If management decided Dragic and Bledsoe couldn't coexist..

Post #1 » by **bwgood77** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 4:21 am

And you figured Bledsoe would get the max, would you rather...

Bledsoe get traded now for assets and stick with Dragic at his $7.5 million a year contract...

or

Trade Dragic and stick with Bledsoe at his $14.5 million avg per year for the next four years.

Personally, I'm hoping they can co-exist, but thought I'd pose the question.

Post #2 » by **lilfishi22** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 4:31 am

I've always wanted Dragic to play the Manu role, coming off the bench and taking big shots. But I get the feeling that Bledsoe wants to be the man and as good as Dragic is, so does management. Dragic is still a young dude but he's from the old regime and if it means flipping one of the two for assets, Dragic unfortunately will be the one leaving town.

I still think they could play together, but it'll require Beldsoe to be a better and more willing passer.

nevetsov · Post #3 » by **nevetsov** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 5:40 am

If it was my choice? I'd keep Goran and flip Bledsoe, because:

1) Bledsoe is currently hotter property as he still has additional "potential", which only diminishes over time. And he's currently further ahead on that timeline then when we got him. Buy low, sell high.

2) Goran at $7.5m is a better third option than Bledsoe is a 2nd option at $14m.

3) I like Goran and Archie as a combo more than Eric and Archie. I think there is a risk that Eric and Archie will overlap as far as skill set.

4) Sentimental attachment to Goran.

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nevetsov · Post #4 » by **nevetsov** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 5:45 am

Or just bring Goran off the bench with Archie and start Green alongside Bledsoe.

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SideSwipe · Post #5 » by **SideSwipe** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 6:19 am

Bledsoe is looking like a great player, but I am not sure I don't trade him over Goran. Goran is more of a leader, and while he is certainly not as athletic as Beldsoe, he more than holds his own. He may not dazzle with defensive plays like Bledsoe does from time to time., but we are also less likely to get frustrated at Goran for putting his head down and dirbbling it off his foot on the drive like we have seen Bledsoe do several times. Will Bledsoe learn? He will probably get better and learn. If Bledsoe gets older and injured he may lose his athletic ability, then you are left with a short guy that can't jump. Bledsoe is too dependent on his athleticism right now.

Goran may still frustrate us from time to time, but I think at this point I still give him the nod for a team you want to be good in 2 years over Bledsoe...for now. We'll see how it goes up until the deadline and make the call.

Post #6 » by **bwgood77** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 6:48 am

nevetsov wrote:If it was my choice? I'd keep Goran and flip Bledsoe, because:

1) Bledsoe is currently hotter property as he still has additional "potential", which only diminishes over time. And he's currently further ahead on that timeline then when we got him. Buy low, sell high.

2) Goran at $7.5m is a better third option than Bledsoe is a 2nd option at $14m.

3) I like Goran and Archie as a combo more than Eric and Archie. I think there is a risk that Eric and Archie will overlap as far as skill set.

4) Sentimental attachment to Goran.

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I kind of agree with this. Someone recently wrote about trading assets while they are hot (or at least hotter than they will be in the future) because if you don't (and if you see they might not be quite as good as people think) then their trade value diminishes greatly. They used Derrick Williams as a good example..that they waited too long...there was another really good example.

I'm not saying Bledsoe is bad by any stretch of the imagination, but is he a max guy? If he and Dragic CAN coexist, I have come to terms with paying him the max, but if their is any sort of friction at all, he may be a guy that you could reap good assets for IF you want to keep Dragic.

The only teams I could see trading fairly decent assets for him are Milwaukee (who desperately needs a pg and would love to have someone they could match an offer on since they can't attract free agents) and Orlando.

I'd be a little surprised if we traded either of them (less surprised with Dragic) but if they did come to that conclusion (that they couldn't play together and thought Dragic was a value contract), you never know.

With Herb Kohl, anti tank guy, Milwaukee offers their first plus Henson or other assets, who knows?

Milwaukee wouldn't look too bad with..

Bledsoe
Mayo
Antetokounmpo
Ilysova
Sanders

Of course, once again, I hope they work out playing together and would rather have them than unproven guys/picks (so anyone ready to say "I can't believe you want to trade....." save yourself the trouble.

