Ersan Trade Ideas - Think hard guys (and Sanders)

[bigkurty]

I have nothing right now. I don't think this question will be able to be answered until mid January. The east is so bad that I could picture everyone but the Knicks, Nets, Pacers, and Heat tanking. So maybe the Knicks and Nets would be interested but they have crap to offer. So then you have to look at teams in the west jockeying for playoff position. I don't think those teams will pull the trigger on anything unless they get a great deal or until they have a better idea where they sit in their conference.

[RandyBreuer]

Let's make a blockbuster with small market OKC to help them win a title or two.

Ersan/Larry/Neal/Radjulica out

Lamb/Adams/P Jones/Perkins/OKC late first or lotto prot Dallas 1st in

[Turd Ferguson]

Let's make a blockbuster with small market OKC to help them win a title or two.

Ersan/Larry/Neal/Radjulica out

Lamb/Adams/P Jones/Perkins/OKC late first or lotto prot Dallas 1st in

Hmmmm Interesting. Does OKC do that? I think since Ers and Larry are both so young, they could still roll with those guys for years to come. Does that work in the trade checker?

One problem I see is this effectively means no combination of Larry, Ersan and Ibaka will ever see the floor at the same time as Durant. Are they having Durant play the 4 in their small-ball lineup? I remember seeing that discussion about surrounding one rim protector with four shooters, and it seems like either Larry/Ibaka could be that rock for OKC in the middle.

[DanoMac]

Let's make a blockbuster with small market OKC to help them win a title or two.

Ersan/Larry/Neal/Radjulica out

Lamb/Adams/P Jones/Perkins/OKC late first or lotto prot Dallas 1st in

I'm down with this

[SupremeHustle]

Ersan/Ridnour/2nd for Bennett and Waiters

[randy84]

The Ersan train has sailed. We couldn't even get Washington to give up a first rounder for him and they wanted a stretch 4.

[runasone]

Thomas Robinson could be a sweet short-term tank commander w/ a little bit of long-term potential if we could build a deal around him w/ Portland.

If they would entertain the idea of Aldridge at the 5, Ilyasova makes a lot of sense for them. If not, it'd be a lot of money for a back-up.

I think that's why there's been talk about a 3-team trade that would send Ersan to Houston, Asik to Portland, and something like McCollum+Robinson to Milwaukee. That would allow them to upgrade the C position without having to change their style of play (ie, they could still use LMA as a stretch 4 offensively, and continue to prioritize limiting 3-point shots on defense).

[fam3381]

Sorry, I have to post this. Hobo Ersan can't be denied.

via https://twitter.com/jhartzell2

[RandyBreuer]

Ersan/Ridnour/2nd for Bennett and Waiters

No, but I will throw in another 2nd if they throw in Thompson.

[The Rebel]

MIL OUT: Ilyasova, Udoh, 2014 2nd Round Pick (Lakers), 2016 2nd Round Pick (Pelicans)
MIL IN: Evan Fournier, Darrell Arthur, PHI protected 2nd rounder

DEN OUT: Fournier, Arthur
DEN IN: Ilyasova

PHI OUT: 31-58 Protected 2016 2nd Round pick, same protection for next 5 seasons, option expires
PHI IN: Udoh, 2014 2nd, 2016 2nd

Denver stays below the luxury tax.

Philly a) has the cap space to accommodate this trade b) is one of the teams (re: Hinkie) that recognizes what value Udoh has c) gets another 2nd this year.

Arthur is then bought-out at the end of the season. Or earlier. Whatever.

EDIT: I think the Bucks could get more value for Ersan, but I like Fournier's game and want a trade that could be done quickly.

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

[bizarro]

Thomas Robinson could be a sweet short-term tank commander w/ a little bit of long-term potential if we could build a deal around him w/ Portland.

If they would entertain the idea of Aldridge at the 5, Ilyasova makes a lot of sense for them. If not, it'd be a lot of money for a back-up.

I think that's why there's been talk about a 3-team trade that would send Ersan to Houston, Asik to Portland, and something like McCollum+Robinson to Milwaukee. That would allow them to upgrade the C position without having to change their style of play (ie, they could still use LMA as a stretch 4 offensively, and continue to prioritize limiting 3-point shots on defense).

I questioned this earlier and I'll question this again: Why does Portland do this? And, why does Houston even consider strengthening a Western Conference opponent?

