D Schroeder sent to the D-League

[Jamaaliver]

Schröder was the 17th pick in the 2013 NBA Draft, but he found himself quickly on the outs with Atlanta head coach Mike Budenholzer, and subsequently, he was passed by on the depth chart by journeyman Shelvin Mack. In 11 games this season, the 20-year-old point guard from Germany is averaging 13.9 minutes, 3.7 points, and 2.5 assists per game, but his shooting his been woeful (35.6% FG, 11.1% from 3) and his turnovers (1.6 per game) have been an issue.

[ATL Boy]

At least he'll get some consistent playing time

[Jamaaliver]

It was inevitable. So much for all of Bud's player development skills. Hard to give young talent all the attention it needs with all the other responsibilities a HC has to handle.

Seems like all our young talent it struggling right now.

[PandaKidd]

With Lou coming back, and in the starting lineup the other night, saw this coming.

Looks like Bud prefers mack to Schroeder. Hes not ready for the NBA, hes too cocky, makes too many TO, and the game is too fast for him right now

[Rip2137]

It was inevitable. So much for all of Bud's player development skills. Hard to give young talent all the attention it needs with all the other responsibilities a HC has to handle.

Seems like all our young talent it struggling right now.

He was being outplayed on both ends of the court by Sheldon Mack, who, by the way, is a young player.

This is to get Dennis some more game time instead of rotting away on the bench. Who are our other young players that are struggling?

[Jamaaliver]

Who are our other young players that are struggling?

Pretty much everyone we've drafted the last two years (not named Mike Scott).

Jenkins, Dennis look terrible. JJ even worse than his rookie year. Jared Cunningham didn't warrant any PT here apparently. Despite injuries to JJ, Korver and Lou.

Muscala and Lucas both weren't ready to contribute, despite the fact their replacements aren't very good.

Nogueira can't stay healthy enough to stay on the floor in Spain.

[Jamaaliver]

Now Jenkins has been sent down to the D-League...to work on his defense???

He lit up the place in a short stint last season. We'll see what comes of it.

[parson]

Being in the same backcourt, maybe they can develop some chemistry and come back up to help off the bench.

[Jamaaliver]

Being in the same backcourt, maybe they can develop some chemistry and come back up to help off the bench.

Good point. I expect Jenkins to avg 30 ppg and Dennis to avg a triple-double.

[Rip2137]

Who are our other young players that are struggling?

Pretty much everyone we've drafted the last two years (not named Mike Scott).

Jenkins, Dennis look terrible. JJ even worse than his rookie year. Jared Cunningham didn't warrant any PT here apparently. Despite injuries to JJ, Korver and Lou.

Muscala and Lucas both weren't ready to contribute, despite the fact their replacements aren't very good.

Nogueira can't stay healthy enough to stay on the floor in Spain.

I get that but you said, "so much for all of Bud's player development skills". You can't actually blame him for Muscala, Lucas and Nogueria seeing as they aren't even on the team right now. Jenkins shot was off and he wasn't playing great D.

There are only 4 "young" players on this team(Scott, Jenkins, Mack, Cunningham). Jenkins shot has been off (which a stint in the D league might help get back, especially when you consider the back injury that could be playing a factor) Scott and Mack have been good and Cunningham is about what you expect from him, especially with Carroll and Martin playing well.

Just saying...50% of our young players are playing better and one that's struggling is coming off a injury...hardly time to disparage Bud's skills with young players.

[parson]

I get that but you said, "so much for all of Bud's player development skills". You can't actually blame him for Muscala, Lucas and Nogueria seeing as they aren't even on the team right now.

Lucas IS Nogueira. He's also Bebe.

[Rip2137]

Yeah, I left have way in between that sentence and came back and didn't pay attention to where I was...my bad....but you get my point.

[Jamaaliver]

There are only 4 "young" players on this team(Scott, Jenkins, Mack, Cunningham). Jenkins shot has been off (which a stint in the D league might help get back, especially when you consider the back injury that could be playing a factor) Scott and Mack have been good and Cunningham is about what you expect from him, especially with Carroll and Martin playing well.

Just saying...50% of our young players are playing better and one that's struggling is coming off a injury...hardly time to disparage Bud's skills with young players.

I tell you that our three first rounders from this year and last year are struggling to garner playing time and even see the court. So much so that each of them have been demoted to the minor league system.

And your response is that Shelvin Mack is playing well.

Also, you forgot to include Dennis amongst the young players. The subject of the entire thread.

Dennis, Jenkins and Jared are all young talent. Each has been surpassed on the depth chart by journeymen who, frankly, are lucky to be on a roster. (Cartier, Shelvin) That is not ideal.

Also, I didn't disparage Bud's development skills. I lamented the fact that as HEAD COACH he can no longer give the majority of his focus to developing young players. That job falls to the assistants:

Hard to give young talent all the attention it needs with all the other responsibilities a HC has to handle.

