Kobe agrees to contact extension with Lakers

[EddieJonesFan]

You'd have a valid point if you could actually suggest who they could've signed with that cap space to become contenders again. Care to take a swing at it?

No, I don't care to, because the plan wasn't a good one to begin with, but it was their plan (not mine) and any chance it had of succeeding, they just shat all over it. This isn't a solution to anything for them.

It's rare when a poster could come off as more intelligent by simply NOT responding. This is one of those occasions.

Care to explain why, or do you think people will just take your assertion at face value?

[DynastySS]

Well Kobe is at least 16x better, so the math works out.

[CharlieMurphy]

No, the argument is that this contract limits the Lakers' ability to strengthen the roster. Completely different argument.

Yeah it's limited, but not to the degree that people are claiming. For someone to claim that their flexibility is drastically limited they need to show how. They need to point to FAs the Lakers could have signed that they can't now. No one in this thread has done so. Instead they argue that posters asking for this information are deflecting, which itself is a deflection.

If you want to argue that their flexibility is limited, I'm gonna agree with you. All contracts limit a team's flexibility. If you want to argue that Kobe's contract has now made the Lakers incapabale of making substantial moves or signing a max player, I'm going to disagree with you because the facts say otherwise.

[notagenius]

Was hoping he'd take a less but I can't blame him.

I'd probably do the same thing. Easier for everyone to turn down that money behind a keyboard.

[defhalotones]

A more important question that I think hasn't been touched on:
Will Kobe allow the Lakers to sign 2 max players? Technically speaking.
I'm not totally sold on him accepting a third banana role for his last couple of years. If history is any indication...

[CharlieMurphy]

thats's not the point though. The point being made is LA has no flexibility now. 13 months ago houston's best player was kevin martin but Morey priortized cap flexibility so he could pounce on situations while the lakers are prioritizing an expensive farewell tour for kobe as a fringe playoff contender.

saying "who would they have got" is an intellectually dishonest answer

(just using houston as an example of cap flexibility not saying they're going to win or anything.)

How is it intellectually dishonest when there are no FAs to prioritize max cap space for in 2014? It's even more absurd that you'd call that intellectually dishonest when you realize that the lakers still have cap space to sign a max player. They've still held on to exactly what you're claiming they don't have.

sign a max player and then who's going to fill out the rest of the roster? the LA sparks??

The Lakers have been pretty good about being able to sign okay talent on cheap deals, see: entire Lakers roster. This team is basically one move from being back in contention assuming Kobe comes back at a high level, which the Lakers must believe judging from that contract.

That's probably where I'd come down on this whole thing. The Lakers gave too much money to Kobe because we haven't seen him play an actual NBA game yet. But despite that I don't think his contract alone is going to doom them from being in contention next season or the season after. What would doom them would be a combination of his contract, him not being able to play at a high level, and the Lakers failing to sign a marquee free agent or make a substantial trade.

[MisterWestside]

Yeah it's limited, but not to the degree that people are claiming. For someone to claim that their flexibility is drastically limited they need to show how.

I showed this several times already in this thread. Go back and read my posts to Phil XI. If you sign any player to way more money than he is actually worth, your are drastically limiting your roster flexibility. Given the player market and his own production (as well as factoring in age and injury), Kobe Bryant isn't worth 48.5 million. Not even close.

If you want to argue that Kobe's contract has now made the Lakers incapabale of making substantial moves or signing a max player, I'm going to disagree with you because the facts say otherwise.

That wasn't the argument, either. They can sign one max player. That pales in comparison to what they could do with their roster (both now and for the future) if Bryant, an aging, 35 year old SG coming off a significant injury, simply signed for less.

If the Lakers want to give themselves the best chance to contend for a title (especially in the loaded Western conference), this contract was a step backwards.

[sacbaby]

No, I don't care to, because the plan wasn't a good one to begin with, but it was their plan (not mine) and any chance it had of succeeding, they just shat all over it. This isn't a solution to anything for them.

It's rare when a poster could come off as more intelligent by simply NOT responding. This is one of those occasions.

Care to explain why, or do you think people will just take your assertion at face value?

does he really need to explain himself here? ok, i'll break down the logic for you. lakers had a plan. lakers realized plan wasn't going to work. lakers changed plan (most likely 2015 FA acquisition targets) to more accurately reflect reality. just because u have a plan, doesn't mean you go down swinging with it even when you realize it's not going to work. that's idiocy.

[semi-sentient]

A more important question that I think hasn't been touched on:
Will Kobe allow the Lakers to sign 2 max players?

It hasn't been touched on because it's a pointless question. The Lakers had no shot at signing 2 max FA's while retaining Kobe.

I'm not totally sold on him accepting a third banana role for his last couple of years.

Why would he need to accept a 3rd banana role? Behind who exactly? The only max player that the Lakers have any chance of landing is Melo and Kobe is still a better offensive player.

... or are you one of those people who thinks an offensively limited player such as Dwight should be a 1st option over Kobe?

[An Unbiased Fan]

Yeah it's limited, but not to the degree that people are claiming. For someone to claim that their flexibility is drastically limited they need to show how.

I showed this several times already in this thread. Go back and read my posts to Phil XI. If you sign any player to way more money than he is actually worth, your are drastically limiting your roster flexibility. Given the player market and his own production (as well as factoring in age and injury), Kobe Bryant isn't worth 48.5 million. Not even close.