Bogyo · Post #7 » by **Bogyo** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 8:11 am

nevetsov wrote:If it was my choice? I'd keep Goran and flip Bledsoe, because:

1) Bledsoe is currently hotter property as he still has additional "potential", which only diminishes over time. And he's currently further ahead on that timeline then when we got him. Buy low, sell high.

2) Goran at $7.5m is a better third option than Bledsoe is a 2nd option at $14m.

3) I like Goran and Archie as a combo more than Eric and Archie. I think there is a risk that Eric and Archie will overlap as far as skill set.

4) Sentimental attachment to Goran.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums mobile app

This. Mostly the second point, which should have been the first imho.

If you have a very good third option at a very good contract at the point, you dont really want to have a somewhat similar player as your 2nd option on a max deal. A "real" shooting guard would be better if we go this way. Or if we could keep Eric around 10 mill (not gonna happen) I would be OK with it.

But I feel that nowdays its a bit harder to have such a good third option at such a great contract, as 1st and 2nd options are (should be) superstars with max contracts... And most 3rd option type players think/feel they are, or they should be no1 or no2, which they are not, and they only mess up the salary/cap situation of their team...

But if we keep Eric on a max contract and win a ring with him down the road, I wont bitch about it either.

Dragic13 · Post #8 » by **Dragic13** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 8:30 am

They seem to play really well together. I don't want to here anything about trading Bledsoe or Dragic anymore!

This is the backcourt of our future and I love it!

I love how we always have one on the floor leading the offense. 8-)

DirtyDez · Post #9 » by **DirtyDez** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 8:37 am

Bledsoe is 4 years younger and probably 2-3 years away from his prime. When that time comes around I sure as hell want him playing for us. Also McD was very aggressive in pursing him. He has big plans for EB.

BurningHeart · Post #10 » by **BurningHeart** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 10:34 am

They'll be together and they'll be fine.

BUT, if I had to choose, I'd have to choose Dragic's much friendlier contract and the chance to raid some team's assets for Bledsoe. I don't like the idea of paying anyone who's not a top 10 or 15 player the max. At all.

thamadkant · Post #11 » by **thamadkant** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 11:44 am

Depends on Bledsoe becomming a 20/8/2 player...

That's worth 14 million a year.

But Dragic at 7.5 million as a 15/7 PG isn't bad as well.

But watching Bledsoe when he is main PG on the court is a lot different from when he is sharing it with Dragic.

carey · Post #12 » by **carey** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 2:47 pm

You guys do realize Goran can and will opt out of his contract after next season? He is due for a raise. Make sure you consider that in your opinion.

RunSunRun · Post #13 » by **RunSunRun** » Sun Dec 1, 2013 4:04 pm

carey wrote:You guys do realize Goran can and will opt out of his contract after next season? He is due for a raise. Make sure you consider that in your opinion.

Yeah, Dragic's friendly contract will not be that much friendlier after next season, especially with so many PG-starved teams around the NBA and even more so if Dragic keeps putting up big numbers. Dragic's contract could actually work against him remaining a part of the Suns because its also currently friendlier to many teams around the NBA who have big budget rosters.

Combine that with Bledsoe being younger and just hitting his peak, I assume the Suns FO would move Dragic over Bledsoe.

JMac1 · Post #14 » by **JMac1** » Mon Dec 2, 2013 5:10 am

If they can't coexist.....I'd take Bledsoe. It's funny, Bledsoe looked so good when Goran was out, but we needed Goran. Goran looked so good when Bledsoe was out.

NapoleonII · Post #15 » by **NapoleonII** » Mon Dec 2, 2013 6:00 am

We'll be fine.

They spent 6 months saying Lebron and Wade couldn't exist.

I know that pair is lightyears ahead of Goran and Bledsoe talent wise, but function wise? It's similar.

They're both primary ball-handlers.

Goran and Bledsoe will have to learn to coexist. But the two of them playing together could be a nightmare for any back court to handle.

phrazbit · Post #16 » by **phrazbit** » Mon Dec 2, 2013 8:44 am

Without question I'd keep Bledsoe and move Dragic. Bledsoe has a ton of talent and is considerably younger.

If anything I feel like "sell high" right now might apply better to Goran anyway. He has proven himself as a solid starting point guard, he is on a cap friendly contract with 1-2 full seasons after this one depending on what he does with his option. Bledsoe's value is somewhat diminished by the obvious payday he is due this summer.