[Rip2137]

How is Jared Cunningham a "young player" but Shelvin Mack is not? Mack came in the league in 2011, played for the Wizards and the Hawks. Cunningham came in 2012, played for Dallas and the Hawks.

Jared Cunningham couldn't get off the bench in the D league, but he should be higher on the depth chart than guys that are producing? Jenkins was coming off a injury, I am not sure what part of that you aren't getting. I like Jenkins, but the guy was/is off due to the time missed and it was pretty obvoius. Dennis Schroder got minutes, proved he wasn't ready and got outplayed by ANOTHER YOUNG PLAYER.

You are right, instead of 4, there are 5 young players on this team. One sucks(Cunningham), one is coming off a injury(Jenkins) 2 are thriving (Scott and Mack) and the other was outplayed by another young player(Schroder).

Player development is not sitting better, more productive players so that your 12th man can get minutes. Its seeing how much better young players get from year to year. I don't think a month in is time to start yelling about not developing young players UNLESS you are a bottom of the barrell team and the players above them are free agents (aka, the Mike Woodson playing Lorenzen Wright over Solomon Jones and Sheldon Williams and Tyronne Lue over AC Law). I can't say enough good things about how this coaching staff is handling this team. Sure, I think Brand should play a few more minutes or Ayon, but things are going just fine.

[Livno]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVP69Zi23p0[/youtube]

[Jamaaliver]

How is Jared Cunningham a "young player" but Shelvin Mack is not?

Once again, you've misquoted me. I said our 'young talent' is struggling. I do not consider Shelvin Mack as part of our young talent base. With Dennis Schroeder, Jeff Teague and Lou Williams on board I see absolutely no place for Mack in the short term or long term. There's a good chance if he were not on our roster, he wouldn't even be playing in the NBA.

Jared Cunningham couldn't get off the bench in the D league, but he should be higher on the depth chart than guys that are producing? Jenkins was coming off a injury, I am not sure what part of that you aren't getting. I like Jenkins, but the guy was/is off due to the time missed and it was pretty obvoius. Dennis Schroder got minutes, proved he wasn't ready and got outplayed by ANOTHER YOUNG PLAYER.

Except that Jenkins wasn't sent to the D-League to rehab from his injury. He was sent there....to learn to guard NBA talent?!?

John Jenkins has been on the outside looking in for the Atlanta Hawks for most of the season and now we know why. Atlanta Hawks Head Coach Mike Budenholzer told the AJC prior to Saturday's game that the team wants to see defensive improvement from Jenkins.

"Defensively, we feel that is where we need to be better so we are talking to John about making that his focus also and that is a real priority," Budenholzer said. "Offensively, we are doing OK. That is probably John's strength. Right now, I think he needs to focus on that defensive end and make sure he is doing everything possible at that end of the court."

[Jamaaliver]

You are right, instead of 4, there are 5 young players on this team. One sucks(Cunningham), one is coming off a injury(Jenkins) 2 are thriving (Scott and Mack) and the other was outplayed by another young player(Schroder).

We have 4 players on our roster in their first or second year of the NBA....all of them are playing poorly. Three fell so far down the depth chart that coach demoted them to the minor league system in Bakersfield.

Scott is struggling as well in his last dozen games, and for the season is only shooting 44% from the field.

Player development is not sitting better, more productive players so that your 12th man can get minutes.

Agreed. But how can Bud be developing our young talent, when they aren't even on the roster? Or in the same state? Coach Bud realized he was unable to give these young players (Jenkins, Jared, Dennis) the attention they need midseason, so he sent them away for OTHERS to develop. They're not facing NBA talent in games or practice. They're not receiving mentoring from NBA coaches.

So now Jenkins can improve his defense by NOT guarding NBA talent? Cartier Martin is terrible. Him surpassing Jenkins and Jared is not a good thing.

We are not a contender. We are an average team. But now our coach won't even take the time to let our young players get their feet wet and play through their mistakes. Mike Woodson did the same thing for years, and we took him to task for it repeatedly. Coach Bud does it, and it's a good thing that NBA trash like Cartier Martin and Shelvin Mack are taking their Playing Time?

Seriously?

[theatlfan]

How is Jared Cunningham a "young player" but Shelvin Mack is not?

Once again, you've misquoted me. I said our 'young talent' is struggling. I do not consider Shelvin Mack as part of our young talent base. With Dennis Schroeder, Jeff Teague and Lou Williams on board I see absolutely no place for Mack in the short term or long term. There's a good chance if he were not on our roster, he wouldn't even be playing in the NBA.

When we signed him, Mack was clearly the #1 D-League prospect of those who weren't "owned" by an NBA team. Someone would have given him a shot and considering the way he's been playing this season, I think he would have stuck on a roster somewhere. I think Mack could be our Will Bynum - someone who can be a fairly cheap backup PG for years. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Mack outlasted the other 3 guys mentioned here in terms of time with the Hawks.