Portland has a very good thing going right now. And, I'll bring this up again: Laugh all you want, but if you've watched Portland's games it's obvious Lopez is working out fabulously for them right now. Freeland (yes, Freeland) is playing great off the bench. And, Robinson is providing them with grit and hustle they've lacked in the past. I don't think they want a thing to do with Asik right now. And, it's been reported in multiple outlets this past week they've grown luke warm to cold on the idea. When you're rolling like they're rolling, you don't just make a change to make a change. They're going to wait it out til the trade deadline to see if they need to tinker.

However, I do agree we need a 3rd team involved. But, it's not going to be a Western conference team (as Houston has alluded to). Here's what we know: Philly, Milwaukee, and Atlanta have all been linked as potential suitors. I think our best bets are to throw in Ersan in 3-way trades with these teams and Houston. Some trades with Asik coming to us (vomit) and other trades with Asik going elsewhere and us taking on other 'assets' - hopefully, of the favorable kind (and, we probably know better than to keep our hopes up...)

[cinematographer]

I think that's why there's been talk about a 3-team trade that would send Ersan to Houston, Asik to Portland, and something like McCollum+Robinson to Milwaukee. That would allow them to upgrade the C position without having to change their style of play (ie, they could still use LMA as a stretch 4 offensively, and continue to prioritize limiting 3-point shots on defense).

I'd need Allen Crabbe coming back. I think it's far more likely he becomes another Danny Green-type, like Middleton, than Robinson becomes something like Reggie Evans. I'd probably flip McCollum, too.

Twenty years ago, I'd be much, much higher on Robinson. But he's already 22 and can't shoot.

[bizarro]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

We've been having pretty good discussion on our board concerning the Sanders/Henson situation. There's pretty good reason to believe they can't co-exist in a productive manner. At least, they can't co-exist in the same lineups consistently. I personally think in the long run they are both great luxuries to have and neither player has even come close to their ceiling. However, in this draft, if you're willing to throw us a considerable deal - a deal that makes us less palatable this season - AND throw us a lotto pick...I'm all ears.

Let's start by saying this: Sanders is available. What do you offer us?

[cinematographer]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

Ersan is twice the player Darrell Arthur is. And you're using a very loose definiton of 'spread 4' when talking about Arthur, who has attempted 30 threes in his NBA career.

Ersan has hit .455 and .444 the last two seasons, on top of being deadly above the break, on top of being rated laughably superior to Arthur by xRAPM. Any gains Arthur has over Ilyasova on pick and roll defense is vastly outweighed by everything else Ilyasova offers.

And how high can they really be on Fournier, given his, shall we say, sporadic play time? We saw the same thing happen with Tobias last year. Nate Effing Robinson is taking his minutes. Nate Effing Robinson.

And, lest we forget, Memphis fleeced Denver in the Koufos trade.

[bizarro]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

We've been having pretty good discussion on our board concerning the Sanders/Henson situation. There's pretty good reason to believe they can't co-exist in a productive manner. At least, they can't co-exist in the same lineups consistently. I personally think in the long run they are both great luxuries to have and neither player has even come close to their ceiling. However, in this draft, if you're willing to throw us a considerable deal - a deal that makes us less palatable this season - AND throw us a lotto pick...I'm all ears.

Let's start by saying this: Sanders is available. What do you offer us?

What about this:

MIL:

Outgoing: Ersan, Sanders, 2014 2nd
Incoming: Fournier, Arthur, 2014 1st (non-protected)

DEN:

Outgoing: Fournier, Arthur, 2014 1st (non-protected)
Incoming: Ersan, Sanders, 2014 2nd

****

As a Buck fan, i love this deal because it gives us two young guys with upside that won't necessarily make an impact this year AND we probably end up getting the Knicks pick. It encourages us to go full out on the Tank.

As a Denver fan, i like this because your team becomes instantly more dangerous in a tough Western conference. You have a definitive rim protector and a top 3 defensive Center who is only tapping into his potential. And you keep your pick and pop versatility with the 2nd best stretch 4 in the game. You also get a high 2nd round pick in this year's draft (Milwaukee has 3).

[bizarro]

I think that's why there's been talk about a 3-team trade that would send Ersan to Houston, Asik to Portland, and something like McCollum+Robinson to Milwaukee. That would allow them to upgrade the C position without having to change their style of play (ie, they could still use LMA as a stretch 4 offensively, and continue to prioritize limiting 3-point shots on defense).

