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KCP for Afflalo Asap!!!

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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#81 » by Blkbrd671 » Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:40 pm

Warspite wrote:
My trade proposal was to keep KCP. I would offer 2016 and 2018 1sts and cap relief for him. If Dumars wants home court in the 1st rd this is the kind of trade you do. I certainly see your point about letting them play and use this yr grow and continue to stockpile waiting for that Sheed type trade to get us over the top.

Im just not sure there is a trade/FA out there thats going to be worth Monroe/KCP/Cap space. No allstar has been traded in almost 3 yrs.

IMHO the biggest problem is Jennings. As long as he doesnt feel the pressure to distribute the ball and run the team he will continue to shoot +15FGA per game and that is not winning basketball. I would like to see Jennings with 4 fewer FGAs and 3 more apg.



Honestly our biggest problem is jennings, while i love the PG passing ability and always a threat to drop 100 each night, his defense has been absolutely atrocious, almost Calderon like
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#82 » by RTM » Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:55 pm

Right now, I would deal KCP/CV for AA. I'd certainly move KCP before first rounders way out in 2016 or 2018 - that's far too risky, given that we have no idea where this team will be then.

Problem is, his value is at an all time high - Orlando would definitely want more, given his favorable contract situation. Even if he cools off, would they want KCP with Oladipo and Harkless?

I think a third team would have to get involved. Maybe Minny? I know they liked Pope a lot, and could use a guy to groom behind Martin, so maybe they'd be willing to take Big Baby and give Orlando Williams and Shved. Although rumor has it that they want vets now, so maybe that's unlikely too.

Another possibility could be a deal with Boston, where they get KCP, CV, and some of Orlando's assets for Rondo, and we get AA (and maybe Brandon Bass, who has a reliable midrange jumper, making him useful as a floor stretching big and reliable backup).
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#83 » by BadMofoPimp » Thu Nov 21, 2013 6:15 pm

Don't look now but Afflalo is averaging 22.0pts 4.6reb 4.5ast on .494% .541% .820%........

He went 7 for 9 from the 3 last night on the way to 30 points.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#84 » by Ducklett » Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:50 pm

Warspite wrote:
Blkbrd671 wrote:
Warspite wrote:I respect blkbrd a ton but I disagree. AA would improve this team to the point that we could be .500 with a tough stretch of games behind us. If he was putting up those stats for us Monroe, Smith and Drummond would look much better and everyone would be talking about Jennings transforming into Stockton Jr.



appreciate the words but i really don't see it, our problem right now is defensively our entire team is completely horrid(adjusting to coach etc.), adding AA may change that slightly, but he can't guard all the positions. My problem with this deal is that we take cap space and a lotto pick for a 3 and D guy. Assets i'd rather save for a much larger and better deal down the road. Our goal shouldn't be to get to .500 but rather get to the playoffs and beyond.


My trade proposal was to keep KCP. I would offer 2016 and 2018 1sts and cap relief for him. If Dumars wants home court in the 1st rd this is the kind of trade you do. I certainly see your point about letting them play and use this yr grow and continue to stockpile waiting for that Sheed type trade to get us over the top.

Im just not sure there is a trade/FA out there thats going to be worth Monroe/KCP/Cap space. No allstar has been traded in almost 3 yrs.

IMHO the biggest problem is Jennings. As long as he doesnt feel the pressure to distribute the ball and run the team he will continue to shoot +15FGA per game and that is not winning basketball. I would like to see Jennings with 4 fewer FGAs and 3 more apg.


But the question is, why would the magic want more picks in 2016/2018 and nothing to start turning around the team now. You think that Magic would want to wait til 2021 to start being a winning team again when these picks would actually be NBA ready?
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#85 » by Warspite » Fri Nov 22, 2013 1:15 am

Ducklett wrote:
Warspite wrote:
Blkbrd671 wrote:

appreciate the words but i really don't see it, our problem right now is defensively our entire team is completely horrid(adjusting to coach etc.), adding AA may change that slightly, but he can't guard all the positions. My problem with this deal is that we take cap space and a lotto pick for a 3 and D guy. Assets i'd rather save for a much larger and better deal down the road. Our goal shouldn't be to get to .500 but rather get to the playoffs and beyond.