I'd drop Cunningham from the list as well. DAL thought so much of him that they gave up two position in the draft and were excited to dump him on draft day. We were so excited about acquiring him that we refused his y3 rookie level TO already. All we've ever seen Cunningham as is an expiring contract that can be used in a bigger deal and that's the only reason he's still on the roster. No one is trying to develop Cunningham into something we can use - Cunningham will be off the roster as soon as it no longer makes any sense to keep his contract around. Mack definitely deserves to be in the "developing young players" debate before Cunningham does.

You are right, instead of 4, there are 5 young players on this team. One sucks(Cunningham), one is coming off a injury(Jenkins) 2 are thriving (Scott and Mack) and the other was outplayed by another young player(Schroder).

We have 4 players on our roster in their first or second year of the NBA....all of them are playing poorly. Three fell so far down the depth chart that coach demoted them to the minor league system in Bakersfield.

Scott is struggling as well in his last dozen games, and for the season is only shooting 44% from the field

I think the biggest problem for Jenkins has been Coach Bud's insistence that Korver play the 2. That effectively blocks Jenkins since his skillset is pretty redundant to Korver's yet Korver is better - as evidenced by the fact that our team is significantly better when Korver isn't out. This means that Jenkins has to add another skill to get PT and Coach Bud has made it clear which skill he wants Jenkins to add. Will it work? Time will tell.

Schröder is a 19 yo who is going through a culture change right now. 19 yo who are drafted @ 17 aren't typically seen as "win now" guys so I can't really pin his struggles on squarely on Coach Bud's shoulders... yet.

Even if Scott has played his best b-ball, then he contributed more than what I expected out of a 2nd rounder already.

Player development is not sitting better, more productive players so that your 12th man can get minutes.

Agreed. But how can Bud be developing our young talent, when they aren't even on the roster? Or in the same state? Coach Bud realized he was unable to give these young players (Jenkins, Jared, Dennis) the attention they need midseason, so he sent them away for OTHERS to develop. They're not facing NBA talent in games or practice. They're not receiving mentoring from NBA coaches.

So now Jenkins can improve his defense by NOT guarding NBA talent? Cartier Martin is terrible. Him surpassing Jenkins and Jared is not a good thing.

We are not a contender. We are an average team. But now our coach won't even take the time to let our young players get their feet wet and play through their mistakes. Mike Woodson did the same thing for years, and we took him to task for it repeatedly. Coach Bud does it, and it's a good thing that NBA trash like Cartier Martin and Shelvin Mack are taking their Playing Time?

Seriously?

Your larger point here is valid. There should be some concern that our last 3 1st round picks are either playing clear across the country in CA or still overseas while we have a recent 2nd rounder and 2 scrap heap guys getting minutes with the big club. Also note that our recent 2nd that is still overseas is actually playing better than that 1st rounder as well (when he plays). One of the things I was excited about with the Ferry/Bud relationship was that they'd be on the same page in terms of player acquisition and development. We're barely a couple of months into this reign, and we're simply not seeing this. The name of the game for the FO in the current NBA is the ability to find cheap talent. The mechanicism that has been in place for this for-seemingly-ever has been the draft. If you can consistently get contributors out of the draft, then you'll have a good team. As of right now, it's hard to say that we've done anything but fail in this regard over the last 2 drafts.

Still, coaches and GMs with more lineage have had busts with higher picks in better drafts. Also, Jenkins and Scott were drafted for the last coach - not the current one. Not trying to use this as an excuse (I'd still be hanging an "F" up on the board if I was grading our last 2 drafts in terms of current contribution today), but I haven't given up hope on them... yet.

[Jamaaliver]

All valid points. A few things.

Schröder is a 19 yo who is going through a culture change right now. 19 yo who are drafted @ 17 aren't typically seen as "win now" guys so I can't really pin his struggles on squarely on Coach Bud's shoulders... yet.

Again, I was not 'blaming" his struggles on Coach Bud. Merely lamenting the fact when Tony Parker was a 19 year old rookie PG, new to this league, he had Budenholzer at his disposal to assist through the transition.

Dennis, in the exact same scenario....DOES NOT have Coach Bud at his disposal. That was the entire point of the thread.

Does it really hurt our team to at least let Jared and JJ practice against the big leaguers? Jared could show SOMETHING that increases his trade value. Let's face it, at this point he surely can't do anything to decrease his trade value....

[parson]

^ It's hard to know what going on without being on the inside. Maybe Schröder needs a kick in the rear - a jolt to his system - to get his attitude adjusted. Maybe he has a great attitude but management thinks he needs minutes on the court.

As Pete Babcock put it in his recent interview, you give the guy in charge time, then you judge him by the results. If Schröder becomes a player, then Budenholzer was right. If he doesn't make it, ...