I'd need Allen Crabbe coming back. I think it's far more likely he becomes another Danny Green-type, like Middleton, than Robinson becomes something like Reggie Evans. I'd probably flip McCollum, too.

Twenty years ago, I'd be much, much higher on Robinson. But he's already 22 and can't shoot.

I like me some Crabbe. Nice player. I'd love to see him and Middleton share the floor.

[The Rebel]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

We've been having pretty good discussion on our board concerning the Sanders/Henson situation. There's pretty good reason to believe they can't co-exist in a productive manner. At least, they can't co-exist in the same lineups consistently. I personally think in the long run they are both great luxuries to have and neither player has even come close to their ceiling. However, in this draft, if you're willing to throw us a considerable deal - a deal that makes us less palatable this season - AND throw us a lotto pick...I'm all ears.

Let's start by saying this: Sanders is available. What do you offer us?

I would give you the Knicks pick for Sanders, the big thing is going to be filler, as I have a feeling the Nuggets would insist something like McGee and Fournier for OJ Mayo or something, and some Nuggets fans think that is actually too much.

[emunney]

Why did McCollum re-break the same bone in his foot? If there's a reasonable, avoidable explanation for that, I'd be fine taking him back as the primary piece in an Ersan trade. I don't see the point in taking back T-Rob except as salary filler. I've also been a Crabbe fan for a while.

[bizarro]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

We've been having pretty good discussion on our board concerning the Sanders/Henson situation. There's pretty good reason to believe they can't co-exist in a productive manner. At least, they can't co-exist in the same lineups consistently. I personally think in the long run they are both great luxuries to have and neither player has even come close to their ceiling. However, in this draft, if you're willing to throw us a considerable deal - a deal that makes us less palatable this season - AND throw us a lotto pick...I'm all ears.

Let's start by saying this: Sanders is available. What do you offer us?

I would give you the Knicks pick for Sanders, the big thing is going to be filler, as I have a feeling the Nuggets would insist something like McGee and Fournier for OJ Mayo or something, and some Nuggets fans think that is actually too much.

So, clear this up for me...you'd like Mayo instead of Ersan? Because, we can definitely make that work. I imagine you want some quality bench scoring? This would enable us to swing Ersan in a 3-Way deal with Asik. But, we'd have to consider taking back McGee in lieu of Arthur to make salaries work?

[The Rebel]

Denver specifically targeted Arthur for his jumpshot and pick and roll defense when they traded Koufos, I doubt they would trade him for a different spread 4 who is not as good on defense. Plus they will still have 4 PFs, 3 of which are guys who spread the floor.

They are also high on Fournier, the only guys I could see the Nuggets going after are Henson or Sanders, than I could see them giving up a good package, including a probable lotto pick.

Ersan is twice the player Darrell Arthur is. And you're using a very loose definiton of 'spread 4' when talking about Arthur, who has attempted 30 threes in his NBA career.

Ersan has hit .455 and .444 the last two seasons, on top of being deadly above the break, on top of being rated laughably superior to Arthur by xRAPM. Any gains Arthur has over Ilyasova on pick and roll defense is vastly outweighed by everything else Ilyasova offers.

And how high can they really be on Fournier, given his, shall we say, sporadic play time? We saw the same thing happen with Tobias last year. Nate Effing Robinson is taking his minutes. Nate Effing Robinson.

And, lest we forget, Memphis fleeced Denver in the Koufos trade.

Fournier is struggling, but if you think Nate Robinson is bad then i do now know what to tell you.

As for Arthur being a spread 4, if your only definition is shooting 3 point shots then you are right, Arthur is not that, but he is damn good at the long 2s, which happen to be shots that Shaw and the front office is happy with him taking.

Also you can talk about adjusted plus minus numbers all you want, but at the end of the day all plus minus is dependant on teammates and backups, not to mention RAPM has plenty of flaws on its own.

As for Memphis fleecing the Nuggets, how is that working out for Memphis right now? supposedly according to RAPM and every other stat he was a very good starting center last year, yet just like many other former Nuggets players, his numbers were dramatically inflated. The thing that people do not realize about Koufos is that he is only actually good against undersized centers, on teams that do not run the pick and roll. One of the reasons the Nuggets lost the series against the Warriors last year is that their bigs could not figure out how to hedge on a pick and roll and Bogut ate Koufos alive down in the paint.

I have watched them both, and I will gladly take Arthur's defense over Koufos, not to mention his offense.