs in part thanks to Al. Harrington has played well as a Nugget with Nene.

The problem IMO is the blending of each player by the coaching staff. A short bench and favorites who haven't performed well in extended minutes is something coaching will need to adapt and correct whatvhas not worked.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using RealGM Forums mobile app

so how would you suggest they distribute mins?

Wisely, KH.

Minutes should be awarded objectively, not by veteran status or personality. Webster is a better starter next to Wall and Beal -- last year's three-man data on basketball-reference shows just how potent Wall/Beal/Webster are on the court together. Trevor A is really good with Webster. However, he probably wasn't the answer instead of Webster just because he is a much better defender. Wittman adjusted with Okafor traded. Ariza balled well but the defense was horrible for the team with Booker at PF and Nene at C. Nene at PF and Vesely at C IMO was a much better option. Harrington playing large minutes hurt the team's defense.

KH, Gortat is s really good team player but offense is his specialty. Vesely is also a good team player but defense in transition is his strength. A lineuo with both Vesely and Gortat could be used for a few minutes and probably work well.

Knighthonor, Randy has a tough task now that he has so much talent on a team he coaches. Coach Popovich is tough on stars, veterans, and rookies alike. At the same time he praises young guys like Leonard and is not afraid to start a rookie Dejuan Blair.

I think 10 or 11 or even 12 guys need to play each game. Temple needs to get in. Less Seraphin. A Booker trade to a team like San Antonio would be good because he's too good to bury behind Al Harrington--who is a good veteran. Same for Singleton, a trade would be great.


Sent from my SGH-M919 using RealGM Forums mobile app

[montestewart]

I'll never doubt CCJ's abilities again. Wish we had kept Wolters, he's way better than Maynor, who honestly makes me cringe. GRJR may end up a good player, but he's not a player we need. We need a back up PG desperately.

CCJ is usually way out in front, but plenty of people were calling for Wolters, Crowder, Faried, Blair, etc. EG doesn't get a pass with the tired, "look at all the other GMs that didn't draft [player X]" because his name is on those lists every year, passing up talent when the team has a chronic talent deficit, and wasting picks on trades and gimmick selections.

[nate33]

I'll never doubt CCJ's abilities again. Wish we had kept Wolters, he's way better than Maynor, who honestly makes me cringe. GRJR may end up a good player, but he's not a player we need. We need a back up PG desperately.

I'm going to be "that guy" and point out that Wolters isn't really the sensation everyone is making him out to be. He was thrust into a major minute role at the start of the season due to injuries, and played pretty well for his first 4 games, posting an ORtg of 114 and leading his team to a 2-2 record. But looking deeper, one can see that his competition was some of the worst teams in the league (NYK, BOS, TOR, CLE) and that part of his advantage may have been that his opponents haven't scouted him.

In the 6 games since then, the Bucks have gone 0-6, losing by an average of 14 points; and Wolters is averaging 7 points and 4 assists in 30 minutes a game with a TS% of .416 and an ORtg 92.

On the season as a whole, he is posting a PER of 12.5 with a TS% of .446 and an ORtg of 102.

[AFM]

I'll never doubt CCJ's abilities again. Wish we had kept Wolters, he's way better than Maynor, who honestly makes me cringe. GRJR may end up a good player, but he's not a player we need. We need a back up PG desperately.

I'm going to be "that guy" and point out that Wolters isn't really the sensation everyone is making him out to be. He was thrust into a major minute role at the start of the season due to injuries, and played pretty well for his first 4 games, posting an ORtg of 114 and leading his team to a 2-2 record. But looking deeper, one can see that his competition was some of the worst teams in the league (NYK, BOS, TOR, CLE) and that part of his advantage may have been that his opponents haven't scouted him.

In the 6 games since then, the Bucks have gone 0-6, losing by an average of 14 points; and Wolters is averaging 7 points and 4 assists in 30 minutes a game with a TS% of .416 and an ORtg 92.

On the season as a whole, he is posting a PER of 12.5 with a TS% of .446 and an ORtg of 102.

No one likes "that guy". Don't be "that guy".

[montestewart]

Maybe not a future star, but Wolters, forced into a starter's role as a rookie, is looking better than vet Maynor, and might develop into something more with experience. And costs less.

[payitforward]

I'll never doubt CCJ's abilities again. Wish we had kept Wolters, he's way better than Maynor, who honestly makes me cringe. GRJR may end up a good player, but he's not a player we need. We need a back up PG desperately.

I'm going to be "that guy" and point out that Wolters isn't really the sensation everyone is making him out to be. He was thrust into a major minute role at the start of the season due to injuries, and played pretty well for his first 4 games, posting an ORtg of 114 and leading his team to a 2-2 record. But looking deeper, one can see that his competition was some of the worst teams in the league (NYK, BOS, TOR, CLE) and that part of his advantage may have been that his opponents haven't scouted him.

In the 6 games since then, the Bucks have gone 0-6, losing by an average of 14 points; and Wolters is averaging 7 points and 4 assists in 30 minutes a game with a TS% of .416 and an ORtg 92.

On the season as a whole, he is posting a PER of 12.5 with a TS% of .446 and an ORtg of 102.

What is your point exactly? That Wolters isn't an all-star? That he isn't the best rookie in the league? That he has a lot to learn?

Would you say that a 22 year old 2d round pick rookie PG doing well against "some of the worst teams in the league" (i.e. the NBA) right out of the box is evidence that he was a bad pick? Or a good pick? Isn't that our subject here?