Bulls Might Now Be More Likely To Trade Luol Deng

[ChiefILL53]

Deng for Tyreke is interesting. I like it. A younger player who can handle the ball and has good size.

Looking at this next season. Hopefully we can get the Cats Pick this year and use it.

Rose - New PG - Teague
Tyreke - Snell
Jimmy - Mike D
Taj - Nikola - Murphy
Noah - New C

Before this season I wanted Deng for Evans, but i think NO wouldnt do it, so i would rather take Eric Gordon

You think NO moves gordon for deng and not evans for deng?

[Red Larrivee]

Deng for Tyreke is interesting. I like it. A younger player who can handle the ball and has good size.

Looking at this next season. Hopefully we can get the Cats Pick this year and use it.

Rose - New PG - Teague
Tyreke - Snell
Jimmy - Mike D
Taj - Nikola - Murphy
Noah - New C

For $10M, you could probably find players who contribute more to winning a basketball game than Tyreke does.

If we're trading Deng the object would be to lower payroll and hopefully get a draft pick. The ship has probably sailed on getting equal value for Deng, not that Tyreke is that.

[PistolP]

Deng for Tyreke is interesting. I like it. A younger player who can handle the ball and has good size.

Looking at this next season. Hopefully we can get the Cats Pick this year and use it.

Rose - New PG - Teague
Tyreke - Snell
Jimmy - Mike D
Taj - Nikola - Murphy
Noah - New C

Before this season I wanted Deng for Evans, but i think NO wouldnt do it, so i would rather take Eric Gordon

I've been on the Tyreke bandwagon for a couple seasons now. There are a lot of pros and cons that have been debtated on this board in depth -- remember this thread? But just regarding trade value, I think Tyreke's is at an all-time low right now. His production in NO has been horrible, and he's coming off the bench for a team already stacked with similar-usage guards in Gordon and Holiday. I think from a pure talent perspective that NO would love to swap Evans for a legit starting small forward, particularly one that likes playing off the ball.

[Just_Bullz]

We need to rebuild and trading Deng for picks and lowering the payroll is thr logical thing to do.

[joshcxa]

Unless you plan to tank the season there is no reason to move Deng. You have passed up moving him for 2-3 years now when you could have netted a top 5-10 pick for him and selected a younger player.

Difference is we were in win now mode. Now, not so much.

[fleet]

No where in the above have you mentioned his selfish play, his regression over his 5 seasons and the fact that he hasn't improved much at all.

Why do you say he's regressed? Last year he had career highs in efficiency and career low in turnovers. His assist% and scoring volume were down a little bit but IMO that can be largely explained by his career low usage rate. If he is a little selfish, that's not necessarily bad IMO. This team passes too much and needs somebody with some swagger to attack and not play Hoosiers ball all the time. Oh, and he hasn't played 5 seasons. He's played 4 seasons.

He is a wasted talent and the appeal of Evans should be lost given he is making 44 million.

Last year he put up 18 points, 5 boards, 4 assists and 2 steals per 36 on great efficiency with low turnovers and fouls.

Yeah I thought he was doing better, but sometimes I can't remember ****, especially when players get crushed over their games they usually display without taking into account possible improvement. Interesting to read that. At the very least, he at his best fits a team need, and I think Thibs might be able to keep him in line and use him, coach him up some.

[PistolP]

Ideal scenario for a Deng trade would be moving him for a top 10 pick in this draft or an up and coming stud on a rookie deal like Beal, Barnes, McLemore, etc. I see 0% percent chance of that happening. Instead, I think more realistic options would mid-career wings on deals that go past this season. Afflalo, Matthews, Gordon and Evans come to mind. Only logical trade partner I can see is New Orleans.

I wouldn't just move Deng for cap relief or a mid-to-late 1st. That would be a big step back with limited future upside.

[Derk77]

Deng can easily land us a good SG (if not alone we can add minor pieces)....even with Rose this team is very one dimensional. You need a perimeter scorer/ball handler other then Rose. Butler is best at SF IMO. Trade Deng in a week or so when Butler is fully ready. Playing the guy so many damn minutes is really not helping. You cannot rely on Rose as your only scorer. Boozer is good but they barely utilize him so that's useless as well.

[Bulls69]

What about Deng for Jimmer and filler?

Please no

[Chi town]

IMO Waiters and salary filler is the best and fir for both teams.

[pb-ceo]

I think the bulls should be contrary and while everybody is reluctant to give up a 2014 pick, trade ld for pick in a later year and use the cap space to sign the best wing available next year.

[Ron Johnson]

Good reading for tankers, just so you know your odds. They aren't good.

Good to see you read the article I linked in the other thread. Good stuff.

[Mech Engineer]

I think the bulls should be contrary and while everybody is reluctant to give up a 2014 pick, trade ld for pick in a later year and use the cap space to sign the best wing available next year.

That's a better value then trying for a 2014 first round pick. The odds are teams will not give a possible high pick in 2014 draft but a better pick in the future drafts. The Bulls don't have to get equal pieces if they trade Deng. I would go for Tyreke + a future first rounder(maybe top 5 protected or something like that) from New Orleans for Deng. I think the Pelicans signed Tyreke with the assumption of Gordon not being healthy. If Gordon shows good health, they might dump their extra wing player to fill another need.