If you want to argue that Kobe's contract has now made the Lakers incapabale of making substantial moves or signing a max player, I'm going to disagree with you because the facts say otherwise.

That wasn't the argument, either. They can sign one max player. That pales in comparison to what they could do with their roster (both now and for the future) if Bryant, a 35 year old SG coming off a significant injury, signed for less.

What can't they do? I still see no specifics. What moves is Kobe's contract preventing?

[Frosty]

1) Pau's expiring is LA's only trade asset, and Kobe's contract doesn't hurt any potential trade at all. Again, LA is not looking to fill the roster with mid-level players, they want stars.

If you have 10 million free under the cap you don't only have Gasol's contract. You can trade a $6 million guy for a $16 mil guy to a team that wants to unload salary.

Let's say Kevin Love gets disgruntled during the 2015 season and Minny wants to unload salary in anticipation of having to pay Rubio and avoid the tax. LA positions a Gasol that is signed to a 6 mil deal or another player and $10 mil in cap space and absorb Love's contract. Avoiding free agency and avoiding losing out on a trade they can't particiapte in.

Bro, why in the World would LA want to take on a 16m salary? Minny isn't trading Pau for Love, maybe a few years ago, but not anymore.

LA still has cap room to sign another max player AND go after Love in 2015 with Kobe's contract.

There isn't a realistic way to make this happen. I'm not even sure there is an unrealistic one.

And "Bro" the point of the Love example was just that, an example. It wasn't a plan, it was to show you the flexibility they are giving up. And teams are often unloading big salaries (Gasol) so not having that flexibility hurts.

[MisterWestside]

What can't they do? I still see no specifics. What moves is Kobe's contract preventing?

More loaded questions? The argument is about roster flexibility, which mopper8 kindly took the time to demonstrate in his lengthy posts to you.

[MaxRider]

0-6 years experience - your max is 25% of the salary cap
7-9 years is 30%
10+ is 35%
and new cba rule
used to be 10.5% yearly raise for team with bird right
now i think is 7%

[ChiCitySPORTS#1]

0-6 years experience - your max is 25% of the salary cap
7-9 years is 30%
10+ is 35%
and new cba rule
used to be 10.5% yearly raise for team with bird right
now i think is 7%

Came here to post this. He's been in the league since 96, his salary ceiling will be higher than any young blood.

[defhalotones]

This should clear everything up..
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-trian ... g-contract

[Frosty]

What can't they do? I still see no specifics. What moves is Kobe's contract preventing?

More loaded questions? The argument is about roster flexibility, which mopper8 kindly took the time to demonstrate in his lengthy posts to you.

He's stuck on Free Agency because it seems like he's determined to defend this deal (Is Kobe UBF?) He's ignoring trade flexibility completely. Having cap space makes you an attractive target for teams unloading salary. Or teams trying to make a multi team trade work.

He puts all of their eggsin the FA bucket but to me that's a very dangerous and limited option.

[MaxRider]

0-6 years experience - your max is 25% of the salary cap
7-9 years is 30%
10+ is 35%
and new cba rule
used to be 10.5% yearly raise for team with bird right
now i think is 7%

Came here to post this. He's been in the league since 96, his salary ceiling will be higher than any young blood.

also
for max salary your new contract cannot be certain percent (i forgot the number) lower than your previous year salary
as you see here his salary never go down
because lakers always has his bird right he always get the max annual raise
back then first rounder only get 3 years contract and now 4, so durant play 4 years for rookie contract and kobe only 3

1996-97 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $1,015,000
1997-98 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $1,167,240
1998-99 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $1,319,000
1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $9,000,000
2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $10,130,000
2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $11,250,000
2002-03 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $12,375,000
2003-04 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $13,500,000
2004-05 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $14,175,000
2005-06 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $15,946,875
2006-07 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $17,718,750
2007-08 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $19,490,625
2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $21,262,500
2009-10 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $23,034,375
2010-11 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $24,806,250
2011-12 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $25,244,493
2012-13 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $27,849,149
2013-14 Los Angeles Lakers NBA $30,453,805

[heatwillbeback]

Lakers did overpay but...

If you were Kobe would you agree with that extension?

The lakers offered that insane money and he just accepted it...

I'm mad at that extension but the FO must be blamed and not Kobe.

What do you expect Kobe to say? I dont want 24 Mil. but I want 15 Mil??

you really believe that PR nonsense Kobe threw out there?

I know his PR people expect some to believe it which is why they released it, but you follow basketball on a message board, ie more than the average fan.

[NBA4EVA2010]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovCdqtCCxP8[/youtube]

[Frosty]

0-6 years experience - your max is 25% of the salary cap
7-9 years is 30%
10+ is 35%
and new cba rule
used to be 10.5% yearly raise for team with bird right
now i think is 7%

Direct from wikipedia

There is an exception to this rule, a player is able to sign a contract for 105% of his previous contract, even if the new contract is higher than the league limit.[11] For example, in the 2013-14 season Kobe Bryant is contracted for $30,453,000[12] (the contract which was signed prior to the 2011 CBA rule changes), Bryant could (in theory) sign a contract starting at $31,975,650 (105% of his previous contract), for the 2014-2015 season and rising thereafter (in practice this contract is very unlikely to be offered, as it would severely impede the team's ability to sign further players due to the salary cap).