Discussion: Should the Bucks trade Larry Sanders?

[FrieAaron]

What's he saying on twitter? I can't see it at work.

[SpursNBucks]

I want to keep him. I just hope as he ages and matures he calms down a bit to prevent any future similar instances. What he needs is that alpha guy to keep him in check. Imagine him playing with Jordan back in the day or Kobe or Lebron right now. He would revere those guys and listen to their advice and thus not get in as much trouble. It always comes back to needing the alpha guy. #saveourbucks

This is what I was thinking - your absolutely right. To think Larry was labeled the leader- how can you lead when your pulling stuff like this? The closest thing they may have as someone that may be Caron Butler right now- pretty sad.

[Badgerlander]

The time to trade Larry was right after the season, trading him now gets you nowhere. He is still a valuable player, but the team needs to be built around defense. With Knight out and Mayo/Butler/Ersan we had almost zero defense in front of him so of course he got in foul trouble. While I don't see Knight as a starting PG, if we end up drafting Wiggins or Exum I think the ballhandling shared in a Knight/Wiggins(Exum)/Giannis lineup would be pretty interesting.

I'd agree with LUKE and give Ersan 36 minutes per game and try to get a pick for him by the deadline, but at the moment it would appear that they are trying to boost Udoh's value to get him out the door.

[Todd_Day]

Hell no. Larry will come back around

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

My Lord, I'm glad many of you are not running this team.

i didnt want to choose an all out tank... but now that were the worst team in the nba in potentially the last 5 years, it makes sense to do this thing the way its supposed to be done. that means not just this year but scrub out next year and possibly even the next year too.

what could possibly be a reason that you would sanction bottoming out and trading bogut that you wouldnt want to trade sanders?

[SkilesTheLimit]

Sanders was very bad (Summer League bad) in the first few games of the season.

That's reason #1 not to trade him right now. What good can come of trading a guy whose value is currently low? Between his poor play and legal issues, we'd most likely get nowhere near his true value. Especially with the guy we have holding the reigns when it comes to executing trades.

[Willie Colon]

Hell. F*cking. No.

[emunney]

I'm not against trading Larry, but this is honestly the worst possible time to think about it. He's practically untradeable this entire year anyway as a Poison Pill provision guy.

[LUKE23]

Yeah, too bad is isn't you running the show so we could have a lineup featuring Luke Babbitt and Joe Alexander.

More like Paul George and Andre Drummond.

i didnt want to choose an all out tank... but now that were the worst team in the nba in potentially the last 5 years, it makes sense to do this thing the way its supposed to be done. that means not just this year but scrub out next year and possibly even the next year too.

what could possibly be a reason that you would sanction bottoming out and trading bogut that you wouldnt want to trade sanders?

This doesn't make much sense to me. Larry is an elite interior defender. I have come to grips with the fact that he won't be a good offensive player, but his D would be extremely hard to replace. That's before we even get into the fact that his value is as low as it has been as of today. You don't, "get whatever you can for him". That's such a horrendous way to run a basketball team.

[emunney]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q88

If a team extends a first round draft pick's rookie scale contract (see question number 58) and then trades the player between the date the extension is signed and the date it takes effect, the player's trade value for the receiving team is the average of the salaries in the last year of the rookie scale contract and each year of the extension. This is called the Poison Pill provision. The sending team uses the player's actual salary when calculating their total outgoing salary. They use the current-year maximum salary in place of the (unknown) maximum salary for a future season, if necessary.

[BobbyLight]

It would be so Bucks to trade him for Asik.

Because the Bucks love to give up real early on things that might be good if they actually gave it time to see it come together. And the good thing we'd be giving up on is a front line of Sanders/Henson/Giannis.

Imagine Wiggins, Smart of Exum in the back court with that. Imagine Wolters (yes, I like him more than Knight at this point)/Mayo/Giannis/Parker/Sanders with Henson first off the bench?

So, yeah, the Bucks will give up on that and trade him for something nowhere near as interesting as any of the above scenarios. Sanders was not good to start the system, but you've seen the rest of the team play as well, right? Because we are incredibly awful from top to bottom. If you want to trade Sanders because he sucked to start, well... you can say that about everyone on the team. So let's see what can actually happen. You swap Sanders for Asik in any of those scenarios and I become far less interested, even if Aski is probably pretty decent overall.

It was a friggin' bar fight, get over it.

[CanadaBucks]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q88

If a team extends a first round draft pick's rookie scale contract (see question number 58) and then trades the player between the date the extension is signed and the date it takes effect, the player's trade value for the receiving team is the average of the salaries in the last year of the rookie scale contract and each year of the extension. This is called the Poison Pill provision. The sending team uses the player's actual salary when calculating their total outgoing salary. They use the current-year maximum salary in place of the (unknown) maximum salary for a future season, if necessary.

So does that mean his trade value is (44+3)/5=9.4m?