[Ron Johnson]

You do not trade Butler under any circumstance. If his draft was held today, he'd be a lottery pick and he's on a great contract. He is elite at everything except scoring, and his numbers show that he would be elite at that if he would quit deferring to Deng (his role model) and Rose.
Shooting Efficiency
FG% 2FG% 3FG% FT% eFG% TS% FGA 3FGA PPS FTA
Average SG 43.2 45.7 38.6 78.1 50.0 54.3 18.1 6.4 1.21 4.6
Butler 43.5 46.5 38.5 86.1 50.7 59.5 12.4 4.7 1.46 6.4

Sorry I can't make the table look right. But you see his points per shot 1.46 and TS% 59.5 are far above average because he gets to the line and makes them. His other raw numbers show he's an elite rebounder, has a far better than average turnover rate, and gets a lot of steals.

Numbers (per 48 minutes) are from NBA Geek and are updated everyday. Avg numbers are for players with more than 130 minutes this year. What all this means is that he should be taking more shots and have more plays called for him. His points per shot and ability to get to the free throw line make him a very good offensive player. People need to drop the yay points way of looking at players, or you'll end up with a team like the Knicks.

[othawhitemeat]

I mean I know there is the tanking article, but in true honesty, we are not that good even if we try hard right now without Rose. Deng is gone after this season as is Boozer even if Rose was healthy. So why not start the obvious. The good news is we have a great talent in Mirotic without using a pick next year. If we tank and just get like the 6th or 7th pick and draft Rodney Hood or at best move up in the draft and get someone to pair with Gary Harris, Adreine Payne, Vonleh, or Aaron Gordon, we have a ton of talent to pair if Rose is healthy. This is not a normal tank - we have some talent already if Rose can play.

Now most tanking teams don't have much value to trade. If we wanted, we have great value in Noah to trade along with Taj. We have good pieces and possibly Deng can land us something in which we were not going to keep anyway.

The obvious is there!

[League Circles]

You do not trade Butler under any circumstance. If his draft was held today, he'd be a lottery pick and he's on a great contract. He is elite at everything except scoring, and his numbers show that he would be elite at that if he would quit deferring to Deng (his role model) and Rose.

No offense, but this is a preposterous statement. Jimmy Butler is far from elite at really everything except maybe man defense. How is he elite at playmaking or even rebounding? Hell he's not even a particularly good ball handler or passer, merely OK. How do numbers show that he would be an elite scorer? Do you realize that you can't just increase attempts drastically and hope to maintain efficiency?

Here are his numbers this year:
Min Pts DRB ORB REB AST TO BLK STl PF
Average SG 331 21.9 4.6 1.0 5.7 4.2 2.9 .4 1.6 3.3
Butler 268 15.2 5.7 2.0 7.7 2.7 2.1 1.3 2.9 1.6
Shooting Efficiency
FG% 2FG% 3FG% FT% eFG% TS% FGA 3FGA PPS FTA
Average SG 43.2 45.7 38.6 78.1 50.0 54.3 18.1 6.4 1.21 4.6
Butler 43.5 46.5 38.5 86.1 50.7 59.5 12.4 4.7 1.46 6.4

Numbers (per 48 minutes) are from NBA Geek and are updated everyday. Avg numbers are for players with more than 130 minutes this year. What all this means is that he should be taking more shots and have more plays called for him. His points per shot and ability to get to the free throw line make him a very good offensive player. People need to drop the yay points way of looking at players, or you'll end up with a team like the Knicks.

The reason Jimmy's efficiency is pretty good is that he doesn't shoot very much. He doesn't have a lot of offensive ability which is why he's our 4th option among the starters. Last year, when he had plenty of opportunity, he scored at a very low rate also. I like Jimmy but there is a reason he was passed over by pretty much every team.

[Ron Johnson]

No offense, but actually numbers show that the common belief that players don't maintain the same efficiency with more usage is untrue. It's a myth, though it kind of seems logical. But it's untrue. An efficient player is an efficient player. And his rebounding numbers, steals, low turnovers, ability to get to the line are elite when compared to shooting guards and so are his points per shot and the number of free throws he makes.

[League Circles]

No offense, but actually numbers show that the common belief that players don't maintain the same efficiency with more usage is untrue. It's a myth, though it kind of seems logical. But it's untrue. An efficient player is an efficient player. And his rebounding numbers, steals, low turnovers, ability to get to the line are elite when compared to shooting guards and so are his points per shot and the number of free throws he makes.

OK, so show me other players who have increased their FGA rate by at least 50-75% and maintained their efficiency. Cause that's what it would take for Jimmy to go from being the low rate scorer he is to being an "elite" scorer.

[Rose2Boozer]

Trading Deng would be the right thing to do. The Bulls just are not in a good position with this team(as currently constructed) to sign another big contract. As far as I'm concerned, Taj should be on the block as well. It could be tough to unload his contract on somebody. That being said, there are always gms willing to take a good player on a bad deal.

Going forward, the Bulls have to look at total skill set on the perimeter. I don't care if the guy is doesn't have ideal size either. They just have to bring some type of consistent offensive attack, and be able to handle the ball exceptionally well. When it comes to the bigs, I like Noah's energy, and I only hope Mirotic's skillset lives up to the hype. But the Bulls are missing a size and power big. That's what's needed to round out the frontcourt rotation for the future.

[YourRoseness]

Trade him off, don't let him walk. He's a an inconsistent 3rd offensive option on a team with no current 1st or 2nd option. We have a coach that is offensively inept, so we can't afford to not have more offensive talent on our roster.