My trade proposal was to keep KCP. I would offer 2016 and 2018 1sts and cap relief for him. If Dumars wants home court in the 1st rd this is the kind of trade you do. I certainly see your point about letting them play and use this yr grow and continue to stockpile waiting for that Sheed type trade to get us over the top.

Im just not sure there is a trade/FA out there thats going to be worth Monroe/KCP/Cap space. No allstar has been traded in almost 3 yrs.

IMHO the biggest problem is Jennings. As long as he doesnt feel the pressure to distribute the ball and run the team he will continue to shoot +15FGA per game and that is not winning basketball. I would like to see Jennings with 4 fewer FGAs and 3 more apg.


But the question is, why would the magic want more picks in 2016/2018 and nothing to start turning around the team now. You think that Magic would want to wait til 2021 to start being a winning team again when these picks would actually be NBA ready?



Those picks are still assests and can be traded at any time for anything they wish. If the Magic saw a player they wanted drop to the 2nd rd they could use one of those future 1sts to get that player. They could bundle those picks for a player that helps them now or on draft night.

I dont expect them to use 2 picks in the 25-30 range and get players out of them that can help there rebuild. They are simply assets to be used to better the team immediately.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#86 » by Ducklett » Fri Nov 22, 2013 1:40 am

Warspite wrote:
Ducklett wrote:
Warspite wrote:
My trade proposal was to keep KCP. I would offer 2016 and 2018 1sts and cap relief for him. If Dumars wants home court in the 1st rd this is the kind of trade you do. I certainly see your point about letting them play and use this yr grow and continue to stockpile waiting for that Sheed type trade to get us over the top.

Im just not sure there is a trade/FA out there thats going to be worth Monroe/KCP/Cap space. No allstar has been traded in almost 3 yrs.

IMHO the biggest problem is Jennings. As long as he doesnt feel the pressure to distribute the ball and run the team he will continue to shoot +15FGA per game and that is not winning basketball. I would like to see Jennings with 4 fewer FGAs and 3 more apg.


But the question is, why would the magic want more picks in 2016/2018 and nothing to start turning around the team now. You think that Magic would want to wait til 2021 to start being a winning team again when these picks would actually be NBA ready?



Those picks are still assests and can be traded at any time for anything they wish. If the Magic saw a player they wanted drop to the 2nd rd they could use one of those future 1sts to get that player. They could bundle those picks for a player that helps them now or on draft night.

I dont expect them to use 2 picks in the 25-30 range and get players out of them that can help there rebuild. They are simply assets to be used to better the team immediately.


But at that point, shouldn't they just look for a different trade for Afflalo, since you just said that they would most likely NOT use those picks. Or get a third team that would take the picks and give up something more substantial in the next year or two?

Since you don't expect them to use the 2 picks, why would other GMs? That makes their value LESS because people would know they would try to trade them out.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#87 » by Warspite » Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:29 am

No I dont think the picks are worth anything but then I expect the Pistons to be in the NBA Finals before 2018.

The value of the picks depends on your faith in Dumars (or me if I was the GM in this hypothetical) to build a good team. Of course I believe I would be in the running for exec of the yr every yr so I think those picks are in the high 20s. Now if you think Dumars is a fool or that I dont know what Im doing those picks are now lottery picks.


For the most part future 1st rd picks are like ladies/men at a bar. They may not look great now but after a few drinks they start to look much better but you dont truely know how good they are untill the future.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#88 » by BadMofoPimp » Fri Nov 22, 2013 3:32 pm

In all fairness, the owner of the Magic does want to win now. He didn't even want to trade Dwight. Owner, Devos, is on his last legs and probably only has a few years to live from the looks of him. I think he is even wheel chair bound now. Thus, they are aiming for a quick turnaround with picks this summer plus the $20 plus million they will have in cap space.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#89 » by Q00 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:09 pm

Warspite wrote:
IMHO the biggest problem is Jennings. As long as he doesnt feel the pressure to distribute the ball and run the team he will continue to shoot +15FGA per game and that is not winning basketball. I would like to see Jennings with 4 fewer FGAs and 3 more apg.


I don't know if I would say Jennings alone is the biggest problem, but I like what you are getting at. I think its an overall team problem, where roles either aren't defined are they are but they are the wrong roles for the wrong players.