On top of that... we have 6 first round picks coming our way over the next two summers, that fact alone will contribute to a huge amount of roster turnover. You look at Goron and he isnt one of McD's guys, he will probably be seeking a significant raise in 2015 and he is one of our most attractive trade assets.

I think the odds are pretty likely that when the 2014/15 season tips off Dragic wont be here anymore.

JDLAW · Post #17 » by **JDLAW** » Mon Dec 2, 2013 9:20 pm

Do not see them trading either one. They are both excellent players and excellent players generally find ways to work with each other.

The comment that Dragic is not one of McDonough's guys is nonsense. He fits all of the criteria McDonough set forth for the acquisition of players and he and Hornacek are both avid backers of the paring of Dragic and Bledsoe in the backcourt. Just because Dragic was not acquired by McDonough in a trade does not mean he has not "adopted" him. By the same token, the Morris twins and Frye and Tucker are not McDonough's boys because he did not acquire them and we should expect them to be traded - except they comprise a significant portion of the Suns rotation. McDonough has shown no inclination to shop any of them. One other thing to remember is that Dragic is one of Sarver's boys. Sarver was the one that brought him back over the desires of Blanks who wanted Felton. It will take a lot of return for the Suns to move either Dragic or Bledsoe.

Post #18 » by **lilfishi22** » Tue Dec 3, 2013 2:17 am

JDLAW wrote:Do not see them trading either one. They are both excellent players and excellent players generally find ways to work with each other.

The comment that Dragic is not one of McDonough's guys is nonsense. He fits all of the criteria McDonough set forth for the acquisition of players and he and Hornacek are both avid backers of the paring of Dragic and Bledsoe in the backcourt. Just because Dragic was not acquired by McDonough in a trade does not mean he has not "adopted" him. By the same token, the Morris twins and Frye and Tucker are not McDonough's boys because he did not acquire them and we should expect them to be traded - except they comprise a significant portion of the Suns rotation. McDonough has shown no inclination to shop any of them. One other thing to remember is that Dragic is one of Sarver's boys. Sarver was the one that brought him back over the desires of Blanks who wanted Felton. It will take a lot of return for the Suns to move either Dragic or Bledsoe.

If the Dragic/McD comment you were referring to was by me, then I think my position was misinterpreted.

I'm not saying Dragic isn't one of McD's guys because he didn't bring him in, only that moving him would be easier than moving Bledsoe since he was the one who made the decision to give up assets for Bledsoe. So moving Bledsoe would appear like a mistake on his part for trading for him in the first place. I'm not saying GM's don't do this but if it's a choice, I'd imagine he'd choose to move the guy that they didn't have a part in bringing in.

Obviously this is far down in the list of pros and cons if they were to choose.

JDLAW · Post #19 » by **JDLAW** » Tue Dec 3, 2013 5:46 pm

It wasn't your comment that prompted my posting.

My point is that they will make the pairing work. They are not moving either one unless someone comes calling with a huge return that includes something that makes the Suns better in the present and future. But hypothetically, assuming that happens, they will not likely pick which one to trade. The team offering to trade will pick the player they want to trade for and the Suns will decide what they are willing to accept. Such a choice will not be made on the rather juvenile basis of 'who is who's boy.'

phrazbit · Post #20 » by **phrazbit** » Tue Dec 3, 2013 9:06 pm

JDLAW wrote:It wasn't your comment that prompted my posting.

My point is that they will make the pairing work. They are not moving either one unless someone comes calling with a huge return that includes something that makes the Suns better in the present and future. But hypothetically, assuming that happens, they will not likely pick which one to trade. The team offering to trade will pick the player they want to trade for and the Suns will decide what they are willing to accept. Such a choice will not be made on the rather juvenile basis of 'who is who's boy.'

Its not about someone being "his boy". Anyone on the roster when McDonough took over should probably have a bag packed. Not that he hates those players but they are guys he inherited. Its nothing against Dragic but thats the situation in any organization when they are going through a rebuild with a new front office.

You combine Dragic's option to opt out of his contract in 2015, the seemingly huge potential of Bledsoe and that McD has no ego attachment to Dragic... and yes, I think its rather likely that Dragic will at some point in the next year get traded.

As I said earlier, simply by virtue of how many draft picks we have, SOME guys are going to have to get moved to make room for the new blood, and given Dragic's position, contract and trade value he makes as much sense as anyone.