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

i didnt want to choose an all out tank... but now that were the worst team in the nba in potentially the last 5 years, it makes sense to do this thing the way its supposed to be done. that means not just this year but scrub out next year and possibly even the next year too.

what could possibly be a reason that you would sanction bottoming out and trading bogut that you wouldnt want to trade sanders?

This doesn't make much sense to me. Larry is an elite interior defender. I have come to grips with the fact that he won't be a good offensive player, but his D would be extremely hard to replace. That's before we even get into the fact that his value is as low as it has been as of today. You don't, "get whatever you can for him". That's such a horrendous way to run a basketball team.

start henson at center. save 50 million. if after trying to trade him for a positive asset over the course of the next year we find NO TAKERS. then we dump him in time for next years free agency in order to allow us to take back dead salary and picks to desperate teams.

sanders is completely worthless to us over the life of his current contract. unload him. hes a wrose headcase than bogut and a fraction of the player. unload him asap. hes useless to us now.

[LUKE23]

As usual, we disagree. You've lost it here. Even if we were going to trade him, why in the hell would we do it now? He started out the season poorly, then got into an altercation. Yes, lets get on the phone today and try and gauge his value. Great plan.

Start Henson at C? I like Henson, but he's never going to be the defender Larry is. He doesn't seem to have the mentality for it, and he doesn't have the frame Larry does either. I'm not necessarily against Henson at C in a vacuum, but if we are trying to become a contending team we need an elite paint defender. Sanders was the best paint defender in the NBA last year in my mind (with advanced stats to back it) and isn't 25 yet. Bail on him because of this? Dumb. Really dumb.

It seems like some of you want a bunch of choirboys on the roster or something. I could give two **** if Sanders got into a bar fight. In all honesty, that bar fight HELPED us this season. It's not like there is any risk to waiting, his value won't be lower later.

[emunney]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q88

If a team extends a first round draft pick's rookie scale contract (see question number 58) and then trades the player between the date the extension is signed and the date it takes effect, the player's trade value for the receiving team is the average of the salaries in the last year of the rookie scale contract and each year of the extension. This is called the Poison Pill provision. The sending team uses the player's actual salary when calculating their total outgoing salary. They use the current-year maximum salary in place of the (unknown) maximum salary for a future season, if necessary.

So does that mean his trade value is (44+3)/5=9.4m?

For the team getting him, that's what he'd count for in terms of getting their incoming and outgoing salaries to agree. But for us, he'd count as his current salary, which would make matching difficult as we're less than 2m under the cap. Basically means we can't execute a two team deal with a team that would be over the cap after the deal. And as we currently have the lowest team salary in the league...

[InsideOut]

His behavior is getting worse instead of better. I would trade him if I could get any type of value for him. Just have a feeling things won't end well for him. Definitely not the guy you want as the face of your franchise.

[Badgerlander]

My Lord, I'm glad many of you are not running this team.

Are you so sure that they aren't? I mean the trades that Hammond has made...

[raferfenix]

I have no interest in Asik. Would rather risk Sanders putting together some good games and increasing his trade value.

Teams know how Kohl rolls with character guys though, so his value might not be so much lower than it was even if we are courting suitors.

Is there a great young player or potential pick available that we could target with a Sanders-based package?


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[paulpressey25]

If the team is smart, they rebuild. That means a number of low contract guys the next three years. So even if Larry doesn't return to form, his salary will help to meet the league required minimum payroll.

I would not trade him.

Now that said, figure out a way to get into the top ten of this draft via a Larry trade (even with Ersan)? Then yes, let's figure that one out.

[tedbrogen]

Why sell at the lowest point possible on him? It's not like his salary is a huge cap hit or if they moved him they'd be able to use cap space to sign someone of value. They don't have any young guys who they will need to pay in the near future either. They have Henson and Wolters under control for 3 more years, Middleton for 2 more years, and the Greek for 4. By the time they have to pay anyone of the youngsters, every remaining contract on the team will have run its course. Who would they possibly even give the money to if they traded Sanders? We all saw what happened this past off-season. No one wanted to take their money. The only guys who will sign with this team in free agency are washed up vets.

They are fortunate in that they can just live through these issues with Larry because they are a bad team, being a bad team is quite helpful right now, and they don't have salary cap issues. When he returns there are 3 scenarios: he gets back to being the impact player on the defensive end he was last season (in which case, he's still young enough and signed to a reasonable deal so you'd want him as part of the core), his play completely tanks (in which case he is almost untradeable but his poor play helps the tank so keep playing him and if he figures things out, great), or he gets in another off-court incident (in which case he is almost untradeable but again it helps the tank to not have an elite defensive player on the court.)

Rather than even discuss trading Larry, the front office should be out there seeing what teams are looking to do salary dumps themselves. Eat a bad contract with 2 or 3 years left in exchange for also receiving a draft pick. In fact, do that a couple of times. If the player they get is useless (say Kendrick Perkins) then great play him a ton of minutes with Ridnour, Neal, Caron, and Udoh and drive this tank further into the ground.