We have the league leader in FG% in Dre and he's taking the least shots of any starter. Then we have the worst FG% shooter in Jennings and he's taking almost twice as much. Those are some mixed up roles. They need to figure ways to get Drummond more shots, like what he's getting now, just more of them. And Jennings needs to stick to being a distributor, taking about half the shots he's taking now.

He has the talent to be a true PG, but he doesn't seem to want to. He seems to want to be a SG. He needs to realize his talent is playmaking, not shooting, and just be content setting up teammates all game, and taking only like 6-8 shots per game.

You can kind of tell he gets bored with that though. Because even when he's just setting up teammates, he can't just set up an easy pass, every pass has to be like a highlight reel to make it excited for him. He needs to learn to just play boring basketball.

If he could discipline himself to just being a true PG the whole game, and taking all of his 6-8 shots from 3, I think that's the role we need him in. If he's going to shoot 38% overall, he might as well be taking all of those shots from 3, where he shot 38% last year. Just have him take 1-2 per quarter to keep the defense honest.

Then Smith wouldn't need to take so many, and he could take those shots in the post instead, which is what his role should be on offense. I think if they just starting putting guys in their correct roles and getting them to be disciplined, this team might work.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#90 » by MrBigShot » Fri Nov 22, 2013 5:12 pm

At this rate, Afflalo will be in the ASG.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#91 » by DetroitDon15 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:07 pm

MrBigShot wrote:At this rate, Afflalo will be in the ASG.


No way he makes it. Sorry
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#92 » by DBC10 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:05 pm

MrBigShot wrote:At this rate, Afflalo will be in the ASG.
Since Steph Curry and Marc Gasol didn't make it last year, I think he'll get the same treatment and be overlooked.
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#93 » by sfballa13 » Sat Nov 23, 2013 1:54 am

DBC10 wrote:
MrBigShot wrote:At this rate, Afflalo will be in the ASG.
Since Steph Curry and Marc Gasol didn't make it last year, I think he'll get the same treatment and be overlooked.


What about trading Monroe to Orlando? Give them back the big man they lost in Dwight?

Monroe, Stuckey, Jerebko, KCP, Bynum
for
Afflalo, Big Baby, Vucevic, Harris, Nelson

Jennings / Nelson
Afflalo / Billups / Singler
Harris / Singler - Datome
Smith / Big Baby
Drummond / Vucevic

I dont know what the details of a Monroe trade would include but i think Monroe gets us Afflalo and at least one of Vucecic / Harris, add in KCP and the dumping of two long deals so we get both.

A bench of Nelson, Billups, Singler, Davis, Vucevic is very good
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Re: KCP for Afflalo Asap!!! 

Post#94 » by DBC10 » Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:22 am

sfballa13 wrote:
DBC10 wrote:
MrBigShot wrote:At this rate, Afflalo will be in the ASG.
Since Steph Curry and Marc Gasol didn't make it last year, I think he'll get the same treatment and be overlooked.


What about trading Monroe to Orlando? Give them back the big man they lost in Dwight?

Monroe, Stuckey, Jerebko, KCP, Bynum
for
Afflalo, Big Baby, Vucevic, Harris, Nelson

Jennings / Nelson
Afflalo / Billups / Singler
Harris / Singler - Datome
Smith / Big Baby
Drummond / Vucevic

I dont know what the details of a Monroe trade would include but i think Monroe gets us Afflalo and at least one of Vucecic / Harris, add in KCP and the dumping of two long deals so we get both.

A bench of Nelson, Billups, Singler, Davis, Vucevic is very good
From the look of things, Vucevic is their big for the future, and while he's no Dwight, he's putting up solid numbers right now.

Honestly, I think the perfect trade partners for Afflalo to be moved are the Grizzlies or the Thunder. Both would have to give up some sort of a mix of young talent and a 1st rounder, but I'm sure the Magic would do that in a heartbeat to expedite the tank.

I could see Lamb + Perkins + 1st to ORL for Afflalo since the Thunder need a 3 and D player that they lost out on Harden.

Or Grizzlies definitely need outside shooting, and could send Tayshaun + a 1st and some other kid to it. Alternatively, they could send Ed Davis, which would go along the young talent acquisition logic and maybe a future 1st with it as well.

I don't think ORL and Detroit are great trading partners when there are others.

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